Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 16719.

bitserve

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Quote from: Meuh6879 on August 09, 2017, 10:49:32 AM

Quote from: Torque on August 09, 2017, 08:57:24 AM

News flash:

BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.^{BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.}^{^{BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.}}
"Never let Perfect become the enemy of Good Enough."

And scaling is a moving target : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pT9kJq_Ogrk ( Andreas M. Antonopoulos )

He is wrong. He is confusing scaling with capacity. Capacity is a moving target. Scaling is an increase in efficiency which, in the case of LN, is basically unlimited.

That's why blocksize increase is an increase in CAPACITY but not a scaling solution, and Segwit+LN is an increase in Scaling (and thus in capacity).

Ibian

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So I'm heading off to thailand fully paid for by the free coins tomorrow, and I need a new suitcase. I'm thinking pink for easy visibility, but maybe an ugly yellow would work too. Thoughts?

Meuh6879

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Quote from: Torque on August 09, 2017, 08:57:24 AM

News flash:

BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.^{BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.}^{^{BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.}}
"Never let Perfect become the enemy of Good Enough."

And scaling is a moving target : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pT9kJq_Ogrk ( Andreas M. Antonopoulos )

bitserve

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Quote from: Torque on August 09, 2017, 10:32:00 AM

So if any of your friends or family laugh at Bitcoin/crypto and call it a short term fad, then show them this:

https://twitter.com/Fidelity/status/895272222847361024

And ask them, "Would Fidelity Investments waste their time with this integration if they thought it was all a short-term fad?"

"Short term" fad when it is now almost 10 years? The tulip mania that many of the skeptics likes to refer was less than one year (8 months?) for most of the bubble. And it never endured a bear market and totally recovered from it. It was just a single boom and dump... aaaand it's gone.

But yeah, it is a good point to use as an additional argument all the big investment/development that is already going into cryptocurrencies ecosystem. Not just speculation for sure.

P.S.: That if I wanted to "argue" about it. Which I don't. I don't even explicitly recommend anyone to invest in Bitcoin. If they, themselves, decide to do it, I can give them some advice, but they are on their own decisions.

Torque

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So if any of your friends or family laugh at Bitcoin/crypto and call it a short term fad, then show them this:

https://twitter.com/Fidelity/status/895272222847361024

And ask them, "Would Fidelity Investments waste their time with this integration if they thought it was all a short-term fad?"

bitserve

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Self made HODLER ✓

Quote from: DonQuijote on August 09, 2017, 10:11:11 AM

Quote from: empowering on August 09, 2017, 07:50:42 AM

BCH Update

There have been 305 blocks mined since the hard fork.

(946 blocks behind the original chain)

The Bitcoin Cash blockchain is currently operating at 13% of the original chain's difficulty.

The original chain has grown 1,013.97MB more than the Bitcoin Cash blockchain.

It is currently 29% more profitable to mine on the original chain.

Current price= ~~treefiddy~~ $320 ish

Is block time stable?

479826    3 minutes ago    0x20000012    F2Pool    RR/NYA/,mm|äK9s(wXqҎ¦׏&L-🐟Mined by yjh42100    No    Yes
479825    29 minutes ago    0x20000002    BTC.top    QRAb]fAb\g݂/BTC.TOP/NYA/EB1/AD6/mm R8úF+TKks ko{(lZI    Yes    Yes
479824    33 minutes ago    0x20000012    BW Pool    PRo YJ(Mined by BW.COM) /BW Pool/NYA/    No    Yes
479823    40 minutes ago    0x20000002    BTC.top    ORAbǴqAbǳg/BTC.TOP/NYA/EB1/AD6/mmƳ~,կwŃp֚_ %GրÓI$    Yes    Yes
479822    53 minutes ago    0x20000002    BTC.com    NRY/BTC.COM/NYA/mm!HNSd$vssƔ%sp@Zb1[jK    No    Yes
479821    1 hour ago    0x20000002    BTC.com    MR|Y/BTC.COM/NYA/mmE /_rrP O-`r*+9#8    No    Yes

No... But it is improving a lot. Almost there.

DonQuijote

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♠ ♥ ♣ ♦ < ♛♚&#

Quote from: empowering on August 09, 2017, 07:50:42 AM

BCH Update

There have been 305 blocks mined since the hard fork.

(946 blocks behind the original chain)

The Bitcoin Cash blockchain is currently operating at 13% of the original chain's difficulty.

The original chain has grown 1,013.97MB more than the Bitcoin Cash blockchain.

It is currently 29% more profitable to mine on the original chain.

Current price= ~~treefiddy~~ $320 ish

Is block time stable?

bitserve

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Quote from: fragout on August 09, 2017, 10:06:46 AM

Quote from: bitserve on August 09, 2017, 10:00:49 AM

Quote from: fragout on August 09, 2017, 09:55:46 AM

What percentage does 2x need in order to lock in? and when will we know if its likely or not. Also if it has 90% support or so, will core still forge on with their non 2x chain?.
I thought everything was great after the BCH split went smoothly and we were finished with this uncertainty but no such luck.

Consensus rules should be the same: 95%+. It is possible to make the same trick that was done for Segwit of having an intermediate BIP that once locked with a lower percentage (80%?) starts rejecting non-signaling blocks so that it forces a 95%+ on second stage.

That also sends a signal to the market that the "upgrade" is unanimously consensutated, even if it is done in a forcible way. I am ok with that.

Anything below 80% consensus for the first stage (intermediary BIP) should be considered an attack.

So at the moment, its 95% needed or perhaps 80% if another bip is introduced. If it dosnt make this, it is just not implemented and there is no new fork Y/N ?

Donno. It depends on how the CORE developers deliver and how miners will behave depending on circumstances. I am just describing what would be ideal circumstances and what would provide the best outcome for all of them/us.

Also, it is probable that CORE developers accept a 2MB fix patch with a 95% consensus rule, not below. It would up to the miners to do the intermediary BIP (as they did with Segwit) to make sure it "forces" the higher consensus after an intermediary BIP is activated with a lesser consensus requirement.

Otherwise the reality is that many actors could veto EVERYTHING with just a 5% hashrate.

fragout

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Quote from: bitserve on August 09, 2017, 10:00:49 AM

Quote from: fragout on August 09, 2017, 09:55:46 AM

What percentage does 2x need in order to lock in? and when will we know if its likely or not. Also if it has 90% support or so, will core still forge on with their non 2x chain?.
I thought everything was great after the BCH split went smoothly and we were finished with this uncertainty but no such luck.

Consensus rules should be the same: 95%+. It is possible to make the same trick that was done for Segwit of having an intermediate BIP that once locked with a lower percentage (80%?) starts rejecting non-signaling blocks so that it forces a 95%+ on second stage.

That also sends a signal to the market that the "upgrade" is unanimously consensutated, even if it is done in a forcible way. I am ok with that.

Anything below 80% consensus for the first stage (intermediary BIP) should be considered an attack.

So at the moment, its 95% needed or perhaps 80% if another bip is introduced. If it dosnt make this, it is just not implemented and there is no new fork Y/N ?

bitserve

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Activity: 1862

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Self made HODLER ✓

Quote from: fragout on August 09, 2017, 09:55:46 AM

What percentage does 2x need in order to lock in? and when will we know if its likely or not. Also if it has 90% support or so, will core still forge on with their non 2x chain?.
I thought everything was great after the BCH split went smoothly and we were finished with this uncertainty but no such luck.

Consensus rules should be the same: 95%+. It is possible to make the same trick that was done for Segwit of having an intermediate BIP that once locked with a lower percentage (80%?) starts rejecting non-signaling blocks so that it forces a 95%+ on second stage.

That also sends a signal to the market that the "upgrade" is unanimously consensutated, even if it is done in a forcible way. I am ok with that.

Anything below 80% consensus for the first stage (intermediary BIP) should be considered an attack.

fragout

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Activity: 1279

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What percentage does 2x need in order to lock in? and when will we know if its likely or not. Also if it has 90% support or so, will core still forge on with their non 2x chain?.
I thought everything was great after the BCH split went smoothly and we were finished with this uncertainty but no such luck.

bitserve

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Activity: 1862

Merit: 1530

Self made HODLER ✓

Quote from: AlexGR on August 09, 2017, 09:34:32 AM

Quote from: Paashaas on August 09, 2017, 08:30:33 AM

The 2x part will never happen in November but who cares? Bigblockers have finally there BCash coin with no Segwit+8mb blocks...thats what they wanted, right?

What they want is control. Block sizes are irrelevant Cool

Miners already have enough control with their hashrate. I prefer a plurality of influencing actors (miners, exchanges, developers, main whales, relevant individuals, users, etc) as a form of power decentralisation.

I do agree block size is not that much relevant (within some common sense boundaries). So that's why I am fine with a moderate (2x) blocksize increase.... delivered by CORE developers and in the safest possible way.

I am totally in disagreement with more power/control "flippening". Let's just have some respect to the "status quo" that have lead us to where we are right now and keep evolving slowly and without ridiculous experiments and power unbalances.

yefi

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Quote from: Elwar on August 09, 2017, 05:39:52 AM

Is this "sell the news" or speculation that once SegWit gets activated there will be problems?

Or just the fact that the price stopped climbing so people will take this opportunity to sell some coins until the next leg up.

Probably the latter. We'll be back up soon enough though.

AlexGR

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Quote from: Paashaas on August 09, 2017, 08:30:33 AM

The 2x part will never happen in November but who cares? Bigblockers have finally there BCash coin with no Segwit+8mb blocks...thats what they wanted, right?

What they want is control. Block sizes are irrelevant Cool

Last of the V8s

legendary

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Merit: 4393

Be a bank

10 years ago

https://group.bnpparibas/en/press-release/bnp-paribas-investment-partners-temporaly-suspends-calculation-net-asset-funds-parvest-dynamic-abs-bnp-paribas-abs-euribor-bnp-paribas-abs-eonia

BNP Paribas Investment Partners temporaly [sic] suspends the calculation of the Net Asset Value of the following funds : Parvest Dynamic ABS, BNP Paribas ABS EURIBOR and BNP Paribas ABS EONIA

The complete evaporation of liquidity in certain market segments of the US securitization market has made it impossible to value certain assets fairly, regardless of their quality or credit rating.

In English what that means is "we couldn't sell this stuff if we tried because no-one knows what it's worth, if anything".

bitcoiners avidly await the next time the truth catches up with these banksters

bitserve

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Quote from: Torque on August 09, 2017, 08:57:24 AM

Quote from: Paashaas on August 09, 2017, 08:30:33 AM

The 2x part will never happen in November but who cares? Bigblockers have finally there BCash coin with no Segwit+8mb blocks...thats what they wanted, right?

Those noobs should stop crying for christ sake...if China didn't HF into BCash then the changes where much higher for the 2x agreement. Double shoot in there own feet lol.

BCash was created for the express purpose of making sure that the scaling debate will continue on into the future ad nauseam and ad infinitum.

The FUDsters can never ever let FUD die, or else Bitcoin wins.

That is all.

News flash:

BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.^{BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.}^{^{BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.}}

But everytime the FUD is defeated Bitcoin comes stronger and higher in price. So.... let the FUD attacks continue!

Torque

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Quote from: Paashaas on August 09, 2017, 08:30:33 AM

The 2x part will never happen in November but who cares? Bigblockers have finally there BCash coin with no Segwit+8mb blocks...thats what they wanted, right?

Those noobs should stop crying for christ sake...if China didn't HF into BCash then the changes where much higher for the 2x agreement. Double shoot in there own feet lol.

BCash was created for the express purpose of making sure that the scaling debate will continue on into the future ad nauseam and ad infinitum.

The FUDsters can never ever let FUD die, or else Bitcoin wins.

That is all.

News flash:

BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.^{BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.}^{^{BITCOIN WILL NEVER BE PERFECT.}}
"Never let Perfect become the enemy of Good Enough."

Paashaas

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Activity: 3620

Merit: 4813

The 2x part will never happen in November but who cares? Bigblockers have finally there BCash coin with no Segwit+8mb blocks...thats what they wanted, right?

Those noobs should stop crying for christ sake...if China didn't HF into BCash then the changes where much higher for the 2x agreement. Double shoot in there own feet lol.

Do people really think moving hunderds of thousands of tx's + multi billion dollar assets/services and other applications just in 1 block...That's way to much ''traffic'' which will lead to heavy
centralization and a good change all those assets goes banana's.

DARKHOLDER

hero member