Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 18407. (Read 26720873 times)

An ibtimes story quotes Charles Hayter estimating that 20% of all funds were lost, provided it had double the coins on deposit compared to last year.

The story says the hack in May last year lost it 1,459 BTC which represented 0.5% of all customer deposits.

If Bitfinex had the same number of coins deposited this year then the hack might have lost it 41% of all customer deposits.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/hong-kong-bitcoin-exchange-bitfinex-reports-65m-btc-stolen-by-hackers-1573968

Ah, if you check them periodically it should be fine. The problem arises when they're unpowered for a long time, as the cells aren't refreshed and the voltage level drops to a point where they become unreadable.

First SSD for me was the veritable Mtron 16GB. Was about the first consumer SSD here in the UK. You could buy a 1TB now for the price and probably still have change.

We NEED a rough estimate of bitfenix's total BTC holdings
this info is simply not available
here we go some conjecture....

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4md665/coinbase_may_have_lied_about_the_number_of/

you'd think bitfinex had a similar amount of coins? right?
so like ~1.5million coins
everyone gets a ~10% hair cut?
wouldn't that be lovely

I also read that Tackett said that Bitfinex was considering a variety of scenarios, so they were not completely taking options off of the table.  I personally believe that in the end, a representation that they are not mixing assets would likely save bitfinex a lot of complications by NOT mixing different asset classes.. so even if they are not taking options off of the table, if they are conceptualizing various scenarios in which they are not going to mix assets, then that is a better arrangement.

On the other hand, if they are conceptualizing scenarios in which their customers are taking losses for their lack of security, then that kind of a conceptualization would have a considerable chance of losing them credibility and good will under their current and potentially future customers.

erroneous loss or erroneous amount of bitcoin available to "socialize" the loss.

if bitfinex held ~230K BTC everyone gets a 50% hair cut

Although Zanetackett keeps talking about scenarios he has stated twice that USD funds will not be susceptible to the socialised loss. I feel for the Bitfinex Bitcoin holders, but it seems the Bitfinex USD funds holders dodged a bullet, provided Bitfinex implements its socialised loss scenario.


https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/4w7o1j/itfinex_update_regarding_margin_funding_providers/d64q1b3


https://www.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/4vtv1m/bitfinex_down_due_to_bitcoin_security_breach/d64qhkr

so market was moving hours before or after the coins moved?

i'm not sure i see a correlation

coinbase fud was full on during the selling

also bitfinex said they lost 119K not 180K

the two smaller moves are probably just normal random movements and unrelated?

Thanks for that link ECB...    The post pretty much states that Bitfinex is going to make a more official update tomorrow, but in the meantime, like you said, Bitfinex is considering a way to socialize losses amongst Bitfinex BTC holders.

 I don't really have a problem with socialized loss in the sense that Bitfinex would later pay back those "losers"... yet, I believe that they are not considering paying back the "losers"...

 I think that it is a bit irresponsible to cause the users to hold the bag... and even though we are finding out some details, we still have to wait for more specifics, which seems to be scheduled to come out tomorrow.

Only to the extent of checking them from time to time. If one were to fail, I'd replace it with a copy from one of the other.

Personally, I've never had an SD card or SSD fail and I was an early adopter of SSDs. I'd hate to admit what I paid for my first PATA 32GB Memorite SSD almost a decade ago but it's still running fine.

When OCZ brought out their first Vertex SATA SSDs, I replaced my Raptor RAID-0 array with 4 of them. When I got my first Revodrive PCIe RAID SSD card, the Vertex cards went into netbooks. All are still working as far AFAIK.

The only flash memory I've had fail were USB keys and that was probably due to physical abuse.

Well, a long time. Say roughly 0.1% fees on 200K per week equals about 10K BTC per year. 15% cut of lending fees would net around 1-2 million per year in USD also (about 3K BTC per year).



Flash memory has limited data retention, have you taken precautions against this?

https://www.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/4vtv1m/bitfinex_down_due_to_bitcoin_security_breach/d64ow17

socialized losses for bitcoin and loans to btc/usd positions. guess we'll know the full facts in a few hours.

Listening to my "stupid-ass repetitive trolling comments" about using exchanges as banks would have saved you money, i.e. you'd have more money than you do today, remember that.

If you at least do not take time to read my relatively short post, then I am not going to take time to respond to your stupid-ass repetitive trolling comments, Lambie, aka... you fucking goofball.        

I didn't read your post but I assume it is some kind of twisted logic on why you let others hold your BTC for you. Well, you did that, and now some of your BTC are gone.

You were derided repeatedly for keeping all your coins on exchanges... and now you've paid a cost for that. Either you learn a lesson from this and do a little research on how to properly secure your own keys, or, you don't. It is was your money. 

Nothing wrong with that... ... Part of the rationale behind efficient market theories is for folks to act in their own self-interests, and to consider what they believe to be their own self-interests from their own perspective. Of course they may get it wrong from time to time, but still.... 

Kind of related to this whole matter, we have quite a few posts in this thread in which posters are attempting to lecture other folks about what they believe to be in the other person's interest or in the interest of folks who have funds on bitfinex as if they know what is in the self-interests of those bitfinex account holders.  That's all fine and dandy, if you happen to have enough information about the other guy's situation.

On the other hand, there may be some guys who may have some unrealistic expectations of wanting to have their cake and eat it too.  the balance is not always going to be clear... Bitfinex does have a duty to communicate about this matter and they have a duty to the users of their system, yet at the same time, we continue to kind of shoot in the dark regarding what is actually going on, what happened and what the path forward is going to be.  Bitfinex agents are surely weighing their options in order to figure out how to deal with this matter in ways to carry out their duties to their customers while weighing the feasibility of their business model and security practices (that is to the extent that they may not be totally scamming, which seems to be a low possibility, even though the nicest of folks may turn into scammers, if they realize that the scammy option is the most feasible under the current circumstances). 

Zanetackett refuses to dismiss the haircut route, but says any haircut estimations (like 63%) are false. Poloniex got hacked for a relatively small amount, and still took forever to pay everyone back. How much does Bitfinex earn in fees, and how long would it take to pay everyone back out of them?

https://www.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/4vtv1m/bitfinex_down_due_to_bitcoin_security_breach/d64magf


https://www.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/4vtv1m/bitfinex_down_due_to_bitcoin_security_breach/d64m7qd

I thought they lost less than half the coins, so why the 63% haircut? I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to go down this route, however. When Poloniex got hacked for 10-15% they did similarly, with a haircut and then gradual reimbursement from their trading fees. Running fractional reserve, in contract, would just cause a run on withdrawals.

I think it's probably total junk. there's so many rumors flying around that people are having fun fabricating things. we'll see. they'll have to come out with some kind of answer relatively soon. i'll be surprised if this is it.

Bread and circuses.

Zanetackett says the Bitfinex site might be back up in view balance only mode by the end of today EST, although that probably means by tomorrow. He's also talking about making an update of where everything stands, but he's refusing to discuss reimbursing customers until after the site's back up.

I doubt we will find out if that tweet is true until after Bitfinex is online again.

https://www.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/4w2osg/daily_discussion_thursday_august_04_2016/d64fayy


https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4vtuxo/bitfinex_security_breach_trading_will_be_halted/d6481sb