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Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 19620. (Read 26608384 times)

hero member
Activity: 737
Merit: 500
Thanks for the explanation on the fullness of the block Smiley

So those few hours with totally full blocks are the sign of the beginning of the end of btc?  Grin

Well I suppose it will be fixed in a way or another.

No, the periods of totally full blocks show that we are hitting the ceiling of the transaction capacity. It's not the beginning of the end of Bitcoin (yet).

Are we?

https://blockchain.info/charts/avg-block-size?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=7&show_header=true&scale=0&address=

Avg size is between 0.5mb and 0.7mb the last few days. Which means there is an extra 40% to 100% available capacity, depending the day.

Of course, it's not about the average size per day (unless you say it's okay to wait a day for your transaction to be  processed). It's about the occurrence of periods that the network is maxxed out. The more often these periods occur and the longer they last, the more degraded the user experience becomes, as I experienced myself a couple of times already.

And the size of blocks mined doesn't tell everything. There are regularly empty blocks, and sometimes miners don't fill up blocks despite plenty of tx waiting to be included. So not all available tx capacity is actually used by all miners.

In the end it's the user experience that matters, whether this is confirmation time or tx fee. If these goes down hill, usage will shrink, user adoption will stall. Stalling adaption will hurt the confidence of the users and ultimately the price of BTC.
legendary
Activity: 1615
Merit: 1000
Yeah seems like blocks are full only from time to time, it's not a global phenomenon. So we won't see a problem in transaction yet!

Yep, and even when blocks are full, if it's just 0-fee transactions that don't go through, that's not such a big problem IMO.

The interesting question is: When transactions with fees start getting stuck in the queue, what happens to the sum of fees? If enough users need to use Bitcoin, then the sum will stay the same or rise. It could also be that even with some users paying more for their transactions, the fees would still add up to less than if all, or some, of the lower-paying TX's had been included. These would be users who are willing to pay some fee, but not whatever fee a limited blocksize leads to.

A hard cap on blocksize takes away the miners' ability to choose what kind of transactions are most economical for them to process. IMO it also takes away any chance of finding a fair price for transactions vs. resource usage since the resource usage is capped by dictate.
full member
Activity: 756
Merit: 100

Yeah seems like blocks are full only from time to time, it's not a global phenomenon. So we won't see a problem in transaction yet!
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
legendary
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1014
Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC
If First Mover advantage is lost, whether it takes years or months, it will be gone forever.  Yeah, Bitcoin will still be around. Hell, MySpace is still around, but The escape route from Bankster tyranny will have been blocked.

Goldman sachs and govcoin can never replicate some of bitcoins best attributes:soverign, immutable, no KYC. and extremely unlikely to replicate other features that make bitcoin so great : limited , disinflationary.

Once you know this , you will have no fear of these private blockchains.

https://www.onthewire.io/new-york-wants-to-force-vendors-to-decrypt-users-phones/

http://9to5mac.com/2016/01/13/new-york-backdoor-access-bill/

http://www.coindesk.com/fincen-fines-ripple-labs-700000-bank-secrecy-act/

Private companies are swell. You can even fine them.
full member
Activity: 756
Merit: 100
Thanks for the explanation on the fullness of the block Smiley

So those few hours with totally full blocks are the sign of the beginning of the end of btc?  Grin

Well I suppose it will be fixed in a way or another.

No, the periods of totally full blocks show that we are hitting the ceiling of the transaction capacity. It's not the beginning of the end of Bitcoin (yet).

It will be fixed. Either by raising the transaction capacity of the network. Or the service becomes too expensive for a part of the users, and the growth of Bitcoin will come to a halt at a quarter of a million transactions per day. And that (given a current user base of only about 1 million) may be the beginning of the end of Bitcoin if the current users (like me, who are expecting growth) lose confidence and start selling their stashes.

Note, the latter situation can develop quite quickly, since the price of Bitcoin is almost entirely based on speculation about its future. Once the hoodlers lose their faith in Bitcoin's future, the price will collapse.

Aw yeaa the fud is fresh and ripe

Is it FUD attempt to have doubt? It would be to yell everywhere "sell sell now it's too dangerous" but just saying that it's a complicated situation where one's faith could be damaged is not FUD...
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
hero member
Activity: 546
Merit: 500
Warning: Confrmed Gavinista

Once you know this , you will have no fear of these private blockchains.

You need to put that into a Matrix meme. Or an Alec Guinness Jedi Mind Trick meme.

Edit:


full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
Thanks for the explanation on the fullness of the block Smiley

So those few hours with totally full blocks are the sign of the beginning of the end of btc?  Grin

Well I suppose it will be fixed in a way or another.

No, the periods of totally full blocks show that we are hitting the ceiling of the transaction capacity. It's not the beginning of the end of Bitcoin (yet).

It will be fixed. Either by raising the transaction capacity of the network. Or the service becomes too expensive for a part of the users, and the growth of Bitcoin will come to a halt at a quarter of a million transactions per day. And that (given a current user base of only about 1 million) may be the beginning of the end of Bitcoin if the current users (like me, who are expecting growth) lose confidence and start selling their stashes.

Note, the latter situation can develop quite quickly, since the price of Bitcoin is almost entirely based on speculation about its future. Once the hoodlers lose their faith in Bitcoin's future, the price will collapse.

Aw yeaa the fud is fresh and ripe
full member
Activity: 756
Merit: 100
Thanks for the explanation on the fullness of the block Smiley

So those few hours with totally full blocks are the sign of the beginning of the end of btc?  Grin

Well I suppose it will be fixed in a way or another.

No, the periods of totally full blocks show that we are hitting the ceiling of the transaction capacity. It's not the beginning of the end of Bitcoin (yet).

It will be fixed. Either by raising the transaction capacity of the network. Or the service becomes too expensive for a part of the users, and the growth of Bitcoin will come to a halt at a quarter of a million transactions per day. And that (given a current user base of only about 1 million) may be the beginning of the end of Bitcoin if the current users (like me, who are expecting growth) lose confidence and start selling their stashes.

Note, the latter situation can develop quite quickly, since the price of Bitcoin is almost entirely based on speculation about its future. Once the hoodlers lose their faith in Bitcoin's future, the price will collapse.

That's right, it's more or less a question of faith when it comes to bitcoin...

I lost mine years ago but it doesn't mean others will too  Wink
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1049
Thanks for the explanation on the fullness of the block Smiley

So those few hours with totally full blocks are the sign of the beginning of the end of btc?  Grin

Well I suppose it will be fixed in a way or another.

No, the periods of totally full blocks show that we are hitting the ceiling of the transaction capacity. It's not the beginning of the end of Bitcoin (yet).

Are we?

https://blockchain.info/charts/avg-block-size?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=7&show_header=true&scale=0&address=

Avg size is between 0.5mb and 0.7mb the last few days. Which means there is an extra 40% to 100% available capacity, depending the day.
hero member
Activity: 546
Merit: 500
Warning: Confrmed Gavinista
Can you give a "for example" on the security patches nodes want besides not being half-broken?

Small sample..


    #6438 2531438 openssl: avoid config file load/race
    #6571 100ac4e libbitcoinconsensus: avoid a crash in multi-threaded environments
    #6694 834e299 [QT] fix thin space word wrap line break issue
    #6703 1cd7952 Backport bugfixes to 0.11
    #6750 5ed8d0b Recent rejects backport to v0.11
    #6769 71cc9d9 Test LowS in standardness, removes nuisance malleability vector.
    #6789 b4ad73f Update miniupnpc to 1.9.20151008
    #6785 b4dc33e Backport to v0.11: In (strCommand == “tx”), return if AlreadyHave()
    #6795 4dbcec0 net: Disable upnp by default



0.11.1 Change log
Detailed release notes follow. This overview includes changes that affect behavior, not code moves, refactors and string updates. For convenience in locating the code changes and accompanying discussion, both the pull request and git merge commit are mentioned.

#6438 2531438 openssl: avoid config file load/race
#6439 980f820 Updated URL location of netinstall for Debian
#6384 8e5a969 qt: Force TLS1.0+ for SSL connections
#6471 92401c2 Depends: bump to qt 5.5
#6224 93b606a Be even stricter in processing unrequested blocks
#6571 100ac4e libbitcoinconsensus: avoid a crash in multi-threaded environments
#6545 649f5d9 Do not store more than 200 timedata samples.
#6694 834e299 [QT] fix thin space word wrap line break issue
#6703 1cd7952 Backport bugfixes to 0.11
#6750 5ed8d0b Recent rejects backport to v0.11
#6769 71cc9d9 Test LowS in standardness, removes nuisance malleability vector.
#6789 b4ad73f Update miniupnpc to 1.9.20151008
#6785 b4dc33e Backport to v0.11: In (strCommand == "tx"), return if AlreadyHave()
#6412 0095b9a Test whether created sockets are select()able
#6795 4dbcec0 net: Disable upnp by default
#6793 e7bcc4a Bump minrelaytxfee default
hero member
Activity: 737
Merit: 500
Thanks for the explanation on the fullness of the block Smiley

So those few hours with totally full blocks are the sign of the beginning of the end of btc?  Grin

Well I suppose it will be fixed in a way or another.

No, the periods of totally full blocks show that we are hitting the ceiling of the transaction capacity. It's not the beginning of the end of Bitcoin (yet).

It will be fixed. Either by raising the transaction capacity of the network. Or the service becomes too expensive for a part of the users, and the growth of Bitcoin will come to a halt at a quarter of a million transactions per day. And that (given a current user base of only about 1 million) may be the beginning of the end of Bitcoin if the current users (like me, who are expecting growth) lose confidence and start selling their stashes.

Note, the latter situation can develop quite quickly, since the price of Bitcoin is almost entirely based on speculation about its future. Once the hoodlers lose their faith in Bitcoin's future, the price will collapse.
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
sr. member
Activity: 392
Merit: 250
I would rather have all those issues than be half broken. Simple fix for upnp... don't allow it.

Imagine if "we" could be not broken and have bug fixes at the same time, plus 2MB blocks, why didn't anyone think of this...?

Imagine if you could code (or pay someone to code) you could actually fix all those things you perceive as being broken, make changes to your hearts content ... instead of sitting on the sidelines, back-seat driving, monday morning quarter-backing and generally sounding like a pompous know-it-all.

Why didn't you think of that?

Thankfully, like-minded people... investors, coders, miners, and exchanges are beginning to coalesce around something I agree with. Our mutual self interests align... Imagine that... could it be possible?

legendary
Activity: 3920
Merit: 2349
Eadem mutata resurgo
Can you give a "for example" on the security patches nodes want besides not being half-broken?

Small sample..


    #6438 2531438 openssl: avoid config file load/race
    #6571 100ac4e libbitcoinconsensus: avoid a crash in multi-threaded environments
    #6694 834e299 [QT] fix thin space word wrap line break issue
    #6703 1cd7952 Backport bugfixes to 0.11
    #6750 5ed8d0b Recent rejects backport to v0.11
    #6769 71cc9d9 Test LowS in standardness, removes nuisance malleability vector.
    #6789 b4ad73f Update miniupnpc to 1.9.20151008
    #6785 b4dc33e Backport to v0.11: In (strCommand == “tx”), return if AlreadyHave()
    #6795 4dbcec0 net: Disable upnp by default



I would rather have all those issues than be half broken. Simple fix for upnp... don't allow it.

Imagine if "we" could be not broken and have bug fixes at the same time, plus 2MB blocks, why didn't anyone think of this...?

Imagine if you could code (or pay someone to code) you could actually fix all those things you perceive as being broken, make changes to your hearts content ... instead of sitting on the sidelines, back-seat driving, monday morning quarter-backing and generally sounding like a pompous know-it-all.

Why didn't you think of that?
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
sr. member
Activity: 392
Merit: 250
Can you give a "for example" on the security patches nodes want besides not being half-broken?

Small sample..


    #6438 2531438 openssl: avoid config file load/race
    #6571 100ac4e libbitcoinconsensus: avoid a crash in multi-threaded environments
    #6694 834e299 [QT] fix thin space word wrap line break issue
    #6703 1cd7952 Backport bugfixes to 0.11
    #6750 5ed8d0b Recent rejects backport to v0.11
    #6769 71cc9d9 Test LowS in standardness, removes nuisance malleability vector.
    #6789 b4ad73f Update miniupnpc to 1.9.20151008
    #6785 b4dc33e Backport to v0.11: In (strCommand == “tx”), return if AlreadyHave()
    #6795 4dbcec0 net: Disable upnp by default



I would rather have all those issues than be half broken. Simple fix for upnp... don't allow it.

Imagine if "we" could be not broken and have bug fixes at the same time, plus 2MB blocks, why didn't anyone think of this...?
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