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Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 21970. (Read 26608844 times)

sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 251
Why is Bitfinex so bearish compared to others?


That. BTC-E is normally $5-10 under finex.
It's been almost $2 between Huobi and Bitfinex for a couple of days. I have been thinking for a while about starting arbitrage trading. I don't believe in TA (Asstrology) and I can't predict the future. Also, it's easy and cheap to move BTC between exchanges (but not other currencies, could be a disadvantage). I have never traded on an exchange before (I just bought my bitcoins from a guy), yet I watch Bitcoinwisdom and am capable of coding my own user interface with the exchanges APIs. I don't want to make a "bot" (even if I actually could, given time and money), but more like a button I can press when two exchanges are in disharmony (One sell, one buy, same amount of BTC).

My question is: Do anybody in this thread have experience with arbitrage trading? Are the margins too small?

There it is. Now, time for "FRIDAY NIGHT VODKA PARTY ALONE IN A TWO ROOM FLAT IN THE SUBURBS OF OSLO"!!! Whoohoooooo!   Undecided

I've done some arbitrage between BTC-E & Bitfinex, stopped doing it no matter I've been in the profit with it. There are several reasons for that.

First there's a problem with moving LTC as secondary currency between exchanges, you can not move US$ so you have to move something to balance the sheets between the cycles. LTC transactions are fast, but not fast enough that LTC fluctuations don't eat your profit. Remember that all bots are doing the same as your bot is doing at that moment when profit margin opens, so the price moves in worse possible direction for you and it moves fast, as fast as best bots can do it, and there are some very good bots out there. If you decide to put permanent amount of LTC on the exchanges, and move them only while nothing happens, general decrease in LTC value also eats your profits. Exchange fees are far from neglectable, if you have to make usual 4-trade cycle to close the arbitrage you have to pay 0.1% + 0.2% + 0.1% + 0.2% = 0.6% fee, you'll find that eats your 1% arbitrage opportunity quickly. There''s also big problem that your bot must take care not only of the prices (which is trivial) but also with the volumes (which is not). Good luck calculating estimations if your bot will be able to close the whole open position when LTC completes withdraw & deposit transaction from one exchange to another.

All above considered I can tell you firsthand that: yes, it can be done, but it was not worth the effort and risk for me. It's easier to trade and profit on the exchanges then to arbitrage between them.

Thanks! You kind of confirmed my suspicions. For me, the tempting ones are when BTC-E is 3-4% lower than the rest. But last time I looked at it the problem was that to make any real money from it I would have to trade with a larger volume than the price could carry. So it would, as you say, be a lot of work and risk for peanuts. But some kind of arbitrage would be cool, if only to get a soft entry into trading.
Yepp, let's leave it to the china bots. They are faster, and more complex. The arbitrage upside has probably been exploited for two years in bitcoinland. I understand that it's no place for me in this concept. But I don't worry. I just have to kick back as a long term hodler and wait.... Mo ha ha ha ha ha herk prft....
legendary
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1014
Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC
Why is Bitfinex so bearish compared to others?


That. BTC-E is normally $5-10 under finex.
It's been almost $2 between Huobi and Bitfinex for a couple of days. I have been thinking for a while about starting arbitrage trading. I don't believe in TA (Asstrology) and I can't predict the future. Also, it's easy and cheap to move BTC between exchanges (but not other currencies, could be a disadvantage). I have never traded on an exchange before (I just bought my bitcoins from a guy), yet I watch Bitcoinwisdom and am capable of coding my own user interface with the exchanges APIs. I don't want to make a "bot" (even if I actually could, given time and money), but more like a button I can press when two exchanges are in disharmony (One sell, one buy, same amount of BTC).

My question is: Do anybody in this thread have experience with arbitrage trading? Are the margins too small?

There it is. Now, time for "FRIDAY NIGHT VODKA PARTY ALONE IN A TWO ROOM FLAT IN THE SUBURBS OF OSLO"!!! Whoohoooooo!   Undecided

I've done some arbitrage between BTC-E & Bitfinex, stopped doing it no matter I've been in the profit with it. There are several reasons for that.

First there's a problem with moving LTC as secondary currency between exchanges, you can not move US$ so you have to move something to balance the sheets between the cycles. LTC transactions are fast, but not fast enough that LTC fluctuations don't eat your profit. Remember that all bots are doing the same as your bot is doing at that moment when profit margin opens, so the price moves in worse possible direction for you and it moves fast, as fast as best bots can do it, and there are some very good bots out there. If you decide to put permanent amount of LTC on the exchanges, and move them only while nothing happens, general decrease in LTC value also eats your profits. Exchange fees are far from neglectable, if you have to make usual 4-trade cycle to close the arbitrage you have to pay 0.1% + 0.2% + 0.1% + 0.2% = 0.6% fee, you'll find that eats your 1% arbitrage opportunity quickly. There''s also big problem that your bot must take care not only of the prices (which is trivial) but also with the volumes (which is not). Good luck calculating estimations if your bot will be able to close the whole open position when LTC completes withdraw & deposit transaction from one exchange to another.

All above considered I can tell you firsthand that: yes, it can be done, but it was not worth the effort and risk for me. It's easier to trade and profit on the exchanges then to arbitrage between them.

Thanks! You kind of confirmed my suspicions. For me, the tempting ones are when BTC-E is 3-4% lower than the rest. But last time I looked at it the problem was that to make any real money from it I would have to trade with a larger volume than the price could carry. So it would, as you say, be a lot of work and risk for peanuts. But some kind of arbitrage would be cool, if only to get a soft entry into trading.
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 251
On monday, everything explodes.
Yes, it's an animalistic instinct based on some recent facts.
If I'm wrong, you all get to paintball my sorry ass....  Embarrassed
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 251
Why is Bitfinex so bearish compared to others?


That. BTC-E is normally $5-10 under finex.
It's been almost $2 between Huobi and Bitfinex for a couple of days. I have been thinking for a while about starting arbitrage trading. I don't believe in TA (Asstrology) and I can't predict the future. Also, it's easy and cheap to move BTC between exchanges (but not other currencies, could be a disadvantage). I have never traded on an exchange before (I just bought my bitcoins from a guy), yet I watch Bitcoinwisdom and am capable of coding my own user interface with the exchanges APIs. I don't want to make a "bot" (even if I actually could, given time and money), but more like a button I can press when two exchanges are in disharmony (One sell, one buy, same amount of BTC).

My question is: Do anybody in this thread have experience with arbitrage trading? Are the margins too small?

There it is. Now, time for "FRIDAY NIGHT VODKA PARTY ALONE IN A TWO ROOM FLAT IN THE SUBURBS OF OSLO"!!! Whoohoooooo!   Undecided

I've done some arbitrage between BTC-E & Bitfinex, stopped doing it no matter I've been in the profit with it. There are several reasons for that.

First there's a problem with moving LTC as secondary currency between exchanges, you can not move US$ so you have to move something to balance the sheets between the cycles. LTC transactions are fast, but not fast enough that LTC fluctuations don't eat your profit. Remember that all bots are doing the same as your bot is doing at that moment when profit margin opens, so the price moves in worse possible direction for you and it moves fast, as fast as best bots can do it, and there are some very good bots out there. If you decide to put permanent amount of LTC on the exchanges, and move them only while nothing happens, general decrease in LTC value also eats your profits. Exchange fees are far from neglectable, if you have to make usual 4-trade cycle to close the arbitrage you have to pay 0.1% + 0.2% + 0.1% + 0.2% = 0.6% fee, you'll find that eats your 1% arbitrage opportunity quickly. There''s also big problem that your bot must take care not only of the prices (which is trivial) but also with the volumes (which is not). Good luck calculating estimations if your bot will be able to close the whole open position when LTC completes withdraw & deposit transaction from one exchange to another.

All above considered I can tell you firsthand that: yes, it can be done, but it was not worth the effort and risk for me. It's easier to trade and profit on the exchanges then to arbitrage between them.
Ok, thanks man. The margins are just too tight. I see max 0,8 % difference between the Huobi and Bitfinex. But this little difference can go on for 2-3 days.

I should probably stay out of this game, ha ha  Grin
legendary
Activity: 1974
Merit: 1077
Honey badger just does not care
Why is Bitfinex so bearish compared to others?


That. BTC-E is normally $5-10 under finex.
It's been almost $2 between Huobi and Bitfinex for a couple of days. I have been thinking for a while about starting arbitrage trading. I don't believe in TA (Asstrology) and I can't predict the future. Also, it's easy and cheap to move BTC between exchanges (but not other currencies, could be a disadvantage). I have never traded on an exchange before (I just bought my bitcoins from a guy), yet I watch Bitcoinwisdom and am capable of coding my own user interface with the exchanges APIs. I don't want to make a "bot" (even if I actually could, given time and money), but more like a button I can press when two exchanges are in disharmony (One sell, one buy, same amount of BTC).

My question is: Do anybody in this thread have experience with arbitrage trading? Are the margins too small?

There it is. Now, time for "FRIDAY NIGHT VODKA PARTY ALONE IN A TWO ROOM FLAT IN THE SUBURBS OF OSLO"!!! Whoohoooooo!   Undecided

I've done some arbitrage between BTC-E & Bitfinex, stopped doing it no matter I've been in the profit with it. There are several reasons for that.

First there's a problem with moving LTC as secondary currency between exchanges, you can not move US$ so you have to move something to balance the sheets between the cycles. LTC transactions are fast, but not fast enough that LTC fluctuations don't eat your profit. Remember that all bots are doing the same as your bot is doing at that moment when profit margin opens, so the price moves in worse possible direction for you and it moves fast, as fast as best bots can do it, and there are some very good bots out there. If you decide to put permanent amount of LTC on the exchanges, and move them only while nothing happens, general decrease in LTC value also eats your profits. Exchange fees are far from neglectable, if you have to make usual 4-trade cycle to close the arbitrage you have to pay 0.1% + 0.2% + 0.1% + 0.2% = 0.6% fee, you'll find that eats your 1% arbitrage opportunity quickly. There''s also big problem that your bot must take care not only of the prices (which is trivial) but also with the volumes (which is not). Good luck calculating estimations if your bot will be able to close the whole open position when LTC completes withdraw & deposit transaction from one exchange to another.

All above considered I can tell you firsthand that: yes, it can be done, but it was not worth the effort and risk for me. It's easier to trade and profit on the exchanges then to arbitrage between them.
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
legendary
Activity: 1246
Merit: 1000
103 days, 21 hours and 10 minutes.
Meh... Opened a few more quarterly contracts.

Keeping the ass end super soft.

super soft would mean 10x, but I know your went 20x probably
legendary
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1014
Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC
legendary
Activity: 4018
Merit: 1250
Owner at AltQuick.com
Meh... Opened a few more quarterly contracts.

Keeping the ass end super soft.
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
hero member
Activity: 560
Merit: 500
Another day, another tiny bulltrap. Best tactic in downtrend: shorts for few days, longs only for few hours rebounds.
1300 cny or below next week pretty likely.
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
legendary
Activity: 2352
Merit: 1064
Bitcoin is antisemitic
hello poor bitcoin fuckers.

still fighting this downtrend?

just sit tight and relax.

legendary
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1014
Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC
I whish you lived in Oslo, fatty. Then we could have a beer and talk Wink

I could pm you whenever I'm down there.
You should! I'm really into this "EDB-penger" shit!

Today, I had a meeting with a VAT specialist from KPMG to remove the extreme norwegian rule to put 25% VAT on the full amount of EVERY transfer between bitcoin and NOK.

I assume you have heard about Sturles great effort to collect money from the community through Lighthouse to pay those shitty, dirty whores from Deloitte in Trondheim.

I'm so upset, I don't have the words! Sturle is the greatest, most up front and steady guy who has been asking norwegian tax authorithys about guidelines regarding NOK/BTC exchanging for several years in many letters, with a passive and weak response.

And then he does a fantastic fundraiser, gets the amount in two days and hires the "services" from the nasty company Deloitte in Trondheim! And what do the assholes do? They fuck Sturle (and all the people giving funds, and all the people trying to invent/create a living in Norway after the oil is gone.)

I'm almost as angry as I am drunk right now! But I know one thing:

Deloitte in Norway are actually paying Google for advertising their "services" (read: buttfucking) related to bitcoin. (Try to google "bitcoin" from a norwegian IP).

And some international companies make contact with me because they want to establish bitcoin business in Norway. I'm just the MC of Oslo Bitcoin Meetup (I'm just a party fixer).

But I tell you this: Deloitte is going to burn hard and die together with their bank brothers on my bitcoin barbecue while I laugh my heart out and point at them!!!!!!!

I'm sorry, but I'm not up to speed with what you're talking about. Any links?
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 251
Good thing I bought 20 bitcoins this week at around 217!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Well done! Keep it for 3 years. And don't let a second party store it for you. Put it on a paper wallet!
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
Good thing I bought 20 bitcoins this week at around 217!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

wow... thats a bargain price, i hope a bear sold it to you  Grin Grin Grin Cheesy Cheesy
sr. member
Activity: 290
Merit: 250
Good thing I bought 20 bitcoins this week at around 217!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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