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Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 25607. (Read 26609624 times)

legendary
Activity: 1470
Merit: 1007
there are 0 benefits for users with 0 btc to use paypal with btc.

like I said, only early adopters who bought really cheap coins could benefit from it for some micropayment, if the fees are reasonable.



One word: moving the goalposts.

(Okay, more like three words.)


even if paypal takes 0 fees for transactions (why would they do that?) you still have to transfer your money from bank to btc exchanges and pay fees for their services.

too much of a hassle for 1 micropayment for a new user.

Not the point. Maybe users will adopt Bitcoin, maybe they won't.

I'm simply pointing out the 'moving goalposts' type responses: A year ago, it was more or less considered a fact by the skeptics that merchants and payment processors (like Paypal) would never adopt Bitcoin. If I have a bit more time, I'll go dig out the posts.

Turns out, that wasn't the case. Merchant adoption is actually picking up quite nicely. Paypal getting on board (cautiously, but still) is pretty big. So now the new argument is: "Okay, so maybe *merchants* are interested, but consumers simply don't care."

Right now, I tend to agree  - user adoption is lagging behind.

What I don't agree with however is the notion that it needs to stay like that, for some rock solid logical reason ("fees will always be higher" etc.).

To me it simply looks like we took one major step in the right direction (merchant adoption, payment options), which means one major risk factor is removed (that you can't spend bitcoins). The future will tell if and how user adoption will kick. Might take some additional incentives, or improved security for users, or maybe just better exchanges, but there's no coherent reason why user adoption cannot happen, imo.
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 254
...
I live in South East Asia, I live on around $2000 a month. That's in a nice villa, with a nice car, and I eat out at least 2x a day (in western restaurants not local food)

in Europe my lifestyle would eat 90% of my income, over here I save >75% of my income.

In most of US, you wouldn't be able to afford your lifestyle, period.  I lived on $2k a month (NYC) and trust me, there was no talk of "villas" or saving Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1029


I have some business issues in the US of A that I am trying to get in order - otherwise I am considering various ways to become location independent.  Currently, I am attracted to south east asia, more than europe - and part of my thinking is that I can live a lot better on a lot less (accordingly, live well within my means, and continue to accumulate wealth with a mostly passive income).  Potentially, later in life, I will be able to travel and live in more expensive areas...... Well, anyhow, this is more of a work of progress than anything set in stone...

Further, I am anticipating that there are going to be a lot of ongoing wishy-washy developments and adjustments when it comes to various tax treatments of BTC... from what I understand, Americans traveling abroad would NOT be required to count the gains of their spent BTC, so long as those BTC are spent overseas.

Regarding number of merchants, the more the better, and regarding spending, there are a lot of mixed blessings about that, and the USA, as most of us already realize, has one of the worst spending records - and some of the american consumerism habits are spreading to other areas around the world... NO simple solutions there when it comes to inequality and wasteful spending while some people are barely able to scratch by meager livings others are living wastefully high on the hog.  Seems to be a topic beyond the scope of this thread (though this thread seems to be fairly tolerant of a variety of topics so long as they are anywhere remotely connected to BTC walls - and even then... ooofffffta...).   Cheesy

I think we have a lot in common, I became "location independent" about 2 years ago now.

I live in South East Asia, I live on around $2000 a month. That's in a nice villa, with a nice car, and I eat out at least 2x a day (in western restaurants not local food)

in Europe my lifestyle would eat 90% of my income, over here I save >75% of my income.




sr. member
Activity: 980
Merit: 256
Decentralized Ascending Auctions on Blockchain


I have some business issues in the US of A that I am trying to get in order - otherwise I am considering various ways to become location independent.  Currently, I am attracted to south east asia, more than europe - and part of my thinking is that I can live a lot better on a lot less (accordingly, live well within my means, and continue to accumulate wealth with a mostly passive income).  Potentially, later in life, I will be able to travel and live in more expensive areas...... Well, anyhow, this is more of a work of progress than anything set in stone...

Further, I am anticipating that there are going to be a lot of ongoing wishy-washy developments and adjustments when it comes to various tax treatments of BTC... from what I understand, Americans traveling abroad would NOT be required to count the gains of their spent BTC, so long as those BTC are spent overseas.

Regarding number of merchants, the more the better, and regarding spending, there are a lot of mixed blessings about that, and the USA, as most of us already realize, has one of the worst spending records - and some of the american consumerism habits are spreading to other areas around the world... NO simple solutions there when it comes to inequality and wasteful spending while some people are barely able to scratch by meager livings others are living wastefully high on the hog.  Seems to be a topic beyond the scope of this thread (though this thread seems to be fairly tolerant of a variety of topics so long as they are anywhere remotely connected to BTC walls - and even then... ooofffffta...).   Cheesy

I think we have a lot in common, I became "location independent" about 2 years ago now.

I live in South East Asia, I live on around $2000 a month. That's in a nice villa, with a nice car, and I eat out at least 2x a day (in western restaurants not local food)

in Europe my lifestyle would eat 90% of my income, over here I save >75% of my income.


legendary
Activity: 1736
Merit: 1001
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 254
there are 0 benefits for users with 0 btc to use paypal with btc.

like I said, only early adopters who bought really cheap coins could benefit from it for some micropayment, if the fees are reasonable.



One word: moving the goalposts.

(Okay, more like three words.)


even if paypal takes 0 fees for transactions (why would they do that?) you still have to transfer your money to btc exchanges and pay the fees for their services.

too much of a hassle for 1 micropayment for a new user.

Gentlemen!  The issue at hand is much simpler than it appears.  Allow me to illustrate:



*The night crew can't be trusted with Bitcoin.  Exchanges should remain open only between 9am and 5pm, EST Angry
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
Moderator
I´m, going to place some orders on BTC-E ~80-150$ for the coming days.  Cool Smiley
400$ doesn´t seem to be sustainable much longer.
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
Moderator
gnu bash vulnerability fear mongering going on /r/bitcoin, be safe do your research.

what does it mean?

It means that exchanges can be hacked (if they weren't already) using this exploit, until they patch the affected systems.
http://arstechnica.com/security/2014/09/bug-in-bash-shell-creates-big-security-hole-on-anything-with-nix-in-it/


https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/huobi-withdrawal-resumed-after-misoperation-involving-920btc-796289

Huobi already gave away 920 free Bitcoins and ~8000 LTC ..
Don´t know if that has something to do with it.
They claim that they already received 800BTC back from the users....
hero member
Activity: 616
Merit: 500
And btc-e almost breakind down the 400's Sad

Weekend dump, except by the fact we are not in the weekend
legendary
Activity: 2338
Merit: 2106
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1000
bitcoinwisdom down?
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
hero member
Activity: 616
Merit: 500
Why the weekend trap in the middle of the week?

We are supposed to go moon, not to fall again:(

Where is the bubble we were supposed to see in september ?
legendary
Activity: 1232
Merit: 1011
there are 0 benefits for users with 0 btc to use paypal with btc.

like I said, only early adopters who bought really cheap coins could benefit from it for some micropayment, if the fees are reasonable.



One word: moving the goalposts.

(Okay, more like three words.)


even if paypal takes 0 fees for transactions (why would they do that?) you still have to transfer your money from bank to btc exchanges and pay fees for their services.

too much of a hassle for 1 micropayment for a new user.
legendary
Activity: 1470
Merit: 1007
there are 0 benefits for users with 0 btc to use paypal with btc.

like I said, only early adopters who bought really cheap coins could benefit from it for some micropayment, if the fees are reasonable.



One word: moving the goalposts.

(Okay, more like three words.)
sr. member
Activity: 270
Merit: 250
cut your looses before its too latex !!

you should have sold at 450, too late now buddy

i am shotr since late Aug and will be for another month

but for you hodlers, you may find comfort here : http://chartfactory.com/

Bitstamp / Bitfinex        nice / nice
legendary
Activity: 3920
Merit: 11299
Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"
^ i don't know where all the hate for MMI comes from.  Back in the day he mined and was hugely bullish.  He reads the charts and now calls a bear market = everyone pours vitriol and hate.

This sort of behaviour simply reinforces the cultist profile of BTC users -- tow the party line or be ridiculed.  Sad but I guess a symptom of the interweb these days.

I think doge is stoopid but I don't spend all day on a doge forum gloating about the price of dogecoin and insisting people recognise that I was right all along.

That's why people dislike him, because only an asshole would spend so much time and energy on something they dislike.

+1     Wink
legendary
Activity: 3920
Merit: 11299
Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"
....
Seems to be a topic beyond the scope of this thread (though this thread seems to be fairly tolerant of a variety of topics so long as they are anywhere remotely connected to BTC walls - and even then... ooofffffta...).   Cheesy
Agreed. To stick to speculation, I speculate the main problem at the mo is the same one that allowed the dominance of the Roman empire, a small but coordinated force can defeat a much larger uncoordinated force and that looks like a problem on all markets, btc is small fry in comparison.
The decaying oscillations are interesting there. Its a means by which a small force can have big effects and the principle is used in all kinds of things, its also very easy to detect and influence. A distributed bot would easily overwhelm it, basically folks running the bot would pick a bull or bear role with their holdings and the bot would push in one direction or the other, it would amplify rather than decay but overall it would add weight and thus stability to the market. It would mean trusting exchanges though and imho that's a bad idea until distributed exchanges come into common use (or exchanges that keep your holdings in multisig wallets under shared control).
EDIT: There's no need for communication between bots, the oscillations are the signal and the bot take an action on detection.

I would NOT give the smaller force as being more coordinated, they just seem to have more opportunities to dump BTC, which creates the appearance of coordination.  So, the easier it is to get in fiat and to flood the markets with fiat (at the whims of the people interested in BTC), then the more difficult it will become for the bears to manipulate the price down with their ability to easily move their BTC around.... Fiat is NOT so easy to move and there are quite a few financial barriers to move around fiat... but if that moving around of fiat (just getting it onto an exchange quickly, easily and inexpensively) is made easier, then watch out BEARS!!!! Wink
sr. member
Activity: 980
Merit: 256
Decentralized Ascending Auctions on Blockchain
Paypal is bigger than that, if they offer bitcoin as a payment method to their customers, unless they're only one way (which I doubt) they'd need to keep them on hand for their customers to both pay with and receive.

It wouldn't be like dell dumping it all on bitpay, paypal would need a certain amount of btc in their reserve

I understood that PayPal is merely accepting dollars from BitPay/Coinbase/Coinsetter and delivering them to merchants who subscribe to PayPal.  And for "digital goods" only. And only in North America. Isn't that so?

In other words, it is just like Dell: people who buy BTC now (on the exchanges or over the counter, in bulk or retail) are paying the shopping bills of owners of old cheap coins who choose to "pay with bitcoin".  Only that there is one more intermediary (PayPal) taking their fee.

Yeah, so far. No one expected paypal to turn around and say "fuck dollars we're now a bitcoin only business" at one fell swoop
legendary
Activity: 1232
Merit: 1011
there are 0 benefits for users with 0 btc to use paypal with btc.

like I said, only early adopters who bought really cheap coins could benefit from it for some micropayment, if the fees are reasonable.

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