Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 27259. (Read 26634273 times)
June 10, 2014, 06:57:44 AM
Philosophical squared circles? It seems Jorge has trolled us all. Good work, sir!
June 10, 2014, 06:52:15 AM
Saying that math concepts are in reality independent of a mind is like saying that the concept of a chair is the object to which it refers with the word "chair".
I can think of the concept squared circle, does it have any reality outside of my mind? It seems to be an impossibility.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reification_(fallacy)
I can think of the concept squared circle, does it have any reality outside of my mind? It seems to be an impossibility.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reification_(fallacy)
June 10, 2014, 06:45:58 AM
Well, we have a major disagreement here.
The gov exhibits behavior suggesting that its goals are precisely the ones you've mentioned. Now it might not have been a conscious choice by any individual or group of individuals to make it so (which helps explain the persistent myth of the "government as servant"), but there we have it. You say it's selfish and thieving people using the gov for their own purposes. I say the very structure of gov provides incentive for such behavior and prohibits honest and non-corrupt behavior.
And government as a monopolistic, hierarchical structure with the legal monopoly of initiating force will be abandoned one day, believe it or NOT
But first stable, proven, decentralized alternatives with a track record of superior efficiency need to emerge.
Hear, hear! The gov exhibits behavior suggesting that its goals are precisely the ones you've mentioned. Now it might not have been a conscious choice by any individual or group of individuals to make it so (which helps explain the persistent myth of the "government as servant"), but there we have it. You say it's selfish and thieving people using the gov for their own purposes. I say the very structure of gov provides incentive for such behavior and prohibits honest and non-corrupt behavior.
And government as a monopolistic, hierarchical structure with the legal monopoly of initiating force will be abandoned one day, believe it or NOT
But first stable, proven, decentralized alternatives with a track record of superior efficiency need to emerge.
June 10, 2014, 06:40:35 AM
What a piece of work is a man, how noble in reason,
how infinite in faculties, in form and moving,
how express and admirable in action, how like an angel in apprehension,
how like a god!
how infinite in faculties, in form and moving,
how express and admirable in action, how like an angel in apprehension,
how like a god!
June 10, 2014, 06:37:43 AM
Discovered math where? Where did it exist?
In Hilbert space, of course. (Well, technically, Banach space.)
Those are concepts too :s
June 10, 2014, 06:36:42 AM
[snip]
but the government has NOT been designed purposefully to engage in thievery nor as a ponzi scheme nor are the various governmental systems something that can be merely abandoned and start anew, believe it or NOT. Even though some people use the government and its various related institutions for variou kinds of selfish and thievery purposes, it was NOT designed for such
[snip]
but the government has NOT been designed purposefully to engage in thievery nor as a ponzi scheme nor are the various governmental systems something that can be merely abandoned and start anew, believe it or NOT. Even though some people use the government and its various related institutions for variou kinds of selfish and thievery purposes, it was NOT designed for such
[snip]
Well, we have a major disagreement here.
The gov exhibits behavior suggesting that its goals are precisely the ones you've mentioned. Now it might not have been a conscious choice by any individual or group of individuals to make it so (which helps explain the persistent myth of the "government as servant"), but there we have it. You say it's selfish and thieving people using the gov for their own purposes. I say the very structure of gov provides incentive for such behavior and prohibits honest and non-corrupt behavior.
And government as a monopolistic, hierarchical structure with the legal monopoly of initiating force will be abandoned one day, believe it or NOT
But first stable, proven, decentralized alternatives with a track record of superior efficiency need to emerge.
June 10, 2014, 06:34:13 AM
I often forget that y'all are not in my mind. (Or rather, that y'all are not aware that y'all are in my mind.) Sorry.
Existential crisis incoming.
June 10, 2014, 06:33:45 AM
Discovered math where? Where did it exist?
In Hilbert space, of course. (Well, technically, Banach space.)
June 10, 2014, 06:32:18 AM
Dear JorgeStolfi, you are wrong on so many levels!! 
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
Math was made by man
The mathematics of 1 + 1 equals 2 already existed billion years ago.
Discovered math where? Where did it exist?
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men...
Math was made by man
Excepting, of course, the natural numbers.
Hun? Math is an abstract tool that helps us making models of the world among other things. How are the natural numbers any different?
A lot of mathematicians seems to be platonists, like if mathematical concepts had an independent reality outside of man... but that's just naive dogmatism.
'Kronecker might be the most famous of the Pre-Intuitionists for his singular and oft quoted phrase, "God made the natural numbers; all else is the work of man."'
I often forget that y'all are not in my mind. (Or rather, that y'all are not aware that y'all are in my mind.) Sorry.
Yep it is indeed similar do the belief in god.
I'm not a mathematical intuitionist, but formalist. Anyway, maybe this is not the right place to talk about philosophy of mathematics
June 10, 2014, 06:30:23 AM
You are just right, there is no proof. The article contains lots of other inaccuracies also.
But its F1 score is still best! Then you will realize the truth: That it is not the theorem which requires proof; it is only yourself. June 10, 2014, 06:27:35 AM
Dear JorgeStolfi, you are wrong on so many levels!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
Math was made by man
Even if maths were made by man, which is pretty debatible, it doen´t change that the laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men.
June 10, 2014, 06:25:58 AM
Church Turing
Glad I am not an altar boy in Church Turing.
Wow, so many happy today.
Nice one. That's what I get for not writing the dash.
Doesn't matter though. I'm sure it's well within the power of a TM to feel doubt about the confines of the TM.
June 10, 2014, 06:24:51 AM
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men...
Math was made by man
Excepting, of course, the natural numbers.
Hun? Math is an abstract tool that helps us making models of the world among other things. How are the natural numbers any different?
A lot of mathematicians seems to be platonists, like if mathematical concepts had an independent reality outside of man... but that's just naive dogmatism.
'Kronecker might be the most famous of the Pre-Intuitionists for his singular and oft quoted phrase, "God made the natural numbers; all else is the work of man."'
I often forget that y'all are not in my mind. (Or rather, that y'all are not aware that y'all are in my mind.) Sorry.
June 10, 2014, 06:23:30 AM
why don't you enlighten us as to why it isn't?
Because I am only an old retard, you are the ones who know bitcoin inside out. Do your homework, and tell me: where is that "pure incorruptible mathematics" proof?You are just right, there is no proof. The article contains lots of other inaccuracies also. Time to move on.
June 10, 2014, 06:21:59 AM
Church Turing
Glad I am not an altar boy in Church Turing.
Wow, so many happy today.
June 10, 2014, 06:21:25 AM
Dear JorgeStolfi, you are wrong on so many levels!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
Math was made by man
Excepting, of course, the natural numbers.
Hun? Math is an abstract tool that helps us making models of the world among other things. How are the natural numbers any different?
A lot of mathematicians seems to be platonists, like if mathematical concepts had an independent reality outside of man... but that's just naive dogmatism.
June 10, 2014, 06:18:26 AM
why don't you enlighten us as to why it isn't?
Because I am only an old retard, you are the ones who know bitcoin inside out. Do your homework, and tell me: where is that "pure incorruptible mathematics" proof?You have a certain point, Jorge, but it isn't to do with mathematics.
You probably get frustrated reading posts from people enthusing about Bitcoin without knowing how it works.
So it's tempting to ask people, "Do you really know what you are talking about?"
But could I ask, at dinner parties are you in the habit of berating the person next to you because they don't know how credit card encryption works?
Although I suppose most people don't spend their time enthusing about credit cards at dinner parties - that would be pretty annoying.
Still, if you have such a low opinion of Bitcoiners you are not obliged to spend so much time on Bitcointalk...
June 10, 2014, 06:18:09 AM
Dear JorgeStolfi, you are wrong on so many levels!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
Math was made by man
Excepting, of course, the natural numbers.
June 10, 2014, 06:15:24 AM
Dear JorgeStolfi, you are wrong on so many levels!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
The laws of mathematics are stronger than the laws of men, I wonder when are you going to realise how wrong you were this days, you have it in front of your very eyes all time! Rechrist!!
Math was made by man
June 10, 2014, 06:14:12 AM
What's up with bitfinex?! Are you the next mtgox?
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