Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 397. (Read 26496457 times)

Isn't that redundant (or soon to be if they're not already)?

Not if he takes a peep on this

Explanation
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Jeez, Phil, this is way too complicated for me, but as i said, I don't anticipate any MtGox coins coming to "rehabilitate" me. What a word!
That said, I agree with @JJG that selling nothing (apart from BCH, of course) is what I would have done in the situation.
With BCH everything is clear..you did not have any, now you got it with a cost base of zero, if you are going the cap gains route.

If you pay something before Sept 16 you show good faith.  My guess is the rulings will be slow and paying on April 15 next year is likely to be the wrong choice.

So because there are two paths here. pay quick and you can always say I tried to do thing right or pay slow giving no defense if they make a shit ruling.

If I turned 33 coins worth 21000 into 5 coins worth 325000 I scored. I am not going to play games and I am going to pay some money before sept 16. Knowing it protects. me.

So you can be sure people looking at large fiat gains will pay even if only 1 in 3 pay now quite a bit of these coins will sell off.

Your explanation makes little to no sense to me, and I still fail to understand how someone with no taxable event (distribution of coins is not a taxable event) would sell coins based on a taxable event that they expect in the future - which the selling of their BTC creates a taxable event, but if they don't sell any then why would taxes be due?


why should anyone in the US assume an event to be taxable merely because you are assuming it to be taxable.

Does not seem taxable to me... and yeah people can do what they want, but I am going to say that the distribution of coins already bought does not sound taxable to me.


Who fucking cares if there may or may not be a ruling or if could possibly maybe potentially be taxable when a reasonable interpretation on the face of the matter is that it is not taxable.

Yeah, go to your accountant, attorney or whatever other source that you have if you feel that you need to clarify what seems to be a non-taxable event.


I don't know.  If a guy has a total of 38 BTC and he got 5 from Gox distribution, then he starts to pay or to calculate his tax obligation at the time that he actually sells any of the coins, and his basis in his Gox goins are going to be from whenever he bought his Gox coins, which could be anywhere between $0 and $1,163 that he might have had bought those Gox coins.  His 33 subsequently bought coins could have a cost basis anywhere between $200 and $73,794, depending on when he purchased the coins... His tax obligation may well relate to various ways that he accounts for the coins and other deductions that he might have.


It would be dumb to pay taxes if there weren't a taxable event.  It may also be dumb to sell coins and then create a taxable event by selling coins that you may well might not have had to sell..

Protip: I would suggest that the default position is not to sell coins rather than assuming that there is a need to sell coins.  Perhaps part of the reason that you (philipma1957) hardly have any bitcoin is because you are ongoingly and continuously presuming needs to sell BTC when you don't need to, and hopefully no one who is anyone is listening to you.  hahahahahaha.. Another protip: when in doubt, don't listen to philipma1957..


Perhaps your whole scenario of some kind of a supposed taxable event had been triggered by having had already declared all of the received coins at a loss in 2014?  So then what are the fact?  We are anticipating that USA folks had already declared their GOX coins as having had been 100% lost in 2014?  Then in those circumstances the coins might be considered as income and potentially trigger a taxable event.  My earlier scenarios (or assessment of the facts) did not presume the coins to have had already been declared as a loss (in 2014 or otherwise).

Maybe I have to reluctantly change my protip to:  Protip: Take whatever philipma1957 with a large grain of salt.. especially when it comes to his suggestions to sell your bitcoin.


Hm? 

I doubt that would be a reasonable interpretation of what I said (or my assessment of why and/or when we got into a bull market). 

Even though I tend to be adamant and argumentative about my claims of whether we are in a bull market or not, I am not claiming to be any kind of an expert regarding these matters, yet it seems that I already said that part of the assessment of getting into a bull market is when their is a pretty decently strong assessment that the bottom is in, and the 200-WMA is a crossing over point that was easy to reference for when we got out of the bear market and went into a bull market either in mid - 2023 or late 2023..

So largely I am proclaiming that there has not been any corrections that have been significant enough since late 2023 for us to go back into a bear market, so it makes little to no sense (and it seems even retarded to me) to proclaim that we could be in a bear market and a bull market at the same time... so that is not exactly triggered by the 200-WMA, even though the 200-WMA could be used as a guage to attempt to figure out if the bottom is in or not or if there might be a new bottom formation that is relevant to proclaiming that we are no longer in a bull market.

So there is more than one reason that I find your comment to be problematic.

1) a potential proclamation that we could be in a bear market even though you used the term "bear session"

2) implication that we could be in a bear and bull at the same time

3) it is just confusing.. and even you probably don't even believe that we are in a bear market that is why you used the term "session" rather than "market" but that is still confusing from the perception of this here cat, to the extent my perception matters

and/or

4) there might be some other reasons that I am leaving out.. so I would like to throw in some more reasons to attack your proclamation.. and yes, we are in a bull market.. so even BTC's price performance is quite great, so I cannot even see why people (including you) are wanting to prematurely throw in ideas of bear.. even if there might have had been some innocent explanations for such, including that you could have just talked about corrections and consolidations rather than talking about bear assessments.. but whatever, you do you, and even if I am not backing up myself very well, I am going to continue down these kinds of opinionated paths, and perhaps even lashing out relatively innocent soothsayer wannabes (is that you?) from time to time.


When in doubt, don't sell.

I am talking to you GOXers.

This is financial advice.   


Hahahahaha

Good one.


That correcting misinformation piece is what Jbreher used to always say when he was pumping Bcash and even sometimes Bcash sv bullshit.


Thanks for clarifying that point, again.

Some of us (dummies here) erroneously believed that our comments in this thread (and perhaps on the forum) affected BTC prices.

Explanation
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It must be those pushups, but I digress...you won't be seeing this anyway 

Too much of the neg vibe that is also coming way too often.
Talking about 135K in the future is meaningless to me and to at least some here if you ALSO say that it might or even likely to drop to 38K beforehand.
I recall another constantly bearish "bullish" influencer... Tone Vays, who kept saying in 2018 (at 3-4K) that we would definitely reach $1000 again.
Nobody listens to him much nowadays.
Imho, try not to be like Tone.

Yeah the tax is levied on the amount used
It's capital gain tax
So it's the gain after removing invested capital
Taxes are not levied on stolen or lost coins but one in access and been sold.
So definitely there's no way it would be humane for the government to impose tax on a tax that has been written off since 2014.

Not really
It still boils down to the country's policy
I mentioned some nations before whose government does not impose tax on equity
Like @philipma1957 said
USA next quarter payment is this September
So there's a likelihood that many of their citizens would sell some portion to pay up their tax.

Yeah I think they might stick with this but many would try to differ and expect a more lenient policy on them
But when has the government ever considered the masses.
I think  there might be a dip but going below $50K might be quite hard to achieve.
Everybody are already expecting the sell
So the impact wouldn't be much
We can't really tell the policy that would be implemented by other countries but we sure Bitcoin is entering 6 digits number now till next year.

Check the tax site I linked to the prior post.
It short, it depends on the court (how they phrased it).
That said "rehabilitation" is more like partial recovery of a temporary lost or misplaced (by the custodian) property, but tax aficionados may differ on this.

I don't think it's regular income.  The law states that it is regular income.  I'm not guessing here like the rest of the people in this thread seem to be doing.  I'd love to be wrong, believe me.  It would benefit me financially.  There's also no guarantee that Michael Dell or Blackrock doesn't just scoop up 10 billion dollars worth of BTC and make this a non-event from a price perspective.  Those who have been around long enough probably remember Tim Draper doing something similar with the US auction of BTC back when it was below $1,000.



Is this hard for you to understand?  I've said repeatedly I'm not a trader.  My cash flow is provided by value stocks that pay increasing dividend amounts (see: Dividend Aristocrats), not speculating on Bitcoin.  I'm definitely not short by any stretch of the imagination and never have been.  If you think me saying BTC will be $135K by April is my way of trying to manipulate the market lower, you are indeed special.  Let me say this again for the people in the back.  Nothing anybody says here has any effect on the market whatsoever.

In the USA this quarter the payment date is Sept 16 2024.

So If you are a USA guy selling and paying makes sense . Now I used cap gains OGnasty thinks it reg income.

I do not know of any IRS ruling on how to classify this profit.

If it is income tax it is a lot higher rate then cap gain rate.

So a 10 coin guy could be looking at 200k tax if it is income tax and not cap gain far worse than the numbers I gave at 20%

He is not shorting, but 'correcting misinformation', lol  
Chanos also always "corrects misallocations".
To each their own, clearly.
The proof will be in the pudding and soon.

Explanation
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That's why i learned less about aerodynamics than about surgery and first aid back then, when i tried to learn how to fly (as a kid) 

As of Gox, i don't even try to guess what will happen, but King Daddy won't care for sure.
Poor traders 

#HODL

Explanation
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Not any sort of forced sale.  I’m sure there will be cases of individuals just paying the taxes out of their pocket and holding the coins. For me, I’ll be selling at least 1/3 because I learned from my stint as treasurer here that you don’t play around with owed taxes and Bitcoin. I lost years worth of BTC income by not immediately cashing out what I needed to pay taxes when I was finally paid my treasurer income. In this instance, I’ll be safe instead of sorry. I won’t be alone.

Getting those coins back not necessarily means instant sell bc of taxes or am I wrong?

Explanation
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