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Topic: Wall Observer - MtGoxUSD wall movement tracker - page 759. (Read 1811603 times)

hero member
Activity: 602
Merit: 508
Firstbits: 1waspoza
I didn't realize btc-e was in Russia. Yes, that would make them harder to actually take down.

You know what we really need? Another large, popular exchange in Brazil.


There is echange in India in the making. https://twitter.com/bensonsamuel/status/291228332962496513
hero member
Activity: 784
Merit: 1000
It does not need to be a coordinated attack - USA alone is enough to scare investors, sure the anarchists will stay with bitcoin till the end - but USA can destroy the exchanges.

mtgox is in Japan. But lets say they shut them down, the volume would be back, distributed among the rest of the platforms within a month, prices in 2 months.
Even if they manage to shut down all the popular exchanges (btc-e is in russia btw, good luck with that) there would be new ones after a week.
They can stop american banks talk to them - this would be enough to send the price in a down spiral.

That said - I don't really believe that they would do it before bitcoin starts the real disruption - the government machine cannot outlaw something that easily, it takes years to come to a reasonable legislation etc.  But if stuff like what Falkvinge wrote about http://falkvinge.net/2011/05/19/the-information-policy-case-for-flat-tax-and-basic-income/ happens then we'll see what the US government can and what it cannot.  If until that time bitcoin has a lot of business going on it and not just the drugs and rhino horns - then this will be a fight - otherwise they'll crush the currency by undermining trust in it.  A currency without trust is worthless.

Maybe, but In my opinion, I think that any official action the US government takes against bitcoin will simply initiate the Kenobi effect.

"strike me down and shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine"

In essence, the mere fact that the US government would officially recognize bitcoin as a threat would itself lend Bitcoin credence.
Aside from that, there is the Bureaucratic and legal jungle in which trying to outlaw bitcoin basically boils down to outlawing free speech.

But before that there's the task of even getting law makers to give a damn. These are the same people who lost billions (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/06/19/missing-iraq-money-may-be-as-much-as-18-billion/) and just shrug their shoulders. they're not going to give a damn about bitcoin's measly <200 million economy.

Trying to incite public outrage with "it buys drugs!" will be seen as just more war on drugs rhetoric. The majority of US citizens see it as a monumental failure, and the political climate towards drugs is beginning to change anyway, what with Washington and Colorado legalizing marijuana.

Anyway, any direct action will just serve to promote it, people will read about it and they will see how awesome it is.

I think the governments best shot at stopping bitcoin is ignoring it all together...




 


Besides, just like explosives/guns, Bitcoin could be considered destructive to/useful for the government at the same time, as are all technological inventions which are impartial and neutral.
vip
Activity: 571
Merit: 504
I still <3 u Satoshi
It does not need to be a coordinated attack - USA alone is enough to scare investors, sure the anarchists will stay with bitcoin till the end - but USA can destroy the exchanges.

mtgox is in Japan. But lets say they shut them down, the volume would be back, distributed among the rest of the platforms within a month, prices in 2 months.
Even if they manage to shut down all the popular exchanges (btc-e is in russia btw, good luck with that) there would be new ones after a week.
They can stop american banks talk to them - this would be enough to send the price in a down spiral.

That said - I don't really believe that they would do it before bitcoin starts the real disruption - the government machine cannot outlaw something that easily, it takes years to come to a reasonable legislation etc.  But if stuff like what Falkvinge wrote about http://falkvinge.net/2011/05/19/the-information-policy-case-for-flat-tax-and-basic-income/ happens then we'll see what the US government can and what it cannot.  If until that time bitcoin has a lot of business going on it and not just the drugs and rhino horns - then this will be a fight - otherwise they'll crush the currency by undermining trust in it.  A currency without trust is worthless.

Maybe, but In my opinion, I think that any official action the US government takes against bitcoin will simply initiate the Kenobi effect.

"strike me down and shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine"

In essence, the mere fact that the US government would officially recognize bitcoin as a threat would itself lend Bitcoin credence.
Aside from that, there is the Bureaucratic and legal jungle in which trying to outlaw bitcoin basically boils down to outlawing free speech.

But before that there's the task of even getting law makers to give a damn. These are the same people who lost billions (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/06/19/missing-iraq-money-may-be-as-much-as-18-billion/) and just shrug their shoulders. they're not going to give a damn about bitcoin's measly <200 million economy.

Trying to incite public outrage with "it buys drugs!" will be seen as just more war on drugs rhetoric. The majority of US citizens see it as a monumental failure, and the political climate towards drugs is beginning to change anyway, what with Washington and Colorado legalizing marijuana.

Anyway, any direct action will just serve to promote it, people will read about it and they will see how awesome it is.

and they will want to use it

I think the governments best shot at stopping bitcoin is ignoring it all together...




 
zby
legendary
Activity: 1594
Merit: 1001
It does not need to be a coordinated attack - USA alone is enough to scare investors, sure the anarchists will stay with bitcoin till the end - but USA can destroy the exchanges.

mtgox is in Japan. But lets say they shut them down, the volume would be back, distributed among the rest of the platforms within a month, prices in 2 months.
Even if they manage to shut down all the popular exchanges (btc-e is in russia btw, good luck with that) there would be new ones after a week.
They can stop american banks talk to them - this would be enough to send the price in a down spiral.

That said - I don't really believe that they would do it before bitcoin starts the real disruption - the government machine cannot outlaw something that easily, it takes years to come to a reasonable legislation etc.  But if stuff like what Falkvinge wrote about http://falkvinge.net/2011/05/19/the-information-policy-case-for-flat-tax-and-basic-income/ happens then we'll see what the US government can and what it cannot.  If until that time bitcoin has a lot of business going on it and not just the drugs and rhino horns - then this will be a fight - otherwise they'll crush the currency by undermining trust in it.  A currency without trust is worthless.
hero member
Activity: 784
Merit: 1000
I didn't realize btc-e was in Russia. Yes, that would make them harder to actually take down.

You know what we really need? Another large, popular exchange in Brazil.

But, I would add, do not underestimate the reach of the existing fiat banks.

Bribe a Russian official? $1,000,000.
Crash Bitcoin? Priceless.
(for everything else, there's Mastercard)

Bribing? there are gonna be higher bidders you know? Think where would the dictators of some nations possibly want to store their wealth now that Uncle Sam is on a campaign to strangle them financially by bullying the banks. And Russia would be a very ideal intermediate nation....

Besides, money is important everywhere, but not the only important thing. Consider why would the Russian bureaucrats went out of place to ban American adoptions of Russian children, more adoptions are supposed to mean less financial burden for the government. Sometimes, just posture to stand up against the Americans itself is quite important. We have another example here, why would the Ecuadorian government provide asylum for Assange? Do they really care more about the freedom of speech then the US/UK governments? Perhaps not.

But I agree with you that we should set up exchanges everywhere to spread out the risk.
full member
Activity: 140
Merit: 100
1221iZanNi5igK7oAA7AWmYjpsyjsRbLLZ
I didn't realize btc-e was in Russia. Yes, that would make them harder to actually take down.

You know what we really need? Another large, popular exchange in Brazil.

But, I would add, do not underestimate the reach of the existing fiat banks.

Bribe a Russian official? $1,000,000.
Crash Bitcoin? Priceless.
(for everything else, there's Mastercard)
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1057
Marketing manager - GO MP
It does not need to be a coordinated attack - USA alone is enough to scare investors, sure the anarchists will stay with bitcoin till the end - but USA can destroy the exchanges.

mtgox is in Japan. But lets say they shut them down, the volume would be back, distributed among the rest of the platforms within a month, prices in 2 months.
Even if they manage to shut down all the popular exchanges (btc-e is in russia btw, good luck with that) there would be new ones after a week.
zby
legendary
Activity: 1594
Merit: 1001
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?

he's probably thinking something very bad will happen at one point ( Governments start poking around ) and price will suffer gr8ly.

anything can happen.... <1$ bitcoins is not imposable,

to think nothing bad will ever happen is just plain stupid, its just getting started... the currency wars are going to get real ugly, real soon.

Despite what conspiracy theorists would want you to believe, the world's governments are not in such a good companionship as to make a coordinated attack on Bitcoin.

It does not need to be a coordinated attack - USA alone is enough to scare investors, sure the anarchists will stay with bitcoin till the end - but USA can destroy the exchanges.
full member
Activity: 140
Merit: 100
1221iZanNi5igK7oAA7AWmYjpsyjsRbLLZ
Gold may devalue a little but if it does the USD will be in hyperinflation, so USD/gold prices won't collapse.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?

he's probably thinking something very bad will happen at one point ( Governments start poking around ) and price will suffer gr8ly.

anything can happen.... <1$ bitcoins is not imposable,

to think nothing bad will ever happen is just plain stupid, its just getting started... the currency wars are going to get real ugly, real soon.

Despite what conspiracy theorists would want you to believe, the world's governments are not in such a good companionship as to make a coordinated attack on Bitcoin.

yes, very true.  Germany repatriating gold from the US and France is one example.

Since you are aware of this you still think that Gold gonna collapse?

i still have the short on.
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1057
Marketing manager - GO MP
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?

he's probably thinking something very bad will happen at one point ( Governments start poking around ) and price will suffer gr8ly.

anything can happen.... <1$ bitcoins is not imposable,

to think nothing bad will ever happen is just plain stupid, its just getting started... the currency wars are going to get real ugly, real soon.

Despite what conspiracy theorists would want you to believe, the world's governments are not in such a good companionship as to make a coordinated attack on Bitcoin.

yes, very true.  Germany repatriating gold from the US and France is one example.

Since you are aware of this you still think that Gold gonna collapse?
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?

he's probably thinking something very bad will happen at one point ( Governments start poking around ) and price will suffer gr8ly.

anything can happen.... <1$ bitcoins is not imposable,

to think nothing bad will ever happen is just plain stupid, its just getting started... the currency wars are going to get real ugly, real soon.

Despite what conspiracy theorists would want you to believe, the world's governments are not in such a good companionship as to make a coordinated attack on Bitcoin.

yes, very true.  Germany repatriating gold from the US and France is one example.
hero member
Activity: 784
Merit: 1000
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?

he's probably thinking something very bad will happen at one point ( Governments start poking around ) and price will suffer gr8ly.

anything can happen.... <1$ bitcoins is not imposable,

to think nothing bad will ever happen is just plain stupid, its just getting started... the currency wars are going to get real ugly, real soon.

Despite what conspiracy theorists would want you to believe, the world's governments are not in such a good companionship as to make a coordinated attack on Bitcoin.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?

he's probably thinking something very bad will happen at one point ( Governments start poking around ) and price will suffer gr8ly.

anything can happen.... <1$ bitcoins is not imposable,

to think nothing bad will ever happen is just plain stupid, its just getting started... the currency wars are going to get real ugly, real soon.

so if currency wars get started, just which currency is it that isn't going to be debased?  oh wait, Bitcoin!

wouldn't that make it do a moon shot?
full member
Activity: 140
Merit: 100
1221iZanNi5igK7oAA7AWmYjpsyjsRbLLZ
accumulate dept!
It's almost as if the toxic loans leading to a crash in 2008 never happened. Don't accumulate debt unless you're a nation-state and can keep your creditors out by force.
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
what you want to do is abuse the dying system
buy stuff ( silver and gold is not the only commodity with intrinsic value)
and above all accumulate dept! ... its almost overWink
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?

he's probably thinking something very bad will happen at one point ( Governments start poking around ) and price will suffer gr8ly.

anything can happen.... <1$ bitcoins is not imposable,

to think nothing bad will ever happen is just plain stupid, its just getting started... the currency wars are going to get real ugly, real soon.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?

< $2?

...maybe he works for eBay. Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
After the $30 peak, it took some time before people realised that it had become a bear market.

Exactly.  It'll take a while, but eventually I think we're likely to get into the $10 area, and probably lower.  I've got all the time in the world.

proudhon, tell us at what price you'll actually buy and become a bull.  b/c you've been a bear all the way down to $2 and now all the way up to $19 and back down to where we are now.  when, oh when?
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
I believe the drop will be fast and painless.
we should hit bottom next weekend (the 2nd).
their wont be enough to go around at 14, so get ready, send your funds.
as always some crazy bull can come along and change everything. I will keep an eye out, and issue buy alerts  at the appropriate time Cool
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