Want to pay NO income tax? Cut welfare. - page 4.

DoomDumas

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Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on December 15, 2012, 03:20:15 AM

Example for Australia:

$150,890 million - Individuals Income Tax (includes capital gains)

$121,907 million - Social Security and Welfare

$21,277 million - Defence

1. Remove income tax.
2. Remove social security and welfare.
3. Remove defence (we don't need to be fighting in any wars)
4. Bump up the corporate tax by 1% or so.
5. Huh

6. PROFIT!

Better than that, just take back owner ship of the money-printer, instead of borowing money with interest from the FED.. there you go.. keep SS and Welfare, no taxes increase, and no more deficit..

US debt = US Govt owe to the FED

Shutdown the FED (privately owned) and no more debt right away !

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Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 06:40:52 PM

It's all connected, intertwined, in a way I don't even think the architects of the system understood.

In what manner is the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937 and the New Deal of 1933 connected to people of lower income in urban areas experimenting with very hard drugs and if we want to include both, profiting from the sale of it (not sure if you were referring to both of my examples in your response)?

myrkul

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Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 06:01:53 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 03:44:30 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 03:29:41 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 03:05:30 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:48:36 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 02:36:28 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:10:54 PM

Before the 30s, place like Harlem and Chicago's south side were considered cultural centers where people from all walks of life came for the music and atmosphere.

So what happened? What turned these jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights?

Well drug addiction is really harsh if you have dealt with or known anyone that has been affected by these severe drugs (heroin, crack, meth & pain-pills). That is what happened, in literally every urban area with low income occupants. Did you not know this happened? Also WW2, Korean and Vietnam war which are traditionally disproportionately represented by lower income people. They come back with either drug addictions or mental issues from war where they turn to drugs to cope or forget the trauma of war.

So, War, and drug addiction.

War we can lay squarely at the feet of the State. I don't think anyone's going to argue against that.
Drug addiction, though, especially to the harder forms.. that's a tougher nut to crack... or so it would seem. What was the Jazz musician's drug of choice?
Hint: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D44pyeEvhcQ

So, What turned these Jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights (note, I am not talking about sidewalks, here)

I think just experimentation and that spread but the problem was that they are almost impossible to quit. From accounts I have read, it literally just spread like wild-fire that in a time frame like a few months is what just everywhere like an epidemic. Also there was a ton of money (profit) involved in it so it was pushed quite hard.

You're still chopping away at the branches. Strike the root. Why were they experimenting? Why was it so profitable?

Please enlighten me, you seem to know the answer, I have been responding to questions to this point.

Oh come now... What might have caused these Jazz musicians to experiment with harder drugs? Why was it so profitable to sell crack cocaine in the ghettos? What happened in 1937 that started us down the road to where we are now? What started right around the same time that started us down an even more disastrous road?

It's all connected, intertwined, in a way I don't even think the architects of the system understood.

Dalkore

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Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 03:44:30 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 03:29:41 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 03:05:30 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:48:36 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 02:36:28 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:10:54 PM

Before the 30s, place like Harlem and Chicago's south side were considered cultural centers where people from all walks of life came for the music and atmosphere.

So what happened? What turned these jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights?

Well drug addiction is really harsh if you have dealt with or known anyone that has been affected by these severe drugs (heroin, crack, meth & pain-pills). That is what happened, in literally every urban area with low income occupants. Did you not know this happened? Also WW2, Korean and Vietnam war which are traditionally disproportionately represented by lower income people. They come back with either drug addictions or mental issues from war where they turn to drugs to cope or forget the trauma of war.

So, War, and drug addiction.

War we can lay squarely at the feet of the State. I don't think anyone's going to argue against that.
Drug addiction, though, especially to the harder forms.. that's a tougher nut to crack... or so it would seem. What was the Jazz musician's drug of choice?
Hint: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D44pyeEvhcQ

So, What turned these Jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights (note, I am not talking about sidewalks, here)

I think just experimentation and that spread but the problem was that they are almost impossible to quit. From accounts I have read, it literally just spread like wild-fire that in a time frame like a few months is what just everywhere like an epidemic. Also there was a ton of money (profit) involved in it so it was pushed quite hard.

You're still chopping away at the branches. Strike the root. Why were they experimenting? Why was it so profitable?

Please enlighten me, you seem to know the answer, I have been responding to questions to this point.

asdf

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Quote from: Endgame on December 15, 2012, 08:44:18 AM

Without welfare, students will have to work there way through uni, sick people will die or depend on charity donations, single mothers and the poor will end up homeless and on the street, crime will increase, and the gap between the rich and poor will become even greater.

Try looking at the other side of the coin. What are the consequences of NOT robbing people of half their labor to give handouts?

- A man can actually support his family without his wife working, leading to better raised children, less strain on the relationship hence fewer single moms needing welfare.
- More disposable income/time for voluntary charity.
- Stop the culture of dependency that the welfare system creates. These people will actually work and produce extra wealth for society instead of pumping out more welfare babies.
- More wealth produced due to NOT reallocating resources from the productive to the unproductive. This will result in lower cost of living.

Of course, most of the problems that the welfare system "solves" are problems which are also created by state violence: crime, gap between rich and poor, high cost of medical care/education, etc.

You are treating the symptoms of institutionalised violence with institutionalised violence.

asdf

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Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on December 15, 2012, 03:20:15 AM

Example for Australia:

$150,890 million - Individuals Income Tax (includes capital gains)

$121,907 million - Social Security and Welfare

$21,277 million - Defence

1. Remove income tax.
2. Remove social security and welfare.
3. Remove defence (we don't need to be fighting in any wars)
4. Bump up the corporate tax by 1% or so.
5. Huh

6. PROFIT!

Hell yes! I'm living in AU and have made the same point.

Rudd-O

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Quote from: Endgame on December 15, 2012, 08:44:18 AM

Without welfare, students will have to work there way through uni

OH, THE HORROR! ANYTHING BUT THAT!

:-D

myrkul

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Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 03:29:41 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 03:05:30 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:48:36 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 02:36:28 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:10:54 PM

Before the 30s, place like Harlem and Chicago's south side were considered cultural centers where people from all walks of life came for the music and atmosphere.

So what happened? What turned these jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights?

Well drug addiction is really harsh if you have dealt with or known anyone that has been affected by these severe drugs (heroin, crack, meth & pain-pills). That is what happened, in literally every urban area with low income occupants. Did you not know this happened? Also WW2, Korean and Vietnam war which are traditionally disproportionately represented by lower income people. They come back with either drug addictions or mental issues from war where they turn to drugs to cope or forget the trauma of war.

So, War, and drug addiction.

War we can lay squarely at the feet of the State. I don't think anyone's going to argue against that.
Drug addiction, though, especially to the harder forms.. that's a tougher nut to crack... or so it would seem. What was the Jazz musician's drug of choice?
Hint: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D44pyeEvhcQ

So, What turned these Jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights (note, I am not talking about sidewalks, here)

I think just experimentation and that spread but the problem was that they are almost impossible to quit. From accounts I have read, it literally just spread like wild-fire that in a time frame like a few months is what just everywhere like an epidemic. Also there was a ton of money (profit) involved in it so it was pushed quite hard.

You're still chopping away at the branches. Strike the root. Why were they experimenting? Why was it so profitable?

Dalkore

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Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 03:05:30 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:48:36 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 02:36:28 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:10:54 PM

Before the 30s, place like Harlem and Chicago's south side were considered cultural centers where people from all walks of life came for the music and atmosphere.

So what happened? What turned these jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights?

Well drug addiction is really harsh if you have dealt with or known anyone that has been affected by these severe drugs (heroin, crack, meth & pain-pills). That is what happened, in literally every urban area with low income occupants. Did you not know this happened? Also WW2, Korean and Vietnam war which are traditionally disproportionately represented by lower income people. They come back with either drug addictions or mental issues from war where they turn to drugs to cope or forget the trauma of war.

So, War, and drug addiction.

War we can lay squarely at the feet of the State. I don't think anyone's going to argue against that.
Drug addiction, though, especially to the harder forms.. that's a tougher nut to crack... or so it would seem. What was the Jazz musician's drug of choice?
Hint: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D44pyeEvhcQ

So, What turned these Jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights (note, I am not talking about sidewalks, here)

I think just experimentation and that spread but the problem was that they are almost impossible to quit. From accounts I have read, it literally just spread like wild-fire that in a time frame like a few months is what just everywhere like an epidemic. Also there was a ton of money (profit) involved in it so it was pushed quite hard.

myrkul

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Activity: 532

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FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:48:36 PM

Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 02:36:28 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:10:54 PM

Before the 30s, place like Harlem and Chicago's south side were considered cultural centers where people from all walks of life came for the music and atmosphere.

So what happened? What turned these jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights?

Well drug addiction is really harsh if you have dealt with or known anyone that has been affected by these severe drugs (heroin, crack, meth & pain-pills). That is what happened, in literally every urban area with low income occupants. Did you not know this happened? Also WW2, Korean and Vietnam war which are traditionally disproportionately represented by lower income people. They come back with either drug addictions or mental issues from war where they turn to drugs to cope or forget the trauma of war.

So, War, and drug addiction.

War we can lay squarely at the feet of the State. I don't think anyone's going to argue against that.
Drug addiction, though, especially to the harder forms.. that's a tougher nut to crack... or so it would seem. What was the Jazz musician's drug of choice?
Hint: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D44pyeEvhcQ

So, What turned these Jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights (note, I am not talking about sidewalks, here)

Dalkore

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Activity: 1330

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Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 02:36:28 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:10:54 PM

Before the 30s, place like Harlem and Chicago's south side were considered cultural centers where people from all walks of life came for the music and atmosphere.

So what happened? What turned these jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights?

Well drug addiction is really harsh if you have dealt with or known anyone that has been affected by these severe drugs (heroin, crack, meth & pain-pills). That is what happened, in literally every urban area with low income occupants. Did you not know this happened? Also WW2, Korean and Vietnam war which are traditionally disproportionately represented by lower income people. They come back with either drug addictions or mental issues from war where they turn to drugs to cope or forget the trauma of war.

myrkul

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Activity: 532

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Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 02:10:54 PM

Before the 30s, place like Harlem and Chicago's south side were considered cultural centers where people from all walks of life came for the music and atmosphere.

So what happened? What turned these jazz-filled cultural centers into crack-filled blights?

Dalkore

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Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 01:51:58 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 01:46:54 PM

If your making a general statement about the effects of welfare on the prosperity of America then obviously you are not just talking about Harlem. I just wanted to make sure you knew about redlining and the effects on urban decay.

No, not just about Harlem. Harlem, however, is a perfect example. Inner city areas continued to decay, all over the country, even after redlining (A policy, as I pointed out, started by a welfare agency.) was stopped.

Why?

Well the thing with decay is that after it has set in after so long everything is in disrepair and complete rebuilding is the only real solution. That is why you don't want policies like that to continue for very long if at all. Also let us not forget about the heroin and crack cocaine epidemics that his lower class urban neighborhoods and utter destroyed these thriving communities and family units. Before the 30s, place like Harlem and Chicago's south side were considered cultural centers where people from all walks of life came for the music and atmosphere.

I see welfare and a proposed solution after devastating effects of just a couple items I mentioned took hold. Before that, when our manufacturing was humming along, these places where great to be in. During that time, organized crime and bootlegging, prostitution and numbers rackets were the major issues of the day.

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Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 01:46:54 PM

If your making a general statement about the effects of welfare on the prosperity of America then obviously you are not just talking about Harlem. I just wanted to make sure you knew about redlining and the effects on urban decay.

No, not just about Harlem. Harlem, however, is a perfect example. Inner city areas continued to decay, all over the country, even after redlining (A policy, as I pointed out, started by a welfare agency.) was stopped.

Why?

Dalkore

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Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 12:56:15 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 12:48:19 PM

Do you know what "Red-lining" is? Well that has much more to do with the general disarray than welfare. Your view it way to simplistic to advocate changes based on things like pictures 40 years apart.

That was an interesting article. It never mentioned Harlem, nor does it explain the urban decay in 1986, nine years after the practice was banned.

Also interesting:

Quote

the specific practice called "redlining" began with the National Housing Act of 1934, which established the Federal Housing Administration (FHA).

Wait, isn't the FHA a welfare program?

If your making a general statement about the effects of welfare on the prosperity of America then obviously you are not just talking about Harlem. I just wanted to make sure you knew about redlining and the effects on urban decay.

myrkul

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Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 12:48:19 PM

Do you know what "Red-lining" is? Well that has much more to do with the general disarray than welfare. Your view it way to simplistic to advocate changes based on things like pictures 40 years apart.

That was an interesting article. It never mentioned Harlem, nor does it explain the urban decay in 1986, nine years after the practice was banned.

Also interesting:

Quote

the specific practice called "redlining" began with the National Housing Act of 1934, which established the Federal Housing Administration (FHA).

Wait, isn't the FHA a welfare program?

Dalkore

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Quote from: myrkul on December 15, 2012, 10:43:35 AM

Quote from: nebulus on December 15, 2012, 10:30:51 AM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 10:25:29 AM

I think you got this one wrong (pictures). African-Americans had few rights in the 1930s and in the 1960s was the civil rights movements, that is why they were on the streets and that was a good thing to basically anyone you talk with. It took the time from 1864 (emancipation of the slaves) to 1960 for the next step in getting equal rights in America.

+1, the thing is called Voting Right Act. Even the 1964 picture's name refers to Demonstrations.

Don't look at the people.

Look at the places.

First picture: Clean streets, no bars on windows or doors.
Second picture: litter-strewn streets, bars on windows and doors.

Here, look at a picture after 20 more years of "helping the poor":
Harlem, 1986:

Do you know what "Red-lining" is? Well that has much more to do with the general disarray than welfare. Your view it way to simplistic to advocate changes based on things like pictures 40 years apart.

myrkul

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Quote from: nebulus on December 15, 2012, 10:30:51 AM

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 10:25:29 AM

I think you got this one wrong (pictures). African-Americans had few rights in the 1930s and in the 1960s was the civil rights movements, that is why they were on the streets and that was a good thing to basically anyone you talk with. It took the time from 1864 (emancipation of the slaves) to 1960 for the next step in getting equal rights in America.

+1, the thing is called Voting Right Act. Even the 1964 picture's name refers to Demonstrations.

Don't look at the people.

Look at the places.

First picture: Clean streets, no bars on windows or doors.
Second picture: litter-strewn streets, bars on windows and doors.

Here, look at a picture after 20 more years of "helping the poor":
Harlem, 1986:

nebulus

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... it only gets better...

Quote from: Dalkore on December 15, 2012, 10:25:29 AM

I think you got this one wrong (pictures). African-Americans had few rights in the 1930s and in the 1960s was the civil rights movements, that is why they were on the streets and that was a good thing to basically anyone you talk with. It took the time from 1864 (emancipation of the slaves) to 1960 for the next step in getting equal rights in America.

+1, the thing is called Voting Right Act. Even the 1964 picture's name refers to Demonstrations.

nebulus

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Activity: 490

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... it only gets better...

Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on December 15, 2012, 03:20:15 AM

1. Remove income tax.
2. Remove social security and welfare.
3. Remove defence (we don't need to be fighting in any wars)
4. Bump up the corporate tax by 1% or so.
5. Huh

6. PROFIT!

Clearly, you are an idiot!

Topic: Want to pay NO income tax? Cut welfare. - page 4. (Read 10095 times)