Warren Buffet to buy Bitcoins? - page 3.

NUFCrichard

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Quote from: Qoheleth on November 15, 2013, 02:37:15 PM

Quote from: TERA on November 15, 2013, 12:49:18 PM

Buffet only invests in assets that produce something and yield dividends. He says if there is no dividend then it is not an investment but only a price speculation, or gambling. He needs to have two sources of gain: the price increase and the dividends, not just one - the price increase. His main MO is buy and hold, never sell, and just collect dividends.

Yeah, this.

Buffet's verdict on Bitcoin may still be up in the air, but I guarantee that he'll never hold it as an investment, even if he decides that Gates was right and Munger was wrong. It suffers from the same problem that Buffet sees with "investing" in gold: gold doesn't do anything - at best, it's just an instrument - so the only way to profit on it is speculation. Real investment in Buffet's philosophy is buying something that is useful... for instance, a corporation, which consistently makes profit in a way the investor can understand and be confident in.

So really, the question is if/when Buffet would invest in Bitcoin-using businesses, and whether it'll happen because he added a Bitcoin-using business to his portfolio, or because one of the businesses in his portfolio started using Bitcoin on their own.

But he could invest indirectly in bitcoin them by buying up bitcoin companies... Hopefully gox!

notme

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Quote from: deadweasel on November 15, 2013, 02:58:34 PM

Quote from: capsqrl on November 15, 2013, 02:55:45 PM

I don't understand why someone in Buffet's position would outright never buy bitcoins. So what if it's risky? If you put 100.000 USD into it, and Bitcoin just collapses, so what? You probably have more money between your coach cussions. It's not like you'll be on the street, dancing for nickles. On the other hand, if Bitcoin goes mainstream big-time, the upside is astronomical. I don't understand this attitude.

Buffet is traditional. He invests based on economic value of an on-going concern. He is not a speculator the way bitcoiners are...

This, and he is one of the few big investors that knows when "enough is enough". He still lives in the same home he bought for under $40k.

deadweasel

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Quote from: capsqrl on November 15, 2013, 02:55:45 PM

I don't understand why someone in Buffet's position would outright never buy bitcoins. So what if it's risky? If you put 100.000 USD into it, and Bitcoin just collapses, so what? You probably have more money between your coach cussions. It's not like you'll be on the street, dancing for nickles. On the other hand, if Bitcoin goes mainstream big-time, the upside is astronomical. I don't understand this attitude.

Buffet is traditional. He invests based on economic value of an on-going concern. He is not a speculator the way bitcoiners are...

kireinaha

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Quote from: BitcoinAshley on November 15, 2013, 02:11:33 PM

Quote from: kireinaha on November 15, 2013, 12:00:19 PM

Absolutely, I agree. Everyone who is currently investing in bitcoin has one ultimate goal: cash out and collect fiat. But some people online don't expect to do that until BTC reaches $100,000 and I highly doubt that day will ever come.

QUOTED FOR ABSOLUTE BULLSHIT. Seriously, you win #1 bullshit of the year award for this statement. You said "EVERYONE who is currently investing.... has (x) goal"
That means your statement can be proven wrong with just one example.
So I present myself. QED. Bullshit called. Better luck next time bucko ;-)

(Seriously, though, you can't just get up and speak for EVERYONE. A large part of what some trolls would call the "bitcoin cult" has ultimately one goal: To absolutely destroy fiat. Completely incompatible with your claimed "goal of everyone." So I call bullshit AGAIN, since the "true believers" who wish to, **MORE OR LESS**, annihilate fiat altogether are not exactly hard to find and number in at least the thousands or tens of thousands.)

Bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit. I mean, come on, you could not have GOTTEN any bullshittier than that. And the confidence & matter-of-factness with which you worded that statement was just plain offensive.

You missed the point. I don't care about the handful of people on this forum and on reddit who believe bitcoin is going "to da moon" and is set on a trajectory to destroy fiat and world domination; their starry eyed speculation has no basis in reality and I don't even consider them to be investors. A better term would be "wreckless gambling" or "delusional". You know, I'm happy for you. Honestly. If you really believe that bitcoin is going to destroy fiat, you obviously live in a dream world and you must enjoy it there. So more power to you.

capsqrl

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I don't understand why someone in Buffet's position would outright never buy bitcoins. So what if it's risky? If you put 100.000 USD into it, and Bitcoin just collapses, so what? You probably have more money between your coach cussions. It's not like you'll be on the street, dancing for nickles. On the other hand, if Bitcoin goes mainstream big-time, the upside is astronomical. I don't understand this attitude.

AlexNeto

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Z-pay.io

I would love to know what George Soros thinks.
Buffet is wrong person. He is an investor, not a speculator.

Qoheleth

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Spurn wild goose chases. Seek that which endures.

Quote from: TERA on November 15, 2013, 12:49:18 PM

Buffet only invests in assets that produce something and yield dividends. He says if there is no dividend then it is not an investment but only a price speculation, or gambling. He needs to have two sources of gain: the price increase and the dividends, not just one - the price increase. His main MO is buy and hold, never sell, and just collect dividends.

Yeah, this.

Buffet's verdict on Bitcoin may still be up in the air, but I guarantee that he'll never hold it as an investment, even if he decides that Gates was right and Munger was wrong. It suffers from the same problem that Buffet sees with "investing" in gold: gold doesn't do anything - at best, it's just an instrument - so the only way to profit on it is speculation. Real investment in Buffet's philosophy is buying something that is useful... for instance, a corporation, which consistently makes profit in a way the investor can understand and be confident in.

So really, the question is if/when Buffet would invest in Bitcoin-using businesses, and whether it'll happen because he added a Bitcoin-using business to his portfolio, or because one of the businesses in his portfolio started using Bitcoin on their own.

BitcoinAshley

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Quote from: kireinaha on November 15, 2013, 12:00:19 PM

Absolutely, I agree. Everyone who is currently investing in bitcoin has one ultimate goal: cash out and collect fiat. But some people online don't expect to do that until BTC reaches $100,000 and I highly doubt that day will ever come.

QUOTED FOR ABSOLUTE BULLSHIT. Seriously, you win #1 bullshit of the year award for this statement. You said "EVERYONE who is currently investing.... has (x) goal"
That means your statement can be proven wrong with just one example.
So I present myself. QED. Bullshit called. Better luck next time bucko ;-)

(Seriously, though, you can't just get up and speak for EVERYONE. A large part of what some trolls would call the "bitcoin cult" has ultimately one goal: To absolutely destroy fiat. Completely incompatible with your claimed "goal of everyone." So I call bullshit AGAIN, since the "true believers" who wish to, **MORE OR LESS**, annihilate fiat altogether are not exactly hard to find and number in at least the thousands or tens of thousands.)

Bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit. I mean, come on, you could not have GOTTEN any bullshittier than that. And the confidence & matter-of-factness with which you worded that statement was just plain offensive.

TERA

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Buffet only invests in assets that produce something and yield dividends. He says if there is no dividend then it is not an investment but only a price speculation, or gambling. He needs to have two sources of gain: the price increase and the dividends, not just one - the price increase. His main MO is buy and hold, never sell, and just collect dividends.

kireinaha

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Quote from: Miz4r on November 15, 2013, 12:12:14 PM

This assumption is simply false. Not everyone's ultimate goal is fiat, mine is that bitcoin becomes successful and I can use it instead of fiat. I'm sure I'm not the only one around here.

Ok, sorry, not everyone, but that's what most are thinking. I personally don't want to keep my money in a currency that can swing in value 10%-50% in one day, and can be wiped out by a hardware failure or theft. At least if something happens to my USD in the bank, it's covered by FDIC insurance.

porcupine87

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hm

Quote from: kokojie on November 15, 2013, 11:36:51 AM

Quote from: wobber on November 15, 2013, 11:14:55 AM

Do you think this will happen? I'd love the guy to own some 10,000 coins. Or is he too old for this thing?

Does anyone knows if he publicly mentioned anything about bitcoins?

He will not. Warren Buffet does not invest in new technology, he only invest in things that he can fully understand, companies with a proven track record.

His biggest holdings are: exxon mobile, coca cola, wellsfargo, IBM, walmart and american express

+1
I read this 5min ago in an article (German). He does not fully understand Bitcoin, so he won't invest (his iron rule). He is not stupid.

BldSwtTrs

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Quote from: wobber on November 15, 2013, 11:47:07 AM

Quote from: kireinaha on November 15, 2013, 11:41:20 AM

Quote from: mvidetto on November 15, 2013, 11:28:25 AM

I read in a few places that he thinks the whole currency is a bubble and would never buy bitcoins. He's just too old to believe in this type of thing.

Exactly. He's too old (ie. too wise) to invest heavily in bitcoin. Look, I hope bitcoin takes off because I would come out well, but the long term outlook for Bitcoin is still very shaky and a guy like Buffet can easily recognize that.

By any means I'm not attacking you, but everyone thinks the same. The ultimate goal is fiat.

No, the ultimate goal is wealth.

Bitcoin will capture the value of multiple other markets which is going to make bitcoin owners wealthy. This is the truth, and the number of people who want to cash out is orthogonal to the truth.

People who want to cash out just don't understand the big picture and/or don't have the guts to play at the stake which are involved.

Miz4r

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Quote from: kireinaha on November 15, 2013, 12:00:19 PM

Quote from: wobber on November 15, 2013, 11:47:07 AM

Quote from: kireinaha on November 15, 2013, 11:41:20 AM

Quote from: mvidetto on November 15, 2013, 11:28:25 AM

I read in a few places that he thinks the whole currency is a bubble and would never buy bitcoins. He's just too old to believe in this type of thing.

Exactly. He's too old (ie. too wise) to invest heavily in bitcoin. Look, I hope bitcoin takes off because I would come out well, but the long term outlook for Bitcoin is still very shaky and a guy like Buffet can easily recognize that.

By any means I'm not attacking you, but everyone thinks the same. The ultimate goal is fiat.

Absolutely, I agree. Everyone who is currently investing in bitcoin has one ultimate goal: cash out and collect fiat.

This assumption is simply false. Not everyone's ultimate goal is fiat, mine is that bitcoin becomes successful and I can use it instead of fiat. I'm sure I'm not the only one around here.

kireinaha

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Quote from: wobber on November 15, 2013, 11:47:07 AM

Quote from: kireinaha on November 15, 2013, 11:41:20 AM

Quote from: mvidetto on November 15, 2013, 11:28:25 AM

I read in a few places that he thinks the whole currency is a bubble and would never buy bitcoins. He's just too old to believe in this type of thing.

Exactly. He's too old (ie. too wise) to invest heavily in bitcoin. Look, I hope bitcoin takes off because I would come out well, but the long term outlook for Bitcoin is still very shaky and a guy like Buffet can easily recognize that.

By any means I'm not attacking you, but everyone thinks the same. The ultimate goal is fiat.

Absolutely, I agree. Everyone who is currently investing in bitcoin has one ultimate goal: cash out and collect fiat. But some people online don't expect to do that until BTC reaches $100,000 and I highly doubt that day will ever come.

mgio

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He never will. Bitcoin is far too risky for him. The market is also far to small. Not enough liquidity for him to buy any amount of coins that would be meaningful to him.

wobber

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Quote from: kireinaha on November 15, 2013, 11:41:20 AM

Quote from: mvidetto on November 15, 2013, 11:28:25 AM

I read in a few places that he thinks the whole currency is a bubble and would never buy bitcoins. He's just too old to believe in this type of thing.

Exactly. He's too old (ie. too wise) to invest heavily in bitcoin. Look, I hope bitcoin takes off because I would come out well, but the long term outlook for Bitcoin is still very shaky and a guy like Buffet can easily recognize that.

By any means I'm not attacking you, but everyone thinks the same. The ultimate goal is fiat.

lucaspm98

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I highly doubt it, from what I know he prefers more "stable" and "safe" investments. He's missing out on a great opportunity though!

kireinaha

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Quote from: mvidetto on November 15, 2013, 11:28:25 AM

I read in a few places that he thinks the whole currency is a bubble and would never buy bitcoins. He's just too old to believe in this type of thing.

Exactly. He's too old (ie. too wise) to invest heavily in bitcoin. Look, I hope bitcoin takes off because I would come out well, but the long term outlook for Bitcoin is still very shaky and a guy like Buffet can easily recognize that.

Le Happy Merchant

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