what proof must one have to identify himself as Nakamoto Satoshi? - page 2.

borovichok

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Quote from: Akash1243 on December 16, 2021, 01:32:47 AM

We always wonder who the real master mind behind the name of Nakamoto Satoshi the creator of bitcoin is.But what exactly would make you believe or convince you that "this" person is Satoshi if he/she ever decided to reveal himself.
There might be infinite wannabes and glory hunters wanting to rise to fame ,given the real Satoshi is one among them how would you go on about finding the right person.

Nakamoto Satoshi is one of the hidden identity of the world most transposed being. People have a strong belief that he's masculine but don't what he looks like. Many people have come out over the past years claiming to be Satoshi nakamoto but always failed the test. The owner of bitcoin is a team, and we all know that a team is not made up of one or two person but three to four. Cryptocurrency was invented in 2008 by unknown group of people who called themselves Satoshi nakamoto, so we can see that it's not only one man's name.

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Quote from: Akash1243 on December 16, 2021, 01:32:47 AM

We always wonder who the real master mind behind the name of Nakamoto Satoshi the creator of bitcoin is.But what exactly would make you believe or convince you that "this" person is Satoshi if he/she ever decided to reveal himself.
There might be infinite wannabes and glory hunters wanting to rise to fame ,given the real Satoshi is one among them how would you go on about finding the right person.

I think finding Satoshi Nakamoto is very difficult, because Satoshi also doesn't want to show himself, surely it will be difficult to identify him.
and in my opinion satoshi must remain a secret, because if only satoshi divulged his identity, I'm afraid many people will target him, because surely behind the success of bitcoin, there must be those who don't like bitcoin.

blockman

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I guess we'll live on the belief that anyone who will try to prove himself as satoshi even with valid proof, won't be enough to make all of us believe.
Like what the others have pointed out earlier, it makes sense that if anyone has found out the private keys of satoshi or he has handed it to the one whom he's fully trusting, there will be a point in time when funds might be moved. Or like what wind fury said about Hal's fund and he's the true satoshi, that inheritance that his children, wife, or any relative will come to the point of time that they have to sell it.
But otherwise, until it's not moving, let's don't dig it anymore and I guess if satoshi is alive, he's liking more the situation that no one will ever know the true him/they.

BitcoinPanther

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Quote from: Blawpaw on December 22, 2022, 05:40:49 PM

Quote from: Akash1243 on December 16, 2021, 01:32:47 AM

We always wonder who the real master mind behind the name of Nakamoto Satoshi the creator of bitcoin is.But what exactly would make you believe or convince you that "this" person is Satoshi if he/she ever decided to reveal himself.
There might be infinite wannabes and glory hunters wanting to rise to fame ,given the real Satoshi is one among them how would you go on about finding the right person.

The only way Satoshi has to reveal his identity is through his technology itself. REMEMBER: NOT YOUR KEYS, NOT YOUR COINS. Satoshi along with other early adopters is said to have millions of bitcoins stashed on specific wallets. So, if he signs a transaction from one of his addresses he proves he really is Satoshi Nakamoto. One of the genesis block that is said to be his, is this one: 1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa. You can read more about it here.

There are still flaws, I agree with the posts that proving ownership doesn't prove the identity. One good example is cited by BlackHatCoiner and supported by Wind_FURY posts. Besides, if you are the real satoshi, you don't have to prove you really are Satoshi the more effort you made to prove yourself the more harder it is for the hesitant to believe. Being oneself comes naturally and people will see the proof by themselves.

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Quote from: pooya87 on December 16, 2021, 02:39:38 AM

Attempting to prove identity is itself shady to me.
Because why did Satoshi go away in first place to want to come back now and need to prove his (her, their) identity. And why prove his identity in first place? If he wanted to do anything like contribute to Bitcoin he could do that under any identity he wanted. Maybe he is already creating pull requests and reviewing changes in Bitcoin!
Only those who are set to gain something would want to prove something. There is nothing to be gained for Satoshi to prove his identity. Only losses, loss of privacy, maybe even security as his life may be in danger, etc.

This has a point. If he is the real Satoshi, I don't think he will bother to prove himself that he is the real one. After all, Satoshi doesn't need any spotlight or acknowledgement, all he aimed was just to help us by giving us the freedom from the banks and be our own bank. Otherwise, if he is not the real Satoshi and would want to steal the reputation of Satoshi, for sure proving himself to the people might only be his focus.

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Quote from: Akash1243 on December 16, 2021, 01:32:47 AM

We always wonder who the real master mind behind the name of Nakamoto Satoshi the creator of bitcoin is.But what exactly would make you believe or convince you that "this" person is Satoshi if he/she ever decided to reveal himself.
There might be infinite wannabes and glory hunters wanting to rise to fame ,given the real Satoshi is one among them how would you go on about finding the right person.

The only way Satoshi has to reveal his identity is through his technology itself. REMEMBER: NOT YOUR KEYS, NOT YOUR COINS. Satoshi along with other early adopters is said to have millions of bitcoins stashed on specific wallets. So, if he signs a transaction from one of his addresses he proves he really is Satoshi Nakamoto. One of the genesis block that is said to be his, is this one: 1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa. You can read more about it here.

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Quote from: Akash1243 on December 16, 2021, 01:32:47 AM

We always wonder who the real master mind behind the name of Nakamoto Satoshi the creator of bitcoin is.But what exactly would make you believe or convince you that "this" person is Satoshi if he/she ever decided to reveal himself.
There might be infinite wannabes and glory hunters wanting to rise to fame ,given the real Satoshi is one among them how would you go on about finding the right person.

If you're truly Satoshi or anybody claiming to be, then it shouldn't be a thing of threat or an hacullian task to het yourself verified being the Satoshi and there are many ways to achieve this, you must posses the said amount of bitcoin Satoshi is believed to have in possession, prove the ownership and access to the wallet address that has the bitcoin and lastly sign a message with that same address, you don't have to struggle in performing those task being the Satoshi because that's what we know to be in your capacity to do, but know this that Satoshi will always present himself with all integrity he's deserving by being reserved and away from all these.

xml

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The more evidences, the more confidence of Satoshi idenditity proof, e.g. sending transaction from his addresses (12cbQLTFMXRnSzktFkuoG3eHoMeFtpTu3S, 1NS17iag9jJgTHD1VXjvLCEnZuQ3rJED9L and so on) or signing a message with the corresponding keys combined with evidence of his English and C++ programming skills. Others may include:
- clarification of his vague explanation of the choice of 21 million BTC cap,
- explanation of his reasons for staying anonymous,
- confirmation by peer-reviewers (of source code and whitepaper),
- confirmation by witnesses who knew about him working on Bitcoin,
- materials created during his research on Bitcoin,
- release of the Bitcoin source code versions previous to the first published ones (and links to source code fragments that were copied or stripped down, e.g. poker bot),
- evidences of bitcoin.org domain registration,
- evidences of setting up the bitcoin.org website,
- publishing his correspondence,
- explanation of origin of his nick if not random,
- hand-written notes about Bitcoin,
- revealing unknown facts that could be verified.

The Cryptovator

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To be honest, most likely Satoshi can't prove himself as a Bitcoin creator. I would be convinced if he signed a message from his Bitcoin address. But the community will still raise questions about either private keys held by Satoshi or by his next generation. It's become quite a complicated process since no one saw him ever. It's easy to prove ownership of the private key, but can't prove as a creator. It's not hard only, but also impossible IMO if the community refuses. What will do the community if sign a message after 100 years from Satoshi's address? Does it prove that the message signer is Satoshi Nakamoto?

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Quote from: Obito on December 17, 2021, 06:05:26 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Real Satoshi won't reveal his/her/their identity, especially knowing how identity-based hate could be used to harm Bitcoin reputation and possibility harmed by authoritarian government.

But that's not the point if this discussion, you didn't thought that this is all just hypothetical? Yes, you're right and you've got a point as to why Satoshi won't go public but it's not the point.

To me, I think that the only proof that Satoshi could identify himself is probably doing a signed message on his address, or logging in his forum account or logging in the Bitcointalk forum prototype (forgot the name of predecessor).

Right. If he can leave a signed message on his address, then it may be a proof of a real Satoshi. His own bitcoin forum account has been hacked already so there's no way he can access that anymore. If he can be the real Satoshi, i think he will do such a thing that we never thought of thinking and its only him who knows that.

However, i'm not really expecting that he'll show off one of these days because its better to make him anonymous for good than to make him known and confuse the whole crypto market.

Obito

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Real Satoshi won't reveal his/her/their identity, especially knowing how identity-based hate could be used to harm Bitcoin reputation and possibility harmed by authoritarian government.

But that's not the point if this discussion, you didn't thought that this is all just hypothetical? Yes, you're right and you've got a point as to why Satoshi won't go public but it's not the point.

To me, I think that the only proof that Satoshi could identify himself is probably doing a signed message on his address, or logging in his forum account or logging in the Bitcointalk forum prototype (forgot the name of predecessor).

Easteregg69

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An ego would do for a start. Proof comes with building it. Knowing every detail. Be able to move every brick in the mouse around even after it has been build. And to some extend leave it like it has always been like that.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on December 16, 2021, 07:36:52 AM

And as time goes on, the proof from the signature becomes less significant. There'll definitely be a time in the future when someone finds the private key of the genesis' public key[1]. This won't make them Satoshi. Proof of ownership isn't proof of identity either way. It'll be really vague if a valid signed message appeared out of nowhere and I wouldn't hold my breath that they're Satoshi.

[1] 04678afdb0fe5548271967f1a67130b7105cd6a828e03909a67962e0ea1f61deb649f6bc3f4cef3 8c4f35504e51ec112de5c384df7ba0b8d578a4c702b6bf11d5f

That’s a very good point! Because what if Hal Finney was the real Satoshi, and what if he gave all his private keys to his son/daughter/wife as an inheritance?

I believe it must be time to accept that Satoshi should be “dead” to the community, although should also be honored for opening the Pandora’s Box. Cool

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I was reading all the Satoshi Nakamoto related articles for the last few weeks because I'm going to compile an article in my local language so that people can know the truth.
I don’t think Satoshi can have his identity proved without signing a message from his known address and a PGP signature. But I'm sure that's not going to happen ever because satoshi will not appear.

Quote from: mocacinno on December 16, 2021, 01:45:47 AM

Since his posts were migrated from a different platform to bitcointalk.org.

What does that mean? He himself has posted some old post from the previous Forum in this forum. So?

o_e_l_e_o

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Quote from: mocacinno on December 16, 2021, 01:45:47 AM

That would conclusively prove it.

I don't think it would, as I've discussed in other threads previously. It would prove ownership of the private keys, but it would not prove identity. It is an important and necessary first step towards proving identity, and without it anyone claiming to be Satoshi can be ignored, but on its own it is not enough.

Quote from: jackg on December 16, 2021, 01:50:54 AM

That account is locked by Theymos, this kinda raises the interesting question though of whether there would be something to persuade him to unlock it (for the real satoshi - or a good masquerader - if they return).

theymos previously said this about it:

Quote from: theymos on April 25, 2013, 01:12:22 PM

His account is locked, so no. If he wants to claim his account, he'll have to contact me with a PGP signature.

That was over 8 years ago, though. Perhaps his opinion has changed and he would require more proof than a PGP signature.

Quote from: dothebeats on December 16, 2021, 03:01:03 AM

Signed message also works, but CSW and co found some loopholes which makes their signed message appear legitimate.

There are no loopholes. They performed parlor tricks, including on some people who really should have known better. Nothing CSW has presented has ever come close to being considered legitimate.

BlackHatCoiner

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Farewell, Leo

And as time goes on, the proof from the signature becomes less significant. There'll definitely be a time in the future when someone finds the private key of the genesis' public key[1]. This won't make them Satoshi. Proof of ownership isn't proof of identity either way. It'll be really vague if a valid signed message appeared out of nowhere and I wouldn't hold my breath that they're Satoshi.

[1] 04678afdb0fe5548271967f1a67130b7105cd6a828e03909a67962e0ea1f61deb649f6bc3f4cef3 8c4f35504e51ec112de5c384df7ba0b8d578a4c702b6bf11d5f

tranthidung

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Farewell o_e_l_e_o

Bitcoin gives you way to sign message from your private key. Why not think of it first? Wink

Two main ways to prove one is real Satoshi Nakamoto

Private key. Like what mentioned in this article Who Wants To Claim $2.5 billion ... Just Show Us Your Private Key ... Mr Satoshi Nakamoto
PGP key - Read more in Why is Satoshi Nakamoto's PGP Key not currently on bitcoin.org ?

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Quote from: Akash1243 on December 16, 2021, 01:32:47 AM

We always wonder who the real master mind behind the name of Nakamoto Satoshi the creator of bitcoin is.But what exactly would make you believe or convince you that "this" person is Satoshi if he/she ever decided to reveal himself.
There might be infinite wannabes and glory hunters wanting to rise to fame ,given the real Satoshi is one among them how would you go on about finding the right person.

So many people including Craight White have falsely claimed to be Nakamoto Satoshi. Now the situation is that if the real satoshi come in the public and reveals his identity, it will be hard to believe.
There is no point to hide your identity and reveal it when no one is willing to believe you.

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Quote from: Akash1243 on December 16, 2021, 01:32:47 AM

We always wonder who the real master mind behind the name of Nakamoto Satoshi the creator of bitcoin is.But what exactly would make you believe or convince you that "this" person is Satoshi if he/she ever decided to reveal himself.
There might be infinite wannabes and glory hunters wanting to rise to fame ,given the real Satoshi is one among them how would you go on about finding the right person.

There is nothing that makes it all right proving Him as Satoshi if he Can Sign a Message and move the funds (that 1 million bitcoin or less depend on his interest) for this maybe the whole crypto community will listen and believe it was Him, though i doubt this will ever happen in front of everyone , if Satoshi decide to move the funds he will do this silently and no one will ever know (of course we can follow the transactions) .

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Quote from: kryptqnick on December 16, 2021, 03:36:29 AM

Quote from: mocacinno on December 16, 2021, 01:45:47 AM

If he really wanted to prove he is satoshi, he can move funds from a couple of the earliest block's block reward, or he can sign a message... That would conclusively prove it.

I believe that's pretty much the only conclusive way to prove it,

Considering the fact that we don't have any proof of which coins belong to Satoshi, this is not a solid proof either. Many of the early mined coins belong to people other than Satoshi! The only 100% sure coin that belongs to Satoshi is the Genesis block reward which is unspendable Tongue

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