Which hardware wallet to buy? - page 2.

dkbit98

legendary

Activity: 2212

Merit: 7064

Quote from: n0nce on August 03, 2022, 05:08:57 PM

Keep in mind that thermal prints can degrade extremely quickly. For example (duh) by being exposed to heat, such as laminating the print or just storing it in a hot place.

Yes I know, but I like it for portability and it can be used for printing fast QR codes to receive payments.
I would never print seed words or private keys with this and expect it to survive for years without fading, but you can see this verizon guys are doing exactly that on video I posted

Quote from: Cricktor on August 04, 2022, 06:54:59 AM

If you lost your iCoin and still have the mnemonic seed words and you can still by another new iCoin, then it might work to recover your wallet. A win for the company as another shitty device is sold. I guess the marketing department had lots of "nice ideas" in the development process of such crap.

They say it's BIP HD compatible, whatever that means.
Oh but I am sure they will release iCoin version 2 device that will cost even more, and you will be forced to buy it for more security.
I found user manual on their website but it doesn't say anything about seed words backup or recovery, and it looks unfinished:
https://www.icointechnology.com/user-manual

DireWolfM14

copper member

Activity: 2338

Merit: 4543

Join the world-leading crypto sportsbook NOW!

Quote from: witcher_sense on August 04, 2022, 01:00:06 AM

~

I agree with Cricktor, it's probably an intentional move to force people to use only the iCoin. It wouldn't be the first time a company tried to force their customers to rely on only their product.

Quote from: Pmalek on August 04, 2022, 01:51:30 PM

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on July 31, 2022, 10:09:22 PM

...so I asked their support team a few questions:

Those questions might be above their paygrade I am afraid. You might get a response like: of course it's open. You enter PIN, wallet is OPEN. No PIN - wallet is CLOSED. 100%. Turn on flashlight for easier PIN entry.

Lol, maybe so. It is telling that they have yet to respond to my questions. If I ever to get a response I'll post it here.

Pmalek

legendary

Activity: 2730

Merit: 7065

Quote from: SFR10 on July 27, 2022, 03:35:32 AM

I have a strong feeling you're just shilling for that wallet.

This user's post history shows otherwise. I only took a quick look at his posts and he never mentioned this particular wallet before or after this post. I didn't find any other signs of shilling some other services or products either.

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on July 31, 2022, 10:09:22 PM

...so I asked their support team a few questions:

Those questions might be above their paygrade I am afraid. You might get a response like: of course it's open. You enter PIN, wallet is OPEN. No PIN - wallet is CLOSED. 100%. Turn on flashlight for easier PIN entry.

Cricktor

hero member

Activity: 714

Merit: 1010

Crypto Swap Exchange

Quote from: witcher_sense on August 04, 2022, 01:00:06 AM

In the next section, they keep telling us a lie that you somehow still can recover your wallet if you lose your iCoin:

Quote

What happens if I lose my seed phrase?

If you still have access to your iCoin Hardware Wallet and know your pin, you can go into your wallet’s settings and display or print your seed phrase.

If you have lost your seed phrase and your hardware wallet, your funds will not be able to be recovered.

If you lose your hardware wallet, you won't be able to regain access to your funds (even if a copy of the seed phrase is still in your possession). The reason is exactly the same: you will have no idea what the right derivation path is.

A non-standard derivation path which is kept hidden by the device or software is a big red flag and a no-go, stay away from such shit.

If you lost your iCoin and still have the mnemonic seed words and you can still by another new iCoin, then it might work to recover your wallet. A win for the company as another shitty device is sold. I guess the marketing department had lots of "nice ideas" in the development process of such crap.

witcher_sense

legendary

Activity: 2464

Merit: 4415

🔐BitcoinMessage.Tools🔑

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on August 01, 2022, 06:16:57 AM

Quote from: https://www.icointechnology.com/faq

iCoin’s wallet uses a specific hardened derivation path to generate keys. We do not check all derivation paths because the wallet is cold and not network connected. At this time we do not allow users to choose derivation paths.

Oh good. Another wallet using a non-standard derivation path, but it won't tell you what it is. I look forward to future posts on this forum of people with seed phrases generated by this wallet who are recovering empty wallets and cannot find their coins. And no option to pay using bitcoin. Nothing says "pioneer of ... the digital economy" quite like not actually accepting any digital currencies. Roll Eyes

It looks like they are contradicting themselves because in another section of the FAQ they claim that:

Quote

iCoin uses the BIP 39 HD standard, your 24-word seed phrase generated on the iCoin hardware wallet can regenerate your keys on any wallet that supports the BIP 39 standard.

If they use non-standard derivation paths for coins, it is highly unlikely users will find their funds after recovering into another wallet. Clearly, they are being dishonest here claiming that they "follow" standards. IMHO, following standards includes not only using standard key derivation schemes but also standard derivation paths, gap limits, coin types, etc.

In the next section, they keep telling us a lie that you somehow still can recover your wallet if you lose your iCoin:

Quote

What happens if I lose my seed phrase?

If you still have access to your iCoin Hardware Wallet and know your pin, you can go into your wallet’s settings and display or print your seed phrase.

If you have lost your seed phrase and your hardware wallet, your funds will not be able to be recovered.

If you lose your hardware wallet, you won't be able to regain access to your funds (even if a copy of the seed phrase is still in your possession). The reason is exactly the same: you will have no idea what the right derivation path is.

NotATether

legendary

Activity: 1568

Merit: 6660

bitcoincleanup.com / bitmixlist.org

Quote from: JamesDaniel90 on June 23, 2022, 12:34:40 PM

I have just watched a few comparison videos on the different ledgers available and I am leaning towards the Nano S plus. Yes the nano X has bluetooth but don't feel I need it.

This is my list:

Bitcoin
Quant
Algorand
Cronos
Decentraland
Gala
Polygon
Enjin
Shiba Inu
LCX

Will these all be ok to store on Ledge S plus?

I don't think so. Reliable data isn't always available on the coins supported for hardware wallets (especially in the case of tokens), so it is probably a safer bet to get the Nano X and not having to worry about some coins you use being unsupported.

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 5943

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: dkbit98 on August 03, 2022, 04:10:28 PM

To be fair, I like the idea of using thermal printer, so this could be only thing I would consider using, but I don't like it's using bluetooth for communicating with device.

Keep in mind that thermal prints can degrade extremely quickly. For example (duh) by being exposed to heat, such as laminating the print or just storing it in a hot place.
You can try e.g. leaving a thermal printed receipt in your wallet for a few weeks and the writing may become illegible. It depends a lot on the paper and other factors; generally not my preferred seed storage.

dkbit98

legendary

Activity: 2212

Merit: 7064

Quote from: n0nce on August 02, 2022, 05:07:21 PM

Oh no please don't make me buy one just to open it and destroy the whole product through an honest review and pictures of the internals..

Don't worry I won't force anyone to waste money on overpriced iCoin hardware wallet, but you could do some airgap experiments with it if you insist.
I don't know what operating system this device is using but judging by this video of two ''verizon experts'' speaking, I think it's probably using Android OS.
To be fair, I like the idea of using thermal printer, so this could be only thing I would consider using, but I don't like it's using bluetooth for communicating with device.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0KlPtZqHcHk

ABCbits

legendary

Activity: 2870

Merit: 7490

Crypto Swap Exchange

Quote from: iCoin2 on July 29, 2022, 02:40:16 PM

--snip--

At a glance, it looks like they spend most of their funds into advertising rather than development of the hardware wallet itself. Anyway, few FAQ bothers me.

Quote from: n0nce on August 02, 2022, 05:07:21 PM

--snip--

But it's just too damn expensive for a little fun post like that, I'm sorry. Wink

I agree, although few people might make a donation to see such post.

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 5943

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: dkbit98 on August 02, 2022, 04:35:12 PM

Quote from: n0nce on August 01, 2022, 06:37:30 PM

From UI and form factor, as well as the overall credibility of the project, I guess that it is probably a repurposed, very old Android smartphone (like Samsung Galaxy S3) with a stripped-down OS and a single application (wallet).
It wouldn't be the first Android-based hardware wallet, but at least other projects aren't based on off-the-shelf, outdated hardware (just a guess, but an educated one in my opinion..).

I bet opening this devices you will find antennas and all other stuff you would find in older smartphones.
But maybe developers are hiding written private keys there Cheesy

Oh no please don't make me buy one just to open it and destroy the whole product through an honest review and pictures of the internals..
It could be a lot of fun, though. Maybe I could even throw in a 0-day (just reusing an n-day of the device that was used as base for the wallet, if my suspicion is right that it's an old smartphone) just to spice the review up a bit?

But it's just too damn expensive for a little fun post like that, I'm sorry. Wink

dkbit98

legendary

Activity: 2212

Merit: 7064

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on July 31, 2022, 10:09:22 PM

Oh, come on now, Wiz Khalifa is using it! It could be really nice, but it looks like a pretty basic wallet with a touch screen and a camera. Oh, and it has a flashlight, in case you need to recover your seed in a cave, presumably.

Yes I was dreaming all my life to have a hardware wallet with powerful flashlight so I can go in cave whenever I want to see my balance and make transactions.
Seriously someone should make a list of worst hardware wallets ever made and this iCoin would have deserved place in this list.
Do I need to buy ten iCoin wlalets like Wiz Khalifa?

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on July 31, 2022, 10:09:22 PM

WTF, over? Do these people have any idea how blockchain works? Anyway, there's no mention of it being open source or even available for peer review, so I asked their support team a few questions:

I am sure they are top gun experts for cryptocurrencies and even prince of Nigeria is using their technology to store his wealth.

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on August 01, 2022, 06:16:57 AM

Or not even knowing how they are spelt. Roll Eyes

This is how verizon people are spelling stuff, it's a special encryption technology based on blockchain.
It's like iPhones for hardware wallets, so they named it iCoin.

Quote from: n0nce on August 01, 2022, 06:37:30 PM

From UI and form factor, as well as the overall credibility of the project, I guess that it is probably a repurposed, very old Android smartphone (like Samsung Galaxy S3) with a stripped-down OS and a single application (wallet).
It wouldn't be the first Android-based hardware wallet, but at least other projects aren't based on off-the-shelf, outdated hardware (just a guess, but an educated one in my opinion..).

I bet opening this devices you will find antennas and all other stuff you would find in older smartphones.
But maybe developers are hiding written private keys there Cheesy

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 5943

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on July 31, 2022, 10:09:22 PM

Quote from: dkbit98 on July 31, 2022, 05:21:00 PM

I would never use this wallet for anything, and I don't think it's secure enough for storing anything other than coupon codes or maybe pizza recipes.

Oh, come on now, Wiz Khalifa is using it! It could be really nice, but it looks like a pretty basic wallet with a touch screen and a camera. Oh, and it has a flashlight, in case you need to recover your seed in a cave, presumably.

From UI and form factor, as well as the overall credibility of the project, I guess that it is probably a repurposed, very old Android smartphone (like Samsung Galaxy S3) with a stripped-down OS and a single application (wallet).
It wouldn't be the first Android-based hardware wallet, but at least other projects aren't based on off-the-shelf, outdated hardware (just a guess, but an educated one in my opinion..).

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18771

Quote from: https://www.icointechnology.com/faq

iCoin’s wallet uses a specific hardened derivation path to generate keys. We do not check all derivation paths because the wallet is cold and not network connected. At this time we do not allow users to choose derivation paths.

Oh good. Another wallet using a non-standard derivation path, but it won't tell you what it is. I look forward to future posts on this forum of people with seed phrases generated by this wallet who are recovering empty wallets and cannot find their coins. And no option to pay using bitcoin. Nothing says "pioneer of ... the digital economy" quite like not actually accepting any digital currencies. Roll Eyes

Quote from: https://www.verizon.com/about/news/speed-june-30-2022

The iCoin wallet supports Bitcoin, as well as Etherium and ERC tokens.

Or not even knowing how they are spelt. Roll Eyes

This screams of Verizon trying to make some easy money. At $200 it's way overpriced as well.

DireWolfM14

copper member

Activity: 2338

Merit: 4543

Join the world-leading crypto sportsbook NOW!

Quote from: dkbit98 on July 31, 2022, 05:21:00 PM

I would never use this wallet for anything, and I don't think it's secure enough for storing anything other than coupon codes or maybe pizza recipes.

Oh, come on now, Wiz Khalifa is using it! It could be really nice, but it looks like a pretty basic wallet with a touch screen and a camera. Oh, and it has a flashlight, in case you need to recover your seed in a cave, presumably.

I love this tidbit from the FAQs:

Quote from: https://www.icointechnology.com/faq

My account had 10.0 BTC, then I sent 3.0 BTC to another bitcoin address. Now my account shows 0.0 BTC ‘available' to send. Where are my 7.0 BTC?

Bitcoin transactions are constructed using an input, or multiple inputs. If a User has 1 input that equals 10.0 BTC, and this User wants to send 3.0 BTC to a bitcoin address, the entire input of 10.0 BTC is required to construct that transaction, and the User’s 7.0 BTC in change will be returned to the From address. Even though the User only wants to transfer 3.0 BTC, inputs cannot be broken down into smaller inputs.

If the User tries to send another BTC transfer from that account while a previous transaction pends, the number of bitcoin ‘available' to spend will be 0.0 BTC. The User has no inputs to spend. Once the pending transfer clears, the User’s remaining 7.0 BTC will reflect as the account’s new BTC balance, and the User will have 7.0 BTC ‘available' to spend.

Use the Fee Slider to adjust your transfer speed when constructing a transaction.

And this from their manual:

Quote from: https://www.icointechnology.com/user-manual

To remove your ERC token from the iCoin Hardware Wallet, display your ETH address’ Private Key or QR on the Hardware Wallet. Use anysoftwarewalletmobile appto import your ERC Private Key.

WTF, over? Do these people have any idea how blockchain works? Anyway, there's no mention of it being open source or even available for peer review, so I asked their support team a few questions:

Quote

1. Is the source code of the hardware wallet open-source or available for peer review?
2. Is the hardware open for peer review?
3. Is the source code of the mobile app open-source or available for peer review?
4. Is the firmware for the printer open-source or available for peer review?
5. What licensing standard (if any) is applicable?

dkbit98

legendary

Activity: 2212

Merit: 7064

Quote from: iCoin2 on July 29, 2022, 02:40:16 PM

Also sold by Verizon.

Oh then it must be ''good'' if it's sold by Verizon Cheesy

Knowing Verizon famous bad practice of locking smartphones, I wouldn't be surprised if they did the same thing with this cheap bad iCoin hardware wallet.
I would never use this wallet for anything, and I don't think it's secure enough for storing anything other than coupon codes or maybe pizza recipes.

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 5943

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: iCoin2 on July 29, 2022, 02:40:16 PM

check out the latest air gap hardware wallet from iCoin Technology. www.icointechnology.com. Also sold by Verizon. Can buy it using your VZ account or just by online with a credit card.

I don't think this is the right thread to introduce your product; you could do your own [ANN] thread in the Hardware Wallet section, though.
The first question that springs to mind is if it's open source, because it doesn't seem so to me.

Since there are existing, trusted open-source alternatives, with and without airgap, in similar price range (also lower) I am not sure you will find a lot of customers here, at least not for $199.

iCoin2

newbie

Activity: 1

Merit: 0

check out the latest air gap hardware wallet from iCoin Technology. www.icointechnology.com. Also sold by Verizon. Can buy it using your VZ account or just by online with a credit card.

dkbit98

legendary

Activity: 2212

Merit: 7064

Quote from: OROBTC on July 21, 2022, 07:15:26 PM

For me the Trezor is slightly easier to use. The BitBox has coin control. Both allow secondary passwords, both seem reasonably sturdy. Both use apps on a PC. Both seem to be excellent hardware wallets.

I think it's about time for Trezor Suite to finally add coin control to their hardware wallets, this is one of the features on their roadmap for years, and lack of this is a big disadvantage.
Except Bitbox I don't know other hardware wallets that have coin control support, but you can always use them in combination with Electrum wallet to enable this feature.
Ledger has coin control with crappy ledger live app but it is inferior compared to Electrum wallet.

SFR10

legendary

Activity: 2968

Merit: 3406

Crypto Swap Exchange

Quote from: Retiicle on July 27, 2022, 02:06:13 AM

I think Ledger Nano S is the best, then Trezor T-Next Gen and SecuX V20 take the joint second position.

You might want to explain why you think the Nano S is better than the other two!
^{- I do know for a fact that it's not, but I'd like to see your argument...}

Quote from: Retiicle on July 27, 2022, 02:06:13 AM

I’m using Ledger Nano S along with Capital Wallet (a hot wallet).

I have a strong feeling you're just shilling for that wallet ^{[despite its creation date, it seems fairly new to me]} and it appears to be a custodial wallet ^{[I had no luck in reading all of the answers on their FAQ page (due to bad coding), but I've seen enough red flags not to recommend that wallet (e.g. here's a simple one)]}!

Retiicle

newbie

Activity: 27

Merit: 0

I think Ledger Nano S is the best, then Trezor T-Next Gen and SecuX V20 take the joint second position. I’m using Ledger Nano S along with Capital Wallet (a hot wallet). The combination of a cold and hot wallet is always better.

Topic: Which hardware wallet to buy? - page 2. (Read 1404 times)