Topic: who bought bitmain Z9 will face a big issues now - page 5. (Read 4116 times)

The design even at low 2400 rpm is noisy actually. Ants can go to 6120 rpm. U can try though. If u mod to lower fans, u risk frying your board only. I believe thats why u cant choose fanspeed for S9. U should just do yourself a favor and create a noisy place to put them. Furthermore, GPUs have 2 fans for about 132-130watts. Thus, is only so noisy. Antminers have 2 fans for 2-12 times the watts. If u ever use the amd gpu design with just 1 fan, not the aftermarket model, u will realize that one is quite noisy too. Furthermore, a few ants together will amplify the sound output.

ASIC means Application-specific integrated circuit and you have some ASICs on your graphics cards to treat some special tasks. On another way we are also talking about GPU ASIC quality.

Why is it greedy to buy 1 ASIC and it's not greedy to buy 300 GPU's?

who bought bitmain Z9 will face a big issues now

an i don't care if they do greed will do that so i hope they do .....

Writing this means you have no clue what you're writing about. Educate yourself in the first place.

Why to be agressive?
There is not only one company that makes ASICs, there are many.
GPU are also ASICs
Centralization is if you own 51% of the network hashrate, they never did. Centralization can also be with GPU if one pool has 51% of the network hashrate (Ethpool/Ethermine has today 28%)

Before to go to Mars you can learn a little bit more about blockchain, ASICs, centralisation...

Yeah man i can make asics2 but i am already bussy with going to the Mars and finding cure for cancer,asics will be my next project after those 2 for sure.How its not a centralization if only one company makes them and mine them for months?And no other companies cant make them,you ever wonder why nvidia intel or any other large chip company didnt even tried to get in crypto mining?Its because bitmain would just reverse engineer those chips and kill the price of them thx to cheap work force since China dont care about copyrights

the real fix I cen see for this is:
someone needs to come up with a hashrate stabilized way of mining the algo;  how this can be done purely client-side:  we need to brainstorm.

SSL uses timestamps;  maybe we can figure out some sort of deal like this to give an overall hashrate impact on result difficulty requirement.

I.E.  After X hashrate, your diff increases to offset to be a virtual  X hashrate.


People can get around this;  purely flat out random nonces and result ranges.   This is definitely possible.... but imagine a stratum trying to keep all of its clients records in this manner... what its checked and what it hasn't....   if you require the previous 3 nonces results as salts to the 4th nonce;  you are required to do sequential workunits..... and the random card is out the window as an option.


There are solutions to "anti-asic".  people need to "think 4th dimensionally" and consider the objective not the mathamatics side;  because the math is what the asic is good at.    Make the "meta"; the way of obtaining the result: the anti-asic strategy itself instead of the algo's individual mathematic calculations.

food for thought.



and FYI:  a subpoena on records, wallets, exchanges, etc... let alone the chip order purchase dates, board MFG and RX dates, etc for the XMR units would EASILY show if they were operating in a dishonest manner (selling used as new, etc etc etc).

The pure fact of drop in nethash at the split;  means that YES;  some of their machines were running.   Not beyond the shadow of a doubt;  but its more than circumstantial, as well as enough to go off of to open a lawsuit and obtain said legal documents/records they would have to prove their innocence.  Im not saying they were the ONLY ones with a XMR asic;  but;  Occam's razor.  I dare the imitation pundits to provide a simpler and more logical explanation.... I bet you can't.  If it were merely an issue of people not updating their miner apps;  the nethash would have climbed substantially after the fork to m7.

Sitting there and commenting with mostly denigration is extremely childish, and shows you know little about what you are speaking of... you only see a narrow slice of the big picture.

I don't really agree.  You don't know how long they have been in the game and neither does anyone else.  On top of that, they have a lot more money than anyone else that is attempting to compete with Bitmain. 

Also, Bitmain isn't crushing Nvidia and AMD ... Crypto mining fell into their laps.  Sure they have benefited from it, but I don't believe it is or was ever a huge priority for them.

XMR network stats prior to and after fork pretty much says it all.  ASIC's and/or botnets were most certainly kicked off the network after the fork.  Probably both.  Whether or not those ASIC's belonged to Bitmain can't be proven, but you can put two and two together.  Regardless of who is responsible, they were on the network long before they were being offered for sale at a long bitmain type delay.  The fact that the network hashrate was so high for so long, prior to the announcement of a Cryptonight ASIC gives us a few hints too.

ASIC hardware in itself isn't a threat ... ASIC hardware coming from one large company is who can do whatever they want, because there is no competition at their weight is a threat.  Most people who have small-mid sized mining farms, should be able to afford asic hardware.  My concern with it is there isn't any competition on the same level to keep the big companies in check.

Lol, this thread is so full of hate.

If you really want fully decentralized you would have to figure out how to eliminate the mining pools too.  ASIC's and GPU's are all still being centralized in mining pools.

I can understand the hardware monopoly arguments.  But on that front there have been some noises made about Samsung possibly making mining chips, if that were true they would immediately dominate the hardware scene for whatever algorithm they touched with the possible exception of SHA-256.  But if you look at something like X11, there are a whole bunch of competitors making ASIC's there, which is a good thing.  Even though most people who bought X11 ASIC's in the recent generation lost money (and that's basically true for all the X11 ASIC's manufacturers), what is also now true is that any new generation of X11 ASIC's will be much easier to value at release.  A very high network hashrate relative to the power of an individual mining machine means that each individual mining machine is a drop in the bucket in terms of network hashrate, which means that it is easy to judge the value of that miner.  And that is true whether you are talking about a new GPU model or an ASIC.  Look at an S9.  It is easy to calculate ROI on an S9, even if bitmain sells 10k of them this month.

ASIC's are most destructive when they are new to a given algorithm and their individual hashrate relative to the network hashrate is very high.  That's also when the ASIC manufacturer is most likely to ask a lot for them because they look extremely valuable when they are new (and they are for the manufacturer).  But bitmain in particular can pump out a whole lot of new miner models and really ramp difficulty on an algorithm that doesn't already have ASIC's, which makes valuing these new miners pretty difficult.

Hardware investments mean people are financially invested in maintaining the value of a coin.  One reason bitcoin is very unlikely to ever see sub-$1000 prices again is because hundreds of milllions has been invested in the mining gear, those miners aren't likely to dump at prices that lose them money.  In fact I would be shocked to ever see sub-$5k prices on bitcoin ever again.

Personally I have no major vested opinion on whether GPU's are better than ASIC's or vice-versa.  I own both.  I do see the writing on the wall however and plan to sell about half of my GPU's in the coming months while they still get a good price.  I think when ETH is no-longer mine-able with GPU then GPU mining in general will not be very profitable just because so damn many people are doing it.

I actually Lol'd at this response. 

Holy unintelligence.

hey buddy
wait a second:
1.  when coin devs, in whitepaper stated that this new coin is asic resistant and they ask GPU miners to dig there sh...t coin and support them = who is to blame, without us gpu miners, coin devs still will be working in geek squad at bestbuy.
2. there is not court of law in crypto  - community is judge and jury.
when you see 500MH, mining fork monero and 700MH mining monero asic - what proof you need. Please stop taking people for stupid.
3. Sh...tman business model is bad - that is why community hate them. We dont hate Nvidia or AMD, they come with new hardware every 6 months - did you see any one complain.
4. Sh..tman trys to take over crypto - is that hard to understand. They dig coins before they put equipment for sale and why:
a. because they have some new updated version of it on drawing board.
b. they sale use crap for top dollars
c. they need to let the carrot on front of some idiots  and keep the crypto alive because without community  - crypto is dead. and who they will sale there outdated asic or mined coins to?

I'm not arguing that.   So much hostility around here it is unreal.   

Good lawd.

Ok, at the moment the Asics were kicked out the hashrate droped 30% or 40% and it`s not Asics???
You have a GREAT logic

I'm not choosing not to see.  

I'm asking if you can prove in a court of law that Bitmain mined with those machines.

My answer is 99.9% no.   Yet people continue to insist that they did, maybe so, I can't prove it, and neither can you.

Hey, are you kidding?
Look at hashrate of monero, seriously, if you just spend 1 minute on Google you will find the proof you need
When monero forked the hashrate and difficulty lowered A LOT, Asics were kicked out

So, it`s hard to explain when people choose not to see, like you.

I appreciate the reply and effort but that doesn't change the evolution of technology. 

Roadmaps change.

If you want to blame someone, blame Bitmain, not ASIC's themselves.    Also you need to provide proof that bitmain mined monero or sold used Asic's before saying what people "think".

More ASIC manufacturers would be helpful.    You're also talking about the current state of ASIC's, not future, you can already see the potential in efficiency.

If you can afford a GPU mining rig, you can afford an ASIC.   Unless you're mining with 1 card.

I get it, but you guys really just don't seem to have any open mindedness toward making mining more efficient and secure.

What would Bitmain have to do to make you happy?  Or would the addition of say a dozen other ASIC manufacturers help?

I would like to see more ideas vs everyone just bashing each other and getting pissed so that both "groups" can benefit from the time and money they've put towards a project.

Either way, good luck to Z9 purchasers and GPU owners going forward.   

I'm tired of trying to explain, but let's go:

Devs wrote their whitepappers saying that they will be asic resistant, asic proof, they would change algo if needs

Bitmain and ALL Asics producers mined MONERO and dumped Asics to idiots because they knew of Monero FORK, look the hashrate of MONERO, it's disgusting this kind of behavior

They tried to sell used Asics as new

GPUs have 2 or 3 year warranty - Asics 180 days without refund

Not everyone can buy Asics, GPUs are easy to find and buy, everyone can join and make decentralization possible

Soon there will be only big farms with Asics, in a few hands

People like to say it's more efficient and will save energy, but remember Asics only mine one algo and when it's not profitable become a doorstep, GPUs when it's not profitable can be a part of PC gaming, office PC, and a lot of other uses

All stated above are FACTS.