Topic: Why arnt we seeing more bitcoin ATM popping up? - page 9. (Read 7760 times)
In many countries, there is strict regulations with Bitcoins. It is not easy to get a permit, Taiwan did not have a Bitcoin ATM due to this reason. The machine itself would cost around $1000+. With the low adoption rates, it is highly impossible for the owners to make any profit if they do not already have a land space or placed it at areas with low human traffic. Exchanges are much more convenient for most users since it only requires the transfer of money from bank account.
The maintenance for the ATM could be more expensive and that's why the number of these is not high.
In many countries bitcoin is illegal to use so this maybe can stop this journey.
The fees aren't same as in online exchanges, also it isn't anymore anonymous because there should be security cameras near the ATM
In many countries bitcoin is illegal to use so this maybe can stop this journey.
The fees aren't same as in online exchanges, also it isn't anymore anonymous because there should be security cameras near the ATM
There are quite many new installations (I run coinatmradar.com). However, I must admit there are many which close business.
In the end of the day - the main reason is probably lack of demand. Masses are still not looking of entering into bitcoin.
So sometimes the machine might be not profitable, taking into account initial costs (machine price, legal costs) - not that many operators might want to try it.
However, I know operators who earn a lot via bitcoin ATM business, of course, they run a network, not just one machine.
Other reasons are regulation and high fees. Regulation and all compliance stuff made the operators very careful of entering this business, both from the cost and organizational perspective.
As the result fees are quite high, now about 6% commission on average. With increased competition fees didn't go lower. I think mainly it's because the most of buyers will buy the same amount of bitcoins at 3% commission or 6% or 10%. So basically these high fees are kind of equilibrium operators find in order to maximize profits. If you make fees lower - you won't get that much new customers in order to cover the commission difference via volume.
In the end of the day - the main reason is probably lack of demand. Masses are still not looking of entering into bitcoin.
So sometimes the machine might be not profitable, taking into account initial costs (machine price, legal costs) - not that many operators might want to try it.
However, I know operators who earn a lot via bitcoin ATM business, of course, they run a network, not just one machine.
Other reasons are regulation and high fees. Regulation and all compliance stuff made the operators very careful of entering this business, both from the cost and organizational perspective.
As the result fees are quite high, now about 6% commission on average. With increased competition fees didn't go lower. I think mainly it's because the most of buyers will buy the same amount of bitcoins at 3% commission or 6% or 10%. So basically these high fees are kind of equilibrium operators find in order to maximize profits. If you make fees lower - you won't get that much new customers in order to cover the commission difference via volume.
think logically..
if a BTM fee is 1%, the BTM owner would need a living wage income just to be happy operating it.
thus for an BTM to be a semi success, it requires:
atleast 200 people putting in regular weekly amounts in of half thier wage.
(week wage= $300, half week wage=$150)
(1%fee of $150=$1.50)
(200x$1.50=300)
atleast 400 people putting in regular weekly amounts in of 25% their wage.
(week wage= $300, half week wage=$75)
(1%fee of $75=$0.75)
(400x$0.75=300)
so do you know 400 people in your town or city that want to buy $75 worth of bitcoin EVERY week. just to give the operator a weekly income as compensation for operating a BTM (yes the fee would probably be 2%+ to cover rental equipment and utility costs).
or if you live in an area where that many people invest that amount. or know the total bitcoins processed exceeds $30,000 worth every week.
..then maybe its worth having a BTM in your city.
but if you only know of 5 people in your area, and they rarely buy bitcoin, or when they do, its only $10-$20 a time........... forget it
if a BTM fee is 1%, the BTM owner would need a living wage income just to be happy operating it.
thus for an BTM to be a semi success, it requires:
atleast 200 people putting in regular weekly amounts in of half thier wage.
(week wage= $300, half week wage=$150)
(1%fee of $150=$1.50)
(200x$1.50=300)
atleast 400 people putting in regular weekly amounts in of 25% their wage.
(week wage= $300, half week wage=$75)
(1%fee of $75=$0.75)
(400x$0.75=300)
so do you know 400 people in your town or city that want to buy $75 worth of bitcoin EVERY week. just to give the operator a weekly income as compensation for operating a BTM (yes the fee would probably be 2%+ to cover rental equipment and utility costs).
or if you live in an area where that many people invest that amount. or know the total bitcoins processed exceeds $30,000 worth every week.
..then maybe its worth having a BTM in your city.
but if you only know of 5 people in your area, and they rarely buy bitcoin, or when they do, its only $10-$20 a time........... forget it
I really thought this time last year that we would have a lot more
bitcoin ATM machines. There is so many people on localbitcoin especailly
in certain areas. I just really thought I would see more in heavily populated
areas. Why do you guys think there isn't many out there still? I know the one
I saw in California had ridiculous fee's but I think people still used it a lot.
bitcoin ATM machines. There is so many people on localbitcoin especailly
in certain areas. I just really thought I would see more in heavily populated
areas. Why do you guys think there isn't many out there still? I know the one
I saw in California had ridiculous fee's but I think people still used it a lot.
One possibility is that the long term purpose of bitcoin with $8 per transaction is not to replace the small change which you buy a newspaper or a bread roll with, but to replace gold billion bars in Fort Knox and numbers on the reserve bank ledgers with something a little less heavy to carry around than solid gold and a little less fictional than the ledger. I don't think that anyone has yet complained at there not being an ATM for gold bullion bars.
If this is the case then we saw few installed ATM this year while the developments of low TX fee fast transaction time altcoins get evaluated, to see which of those should proliferate into a multitude of bitcoin-backed sidechains. This would see altcoin-sidechain atm's appearing in a later year, which must be suited to the small everyday transactions which people presently do with pocket money.
Has anyone had a go at evaluating point-of-sale use of Freicoin ?
There aren't many because they're expensive, they require a space to stay, they aren't quickly profitable, their fees are big, some required too much personal information... I think these are the main reasons, there are probably quite a few more
Exactly this! Also how many do you need? For one city for example, if you already have 5 ATMs, do you need another 5? I don't think so. You are just raising yourself costs and losing money.
That's something that really bothers me. If you look at Europe, as an example, many big/medium cities have 2, 3, 4 or more Bitcoin ATM's and some others don't have any. They aren't evenly distributed in most places! Where they exist, there are a few of them, and in the other places around there aren't any!
You are right there. When I looked at some ATMs maps in Europe, this is the first thing that has crossed my mind. How unevenly they are spread. And then sometimes, some much bigger cities don't have any ATMs, and some smaller ones have an ATM, even in the same country.
United States is much more in the equilibrium when it comes to this problematic. Then again, the adoption and Bitcoin awareness in the US is higher than in Europe.
That's normal. People don't know if it's a good investment so are waiting for others to try it first. Once they see ATM's being popular they buy more. That's why in some cities you have a lot of them.
1. Bitcoin ATM unit is expensive
2. Who will buy the Bitcoin ATM and maintain those units. Banks can do it because they have a lot of transactions per day so it's sustainable for Banks (fiat) not with Bitcoins.
3. There should be a demand in that area where Bitcoin ATM will be stationed.
2. Who will buy the Bitcoin ATM and maintain those units. Banks can do it because they have a lot of transactions per day so it's sustainable for Banks (fiat) not with Bitcoins.
3. There should be a demand in that area where Bitcoin ATM will be stationed.
There aren't many because they're expensive, they require a space to stay, they aren't quickly profitable, their fees are big, some required too much personal information... I think these are the main reasons, there are probably quite a few more
Exactly this! Also how many do you need? For one city for example, if you already have 5 ATMs, do you need another 5? I don't think so. You are just raising yourself costs and losing money.
That's something that really bothers me. If you look at Europe, as an example, many big/medium cities have 2, 3, 4 or more Bitcoin ATM's and some others don't have any. They aren't evenly distributed in most places! Where they exist, there are a few of them, and in the other places around there aren't any!
You are right there. When I looked at some ATMs maps in Europe, this is the first thing that has crossed my mind. How unevenly they are spread. And then sometimes, some much bigger cities don't have any ATMs, and some smaller ones have an ATM, even in the same country.
United States is much more in the equilibrium when it comes to this problematic. Then again, the adoption and Bitcoin awareness in the US is higher than in Europe.
Because not even half of the worlds population are using bitcoins, some don't even know it exists.
That would be some expensive ATM if nobody is going to use it
That would be some expensive ATM if nobody is going to use it
They are expensive + people dont buy BTC from them because it is exansive 
It is cheaper to buy them at Bitcoin exchange places.
It is cheaper to buy them at Bitcoin exchange places.
Bitcoin need more mass adaption for the ATM owner to get some profit out of it. And the legal requirement to setup atm is quite tedious for a private company or a person. Big banks are still being afraid of installing bitcoin atm with their atm machines.
Huge, massive fees and all that info you have to hand over, I would never use one.
I don't think it's necessary to have a bitcoin ATM that is why there are not much popping anywhere. If there is some kind of necessity in it then expect everyone to make one. I mean there are other options that you can also get your bitcoins other than atm plus the current state of bitcoin now, I don't think those atm operators will benifit much from all the fees in building one.
I really thought this time last year that we would have a lot more
bitcoin ATM machines. There is so many people on localbitcoin especailly
in certain areas.
bitcoin ATM machines. There is so many people on localbitcoin especailly
in certain areas.
Because amongst the mainstream public there isn't enough usage or interest to maintain more than a handful of ATMs. The ATMs have associated operating costs (maintenance, rental space, initial capital) and these have to be recouped before anyone would consider producing more. I don't think we'll see an significant increase in ATMs until Bitcoin is adopted by a significantly larger proportion of society than it is now.
Maybe the company of the Bitcoin ATM is still developing the better ATM for the customer to use.
also they are not really needed, you can buy easily on any exchange, localbitcoin, i can't really see the point of atm for bitcoin
also everything that increase the fee for bitcoin is a no no in my view, instead they should offer a discount, if you purchase from an atm...
also everything that increase the fee for bitcoin is a no no in my view, instead they should offer a discount, if you purchase from an atm...
But ATM's are owned by a person or a company that payed a lot of cash for the ATM, connectivity, power, rent for the space where the ATM is installed.
If they would offer bitcoins with a discount, i don't think it would be a viable business model.
I think this is one of the main reasons why you don't see a lot of ATM's: it takes a lot of effort, time and money to install and maintain an ATM...
Any high volume ATMs would have to pay for an armored van with security guards to move fiat between the ATM and a bank. That service wouldn't be cheap, and securing the premises an ATM is installed in would cost an operator more money. If it was highly profitable more operators would be prepared to pay those expenses, but it can't be profitable enough yet.
There aren't many because they're expensive, they require a space to stay, they aren't quickly profitable, their fees are big, some required too much personal information... I think these are the main reasons, there are probably quite a few more
Exactly this! Also how many do you need? For one city for example, if you already have 5 ATMs, do you need another 5? I don't think so. You are just raising yourself costs and losing money.
That's something that really bothers me. If you look at Europe, as an example, many big/medium cities have 2, 3, 4 or more Bitcoin ATM's and some others don't have any. They aren't evenly distributed in most places! Where they exist, there are a few of them, and in the other places around there aren't any!
There aren't many because they're expensive, they require a space to stay, they aren't quickly profitable, their fees are big, some required too much personal information... I think these are the main reasons, there are probably quite a few more
Exactly this! Also how many do you need? For one city for example, if you already have 5 ATMs, do you need another 5? I don't think so. You are just raising yourself costs and losing money.
It's all about the demand. When we will be more mass adopted, the demand will be much higher and then we will see other machines popping out everywhere!
also they are not really needed, you can buy easily on any exchange, localbitcoin, i can't really see the point of atm for bitcoin
also everything that increase the fee for bitcoin is a no no in my view, instead they should offer a discount, if you purchase from an atm...
also everything that increase the fee for bitcoin is a no no in my view, instead they should offer a discount, if you purchase from an atm...
But ATM's are owned by a person or a company that payed a lot of cash for the ATM, connectivity, power, rent for the space where the ATM is installed.
If they would offer bitcoins with a discount, i don't think it would be a viable business model.
I think this is one of the main reasons why you don't see a lot of ATM's: it takes a lot of effort, time and money to install and maintain an ATM...
also they are not really needed, you can buy easily on any exchange, localbitcoin, i can't really see the point of atm for bitcoin
also everything that increase the fee for bitcoin is a no no in my view, instead they should offer a discount, if you purchase from an atm...
also everything that increase the fee for bitcoin is a no no in my view, instead they should offer a discount, if you purchase from an atm...
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