Why I used to trust Patrick Harnett - page 11.

JoelKatz

legendary

Activity: 1596

Merit: 1012

Democracy is vulnerable to a 51% attack.

Quote from: ?? on ??

Let's discuss a specific example. Let's say I have 10,000 BTC and lend out half of it at an average monthly interest rate of 10%, profit per month is 500 BTC.

There is more demand for loans so I have a choice, I can lend out more of my own BTC and eliminate my operating capital buffer or I can take on deposits.

Let's say I am able to get people to deposit 5,000 BTC in two month CDs at an average monthly interest rate of 6%. I lend it out at the average monthly interest rate of 10%, additional profit per month is 500-300=200 BTC.

So, I have increased my profit by 200 per month and I still have my 5,000 BTC operating capital.

With this example in mind please describe your concern.

No sane person actually believes that there exists some massive supply of ultra-low-risk, ultra-high-interest loans. And no sane person with the wisdom to exploit such a pipeline to financial success (assuming it exists, which it doesn't) would also be so stupid as to borrow money at 100% APR. You can treat other people like idiots but I'm not falling for it.

6%/month is slightly more than 1.5%/week. As Gavin put it: It is impossible to get risk-free 1.5% weekly interest, I don't care how good you are at "playing the market" or "choosing who to lend to."

556j

sr. member

Activity: 252

Merit: 250

Quote from: JoelKatz on September 04, 2012, 07:33:33 AM

And you continue to borrow bitcoins at ultra-high-interest even though you are making enough money to pay those debts back. And that should, rationally, be your top priority. Any profitable business would make paying back ultra-high-interest loans its top priority.

How much of your net worth would you feel comfortable keeping in bitcoin? What you are suggesting could be devastating if for whatever reason bitcoin crashed and a person had most or all of their profits invested in their bitcoin business. But if you borrow and all your debits are in bitcoin you don't care the exchange rate. It's a way to short.

JoelKatz

legendary

Activity: 1596

Merit: 1012

Democracy is vulnerable to a 51% attack.

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: JoelKatz on September 04, 2012, 06:54:29 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Yes we can, and do. It is simple. Look at the rates people pay for loans over in the loan thread. All you need to do to make a profit is borrow money at a rate below the rate people will pay for loans - and avoid getting ripped off by people who default on their loans.

Well, and you also need to take all the risk yourself and still be willing to settle for only a sliver of the profit. And you have to stubbornly refuse to pay back your ultra-high-interest debt even though there's no possible reason you still need it.

I don't follow you. If I can't find homes for the BTC I have on deposit I send them back to their owners (with interest). What are you talking about?

Why would you 100% agree with me but prefix it with "I don't follow you" and follow it with "What are you talking about"? You've just said exactly what I said. You are taking all the risk. You are keeping only a sliver of the profits. And you continue to borrow bitcoins at ultra-high-interest even though you are making enough money to pay those debts back. And that should, rationally, be your top priority. Any profitable business would make paying back ultra-high-interest loans its top priority.

Either you're making a lot of money yourself or you're not. If you are, there is no rational explanation for why you continue to acquire more ultra-high-interest debt. You would have paid it all off and never borrowed again. If you're not, there is no rational explanation for why you expend all this effort and take all this risk.

JoelKatz

legendary

Activity: 1596

Merit: 1012

Democracy is vulnerable to a 51% attack.

Quote from: ?? on ??

Yes we can, and do. It is simple. Look at the rates people pay for loans over in the loan thread. All you need to do to make a profit is borrow money at a rate below the rate people will pay for loans - and avoid getting ripped off by people who default on their loans.

Well, and you also need to take all the risk yourself and still be willing to settle for only a sliver of the profit. And you have to stubbornly refuse to pay back your ultra-high-interest debt even though there's no possible reason you still need it.

Mosrite

member

Activity: 70

Merit: 10

sealswithclubs.eu

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Mosrite on September 04, 2012, 05:48:51 AM

Quote from: PatrickHarnett on September 04, 2012, 04:42:25 AM

While some people do trust me, I would like to point out there are some that do not. Some of those people I have never had contact with, nor have they discussed with me the issues they have. There is also a special group that have assumed I'm only here in Bitcoinland to steal money from people, but I'm not going to convince them otherwise.

I am aware of at least one "bet" about my failing to make repayments.

Якщо потік з'являється в режимі «короткострокового кредитування", або "довгострокові пропозиції," це Понці.

It turns out to be just more FUD:

Quote

If the flow appears in the "short-term loans," or "long-term proposals," is a Ponzi.

Totally laughable response. YOU are a scammer, and you're supporting more scammers. No investment product can guarantee returns anywhere near the frauds that are all over this board.

Я стає настільки високі, людина

Mosrite

member

Activity: 70

Merit: 10

sealswithclubs.eu

Quote from: PatrickHarnett on September 04, 2012, 04:42:25 AM

While some people do trust me, I would like to point out there are some that do not. Some of those people I have never had contact with, nor have they discussed with me the issues they have. There is also a special group that have assumed I'm only here in Bitcoinland to steal money from people, but I'm not going to convince them otherwise.

I am aware of at least one "bet" about my failing to make repayments.

Якщо потік з'являється в режимі «короткострокового кредитування", або "довгострокові пропозиції," це Понці.

PatrickHarnett

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

While some people do trust me, I would like to point out there are some that do not. Some of those people I have never had contact with, nor have they discussed with me the issues they have. There is also a special group that have assumed I'm only here in Bitcoinland to steal money from people, but I'm not going to convince them otherwise.

I am aware of at least one "bet" about my failing to make repayments.

squall1066

copper member

Activity: 2310

Merit: 1032

Quote from: brendio on July 19, 2012, 09:46:41 PM

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/7316575/FBI-seizes-Kiwi-SpongeBob-coins

Hey, would anyone be interested in silver "In Patrick We Trust" coins?

Hell yeah! in the shape of a starfish!! Cool.

Mosrite

member

Activity: 70

Merit: 10

sealswithclubs.eu

Matthew N. Wright. Any wagers on offer?

nimda

hero member

Activity: 784

Merit: 1000

0xFB0D8D1534241423

Ooh, that sounds like quite the idea Shocked

ripper234

legendary

Activity: 1358

Merit: 1003

Ron Gross

Quote from: yjacket on July 26, 2012, 11:25:37 PM

Can someone explain the purpose of this thread? Was Patrick called into question?

Yes, by my wife

Before I invested with him, I had to explain to her why he's reliable ... so I wanted to share the information with newcomers. This post on my blog actually attracted at least one friend of mine who is now interested in investing with Patrick (but without being exposed to BTC-USD flucutations).

yjacket

full member

Activity: 202

Merit: 100

Can someone explain the purpose of this thread? Was Patrick called into question?

brendio

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/7316575/FBI-seizes-Kiwi-SpongeBob-coins

Hey, would anyone be interested in silver "In Patrick We Trust" coins?

SimBesh

member

Activity: 89

Merit: 10

PM'd Patrick wanting to withdraw >300btc i had on loan to him, 30 minutes later the coins were sitting in my wallet.
Top bloke!

Fiyasko

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1001

Okey Dokey Lokey

Quote from: PatrickHarnett on July 08, 2012, 06:24:21 PM

I was avoiding posting here, but I obviously need to provide (repeat) some information about my business and it is my private business and doesn't need to be disclosed.

Yes, I have a BS&T account, and have had it since 17 December 2011 (no secret, it's announced in the BS&T thread). For a long time it sat around 4k and at the moment it's sitting at 10k and will probably stay that way until Christmas. I'll be getting 5%/week on it as I don't expect to be attracting pass-through deposits. Income derived from this account goes into two main activities:
1: Increasing BTC investments including GLBSE assets, mining equipment and a stake I have in things like a BTC electronics business, and
2: Cashing out funds to pay for various real-life things including various organisations like our local homeless shelter which is costing me a couple hundred dollars/week thanks to the efforts my wife makes.

Outside of the BS&T account, as of today, I have 10,794 BTC outstanding in loans and 10,586 BTC held on deposit (plus 160 in the 7Seas fund). This is the core business of StarFish BCB and what generates the return for people looking for something other than BS&T exposure.

That is a Godly amount of trust.
*bows*

BrightAnarchist

donator