WHY isn't there any hardware wallet with all those millionaires around !!!

gweedo

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Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on July 08, 2013, 09:43:09 PM

Quote from: jasperIL2267 on July 08, 2013, 09:23:38 PM

Who needs hardware wallet when you got blockchain.info?

are you serious? Roll Eyes

No are you both serious...

Hardware wallets like the trezors are the best in this space. *Disclaimer I brought one* Let me explain what made me actually by this thing. At one point I wanted to get a hardware dedicated wallet, that can randomly generate keys and sign transactions. Almost how I would use armory. Then I saw the trezor and I was like what is my biggest threat, someone hacking my computer. But for the most part I keep a good chunk on my computer. So instead of having this one device where maybe I could use it outside of my house maybe once or twice. It isn't worth it to have a dedicated hardware wallet, but instead just a small hardware wallet, that will sign seems like the more logical choice.

Also this will help with my businesses, that use this hacky cold storage technique with trezor I can use bitcoind or armory and get the true cold storage since they would need the device to sign those transactions.

🏰 TradeFortress 🏰

vip

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👻

Quote from: jasperIL2267 on July 08, 2013, 09:23:38 PM

Who needs hardware wallet when you got blockchain.info?

are you serious? Roll Eyes

CryptoLover

newbie

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Just be patient it will come when it comes.

CryptoLover

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TBH not much bitcoin millionaires right now.

jasperIL2267

newbie

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Who needs hardware wallet when you got blockchain.info?

Anduck

legendary

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quack

Why are people so mad???

IMO there should be a hardware wallet that's got a screen, good connectivity (wifi/3G/NFC), usb, camera for QR codes, long life battery and hardened bitcoin software. This device could -only- be used for bitcoin.
I think there's a demand for device like this.

SpontaneousDisorder

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If someone develops a smartphone app that supports bitsafe/trezor we will be most the way there. I think we are a way from a true dedicated smartphone/wallet though. At least one that's developed thoroughly with security in mind.

MWNinja

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They are called smartphones, and there are good security features now available to the government market that are very interesting to the bitcoin domain for secure wallet storage. I have a working demo that can load up a bitcoin wallet in a trusted virtual machine on a virtualized, isolated copy of andrioid. The same technology is used by the Marine Corps trusted handheld program. The problem is somebody has to order 100k phones and launch an MVNO to really bring this to market. And the phones are just a small part of what it would take to launch something like this.

PM me if you are that somebody and we can get the NDA process started once you are qualified.

emmanuel645

newbie

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Quote from: grue on July 07, 2013, 06:42:35 PM

Why isn't there? But there is. Wink

Quote from: emmanuel645 on July 07, 2013, 02:45:10 PM

If you think I am right please donate cause I need cash to finance my studies = 17P5bJQU1hjHkKPZRxbuZCLJy771PMQFux

LOL
beggar pls go

you are right I should not have begged.

grue

legendary

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Why isn't there? But there is. Wink

Quote from: emmanuel645 on July 07, 2013, 02:45:10 PM

If you think I am right please donate cause I need cash to finance my studies = 17P5bJQU1hjHkKPZRxbuZCLJy771PMQFux

LOL
beggar pls go

emmanuel645

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20 dollars might be too expensive but it will be a huge improvement over what we have now.

btchip

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CTO, Ledger

Quote from: emmanuel645 on July 07, 2013, 06:06:14 PM

If they are under 20 dollars each you would be able to buy one for whole your family and friends!

I'd like to see hardware wallets everywhere, 20 dollars is still way too expensive IMHO Grin

Quote from: emmanuel645 on July 07, 2013, 06:06:14 PM

just make a usb wireless dongle specially made to work with the hardware wallet. That will make it very easy for stores that want to accept bitcoin because all they will have to do is plug the dongle and start sharing internet.

oh, but then it's a different product, not something as convenient to carry around as the currently (almost) existing hardware wallet solutions, which are great to pay on the web in an unsecure environment, but not so great to pay on a Point Of Sale device. Depends what you want to do first, it's not easy to fit all use cases with a nice price tag Grin

emmanuel645

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Quote from: Deafboy on July 07, 2013, 05:51:26 PM

There are secure key-storage devices like Trezor or Bitsafe. Why there are no full client HW wallets?
Because you can use cheap Android smartphones for that. I have bought one for less then a price of Trezor. I'm using it as BTC wallet only.

Quote

smartphone could break

Dedicated HW wallet can break as well. All you need to do is backup the wallet, or save the seed.

Quote

possible malwhare

Malware is not an issue if you are using it as single purpose device. Do not install anything besides the wallet app. Do not even register your google account.

That is exactly what I was thinking however if we put a bit of money together we could build a much cheaper alternative because

1) no need for gprs/edge/3G
2) no need for full touch screen, a candy bar* design would be better since all you have to do is type numbers and click send.
3) no need for speakers or microphone.

If they are under 20 dollars each you would be able to buy one for whole your family and friends!

Quote from: btchip on July 07, 2013, 05:59:34 PM

Why insisting on the wireless part ? Again, wireless pairing on arbitrary devices is not easy.

Your options :

NFC : cool, how many desktop computers support NFC ? how many smartphones support NFC right now ? And do you really want to keep both devices glued to each other while the transaction is performed ?
Wifi : ok, how do you enter the passphrase, how do you retrieve the device IP, how many desktop computers use Wifi too ?
Bluetooth : pairing is not trivial either.
Zigbee : not deployed.

USB : connect, no setup, done. If you get a device and a USB cable, I figure people will know what to do with it

just make a usb wireless dongle specially made to work with the hardware wallet. That will make it very easy for stores that want to accept bitcoin because all they will have to do is plug the dongle and start sharing internet.

*candy bar design is like dumb phone design.

btchip

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CTO, Ledger

Oh, and no, using a smartphone to store private keys might not be such a good idea

btchip

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Why insisting on the wireless part ? Again, wireless pairing on arbitrary devices is not easy.

Your options :

NFC : cool, how many desktop computers support NFC ? how many smartphones support NFC right now ? And do you really want to keep both devices glued to each other while the transaction is performed ?
Wifi : ok, how do you enter the passphrase, how do you retrieve the device IP, how many desktop computers use Wifi too ?
Bluetooth : pairing is not trivial either.
Zigbee : not deployed.

USB : connect, no setup, done. If you get a device and a USB cable, I figure people will know what to do with it

Deafboy

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There are secure key-storage devices like Trezor or Bitsafe. Why there are no full client HW wallets?
Because you can use cheap Android smartphones for that. I have bought one for less then a price of Trezor. I'm using it as BTC wallet only.

Quote

smartphone could break

Dedicated HW wallet can break as well. All you need to do is backup the wallet, or save the seed.

Quote

possible malwhare

Malware is not an issue if you are using it as single purpose device. Do not install anything besides the wallet app. Do not even register your google account.

edit: There was one project started by Matthew, to create independent hardware wallet in form of a "smartwatch". Now it's dead.

emmanuel645

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For those who think that there is no market for such a device, just put yourself in the place of someone who dosen't know anything about computers. Those people have three choices and all of them have drawbacks.

1) use a browser/computer wallet = computer could get hacked.
2)use an smartphone wallet = smartphone could break, possible malwhare, accidently deleting app (i have seen it a lot)
3)use tresor = a noob would and understand and you would have to connect it to a computer to get it working.

however a true single purpose hardware wallet that coulse wirelessly theter to a computer to get internet connection would not have any of those problems and also you could just give them to friends, family.

btchip

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Quote from: emmanuel645 on July 07, 2013, 04:57:02 PM

Sorry but I can't any keyboard on the trezor to type the amount of money you want to send nor do I see any wireless capability. Trezor is only for techie people not the average joe.

From my personal experience (if you don't consider Wifi direct devices, which are not really mainstream), it's easier to connect a USB device to a computer/tablet than to configure a wireless/contactless connection.

IMHO it's also more convenient for the average joe to recheck something on a second screen than to type an amount (or an address, not considering the payment protocol) on a tiny keyboard.

Gabi

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If you want to walk on water, get out of the boat

Yeah sure, keeping the coins in wallet.dat is much better instead

facepalm.

AliceWonder

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I'm not sure there is any market for a hardware wallet that does what you want.
Sounds like an app on a smartphone is what you want.

How many bulky devices with screens and inputs that all need charging do you want to have to carry with you?

Topic: WHY isn't there any hardware wallet with all those millionaires around !!! (Read 2416 times)