[XMR] Monero Speculation - page 951.

ArticMine

legendary

Activity: 2282

Merit: 1050

Monero Core Team

Quote from: bitebits on November 05, 2016, 04:37:18 PM

@Saddam @KeyJockey

How do you know Monero is excluded from the data set / which coins are included?

I doubt Monero has been excluded, but by any objective analysis of the data Monero would be an outlier. He is also comparing Bitcoin trading starting in 2010 after 1 year of hyper inflation with alt-coin trading starting right after alt-coins are release. In the case of Monero the hyper inflation of the first year is included in the analysis; while this was not included in the Bitcoin case A more apt comparison would be to wait 6 - 9 months to start measuring trading data.

bitebits

legendary

Activity: 2242

Merit: 3523

Flippin' burgers since 1163.

@Saddam @KeyJockey

How do you know Monero is excluded from the data set / which coins are included?

saddambitcoin

legendary

Activity: 1610

Merit: 1004

Quote from: KeyJockey on November 05, 2016, 09:12:02 AM

Quote from: bitebits on November 05, 2016, 03:34:28 AM

Interesting article, although I wish it had more detailed data:
http://woobull.com/data-visualisation-118-coins-plotted-over-time-this-is-why-hodl-alt-coin-indexes-dont-work/

Yes, interesting BUT seems to me like this guy is deliberately leaving MONERO out of his analysis. Wonder why...

If somebody bought XMR two years ago for about $0.70 seventy cents each when bitcoin average was about $500 each, and now bitcoin is about $700 but Monero spiked up over $12 and has now fallen back to about $5 five bucks range...?

Well, that’s XMR doubling FOUR times in the interim and settling down to "only" having doubled TWO or THREE times (0.70 to 1.40 to 2.80 to about $5.60-ish).

If Bitcoin had done the same we'd have seen it hit about $8000 and settle back to $2500 today.

Not sure how that doesn't count as "outperform" in his analysis… Tongue

P.S. {Edit} I copied this post from a comment on his site, which he's now replied to saying that XMR didn't qualify due to not being over $5 Million market cap long enough or something like that. But other alts like MAID made this cut? Hm, srsly? Seems to me like some sketchy pick and choosing of the data set, what's that they say about "Liars, Damn Liars, and Statisticians...?" LOL

He seems to have something against XMR or is just a BTC maximalist: https://twitter.com/dangermouse117/status/793075939483668482

But cool charts anyway. I think if XMR was added to the 2014 data set, you'd see some even better results vs BTC.

bobabouey2

sr. member

Activity: 248

Merit: 250

Quote from: coinfanman on November 05, 2016, 04:31:12 AM

Did he not even know what he signed up for as trusted person? Unbelievable. This Zcash is truly a total
corporate scam. He should resign immediately rather than write disclaimers, which most people do not
read, just see his name. Once zcash goes down, he and others will also go down. Gavin is already down
the drain for earlier actions.

He has nothing to resign from, his participation in the magic ceremony was a one-time event. Zooko et al were clearly trying to show they were so confident in their process that they could invite someone like Todd who would speak freely. They may come to regret that, but the alternative, only having friendly people, would have its own problems.

KeyJockey

hero member

Activity: 608

Merit: 509

Quote from: bitebits on November 05, 2016, 03:34:28 AM

Interesting article, although I wish it had more detailed data:
http://woobull.com/data-visualisation-118-coins-plotted-over-time-this-is-why-hodl-alt-coin-indexes-dont-work/

Yes, interesting BUT seems to me like this guy is deliberately leaving MONERO out of his analysis. Wonder why...

If somebody bought XMR two years ago for about $0.70 seventy cents each when bitcoin average was about $500 each, and now bitcoin is about $700 but Monero spiked up over $12 and has now fallen back to about $5 five bucks range...?

Well, that’s XMR doubling FOUR times in the interim and settling down to "only" having doubled TWO or THREE times (0.70 to 1.40 to 2.80 to about $5.60-ish).

If Bitcoin had done the same we'd have seen it hit about $8000 and settle back to $2500 today.

Not sure how that doesn't count as "outperform" in his analysis… Tongue

P.S. {Edit} I copied this post from a comment on his site, which he's now replied to saying that XMR didn't qualify due to not being over $5 Million market cap long enough or something like that. But other alts like MAID made this cut? Hm, srsly? Seems to me like some sketchy pick and choosing of the data set, what's that they say about "Liars, Damn Liars, and Statisticians...?" LOL

dEBRUYNE

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1141

Fully funded. Thanks to everyone who donated!

Quote from: dEBRUYNE on November 04, 2016, 11:33:01 AM

Funding Required - Additional GUI Developer (Jaquee) - Currently at 69.71% (1,725/2,475 XMR)

https://forum.getmonero.org/6/ideas/86991/additional-gui-developer

https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/5b4kr9/funding_required_additional_gui_developer_jaquee/

Quote

Discussion can be found in the thread and in yesterday's reddit thread:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/5asiiw/additional_gui_developer_jaquee_community/

P.S. Even if you don't have an account you are able to contribute, just press the contribute button and it will explain how to donate.

Slow death

legendary

Activity: 3262

Merit: 1130

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: coinfanman on November 05, 2016, 04:31:12 AM

Quote from: bobabouey2 on November 04, 2016, 04:08:38 PM

Interesting series of tweets by Peter Todd on the zcash founder mining reward:

Quote

It's not a matter of what's fair or not, it's a matter of what's good for the ecosystem

Quote

e.g. 20% is so high it's a significant help to a 51% attacker.

Quote

Equally, tying reward to market cap isn't necessarily ethical - can lead to scam incentive

Quote

And like it or not, @zcashco is very likely to be seen by regs as soliciting investment.

Quote

I should add a writeup of this concern to the disclaimers on my trusted setup post.

https://twitter.com/petertoddbtc/status/794331782241984512

His write up should be interesting!

Did he not even know what he signed up for as trusted person? Unbelievable. This Zcash is truly a total
corporate scam. He should resign immediately rather than write disclaimers, which most people do not
read, just see his name. Once zcash goes down, he and others will also go down. Gavin is already down
the drain for earlier actions.

People they believed in this farce to the point of buy into 1 zcash for 3299 bitcoin. After a week see the scenery:

It was a total deception Angry

coinfanman

newbie

Activity: 12

Merit: 0

Quote from: bobabouey2 on November 04, 2016, 04:08:38 PM

Interesting series of tweets by Peter Todd on the zcash founder mining reward:

Quote

It's not a matter of what's fair or not, it's a matter of what's good for the ecosystem

Quote

e.g. 20% is so high it's a significant help to a 51% attacker.

Quote

Equally, tying reward to market cap isn't necessarily ethical - can lead to scam incentive

Quote

And like it or not, @zcashco is very likely to be seen by regs as soliciting investment.

Quote

I should add a writeup of this concern to the disclaimers on my trusted setup post.

https://twitter.com/petertoddbtc/status/794331782241984512

His write up should be interesting!

Did he not even know what he signed up for as trusted person? Unbelievable. This Zcash is truly a total
corporate scam. He should resign immediately rather than write disclaimers, which most people do not
read, just see his name. Once zcash goes down, he and others will also go down. Gavin is already down
the drain for earlier actions.

bitebits

legendary

Activity: 2242

Merit: 3523

Flippin' burgers since 1163.

Interesting article, although I wish it had more detailed data:
http://woobull.com/data-visualisation-118-coins-plotted-over-time-this-is-why-hodl-alt-coin-indexes-dont-work/

Quote

It seems that alt-coins are best left for trading due to their volatility, but very risky as holds. This may change in the years ahead, but for now, out of 700+ coins in my database I would say less than 5 have a shot of doing something interesting. It reminds me of early stage startup investing actually.

Quote

If anything, average alt-coin performance is getting worse over time, though this is probably due to a lot of scams coming into the marketplace. Quite clearly 2014 with 95 coins on offer was the year of the ICOs.

Now $250,000 market cap is a really small figure to achieve for a coin so we might want to filter these coins to the big leagues. The plot below sets the bar at $10m market cap and the picture improves somewhat:

So from 95 altcoins that started in 2014, only seven live to tell the story today:

freedomgo

legendary

Activity: 3318

Merit: 1185

Playbet.io - Crypto Casino and Sportsbook

Quote from: ArticMine on November 04, 2016, 09:15:06 PM

Quote from: bitebits on November 04, 2016, 05:21:56 PM

This whole bear dance is an interesting to watch game of chicken. Who dares to still sell the lowest, to buy back even lower.

Can't say much about the current price. But every time I think about the world's need for (online) financial privacy, and all the subtle answers Monero has for Bitcoin's restrictions, I get bullish on Monero. Can't help it. It is a thing of beauty no-matter it's fiat value.

Deja Vu.

Back in December 2014 people were selling at 0.00110 hoping to buy back at 0.00080. The bottom was 0.00091. Those who bought at 0.00110 and held suffered a paper loss of over 17% and two more paper losses of over 10%. Of course their gains now are at over 500% and at the peak were over 2300%.

As for who sold low (0.00110) hoping to buy lower (0.00080) at the bottom, the "bear pigs" just went to the slaughter.

Trade at your own risk.

I am not interested anymore on selling my XMR as I believe there will be no price fall back again. I am happy to grab the price already so I will just wait and hope the price of bitcoin will be stable again so we can see how XMR react under the situation.

ArticMine

legendary

Activity: 2282

Merit: 1050

Monero Core Team

Quote from: bitebits on November 04, 2016, 05:21:56 PM

This whole bear dance is an interesting to watch game of chicken. Who dares to still sell the lowest, to buy back even lower.

Can't say much about the current price. But every time I think about the world's need for (online) financial privacy, and all the subtle answers Monero has for Bitcoin's restrictions, I get bullish on Monero. Can't help it. It is a thing of beauty no-matter it's fiat value.

Deja Vu.

Back in December 2014 people were selling at 0.00110 hoping to buy back at 0.00080. The bottom was 0.00091. Those who bought at 0.00110 and held suffered a paper loss of over 17% and two more paper losses of over 10%. Of course their gains now are at over 500% and at the peak were over 2300%.

As for who sold low (0.00110) hoping to buy lower (0.00080) at the bottom, the "bear pigs" just went to the slaughter.

Trade at your own risk.

bitebits

legendary

Activity: 2242

Merit: 3523

Flippin' burgers since 1163.

This whole bear dance is an interesting to watch game of chicken. Who dares to still sell the lowest, to buy back even lower.

Can't say much about the current price. But every time I think about the world's need for (online) financial privacy, and all the subtle answers Monero has for Bitcoin's restrictions, I get bullish on Monero. Can't help it. It is a thing of beauty no-matter it's fiat value.

bobabouey2

sr. member

Activity: 248

Merit: 250

Interesting series of tweets by Peter Todd on the zcash founder mining reward:

Quote

It's not a matter of what's fair or not, it's a matter of what's good for the ecosystem

Quote

e.g. 20% is so high it's a significant help to a 51% attacker.

Quote

Equally, tying reward to market cap isn't necessarily ethical - can lead to scam incentive

Quote

And like it or not, @zcashco is very likely to be seen by regs as soliciting investment.

Quote

I should add a writeup of this concern to the disclaimers on my trusted setup post.

https://twitter.com/petertoddbtc/status/794331782241984512

His write up should be interesting!

rangedriver

hero member

Activity: 714

Merit: 504

Quote from: gusterdd on November 04, 2016, 08:41:25 AM

Zec coin would be 3rd coin. BTC,ETH,ZEC

2016/11/03 coin-score
New star coin : ZEC

Major coins are Btc Eth Xmr Zec now.
Xmr has huge demand.

I think you meant to say "XMR would be 3rd coin."

dEBRUYNE

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1141

Funding Required - Additional GUI Developer (Jaquee) - Currently at 69.71% (1,725/2,475 XMR)

https://forum.getmonero.org/6/ideas/86991/additional-gui-developer

https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/5b4kr9/funding_required_additional_gui_developer_jaquee/

Quote

Discussion can be found in the thread and in yesterday's reddit thread:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/5asiiw/additional_gui_developer_jaquee_community/

P.S. Even if you don't have an account you are able to contribute, just press the contribute button and it will explain how to donate.

iCEBREAKER

legendary

Activity: 2156

Merit: 1072

Crypto is the separation of Power and State.

Quote from: hyc on November 03, 2016, 08:50:33 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on November 03, 2016, 04:59:46 PM

That's why I was asking how we can speed up multisig development, with the goal of achieving ~~implementation~~ activation parallel with or soon after RingCT.

I will ask a math PhD buddy if he can do the peer review himself, or help find a qualified specialist, then put up a FFS request based on his feedback.

It's quite clear that RingCT *must* be stable before multi-sig can be added on top. Not much you can parallelize in this development effort.

Sorry I was not clear and wrote "implementation" when "activation" would have been a better word choice.

I understand ring-multisignature implementation is 100% contingent upon RingCT stabilization.

My intended parallel development effort is to have more mathematicians go over Shen's RM paper with a fine-toothed comb.

The more eyes on it (https://shnoe.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/mrl-0008_april28.pdf) we have now, the smoother implementation will go when RingCT is ready.

One nice thing about focusing peer review on https://shnoe.wordpress.com/2016/03/22/ring-multisignature/ is that the reviewers don't necessarily need to be familiar with the rest of Bitcoin type RPOW schemata.

This is a great opportunity to bring a few crypto-curious set theoreticians and topologists into the Monero Mustang community! Cool

CryptoPH

full member

Activity: 161

Merit: 100

<3 Crypto

Quote from: gusterdd on November 04, 2016, 08:41:25 AM

Zec coin would be 3rd coin. BTC,ETH,ZEC

2016/11/03 coin-score
New star coin : ZEC

Major coins are Btc Eth Xmr Zec now.
Xmr has huge demand.

And ZEC is just a few weeks old...
But anyway, XMR still rules!

Few more weeks, and XMR should be bullish again.

gusterdd

full member

Activity: 220

Merit: 100

Zec coin would be 3rd coin. BTC,ETH,ZEC

2016/11/03 coin-score
New star coin : ZEC

Major coins are Btc Eth Xmr Zec now.
Xmr has huge demand.

kurious

legendary

Activity: 2604

Merit: 1748

Quote from: nanobrain on November 03, 2016, 11:57:39 PM

Clinton has made some missteps but she has also spent her life in public service -- and remember gentlemen (and I really don't want to get into a huge debate on this but the research is there) women are always held to far higher standards than men, so many of her indiscretions would have been forgiven if she were a he.

But I find it very revealing how so many people dismiss Trump as a buffoon and think this somehow makes him benign -- very similar to the way Americans confuse 'brash' with 'honest'. I first came across trump 30 years ago when he started destroying Scotland with his stupid golf courses -- we Scots hate him for his destruction of our land. He will be a disaster for the environment for starters.

And all of the evidence (and I've read an awful lot about him over the last six/eight months) suggests he is manipulative, duplicitous and dishonest (as well as being a racist and misogynist who has had links to organised crime).

You Americans may have managed to get yourself two weird candidates for POTUS but you are scaring the hell out of the rest of us with your support for Trump.

I agree with all you say, from south of the border you're north of - but it's not a view that will be applauded here, sadly, nano. Sounds like you heard that interview on BBC R4 with Mr T's first 'Art of the Deal' biographer ;-) Scary... for sure.

elrippo

legendary

Activity: 1008

Merit: 1001

Quote from: nanobrain on November 03, 2016, 11:57:39 PM

Clinton has made some missteps but she has also spent her life in public service -- and remember gentlemen (and I really don't want to get into a huge debate on this but the research is there) women are always held to far higher standards than men, so many of her indiscretions would have been forgiven if she were a he.

But I find it very revealing how so many people dismiss Trump as a buffoon and think this somehow makes him benign -- very similar to the way Americans confuse 'brash' with 'honest'. I first came across trump 30 years ago when he started destroying Scotland with his stupid golf courses -- we Scots hate him for his destruction of our land. He will be a disaster for the environment for starters.

And all of the evidence (and I've read an awful lot about him over the last six/eight months) suggests he is manipulative, duplicitous and dishonest (as well as being a racist and misogynist who has had links to organised crime).

You Americans may have managed to get yourself two weird candidates for POTUS but you are scaring the hell out of the rest of us with your support for Trump.

Please bear in mind, that politicians are just muppets of a far more dangerous portion of people. So it will make absoloutely no difference if Killary or Trump will win, the wars the US starts will still be the same Roll Eyes

Topic: [XMR] Monero Speculation - page 951. (Read 3314350 times)