YoMix warning - page 2. | Bitcointalksearch.org

shield132

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Quote from: Plaguedeath on October 18, 2023, 02:28:22 AM

Quote from: salad daging on October 16, 2023, 01:54:21 PM

I think you made a mistake by doing the mixer service and then using an exchange wallet. It is clear that centralized exchanges have a rule of not accepting deposits from the results of the mixer service because this violates their rules which they consider to be money laundering.

I have used the Mixer service several times but never sent it directly to a centralized exchange because I knew it would be dangerous if it was detected and the balance would be held, use another wallet to be safer, but this is not entirely YoMix's fault because the Uphold exchange itself has strict regulations.

Mixing is actually not money laundering, they're wrong to think it's a money laundering.

There's no different for using another wallet, it's a concealing and they can easily recognize if the funds was come from mixing service.

How do mixers work? Do they use system similar to P2P if the number of coins of multiple users match each-other? Then it can create serious problems.

I know mixing is not money laundering but look at this:
1. Mixer receives money from someone who has done illegal activity.
2. Mixer stores that money on address A
3. I create a mixing order, deposit money to mixer and hours later I declare address B where I want to receive money.
4. Mixer sends me money from address A to address B. Address A has received money from someone who has done illegal activity, so there is a chain: Laundered money -> Address A -> Address B that belongs to me. This is probably what exchanges see and it's very hard to convince them that you are not associated with illegal activities.

pixie85

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Quote from: Bitcoin_Arena on October 16, 2023, 05:11:45 PM

Mixes bitcoins and then send to a centralized exchange. When his account is blocked, goes ahead to blame Yomix for putting him on FBI watch list. Who does that?
What was the point of mixing coins then if you were going to send them to a centralized exchange them?

OP, I don't know how long you have used crypto, but you have no one else to blame but yourself. If you want complete privacy and custody of your funds, then avoid centralized exchanges. Simple as that.

OP did not even prove that using YoMix was the reason his account was blocked.
The mail from Uphold doesn't say anything about the reasons for the ban.

I'd say the outcome is still good for OP.
1. He will no longer have to use Uphold that has an ongoing class action lawsuit against them.
2. He will learn to use Mixers or will stop using them the wrong way. In both cases it's a +

If the amounts moved back and forth are small FBI won't even notice you OP. Wink

Quote from: Don Pedro Dinero on October 17, 2023, 09:50:54 AM

On top of that I see that the Uphold company is based in London, which is the money laundering capital of the world for large amounts of money.

Uphold is headquartered in New York, 6 W 18th St 3rd Floor, United States, and has 2 office locations.
https://craft.co/uphold/locations

hugeblack

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Quote from: Agbe on October 17, 2023, 10:37:40 AM

My first mixing experience was with https://[banned mixer] and they asked me to save my mixing code which I did,

Personally, I do not like the idea of mixing code. It is true that you must trust the mixer and that all the mixers currently in place are centralized, but using that code may mean collecting more data about you or that they do not delete the data as a worst-case scenario.

Quote from: Plaguedeath on October 18, 2023, 02:28:22 AM

@OP should change the title to "Warning, Uphold is refuse funds from mixer".

I don't think he would do that, and he didn't even try hard to defend his arguments.

Plaguedeath

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Quote from: salad daging on October 16, 2023, 01:54:21 PM

I think you made a mistake by doing the mixer service and then using an exchange wallet. It is clear that centralized exchanges have a rule of not accepting deposits from the results of the mixer service because this violates their rules which they consider to be money laundering.

I have used the Mixer service several times but never sent it directly to a centralized exchange because I knew it would be dangerous if it was detected and the balance would be held, use another wallet to be safer, but this is not entirely YoMix's fault because the Uphold exchange itself has strict regulations.

Mixing is actually not money laundering, they're wrong to think it's a money laundering.

There's no different for using another wallet, it's a concealing and they can easily recognize if the funds was come from mixing service.

Quote from: Agbe on October 17, 2023, 10:37:40 AM

You said you have not done it in any other platform, then you would have narrate everything happened so people would have called the attention of Yo!Mix here to verify but here, it is an allegation without prove that Yo!Mix was the one. That screenshot might be a transaction you had done at somewhere else.

Yomix not owe anything to respond to this particular topic, it's a matter between him with Uphold.

@OP should change the title to "Warning, Uphold is refuse funds from mixer".

Agbe

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My first mixing experience was with https://[banned mixer] and they asked me to save my mixing code which I did, and the mixing process was very fine and successful. Though because of the mixing fee I chose, the transaction took about 7 hours but finally, I received alert of the coins. And from your story even at the first clause, you did not tell what really happened, you are hiding somethings and from my understanding, you are using alt-account and that cause part of your hiding story because you don't want to identify your real self. This is not a matter you use an alt-account for. You said you have not done it in any other platform, then you would have narrate everything happened so people would have called the attention of Yo!Mix here to verify but here, it is an allegation without prove that Yo!Mix was the one. That screenshot might be a transaction you had done at somewhere else.

examplens

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Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on October 17, 2023, 09:29:58 AM

I sold an old laptop to a friend for cash. I used the cash to pay a builder who was doing some work for me, and he disappeared without completing the job. Therefore, beware of selling things to my friend! Huh

I traded cash for bitcoin using Bisq. A scammer on Telegram then convinced me to send them my bitcoin and I lost everything. Therefore, beware of using Bisq! Huh

With the fact that you also saw what the OP stated here, I am even closer to the opinion expressed by hugeblack

Quote from: hugeblack on October 17, 2023, 05:24:23 AM

I think @OP is linked to an account that mistakenly copied a different address and when mixing to that address he blamed YoMix.

He is referring to this user who accused Yomix of supporting scammers because they did not want to stop the transaction when he bought a forum account from fraudsters.

Quote from: brace the mace on October 12, 2023, 05:07:21 AM

I inputed a scammer's bitcoin address when sending BTC through the mixer by mistake.
YoMix sent the transactions with fees that are too low and therefore the transactgion has been pending for days now.

I already contacted them through their contact form with my letter of guarantee (which is 100% proof I am the one who used the service) and asked them to do a double spend to a different address with higher fees so the scammer doesn't get my money.

They simply closed my tickets and didn't help me. The transaction is still pending. They can do something, but I guess they're not interested... I told them they can keep part of the transaction as bounty but I guess they preffer a scammer gets paid? Crazy...

o_e_l_e_o

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Quote from: Don Pedro Dinero on October 17, 2023, 09:50:54 AM

The only question I have for you and those of you who know more about the subject is, to what extent is the excuse that they give that they are simply doing it to comply with the law true?

Boilerplate nonsense. They only care about covering their own backs, nothing more. They don't care about preventing money laundering or combating terrorism or any of the other bullshit excuses they use. They care only about their own profits, and they don't care if you are wrongly accused or you lose your coins in the process.

Uphold, like most centralized exchanges, likely simply buy the services of a blockchain analysis company, and that blockchain analysis company tells them which coins are "tainted" and which ones are "clean", which coins to censor and which coins to accept. The reason they can't say any more on the subject is probably because they don't actually know why they are censoring your coins - they've been told to do it and so they will do it without question to protect themselves, and they don't care at all about the user on the other end.

Don Pedro Dinero

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Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on October 17, 2023, 09:29:58 AM

So let me get this straight - you used a mixer, the mixer mixed your coins exactly as they said you would, you deposited your coins on a centralized exchange, the centralized exchange decided to lock your account, and so you post a warning about the mixer? Roll Eyes

Your mistake wasn't in mixing your coins - your mistake was using a centralized exchange which attacks the very essence of bitcoin by treating it as non-fungible, by discriminating against certain coins, and by censoring certain outputs.

Why is no one questioning this? In what other scenario would this be even remotely logical?

I sold an old laptop to a friend for cash. I used the cash to pay a builder who was doing some work for me, and he disappeared without completing the job. Therefore, beware of selling things to my friend! Huh

I traded cash for bitcoin using Bisq. A scammer on Telegram then convinced me to send them my bitcoin and I lost everything. Therefore, beware of using Bisq! Huh

It is Uphold that you should be posting warning messages about, not any mixer. Uphold are the ones who are spying on your coins and locking your account.

I had to quote the whole paragraph because the logic of the argument is impeccable.

The only question I have for you and those of you who know more about the subject is, to what extent is the excuse that they give that they are simply doing it to comply with the law true? Even more so when they say that according to privacy and confidentiality laws they are not going to say anything more on the subject. On top of that I see that the Uphold company is based in London, which is the money laundering capital of the world for large amounts of money.

Londongrad: how the City became a money-laundering haven

Why is London money laundering capital of the world?

o_e_l_e_o

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So let me get this straight - you used a mixer, the mixer mixed your coins exactly as they said you would, you deposited your coins on a centralized exchange, the centralized exchange decided to lock your account, and so you post a warning about the mixer? Roll Eyes

Your mistake wasn't in mixing your coins - your mistake was using a centralized exchange which attacks the very essence of bitcoin by treating it as non-fungible, by discriminating against certain coins, and by censoring certain outputs.

Why is no one questioning this? In what other scenario would this be even remotely logical?

I sold an old laptop to a friend for cash. I used the cash to pay a builder who was doing some work for me, and he disappeared without completing the job. Therefore, beware of selling things to my friend! Huh

I traded cash for bitcoin using Bisq. A scammer on Telegram then convinced me to send them my bitcoin and I lost everything. Therefore, beware of using Bisq! Huh

It is Uphold that you should be posting warning messages about, not any mixer. Uphold are the ones who are spying on your coins and locking your account.

NotATether

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Quote from: hugeblack on October 16, 2023, 12:58:39 PM

you should ask Uphold account about the reason for freezing the account and tell them about the source of the funds, as the account may have been closed by mistake or for any reason.

Generally, most custodial platforms do not want you to be using a mixer with the money you have in there because that will get them into trouble with the government when people start abusing the service (you know, for actual money laundering and terrorism financing).

Some time ago there was even a high profile case of a Binance user who was made to promise to Binance that they would not use a mixer with their binance funds after their account was suspended for withdrawing to Wasabi wallet. So yeah, these wallets have a number against mixers for some reason.

I would not go as far as saying that OP is on an FBI watchlist, because 1) there is no guarantee that Upwork (same company that makes uphold) actually reports these activities to the FBI and 2) they are overwhelmed with leads, tips, and other received data that a single isolated mix isn't going to catch their attention.

The correct action by upwork would be to allow the OP to withdraw their funds, before closing the account if they wanted to terminate it.

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Quote from: yoonie on October 16, 2023, 06:51:25 AM

So I guess thanks YoMix for putting me on an FBI watchlist. Be warned anyone. If it's so easy for an exchange to detect a bitcoin "mixer" it sure as hell means that it's not an actual mixer.

Personal experience in using a mixer is not like what you described. Could I assume you don't know how to use it, I don't think that's possible. Can I assume you don't know the function of the mixer service, I don't think that's possible.
Except for fraudulent mixer services which make everything possible. AFAIK, for mixers like Yomix and several other mixers that are still active it is impossible for the mixer to give your information to other parties because it deviates from the purpose of the mixer.

hugeblack

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Quote from: Bitcoin_Arena on October 16, 2023, 05:11:45 PM

OP, I don't know how long you have used crypto, but you have no one else to blame but yourself. If you want complete privacy and custody of your funds, then avoid centralized exchanges. Simple as that.

There are many who make direct deposits from the mixing service to a central platform because the goal of the mixing service is to break the link between your inputs and your outputs and not to clean the coins (I do not want to use this word because there are no clean coins and dirty coins).
We also have more than 50 members participating in signature campaigns for mixing services, and no one complained. I think @OP is linked to an account that mistakenly copied a different address and when mixing to that address he blamed YoMix.

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Quote from: yoonie on October 16, 2023, 06:51:25 AM

It's well beyond me how a "bitcoin mixer's" developers could be so incompetent.

Don't mix up your own incompetence with someone else's. You don't use mixers to "clean" your coins, but to obfuscate your inputs and break the transaction trail on the blockchain. Obviously, by doing that, you end up with "someone else's" coins that might be linked to some shady activities.

Quote from: yoonie on October 16, 2023, 06:51:25 AM

So I guess thanks YoMix for putting me on an FBI watchlist. Be warned anyone. If it's so easy for an exchange to detect a bitcoin "mixer" it sure as hell means that it's not an actual mixer.

That's nonsense! Jumping to conclusions about being on an FBI watchlist due to using a mixer is a bit of a stretch.

Woodie

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Quote from: yoonie on October 16, 2023, 06:51:25 AM

I recently did an in person transaction and got paid in BTC. Honestly it wasn't anything shady but who knows where these coins were previously... So I thought to use a mixer before cashing out. I have an Uphold account for many many years and never had any issues, so I just mixed my coins with YoMix and deposited there. This was my first transaction I did in Uphold since 3 years ago and in the very next day I get this email. No other transactions were done in the meantime so it's certain this is related to YoMix.

Before blaming YoMix for this hiccup, I believe you have omitted some fine details on your side!

Has your Uphold account been active
When was the last time you used your account besides this transaction
What type of account do you hold with Uphold

Btw reading some of the terms of Uphold>>> https://uphold.com/en-us/legal/membership-agreement/general this could be anything to do with KYC, an inactive account, or their AML checks.

Have you been in touch with their support to try and understand what's happening with your account?

and visiting their Reddit page they seem to be a mess!

Quote from: yoonie on October 16, 2023, 06:51:25 AM

This would mean that the address YoMix used too give me funds immedietly got detected as being connected to terrorism financing.

Am starting to think these guys operate similarly to Paypal where they limit accounts if they receive funds inconsistently and this could be what's happening here...
Just a quick question, how often have you(OP) been depositing funds here..has it been consentient ..if it were $50, $100 then jumped to $2000 am pretty sure they have every right to flag this transaction as its not your regular pattern and best to have a chat with their support, good luck.

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Quote from: yoonie on October 16, 2023, 06:51:25 AM

So I guess thanks YoMix for putting me on an FBI watchlist. Be warned anyone. If it's so easy for an exchange to detect a bitcoin "mixer" it sure as hell means that it's not an actual mixer.

Have you read their article
Why we sometimes have to block, restrict or close accounts - and how to reduce the risk

They stated that there are false positives in their assessment of one's account, have you asked for review of your account I doubt if you are immediately put on FBI's watch list you are creating your own ghost, until now no Chipmixer's customers are charged, so why you would you have that thinking that you are under FBI watch list right away.

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Mixes bitcoins and then send to a centralized exchange. When his account is blocked, goes ahead to blame Yomix for putting him on FBI watch list. Who does that?
What was the point of mixing coins then if you were going to send them to a centralized exchange them?

OP, I don't know how long you have used crypto, but you have no one else to blame but yourself. If you want complete privacy and custody of your funds, then avoid centralized exchanges. Simple as that.

TryNinja

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Call me cynical but I don't believe OP. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Recently registered account (zero posts), so he could say anything. "So why distrust him?" - well, that's because another user was attacking them after copy-pasting the wrong Bitcoin address (context) and then he created another post calling them a "potential honeypot" for revenge (context). I think there is a slight chance this is the same user trying to smear yomix.

Again:

Quote from: TryNinja on October 12, 2023, 08:33:55 PM

Note: I have never used YoMix and have never joined their signature campaign, talked with them, etc... your points just aren't that strong, IMO.

I personally never got any account blocked after using mixers for many years (while I know this has probably happened with other people in the past).

hugeblack

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Quote from: salad daging on October 16, 2023, 01:54:21 PM

I think you made a mistake by doing the mixer service and then using an exchange wallet. It is clear that centralized exchanges have a rule of not accepting deposits from the results of the mixer service because this violates their rules which they consider to be money laundering.

Unless the mixing service is very poor (and as my last test, YOMIX was not) it is difficult or almost impossible for any exchange to be certain that deposits came from a mixer that works in the same way as YOMIX does.
All they will do is analyze the last 10 or 5 transactions, and if they are related to activities such as casinos, addresses on the blacklist, or others, your transaction may be marked badly.
Therefore, unless a careful analysis of your account is carried out, it is difficult for your account to be frozen simply because you used a mixer.

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I think you made a mistake by doing the mixer service and then using an exchange wallet. It is clear that centralized exchanges have a rule of not accepting deposits from the results of the mixer service because this violates their rules which they consider to be money laundering.

I have used the Mixer service several times but never sent it directly to a centralized exchange because I knew it would be dangerous if it was detected and the balance would be held, use another wallet to be safer, but this is not entirely YoMix's fault because the Uphold exchange itself has strict regulations.

Winterfrost

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Last time i checked Yomix is one of the best mixer out there with a lot of users and this is my first time of hearing complaint about the Yomix mixer. I would say you checked your your address again but Yomix supports a lot of addresses including SegWit, Taproot, Legacy, and Bech32, so that should not be the issue. The issue is obviously from your Uphold account perhaps there are some other transactions you did that was related to the claim by Uphold. I still don't know why they wont give you a complete feedback on what may occur, giving excuses to laws and regulation. The reasons for supports is to response to feedback.

Topic: YoMix warning - page 2. (Read 559 times)