Zero KYC tolerance gambling platforms - page 2.

stomachgrowls

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Quote from: Xxmodded on November 27, 2022, 02:01:08 PM

Quote from: Cookdata on November 27, 2022, 09:29:54 AM

You brought to mind a tweet I saw today about phone numbers being sold on the dark web, which stresses the importance of personal documents and information. The majority of those phone numbers are associated with various people all over the world, so I couldn't help but wonder what bad actors could do with them.

Back to documents and KYC in casinos: a reputable casino would take all reasonable precautions to protect player data and funds, but let's be honest with ourselves: if you complete KYC at any casino and they decide to sell your information at some point, you will never know and you won't suspect them because you are accustomed to disclosing personal information to the public, we should learn to normalized No KYC.

My country have been usual habit when your document selling at dark web, I think with mobile phone number not matter again with thousand time inbox message coming from unknow sender and thousand spam sending every day. I don't think with how hidden our document ID when KYC for casino gambling because submit or not our document not hidden or privacy again.

But bit problem when document used for KYC at gambling casino based on majority our country religion are moslem, I think all my gambler in my countries not really agree have to submit KYC with several casino gambling site, they keep try hidden document ID although active with playing several casino gambling.

Majority of us wont really be liking on having that KYc and this is why crypto based gambling sites or casinos did really get soo much attention due to the fact that it do really opposes out centralization or kyc,

but we do go far ahead where regulations becomes more tight and strict then this is where these platforms are starting out to comply or else they cant really be having their operation
or something have a problem towards regulation or something like that.

Although, we do have still casinos nowadays which are fully anonymous and can be trusted.This is why as a gambler then we do still have some options
whether we do comply with those KYC-ed sites or would really be sticking into those anonymous ones.

Xxmodded

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Quote from: Cookdata on November 27, 2022, 09:29:54 AM

You brought to mind a tweet I saw today about phone numbers being sold on the dark web, which stresses the importance of personal documents and information. The majority of those phone numbers are associated with various people all over the world, so I couldn't help but wonder what bad actors could do with them.

Back to documents and KYC in casinos: a reputable casino would take all reasonable precautions to protect player data and funds, but let's be honest with ourselves: if you complete KYC at any casino and they decide to sell your information at some point, you will never know and you won't suspect them because you are accustomed to disclosing personal information to the public, we should learn to normalized No KYC.

My country have been usual habit when your document selling at dark web, I think with mobile phone number not matter again with thousand time inbox message coming from unknow sender and thousand spam sending every day. I don't think with how hidden our document ID when KYC for casino gambling because submit or not our document not hidden or privacy again.

But bit problem when document used for KYC at gambling casino based on majority our country religion are moslem, I think all my gambler in my countries not really agree have to submit KYC with several casino gambling site, they keep try hidden document ID although active with playing several casino gambling.

minime0105

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Quote from: virasisog on November 26, 2022, 09:32:36 AM

Quote from: Xxmodded on November 26, 2022, 04:51:45 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on November 25, 2022, 10:17:46 PM

Maybe those who don't want to do KYC should strictly limit their use of money for gambling and not do anything that would raise the suspicions of the casino against them.
Never gamble with a lot of money if you are not prepared for the risk behind it.
And try to play at a reputable casino so that if you have to do KYC, your data will be safe with them.
And you also have to be prepared to do KYC in the future because this is probably what all casinos will do if the regulators force them to do it for all their users.

Some casino have limited withdrawal or deposit trough account still not KYC yet, I think good ideas when afraid with KYC on casino account based on hidden identity better limited amount for gambling. But have alternative way by gambling on several casino site without needed KYC and spent above $100 until $300 each casino website.

Actually almost the same with exchange market, huge deposit and withdrawing need to increase it by submit KYC, if aware with KYC procedure and won't publish with document ID better use several kinds casino gambling for increasing limit withdrawing or deposit. I don't think have ideas with huge amount of withdrawal with one casino gambling site only.

If you want to transact in a reputable casino freely, better comply with the KYC so you won't have any trouble whenever you deposit or withdraw huge funds. I was also hesitant in submitting my details just to comply with the KYC requirements but I felt relieved because I was able to access all the features on the site and won't have issues whenever I withdraw and deposit my funds regardless of the amount. I think it all depends on the casino. If you want to make sure that your details are safe, make sure to choose a highly trusted and reputable casino.

Some of our people do not understand that KYC is good and also important, whenever a platform that deal's with casino make an emphasis on casino KYC verification that's means that they are protecting your interest and also protect the interest of their company which is well known due to understanding. instead some people prefer some of casino website that doesn't support KYC and make their bet on casino, which from my insight it's not a welcomed development.

Cookdata

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Quote from: traderethereum on November 25, 2022, 10:17:46 PM

Maybe those who don't want to do KYC should strictly limit their use of money for gambling and not do anything that would raise the suspicions of the casino against them.
Never gamble with a lot of money if you are not prepared for the risk behind it.
And try to play at a reputable casino so that if you have to do KYC, your data will be safe with them.
And you also have to be prepared to do KYC in the future because this is probably what all casinos will do if the regulators force them to do it for all their users.

You brought to mind a tweet I saw today about phone numbers being sold on the dark web, which stresses the importance of personal documents and information. The majority of those phone numbers are associated with various people all over the world, so I couldn't help but wonder what bad actors could do with them.

Back to documents and KYC in casinos: a reputable casino would take all reasonable precautions to protect player data and funds, but let's be honest with ourselves: if you complete KYC at any casino and they decide to sell your information at some point, you will never know and you won't suspect them because you are accustomed to disclosing personal information to the public, we should learn to normalized No KYC.

Slow death

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Quote from: AmoreJaz on November 25, 2022, 06:58:52 PM

this is why it is always advisable to just submit kyc if it is indeed necessary. some casinos here don't require kyc even if it is stated on their terms. however, you should always be ready in case they ask for it. but as much as possible better play and spend significant amount of wagering funds in a reputable casino. so in case they need kyc, you won't feel that they are just asking it for nothing.

most of the time people do not have proof of address because they are people who are still at their parents' or uncles' or grandparents' house, so all documents are in the name of their parents or uncles or grandparents and these people cannot deliver the document of residence to the casino. proof of address, that's why you're afraid of KYC, but also most people who earn with cryptocurrencies can't deliver proof of income, and casinos know that, but then why the hell do they ask for it? and I have never heard any casinos come and say they were fined by the license provider because the casino doesn't ask for KYC, has anyone heard that?

Quote from: Shamm on November 26, 2022, 10:47:17 AM

Yes you are right that mate if you are a gambler then you should gamble in the most reputable casino because once you gamble in a reputable casino then you have the assurance of your money cause in a reputable casino your funds will be safe and also you don't need to worry about the withdrawal once you deposits then you can withdraw your money when you want to withdraw.

also the person has a little more security that when doing KYC the casino will not sell your documents, because the big problem is doing KYC in a casino where you do not know who the owners of the casino are, where the casino is located, the casino is new and without reputation, the casino does not sponsor anything in the real world so in this type of casino people have to avoid doing KYC, the casino can sell people's documents and one day some criminal will commit crime using document of some customer of the casino that had its documents stolen and it takes a long time for the police to find out the whole truth

Shamm

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Quote from: virasisog on November 26, 2022, 09:32:36 AM

Quote from: Xxmodded on November 26, 2022, 04:51:45 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on November 25, 2022, 10:17:46 PM

Maybe those who don't want to do KYC should strictly limit their use of money for gambling and not do anything that would raise the suspicions of the casino against them.
Never gamble with a lot of money if you are not prepared for the risk behind it.
And try to play at a reputable casino so that if you have to do KYC, your data will be safe with them.
And you also have to be prepared to do KYC in the future because this is probably what all casinos will do if the regulators force them to do it for all their users.

Some casino have limited withdrawal or deposit trough account still not KYC yet, I think good ideas when afraid with KYC on casino account based on hidden identity better limited amount for gambling. But have alternative way by gambling on several casino site without needed KYC and spent above $100 until $300 each casino website.

Actually almost the same with exchange market, huge deposit and withdrawing need to increase it by submit KYC, if aware with KYC procedure and won't publish with document ID better use several kinds casino gambling for increasing limit withdrawing or deposit. I don't think have ideas with a huge amount of withdrawal with one casino gambling site only.

If you want to transact in a reputable casino freely, better comply with the KYC so you won't have any trouble whenever you deposit or withdraw huge funds. I was also hesitant in submitting my details just to comply with the KYC requirements but I felt relieved because I was able to access all the features on the site and won't have issues whenever I withdraw and deposit my funds regardless of the amount. I think it all depends on the casino. If you want to make sure that your details are safe, make sure to choose a highly trusted and reputable casino.

Yes you are right that mate if you are a gambler then you should gamble in the most reputable casino because once you gamble in a reputable casino then you have the assurance of your money cause in a reputable casino your funds will be safe and also you don't need to worry about the withdrawal once you deposits then you can withdraw your money when you want to withdraw.

virasisog

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Quote from: Xxmodded on November 26, 2022, 04:51:45 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on November 25, 2022, 10:17:46 PM

Maybe those who don't want to do KYC should strictly limit their use of money for gambling and not do anything that would raise the suspicions of the casino against them.
Never gamble with a lot of money if you are not prepared for the risk behind it.
And try to play at a reputable casino so that if you have to do KYC, your data will be safe with them.
And you also have to be prepared to do KYC in the future because this is probably what all casinos will do if the regulators force them to do it for all their users.

Some casino have limited withdrawal or deposit trough account still not KYC yet, I think good ideas when afraid with KYC on casino account based on hidden identity better limited amount for gambling. But have alternative way by gambling on several casino site without needed KYC and spent above $100 until $300 each casino website.

Actually almost the same with exchange market, huge deposit and withdrawing need to increase it by submit KYC, if aware with KYC procedure and won't publish with document ID better use several kinds casino gambling for increasing limit withdrawing or deposit. I don't think have ideas with huge amount of withdrawal with one casino gambling site only.

If you want to transact in a reputable casino freely, better comply with the KYC so you won't have any trouble whenever you deposit or withdraw huge funds. I was also hesitant in submitting my details just to comply with the KYC requirements but I felt relieved because I was able to access all the features on the site and won't have issues whenever I withdraw and deposit my funds regardless of the amount. I think it all depends on the casino. If you want to make sure that your details are safe, make sure to choose a highly trusted and reputable casino.

Xxmodded

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Quote from: traderethereum on November 25, 2022, 10:17:46 PM

Maybe those who don't want to do KYC should strictly limit their use of money for gambling and not do anything that would raise the suspicions of the casino against them.
Never gamble with a lot of money if you are not prepared for the risk behind it.
And try to play at a reputable casino so that if you have to do KYC, your data will be safe with them.
And you also have to be prepared to do KYC in the future because this is probably what all casinos will do if the regulators force them to do it for all their users.

Some casino have limited withdrawal or deposit trough account still not KYC yet, I think good ideas when afraid with KYC on casino account based on hidden identity better limited amount for gambling. But have alternative way by gambling on several casino site without needed KYC and spent above $100 until $300 each casino website.

Actually almost the same with exchange market, huge deposit and withdrawing need to increase it by submit KYC, if aware with KYC procedure and won't publish with document ID better use several kinds casino gambling for increasing limit withdrawing or deposit. I don't think have ideas with huge amount withdrawal with one casino gambling site only.

EarnOnVictor

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Quote from: Strongkored on November 26, 2022, 02:17:33 AM

Quote from: Eternad on November 25, 2022, 10:35:13 PM

Much better to play on decentralized casino that doesn’t require KYC rather than risk playing on casino that has a threat on doing it.

But unfortunately there are not many decentralized casinos that are available and can be made an option for players, or even if there are sometimes centralized casinos are still more attractive in many ways, such as when traders have to choose between decentralized and centralized exchanges, yes DEX is safer because we have access to private Key but the trading volume and low amount of DEX keeps CEX the choice.
I've only seen a few decentralized casinos on this forum, even though they're not that well-known, some of them don't exist anymore the slow development of decentralized casinos has finally made them unable to survive in this gambling business, and KYC will always be a hot topic of discussion, there will always be pros and cons, and whatever choice the player chooses, they have to be prepared for all the risks that arise.

Well said, and you have covered it all, nothing has merits without demerits, which was why I always advocate KYC and more regulations to the disbelieve of others as such have their merits too.

Besides, since there are still some decentralized casinos, one could still take advantage of them no matter how scarce they could be. And I don't think they are scarce or diminishing because they are decentralized, but because they don't attract gamblers with bonuses and perks that would make them register and stay like the centralized casinos.

Strongkored

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Quote from: Eternad on November 25, 2022, 10:35:13 PM

Much better to play on decentralized casino that doesn’t require KYC rather than risk playing on casino that has a threat on doing it.

But unfortunately there are not many decentralized casinos that are available and can be made an option for players, or even if there are sometimes centralized casinos are still more attractive in many ways, such as when traders have to choose between decentralized and centralized exchanges, yes DEX is safer because we have access to private Key but the trading volume and low amount of DEX keeps CEX the choice.
I've only seen a few decentralized casinos on this forum, even though they're not that well-known, some of them don't exist anymore the slow development of decentralized casinos has finally made them unable to survive in this gambling business, and KYC will always be a hot topic of discussion, there will always be pros and cons, and whatever choice the player chooses, they have to be prepared for all the risks that arise.

Eternad

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Quote from: traderethereum on November 25, 2022, 10:17:46 PM

Quote from: AmoreJaz on November 25, 2022, 06:58:52 PM

this is why it is always advisable to just submit kyc if it is indeed necessary. some casinos here don't require kyc even if it is stated on their terms. however, you should always be ready in case they ask for it. but as much as possible better play and spend significant amount of wagering funds in a reputable casino. so in case they need kyc, you won't feel that they are just asking it for nothing.

Maybe those who don't want to do KYC should strictly limit their use of money for gambling and not do anything that would raise the suspicions of the casino against them.
Never gamble with a lot of money if you are not prepared for the risk behind it.
And try to play at a reputable casino so that if you have to do KYC, your data will be safe with them.
And you also have to be prepared to do KYC in the future because this is probably what all casinos will do if the regulators force them to do it for all their users.

No. It’s still absurd to play in the casino at the first place even with this limitation just to hide from the eye of Casino for a possible KYC since all the casino ToS stated that they can imply it whenever they want it. A non-KYC fan should not play in the casino because they are just limiting themselves by playing with risk of exposing there privacy.

Here’s some list that will trigger alarm for Casino security to impose KYC on account and at the same time things that will limit user to experience on casino:

They are not allowed to win huge amount or jackpot prize
Playing only with small amount and manage to win most of the time
Use of VPN
Multiple deposit from different address

Much better to play on decentralized casino that doesn’t require KYC rather than risk playing on casino that has a threat on doing it.

traderethereum

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Quote from: AmoreJaz on November 25, 2022, 06:58:52 PM

this is why it is always advisable to just submit kyc if it is indeed necessary. some casinos here don't require kyc even if it is stated on their terms. however, you should always be ready in case they ask for it. but as much as possible better play and spend significant amount of wagering funds in a reputable casino. so in case they need kyc, you won't feel that they are just asking it for nothing.

Maybe those who don't want to do KYC should strictly limit their use of money for gambling and not do anything that would raise the suspicions of the casino against them.
Never gamble with a lot of money if you are not prepared for the risk behind it.
And try to play at a reputable casino so that if you have to do KYC, your data will be safe with them.
And you also have to be prepared to do KYC in the future because this is probably what all casinos will do if the regulators force them to do it for all their users.

AmoreJaz

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Quote from: CryptoHeadlineNews on November 25, 2022, 04:44:00 PM

Quote from: erep on November 25, 2022, 04:21:10 PM

Quote from: noormcs5 on November 25, 2022, 03:44:02 PM

There are some more reasons other than the privacy ones, that gamblers do not want to do the KYC on the gambling site. There s no grantee that your KYC data is secured on the gambling site and they could misuse your data or even sell it to third parties and get good money out of it

I understand that government want regulations and impose the KYC but what steps they did took to ensure the safety of this data by the sites ?
I think government should be more concerned about it and introduce strict rules for the safety of people's data.

I hope the jurisdictions monitoring user data have completed KYC verification on each partner of the gambling platform, they must ensure user data is protected safely and pressure the gambling platform team not to misuse user KYC data. However, we expect the role of the government to punish if any perpetrator has misused user KYC data for criminal purposes and even sold data anonymously on the black market web.

You really have a brilliant idea here, but these can only be implemented in a country whose law is implemented as clearly started in the constitution, unlike most countries where corruption is the order of the day in mostt high government offices, that authorize exchange to sell our data without the peoples knowledge

this is why it is always advisable to just submit kyc if it is indeed necessary. some casinos here don't require kyc even if it is stated on their terms. however, you should always be ready in case they ask for it. but as much as possible better play and spend significant amount of wagering funds in a reputable casino. so in case they need kyc, you won't feel that they are just asking it for nothing.

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Quote from: erep on November 25, 2022, 04:21:10 PM

Quote from: noormcs5 on November 25, 2022, 03:44:02 PM

There are some more reasons other than the privacy ones, that gamblers do not want to do the KYC on the gambling site. There s no grantee that your KYC data is secured on the gambling site and they could misuse your data or even sell it to third parties and get good money out of it

I understand that government want regulations and impose the KYC but what steps they did took to ensure the safety of this data by the sites ?
I think government should be more concerned about it and introduce strict rules for the safety of people's data.

I hope the jurisdictions monitoring user data have completed KYC verification on each partner of the gambling platform, they must ensure user data is protected safely and pressure the gambling platform team not to misuse user KYC data. However, we expect the role of the government to punish if any perpetrator has misused user KYC data for criminal purposes and even sold data anonymously on the black market web.

You really have a brilliant idea here, but these can only be implemented in a country whose law is implemented as clearly started in the constitution, unlike most countries where corruption is the order of the day in mostt high government offices, that authorize exchange to sell our data without the peoples knowledge

erep

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Quote from: noormcs5 on November 25, 2022, 03:44:02 PM

There are some more reasons other than the privacy ones, that gamblers do not want to do the KYC on the gambling site. There s no grantee that your KYC data is secured on the gambling site and they could misuse your data or even sell it to third parties and get good money out of it

I understand that government want regulations and impose the KYC but what steps they did took to ensure the safety of this data by the sites ?
I think government should be more concerned about it and introduce strict rules for the safety of people's data.

I hope the jurisdictions monitoring user data have completed KYC verification on each partner of the gambling platform, they must ensure user data is protected safely and pressure the gambling platform team not to misuse user KYC data. However, we expect the role of the government to punish if any perpetrator has misused user KYC data for criminal purposes and even sold data anonymously on the black market web.

noormcs5

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Quote from: erep on November 25, 2022, 03:36:44 PM

Quote from: BitcoinAccepted on November 25, 2022, 02:18:05 PM

There are still a few casinos that do not charge KYC. If you are on a gambling site that is not licensed by Malta, Curacao or any other reputable jurisdiction, there is a good chance you can play without KYC. If you are on a gambling site licensed by MGA or Curacao, rest assured that a check is necessary as the licensing providers require it. The rules have been tightened up considerably in recent years, I have read, so in fact gambling sites have no other choice. We would all prefer to play without KYC, but that is a thing of the past. There are also sites where you have to account for your entire wealth.

There are several regulations from leading licensing jurisdictions that have been tightened to verify user data on each gambling platform so that KYC rules have been officially added to the terms and conditions in gambling, but only some gamblers refuse KYC regulations for privacy reasons but other gamblers have no problem with KYC because works to avoid money laundering and other crimes, KYC regulations are not a problem for gamblers if we use top gambling platforms that have been recommended in forums. I recommend avoiding gambling platforms that offer zero KYC because they are not licensed by official jurisdictions so the reputation of the gambling platforms is very low and our account assets are not guaranteed to be protected safely.

There are some more reasons other than the privacy ones, that gamblers do not want to do the KYC on the gambling site. There s no grantee that your KYC data is secured on the gambling site and they could misuse your data or even sell it to third parties and get good money out of it

I understand that government want regulations and impose the KYC but what steps they did took to ensure the safety of this data by the sites ?
I think government should be more concerned about it and introduce strict rules for the safety of people's data.

erep

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Quote from: BitcoinAccepted on November 25, 2022, 02:18:05 PM

There are still a few casinos that do not charge KYC. If you are on a gambling site that is not licensed by Malta, Curacao or any other reputable jurisdiction, there is a good chance you can play without KYC. If you are on a gambling site licensed by MGA or Curacao, rest assured that a check is necessary as the licensing providers require it. The rules have been tightened up considerably in recent years, I have read, so in fact gambling sites have no other choice. We would all prefer to play without KYC, but that is a thing of the past. There are also sites where you have to account for your entire wealth.

There are several regulations from leading licensing jurisdictions that have been tightened to verify user data on each gambling platform so that KYC rules have been officially added to the terms and conditions in gambling, but only some gamblers refuse KYC regulations for privacy reasons but other gamblers have no problem with KYC because works to avoid money laundering and other crimes, KYC regulations are not a problem for gamblers if we use top gambling platforms that have been recommended in forums. I recommend avoiding gambling platforms that offer zero KYC because they are not licensed by official jurisdictions so the reputation of the gambling platforms is very low and our account assets are not guaranteed to be protected safely.

stomachgrowls

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Quote from: BitcoinAccepted on November 25, 2022, 02:18:05 PM

There are still a few casinos that do not charge KYC. If you are on a gambling site that is not licensed by Malta, Curacao or any other reputable jurisdiction, there is a good chance you can play without KYC. If you are on a gambling site licensed by MGA or Curacao, rest assured that a check is necessary as the licensing providers require it. The rules have been tightened up considerably in recent years, I have read, so in fact gambling sites have no other choice. We would all prefer to play without KYC, but that is a thing of the past. There are also sites where you have to account for your entire wealth.

As regulation and laws are becoming more tighter then it wont really be that surprising if these non-kyc casinos or any platforms which are involved with or attached with crypto transactions then it would really be that

understandable that they would really be going on that way.Yes, we do have still casinos nowadays which doesnt have licenses but surprisingly they are able to get sufficient number of users or simply get that

marketshare.People do really give out the importance of total anonymity when they do play gambling but somewhat we do know on whats the exchange for that pros which on the case if the house
do rans away then there's no way of tracing it out.

BitcoinAccepted

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There are still a few casinos that do not charge KYC. If you are on a gambling site that is not licensed by Malta, Curacao or any other reputable jurisdiction, there is a good chance you can play without KYC. If you are on a gambling site licensed by MGA or Curacao, rest assured that a check is necessary as the licensing providers require it. The rules have been tightened up considerably in recent years, I have read, so in fact gambling sites have no other choice. We would all prefer to play without KYC, but that is a thing of the past. There are also sites where you have to account for your entire wealth.

serjent05

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Quote from: Obari on November 24, 2022, 09:25:41 PM

Quote from: Z390 on October 18, 2022, 02:53:10 AM

Is KYC verification very important to crypto gambling websites or this has something to do with their regulations rule? Where can one gamble with zero verification requirements?

KYC is very important to crypto gambling over the years now and not just crypto gambling but gambling in general so as to enhance transpacific behavior of user in their casino and also avoid and prevent money laundering in any form on their casino.

KYC was also induced as a form of regulations mostly by the gambling board to help track the identity of players who are suspected of an criminal activity on the casino.

I understand what you are pointing out, KYC is the tool for casino to verify their users and check whether each account created on the platform is unique individuals. That is the casino ways of establishing any valuable proof if things like hacking, cheating, bugging, or exploitation via multi-accounting are suspected in an account

Quote from: Obari on November 24, 2022, 09:25:41 PM

It is true that some gamblers if no majority of gamblers would prefer to stay anonymous while playing games so as to feel safe and more confident but the truth is that, most of this casinos will never review your identity to anyone without your consent.

Anonymous gambling had been popular because of the implementation of cryptocurrency into the gambling platform and the creation of cryptocurrency Casinos. Originally, Online Casinos implement KYC because they connect the player's banking account or any financial institution to the casino and they need to verify if the owner of the account is the actual owner of the cards used for gambling.

Quote from: delfastTions on November 23, 2022, 02:13:57 AM

Of course, the development of such smart contracts is extremely complex and time-consuming.
And by the way, the price of devs errors is very high. Even small bugs can completely ruin the whole game. But I think that the topic of developing such games is very relevant and someone will definitely work in this direction. First of all, because many millions of people are disgusted that some centralized services, such as online casinos, constantly require KYC.
And even those casinos that did not require verification before, comply with the requirements of regulators and gradually more and more of them require KYC.

True that is why most casino owner prefer to use centralized casino because the security of this kind of casino is already established. While decentralized casino is still in a testing phase and the technology isn't full furnised since there are lots of bugs and glitches in the system. We can prove it by looking at its DeFi platform counterparts where hacking is almost a normal event.

Topic: Zero KYC tolerance gambling platforms - page 2. (Read 4795 times)