Most projects, like Bitcoin, don't even care.
That is what I thought you were going to say. 
Topic: [1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool - page 91. (Read 2591919 times)
April 17, 2016, 08:22:12 AM
April 17, 2016, 07:02:57 AM
P2pool is written in a language that I can only describe as trash.
Not interested in going near it at all.
@kano Speaking of languages, why on earth is Bitcoin written in C++? I thought C would have been the first and better choice.Not interested in going near it at all.
1) Performance
2) Maintainability
Assembly fails badly on 2) so no one in their right mind would write anything but a tiny project using it.
C++ is for those who require a language that forces them to be object oriented (though many don't understand object orientation)
Object orientation is to simplify coding and concepts to supposedly simplify understanding and maintenance but rarely succeeds in doing that.
In of itself, object orientation isn't a bad thing, it's quite the opposite, but it also leads to slow code due to massive bloat.
C has a steep learning cure for anyone who is only familiar with simple languages and script languages.
A pointer is something that many fail to fully understand.
On the other hand, the language specification is so simple that it's not difficult to write a C compiler.
Also, since the language itself is not very far from machine code in concept, it leads to very fast compiled code.
But people can write bad and slow code in any language
Very few at all understand how to successfully performance tune code. Most projects, like Bitcoin, don't even care.
April 17, 2016, 06:06:24 AM
why on earth is Bitcoin written in C++? I thought C would have been the first and better choice.
Hard lol at "better" and "worse" programming languages. Presumably all code for all devices would be "better" if it was written in machine code? 
April 17, 2016, 05:42:52 AM
why on earth is Bitcoin written in C++? I thought C would have been the first and better choice.
Hard lol at "better" and "worse" programming languages. Presumably all code for all devices would be "better" if it was written in machine code?
April 17, 2016, 01:29:38 AM
Check the times of the blocks:
So, what do you think happened?Code:
2016-04-15 02:57:19.832312 UpdateTip: new best=0000000000000000052e336f67c1b0d339d5e7423595c60f169cd17bd24e5306 height=407354 log2_work=84.48832
tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
Doesn't look like it was immediately after a new block...tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
P2pool is written in a language that I can only describe as trash.
Not interested in going near it at all.
@kano Speaking of languages, why on earth is Bitcoin written in C++? I thought C would have been the first and better choice. Not interested in going near it at all.
April 16, 2016, 10:44:32 PM
Block....
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
When P2Pool learns that there's a new block, it mines empty blocks until bitcoind gives it a block template.
The alternative to doing this would be to mine orphaned blocks rather than empty ones. :/
Do it right like we do on ckpool and never mine empty blocks ...
Jeze Kano, if it bothers you so much why don't you contribute to the open source code base of the only decentralized pool rather then promoting your own centralized solution in our thread AGAIN...
Better yet, why not grow a real sack and attack the real problem pools mining empty blocks like antpool?
What's your hate on p2pool all about anyway? Or is it just your not so subtle form of gurrilla marketing?
P2pool is written in a language that I can only describe as trash.
Not interested in going near it at all.
It's design is also flawed.
Lulz - you don't like that I'm part of the team that provides the free opensource software that more miners on the bitcoin network use than any other software, or that the ckpool software that -ck and I write is fully free opensource also?
Oh well, go bitch to someone who cares.
Or is it that you don't like that fact that we have NEVER mined an empty block? ... unlike p2pool.
forrestv has above stated that his software mines empty blocks on purpose.
Yes I run a centralised mining pool ... that doesn't mine empty blocks ... unlike p2pool.
Meanwhile people like you try to centralise p2pool by creating nodes that you get people to mine to, rather than getting people to mine to their own decentralised nodes.
There's 'centralised' p2pool nodes ... which is not all that different to saying there's lots of 'centralised' mining pools out there.
April 16, 2016, 07:56:52 PM
Block....
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
When P2Pool learns that there's a new block, it mines empty blocks until bitcoind gives it a block template.
The alternative to doing this would be to mine orphaned blocks rather than empty ones. :/
Do it right like we do on ckpool and never mine empty blocks ...
Jeze Kano, if it bothers you so much why don't you contribute to the open source code base of the only decentralized pool rather then promoting your own centralized solution in our thread AGAIN...
Better yet, why not grow a real sack and attack the real problem pools mining empty blocks like antpool?
What's your hate on p2pool all about anyway? Or is it just your not so subtle form of gurrilla marketing?
April 14, 2016, 11:06:56 PM
ok sorry if I judge it wrongly lol.. I thought that if a block contain no transaction, it called empty block.
If its not immediately after a new block, it's not empty block? I'm really confuse lol. anyone kind enough to explain it to me
No you got it right the first time. The rest of the discussion was trying to ascertain why it was an empty block. If its not immediately after a new block, it's not empty block? I'm really confuse lol. anyone kind enough to explain it to me
April 14, 2016, 11:03:59 PM
Block....
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
When P2Pool learns that there's a new block, it mines empty blocks until bitcoind gives it a block template.
The alternative to doing this would be to mine orphaned blocks rather than empty ones. :/
Do it right like we do on ckpool and never mine empty blocks ...
April 14, 2016, 11:02:54 PM
Block....
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
When P2Pool learns that there's a new block, it mines empty blocks until bitcoind gives it a block template.
The alternative to doing this would be to mine orphaned blocks rather than empty ones. :/
Check the times of the blocks:
Code:
2016-04-15 02:57:19.832312 UpdateTip: new best=0000000000000000052e336f67c1b0d339d5e7423595c60f169cd17bd24e5306 height=407354 log2_work=84.48832
tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
Doesn't look like it was immediately after a new block...tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
ok sorry if I judge it wrongly lol.. I thought that if a block contain no transaction, it called empty block.
If its not immediately after a new block, it's not empty block? I'm really confuse lol. anyone kind enough to explain it to me
April 14, 2016, 10:52:49 PM
Check the times of the blocks:
So, what do you think happened?Code:
2016-04-15 02:57:19.832312 UpdateTip: new best=0000000000000000052e336f67c1b0d339d5e7423595c60f169cd17bd24e5306 height=407354 log2_work=84.48832
tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
Doesn't look like it was immediately after a new block...tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
April 14, 2016, 10:50:50 PM
Check the times of the blocks:
So, what do you think happened? Code:
2016-04-15 02:57:19.832312 UpdateTip: new best=0000000000000000052e336f67c1b0d339d5e7423595c60f169cd17bd24e5306 height=407354 log2_work=84.48832
tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
Doesn't look like it was immediately after a new block...tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
April 14, 2016, 10:49:49 PM
Block....
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
Whoops! Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
April 14, 2016, 10:49:07 PM
Block....
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
When P2Pool learns that there's a new block, it mines empty blocks until bitcoind gives it a block template.
The alternative to doing this would be to mine orphaned blocks rather than empty ones. :/
Check the times of the blocks:
Code:
2016-04-15 02:57:19.832312 UpdateTip: new best=0000000000000000052e336f67c1b0d339d5e7423595c60f169cd17bd24e5306 height=407354 log2_work=84.48832
tx=122495865 date=2016-04-15 02:57:07 progress=1.000000 cache=4.7MiB(5564tx)
2016-04-15 03:21:13.214595 UpdateTip: new best=000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930 height=407355 log2_work=84.48836
1 tx=122495866 date=2016-04-15 03:20:49 progress=1.000000 cache=51.3MiB(16114tx)
April 14, 2016, 10:45:20 PM
Block....
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
When P2Pool learns that there's a new block, it mines empty blocks until bitcoind gives it a block template.
The alternative to doing this would be to mine orphaned blocks rather than empty ones. :/
April 14, 2016, 10:26:26 PM
Block....
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
Did P2Pool just mine empty block?
https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000003828fbc61ad281aa2e298ed4a299abf36209a4725d51930
April 10, 2016, 07:21:34 PM
Hey we found a block!
Of course I'm out of town and my site is reporting it incorrectly as one orphan and one found block, I'll get it sorted on Friday when I return, but hey, we found a block!
Of course I'm out of town and my site is reporting it incorrectly as one orphan and one found block, I'll get it sorted on Friday when I return, but hey, we found a block!
April 09, 2016, 04:04:13 PM
April 08, 2016, 11:21:18 PM
Isn't an easy solution to too much p2pool participation just to have multiple separate p2pools? I think there are some alts where p2pool got really popular which have done that.
The game theory on this works quite nicely in fact, since being on a p2pool that is too small or too big are both undesirable, so miners will tend to spread out.
Of course, the current problem is too little participation, not too much.
The game theory on this works quite nicely in fact, since being on a p2pool that is too small or too big are both undesirable, so miners will tend to spread out.
Of course, the current problem is too little participation, not too much.
Yeah separate p2pool is one of the idea I think.
That is true, spread out miner is good I think.
This is the biggest problem of all in p2pool. Lets face it, why do we buy ASIC miner? I believe the one who buy ASIC miner already done some research and reading how many btc we could get with the miner, how much electricity cost, etc. How long will ROI... current p2pool payout is based on 3 days worth of share. but with the pool current hash rate, it will hit the block around 10-12 days (according to what was written on the web front end). I don't think you can cover your electricity cost with this unless you have either super unbelievable cheap or free electricity.
I don't know how high the hash rate in p2pool to make the difficulty undesirable but as of this posting date, if it can reach at least 50 Ph/s and it still desirable (good variation) then it should be all good.
April 08, 2016, 09:41:58 PM
ck, could you kind enough to explain to me about this scaling issue, preferably in noob wording lol...
In a regular pool, the more hashrate the pool has, the less variation there is in each miner's payouts. In p2pool it is biphasic. Initially as the hashrate of the pool increases your variation decreases, and then as the hashrate gets larger again, variation starts increasing again. If all miners were on p2pool, it'd be like they were solo mining at 1/20th of the current network diff which would be horrific variation. It's one of the limitations of the p2pool design that's been talked about, thrashed out and debated about for years on end without a solution.Isn't an easy solution to too much p2pool participation just to have multiple separate p2pools? I think there are some alts where p2pool got really popular which have done that.
The game theory on this works quite nicely in fact, since being on a p2pool that is too small or too big are both undesirable, so miners will tend to spread out.
Of course, the current problem is too little participation, not too much.
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