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Topic: 1GH/s, 20w, $500 — Butterflylabs, is it a scam? - page 53. (Read 123109 times)

hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
In sum, we're getting very close.  I'm sorry for not engaging in your warm discussion, but after all, Missouri is the "Show me" state and I think that's the right sentiment for the moment.

So why is your corporation not listed with Missouri Board of Corporations (as required by state law)?

https://www.sos.mo.gov/businessentity/soskb/SearchResults.asp?FormName=CorpNameSearch&Words=Starting&SearchStr=Butterfly+Labs&SearchType=Search

I completely agree with you D&T. Business is business. Some strange points still remain with BFL. Last thing we need is more scammers in this community but ATM it is looking pretty real to me Smiley
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
In sum, we're getting very close.  I'm sorry for not engaging in your warm discussion, but after all, Missouri is the "Show me" state and I think that's the right sentiment for the moment.

So why is your corporation not listed with Missouri Board of Corporations (as required by state law)?

https://www.sos.mo.gov/businessentity/soskb/SearchResults.asp?FormName=CorpNameSearch&Words=Starting&SearchStr=Butterfly+Labs&SearchType=Search
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1057
Marketing manager - GO MP
Give them some time... i want to see the faces of those who called them scams when it works some day. Ninja Queen looks real to me  Cheesy Grin

I called them a scam (and still do) but if it is real I will buy $5K once their claims are confirmed as valid.  No hard feeling, business is business.  I sure as hell am not putting in a pre-order so the money can disapear though.
At least half of this forum would get one, silly  Cheesy
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
Give them some time... i want to see the faces of those who called them scams when it works some day. Ninja Queen looks real to me  Cheesy Grin

I called them a scam (and still do) but if it is real I will buy $5K worth (was planning on buying FPGA in January anyways) once their claims are confirmed as valid.  I guess some would call that eating crow but no hard feeling, business is business.    I sure as hell am not putting in a pre-order so the money can disappear and I got stuck w/ a charge that can't be chargedback.
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1057
Marketing manager - GO MP
The site has privatized whois information:
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with no guarantee or warranties regarding its accuracy. This
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processes designed to collect or compile this data for any purpose,
including mining this data for your own personal or commercial purposes.

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in the "registrant" field. In most cases, GoDaddy.com, Inc.
is not the registrant of domain names listed in this database.


Registrant:
Domains by Proxy, Inc.

DomainsByProxy.com
15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: BUTTERFLYLABS.COM
Created on: 16-Aug-09
Expires on: 16-Aug-12
Last Updated on: 06-Jul-11

Administrative Contact:
Private, Registration [email protected]
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
DomainsByProxy.com
15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States
(480) 624-2599 Fax -- (480) 624-2598

Technical Contact:
Private, Registration [email protected]
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
DomainsByProxy.com
15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States
(480) 624-2599 Fax -- (480) 624-2598

Domain servers in listed order:
NS77.DOMAINCONTROL.COM
NS78.DOMAINCONTROL.COM


Registry Status: clientDeleteProhibited
Registry Status: clientRenewProhibited
Registry Status: clientTransferProhibited
Registry Status: clientUpdateProhibited

It's the oldest tricks in the book.... HYIPs and other scams swear on it.
But go ahead order one now!

Only 99 left!!!111oneoneeleven  Roll Eyes
legendary
Activity: 1022
Merit: 1000
BitMinter
Give them some time... i want to see the faces of those who called them scams when it works some day. Ninja Queen looks real to me  Cheesy Grin
hero member
Activity: 642
Merit: 500
A well written response...  Smiley

P.S.  --  We want to see your birth certificate.   Cheesy
hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
Contrary to comments I have made in the past : this looks damn real to me. Nice quality and workmanship too. However why no screenshots showing hashrate etc. ? Why not showing it in actual action, hashing ? How can I be a community tester for this thing ? Prices are maintained still ?

Thanks.
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1057
Marketing manager - GO MP
BFL
full member
Activity: 217
Merit: 100
Hi guys,

Thanks for all your insightful comments.  Smiley

Although we have concluded it's best to allow this thread to continue on it's own course, I know there are readers among you interested in an update, so I thought I'd post a link to our last production blog update. 

http://butterflylabs.com/november-production-update/



Also...   In roughly two weeks, we will be ready to schedule an open viewing and live product demonstration here in Kansas City.  I would also like to remind everyone that we have an existing offer to send a sample unit to a member of the forum community capable of performing a formal proof of work analysis.  There was no serious response to that offer last time on the forum, but we have received private suggestions and we will add them to the list as we bring it to a vote.  If you care to offer additional nominations, please keep in mind that bitcoin network systems expertise and not general hardware experience would make for better qualification.

In sum, we're getting very close.  I'm sorry for not engaging in your warm discussion, but after all, Missouri is the "Show me" state and I think that's the right sentiment for the moment.

Kind regards,
BFL

hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
Obvious scam is obvious. Let us move on. Shame on you Butterfly labs. The last thing we need here is more damn scammers. Great !
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
popcorn time..
hero member
Activity: 561
Merit: 500

It may have gotten some people to say "well that good I should pre-order".  Their website has a strong call to action.  Pre-order only 100 units available.

WAIT WHAT IF I WAIT AND DON'T GET ONE OF 100 UNITS??? ON NOES I BETTER GET THAT CREDIT CARD NOW.

Of course no unit will show up.  Maybe they return saying unit is coming soon.  Maybe even line up the testers and get their addresses.  It will be just to buy time.  >60 days you have no option to chargeback.  I am sure the pre-orders will "ship" shortly after that window closes.  The website will disapear and the bank account funds were deposited to by CC will be closed.

This is EXACTLY what's going to happen. And those of you currently sitting on paid pre-orders hoping for the best will have a single tear glistening in the corner of your eye, lower lip quivering as you mutter "I should have listened to wormbog and DeathAndTaxes. Those guys are so awesome. WHY DINT I LISTEN??!!!?!??!!11!!eleven"
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
If I remember correctly, the Rep. from Butterflylabs was to send a unit to one of us
to be checked out and see how well it works.
 At this point that has not happened. This does not bode well for Butterflylabs.

It may have gotten some people to say "well that good I should pre-order".  Their website has a strong call to action.  Pre-order only 100 units available.

WAIT WHAT IF I WAIT AND DON'T GET ONE OF 100 UNITS??? ON NOES I BETTER GET THAT CREDIT CARD NOW.

Of course no unit will show up.  Maybe they return saying unit is coming soon.  Maybe even line up the testers and get their addresses.  It will be just to buy time.  >60 days you have no option to chargeback.  I am sure the pre-orders will "ship" shortly after that window closes.  The website will disapear and the bank account funds were deposited to by CC will be closed.
Ad
newbie
Activity: 15
Merit: 0
 If I remember correctly, the Rep. from Butterflylabs was to send a unit to one of us
to be checked out and see how well it works.
 At this point that has not happened. This does not bode well for Butterflylabs.
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
Yeap, I tend to agree, why would they want to spend so much time scamming such a tiny community.  We aren't really big and there aren't that many miners.
hero member
Activity: 561
Merit: 500
Looking fake to me. No markings on chips ? No real incentive to develop real BTC mining product now. More like a scam it seems.

Why do they not submit proof ? Because they don't have proof for a scam. Simple.

This thread reminds me of a long thread on a car site, where most of the people said the car was a fake, and it turned out real.  Lots of analysis of the pictures, including people who were CERTAIN that it was a photoshop job, with detailed graphical markups of the (perceived) problems in the pictures.  


Forget about the product photos. The company's office address is fake and their business is not registered with the state. The scammer clearly has some electrical engineering knowledge and probably has access to a lab somewhere. He's clearly qualified to mock up a plausible looking product. But he can't fake an office or an entry in the state business database. It has already been proven that Butterfly Labs Inc. is not a real business! The photos are irrelevant!

  So, I suppose it would not be pluasable at all for someone to want to enter a product into an 'underground' economy and keep his business, well, underground? ;p

Correct, it is not plausible that a someone making a complex, highly technical, and legal product would choose to sell it exclusively to the 'underground' marketplace by announcing it on a public message board with a link to a public website.

Quote
  Edit; and why is it when anyone argues that there really isn't sufficent evidence to yell 'SCAM' that everyone assumes we're fuggin retarded and being scammed?  Just wanted to point out that I am far from being naive. But, I am open minded....

I haven't heard anyone argue that there's not sufficient evidence to show that it's a scam. Nobody has proposed any reasonable explanation for why Butterfly has a fake office address and is not registered in the state they claim to be doing business in. Those defending the "it's not a scam" position choose to ignore those facts and focus instead on the PCB photos.

I don't think anyone here is stupid or being willfully ignorant. But I do think there are people here who really want this product to be real and are willing to dismiss all evidence to the contrary.

It's the same mentality that drives people to buy lottery tickets, go to church, and vote Republican.  Grin
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
Except in our case, the burden of proof lies nither with the nay sayers or the optimists. It is of the creator to present, and thus far he has, atleast in pretty pixel form....

He hasn't provide proof of anything except a $20 PCB. If someone was running a scam trying to get tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars for a non-existent project then producing a $20 PCB that does absolutely nothing would be a decent ROI% don't you think.



Good point.  I had no idea you can get a raw pcb made singles like that for $20, but if you can, that changes things. 

Well the $20 are usually the ugly yellow kind without silkscreening.  Say $50 for a high end prototype board.
legendary
Activity: 1386
Merit: 1004
Except in our case, the burden of proof lies nither with the nay sayers or the optimists. It is of the creator to present, and thus far he has, atleast in pretty pixel form....

He hasn't provide proof of anything except a $20 PCB. If someone was running a scam trying to get tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars for a non-existent project then producing a $20 PCB that does absolutely nothing would be a decent ROI% don't you think.



Good point.  I had no idea you can get a raw pcb made singles like that for $20, but if you can, that changes things. 
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
Except in our case, the burden of proof lies nither with the nay sayers or the optimists. It is of the creator to present, and thus far he has, atleast in pretty pixel form....

He hasn't provide proof of anything except a $20 PCB. If someone was running a scam trying to get tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars for a non-existent project then producing a $20 PCB that does absolutely nothing would be a decent ROI% don't you think.

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