As long as there is an accounting system for ownership of shares, they still can be traded over the Internet.
But those have not been implemented in to the protocol yet. But, what we could do is create a alt-coin that represents the shares.
Topic: [ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated] - page 476. (Read 771288 times)
October 08, 2013, 07:18:47 PM
An altcoin which represents shares of a specific company is interesting. There would be no mining for it, and it would be strictly an accounting system.
As long as there is an accounting system for ownership of shares, they still can be traded over the Internet.
But those have not been implemented in to the protocol yet. But, what we could do is create a alt-coin that represents the shares.
As long as there is an accounting system for ownership of shares, they still can be traded over the Internet.
But those have not been implemented in to the protocol yet. But, what we could do is create a alt-coin that represents the shares.
October 08, 2013, 07:18:21 PM
You guys colored coins is not an option right now. We need to be thinking of a solution that fits for us in the immediate.
October 08, 2013, 07:16:54 PM
I only held 50,000 shares after the "big crash" down to .0015.
Before that, I managed to sell 150,000 above IPO value on BTCT.
Don't worry, I'm alright. Ken is the only reason the share price has plummeted this far, nothing to do with BF or BTCT
I'm Canadian BTW
Before that, I managed to sell 150,000 above IPO value on BTCT.
Don't worry, I'm alright. Ken is the only reason the share price has plummeted this far, nothing to do with BF or BTCT
I'm Canadian BTW
October 08, 2013, 07:15:25 PM
i am interested what happened to the guy, who paid ken to transfer from BF to btct.
i assume he is back to BF, with a big loss, and more if he is US citizen.
i feel sad for him
i assume he is back to BF, with a big loss, and more if he is US citizen.
i feel sad for him
ancient history.
it was VolcanicEruptor and trust me, there's no need to feel sad for him.
You got that right!
October 08, 2013, 07:15:09 PM
Sigh, more shenanigans as a result of US dumbassery. I find myself more ashamed of the country of my current residence every day.
At this point, as much of a pain in the ass as it would be, I would vote for direct shares (at least until this colored coin thing is implemented [successfully] into the protocol along with a public bitfunderesque list of addresses and the numbers of shares they hold (this way Ken wont have to verify that specific people own specific numbers of shares since to prove that all the seller would need to do is sign a message with that address; he'll still need to manually transfer them either himself, or by some intern/non-skilled laborer who knows his/her way around an excel spreadsheet). Exchanges are no longer useful due to their lack of reliability, willingness to cowtow to implied terrorist demands, and the fact that they are now little more than mediums of price manipulation.
At this point, as much of a pain in the ass as it would be, I would vote for direct shares (at least until this colored coin thing is implemented [successfully] into the protocol along with a public bitfunderesque list of addresses and the numbers of shares they hold (this way Ken wont have to verify that specific people own specific numbers of shares since to prove that all the seller would need to do is sign a message with that address; he'll still need to manually transfer them either himself, or by some intern/non-skilled laborer who knows his/her way around an excel spreadsheet). Exchanges are no longer useful due to their lack of reliability, willingness to cowtow to implied terrorist demands, and the fact that they are now little more than mediums of price manipulation.
October 08, 2013, 07:10:11 PM
i think more crashing will come, some US are sleeping i guess
October 08, 2013, 07:07:17 PM
Well after the whole drama with the website design, I'm not overly optimistic about the design of a complex trading system probably created by whoever made the current ActM website.
I think the best option would be to go direct shares (though it makes liquidating shares more difficult), and hire someone to manage this if required.
I think the best option would be to go direct shares (though it makes liquidating shares more difficult), and hire someone to manage this if required.
You've seen this, right? http://mpex.co/
LOL. I think we can at least hit a slightly higher mark than that.
I meant more about the technical design rather than the graphic design. A trading engine with robust security would be quite difficult to engineer I'd imagine, and I'd like to know more about the development of this site before we all jump ship over to it. It's good forward thinking, but the site also has to be extremely secure as we're dealing with finances, and there has to be some concern given to whether this solution would change anything at all for US shareholders.
October 08, 2013, 07:06:10 PM
i think more crashing will come, some US are sleeping i guess
October 08, 2013, 07:05:34 PM
But those have not been implemented in to the protocol yet. But, what we could do is create a alt-coin that represents the shares.
October 08, 2013, 06:59:49 PM
Yes, I have looked into it somewhat, I might be looking into it some more soon.
October 08, 2013, 06:55:41 PM
October 08, 2013, 06:52:51 PM
Are we forced to liquidate our shares or not, answer this ken?
No. Why would you think that? Activemining isn't going to disappear because the exchanges are being shut down. Investors are still investors. Can't profit off of someone else's money by stealing. Only by borrowing.
October 08, 2013, 06:51:47 PM
i am interested what happened to the guy, who paid ken to transfer from BF to btct.
i assume he is back to BF, with a big loss, and more if he is US citizen.
i feel sad for him
i assume he is back to BF, with a big loss, and more if he is US citizen.
i feel sad for him
ancient history.
it was VolcanicEruptor and trust me, there's no need to feel sad for him.
October 08, 2013, 06:47:26 PM
i am interested what happened to the guy, who paid ken to transfer from BF to btct.
i assume he is back to BF, with a big loss, and more if he is US citizen.
i feel sad for him
i assume he is back to BF, with a big loss, and more if he is US citizen.
i feel sad for him
October 08, 2013, 06:41:47 PM
This is just sad.
I put a good amount of an investment into activemining - knowing it was going to be a very long term investment. now it looks like we will have to sell at a massive loss just to move shares to yet another exchange that hopefully will allow activemining to list (and not potentially close down sometime in the future).
Color Coins - where are you!
I put a good amount of an investment into activemining - knowing it was going to be a very long term investment. now it looks like we will have to sell at a massive loss just to move shares to yet another exchange that hopefully will allow activemining to list (and not potentially close down sometime in the future).
Color Coins - where are you!
Are we forced to liquidate our shares or not, answer this ken?
October 08, 2013, 06:39:43 PM
@kslaughter what would you advice your shareholders to do at this point? Both US citizens and others.
October 08, 2013, 06:38:00 PM
This is just sad.
I put a good amount of an investment into activemining - knowing it was going to be a very long term investment. now it looks like we will have to sell at a massive loss just to move shares to yet another exchange that hopefully will allow activemining to list (and not potentially close down sometime in the future).
Color Coins - where are you!
I put a good amount of an investment into activemining - knowing it was going to be a very long term investment. now it looks like we will have to sell at a massive loss just to move shares to yet another exchange that hopefully will allow activemining to list (and not potentially close down sometime in the future).
Color Coins - where are you!
October 08, 2013, 06:35:17 PM
Aye, that's why I didn't mention it as it would likely face the similar situation as btct and now bitfunder are running into. Colored coins is the best way I think, especially if more governments come to the realization that they won't be able to restrict something that exists within the bitcoin protocol itself. I see the problem with direct shares, but I mean the further we keep getting pushed back here, the more its going to seem like downright oppression. You could make the same argument for using colored coins and say that you're still trading unregistered shares, no matter that you use the term 'colored coins'. They have to realize at some point that its going to be much easier for them to just try and adapt to the changing landscape instead of yanking it backwards so they can have it the way it should be.
Maybe so. OTOH, I dont think there is much harm in adhering to existing laws either. Registering a security isnt that hard, and the disclosures it requires can only be considered a good thing for potential investors. Even if these laws wouldnt apply, most of what they dictate should be common sense, and would avoid 99% of all pirate, labcoin and similar scams. Is that really worth fighting against?
The only annoying thing is that you'd have to register those securities in just about any country, it would be nice if there was some central "internet security and exchange commission".
This is the problem, you are trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.
October 08, 2013, 06:29:09 PM
Aye, that's why I didn't mention it as it would likely face the similar situation as btct and now bitfunder are running into. Colored coins is the best way I think, especially if more governments come to the realization that they won't be able to restrict something that exists within the bitcoin protocol itself. I see the problem with direct shares, but I mean the further we keep getting pushed back here, the more its going to seem like downright oppression. You could make the same argument for using colored coins and say that you're still trading unregistered shares, no matter that you use the term 'colored coins'. They have to realize at some point that its going to be much easier for them to just try and adapt to the changing landscape instead of yanking it backwards so they can have it the way it should be.
Maybe so. OTOH, I dont think there is much harm in adhering to existing laws either. Registering a security isnt that hard, and the disclosures it requires can only be considered a good thing for potential investors. Even if these laws wouldnt apply, most of what they dictate should be common sense, and would avoid 99% of all pirate, labcoin and similar scams. Is that really worth fighting against?
The only annoying thing is that you'd have to register those securities in just about any country, it would be nice if there was some central "internet security and exchange commission".
October 08, 2013, 06:23:07 PM
I wonder if Ken considered the option of hiring somebody to run direct shares. It may have to be a very real consideration. Didn't this same thing happen to btct just a month back or so? and then comes the notice that they'll have to close permanently...
A while back Ken wrote they already had the code for a private exchange, precisely for this reason. I commended him for that, being forward looking (and was ridiculed by many for saying that). Its in this thread. Anyway, e that doesnt change the legal status, selling those shares directly wouldnt be any more legal, unless he registers them first. He might not attract as much attention, but its hardly a fundamental solution.
Aye, that's why I didn't mention it as it would likely face the similar situation as btct and now bitfunder are running into. Colored coins is the best way I think, especially if more governments come to the realization that they won't be able to restrict something that exists within the bitcoin protocol itself. I see the problem with direct shares, but I mean the further we keep getting pushed back here, the more its going to seem like downright oppression. You could make the same argument for using colored coins and say that you're still trading unregistered shares, no matter that you use the term 'colored coins'. They have to realize at some point that its going to be much easier for them to just try and adapt to the changing landscape instead of yanking it backwards so they can have it the way it should be.
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