Topic: all finished - page 5. (Read 44823 times)
If you guys want to point me in the direction of other groups going the same route with the same lawyer, I could shoot them some Qs and see if they are having any progress.
rypedx is taking legal action... One person to consult.
If you guys want to point me in the direction of other groups going the same route with the same lawyer, I could shoot them some Qs and see if they are having any progress.
Might want to try DZ.. GB 3 and 4 are hashfast machines.
Have you talked with any others who have already started the legal process? I wonder if we can learn anything.
The lawyer might consume money, but as was explained by someone else here, this is actually customary.
The fact HF will not even reply is very bad. I believe they are excusing themselves from any kind of responsibility. Worse, while I think they demand arbitration, it might take a court case to get them there. Those folks are starting to sound like BFL.
The lawyer might consume money, but as was explained by someone else here, this is actually customary.
The fact HF will not even reply is very bad. I believe they are excusing themselves from any kind of responsibility. Worse, while I think they demand arbitration, it might take a court case to get them there. Those folks are starting to sound like BFL.
We should ask waldo whats going on, and what are we waiting for (BTC refund or USD refund)
Well, the fact is that there is nothing we can do without waldohoover. It is the person who made the purchase, so nobody else can take legal action against HashFast.
Last message from Waldohoover was that he would seek a USD refund. I'm not sure if he did do that or if he is still willing to consider a legal direction.
Last message from Waldohoover was that he would seek a USD refund. I'm not sure if he did do that or if he is still willing to consider a legal direction.
I can see this flamewar coming once we get USD ;-)
I really can't see how some of you want to make it work without/against waldo. There is no reason to blame him for anything that happened. In addition, if I count it right people committed 0.8 BTC so no point to discuss it further.
I guess we are slowly but surely moving towards USD refunds. Unless anybody has some other idea? So who is willing to spend it's own time to make this thing work? I am not talking some bullshit talk but actual action.
I guess we are slowly but surely moving towards USD refunds. Unless anybody has some other idea? So who is willing to spend it's own time to make this thing work? I am not talking some bullshit talk but actual action.
Well, the fact is that there is nothing we can do without waldohoover. He is the person who made the purchase, so nobody else can take legal action against HashFast.
Last message from Waldohoover was that he would seek a USD refund. I'm not sure if he did do that or if he is still willing to consider a legal direction.
So who is willing to provide 0.2 BTC for lawyer downpayment? At current BTC prices we need 10 ppl.
If we will not be able to gather crowd large enough the only option we got left is obviously USD refund.
I'm ok with with 0.2. Anybody else?
EDIT: I have looked again at invoices provided by waldo: http://imgur.com/qIMQ406 . On all of them says payment 100% via BTC...
If we will not be able to gather crowd large enough the only option we got left is obviously USD refund.
I'm ok with with 0.2. Anybody else?
EDIT: I have looked again at invoices provided by waldo: http://imgur.com/qIMQ406 . On all of them says payment 100% via BTC...
I'm ok with 0.2 if coiningsolutions/waldo/DHJ/RG whoever he is will respond and pick up the torch for his own damn group buy. We need someone with a cool head to manage this, not a hydra. Wheres he at, and most importantly, what's his excuse for ignoring us. That condition must be met before I send the guy anything, but I doubt it will be. Hell, if he spoke to hashfast they same way he spoke to me and others, I dont doubt that they are ignoring his ass.
Agree, I'm not gonna send 0.2 to some random dude. And waldo has already made it clear the he wants nothing to do with us or the lawyer.
What if the lawyer needs more fees and waldo ignores him?
We need someone geographically close to Ray to step up and handle this. Anyone in this GB that lives in NorCal?
I really can't see how some of you want to make it work without/against waldo. There is no reason to blame him for anything that happened. In addition, if I count it right people committed 0.8 BTC so no point to discuss it further.
I guess we are slowly but surely moving towards USD refunds. Unless anybody has some other idea? So who is willing to spend it's own time to make this thing work? I am not talking some bullshit talk but actual action.
So who is willing to provide 0.2 BTC for lawyer downpayment? At current BTC prices we need 10 ppl.
If we will not be able to gather crowd large enough the only option we got left is obviously USD refund.
I'm ok with with 0.2. Anybody else?
EDIT: I have looked again at invoices provided by waldo: http://imgur.com/qIMQ406 . On all of them says payment 100% via BTC...
If we will not be able to gather crowd large enough the only option we got left is obviously USD refund.
I'm ok with with 0.2. Anybody else?
EDIT: I have looked again at invoices provided by waldo: http://imgur.com/qIMQ406 . On all of them says payment 100% via BTC...
I'm ok with 0.2 if coiningsolutions/waldo/DHJ/RG whoever he is will respond and pick up the torch for his own damn group buy. We need someone with a cool head to manage this, not a hydra. Wheres he at, and most importantly, what's his excuse for ignoring us. That condition must be met before I send the guy anything, but I doubt it will be. Hell, if he spoke to hashfast they same way he spoke to me and others, I dont doubt that they are ignoring his ass.
Agree, I'm not gonna send 0.2 to some random dude. And waldo has already made it clear the he wants nothing to do with us or the lawyer.
What if the lawyer needs more fees and waldo ignores him?
We need someone geographically close to Ray to step up and handle this. Anyone in this GB that lives in NorCal?
I'm ok with 0.2BTC downpayment.
So who is willing to provide 0.2 BTC for lawyer downpayment? At current BTC prices we need 10 ppl.
If we will not be able to gather crowd large enough the only option we got left is obviously USD refund.
I'm ok with with 0.2. Anybody else?
EDIT: I have looked again at invoices provided by waldo: http://imgur.com/qIMQ406 . On all of them says payment 100% via BTC...
If we will not be able to gather crowd large enough the only option we got left is obviously USD refund.
I'm ok with with 0.2. Anybody else?
EDIT: I have looked again at invoices provided by waldo: http://imgur.com/qIMQ406 . On all of them says payment 100% via BTC...
I'm ok with 0.2 if coiningsolutions/waldo/DHJ/RG whoever he is will respond and pick up the torch for his own damn group buy. We need someone with a cool head to manage this, not a hydra. Wheres he at, and most importantly, what's his excuse for ignoring us. That condition must be met before I send the guy anything, but I doubt it will be. Hell, if he spoke to hashfast they same way he spoke to me and others, I dont doubt that they are ignoring his ass.
I'm willing to offer 200 mBTC.
Thats even better!
I'm willing to offer 200 mBTC.
So who is willing to provide 0.2 BTC for lawyer downpayment? At current BTC prices we need 10 ppl.
If we will not be able to gather crowd large enough the only option we got left is obviously USD refund.
I'm ok with with 0.2. Anybody else?
EDIT: I have looked again at invoices provided by waldo: http://imgur.com/qIMQ406 . On all of them says payment 100% via BTC...
If we will not be able to gather crowd large enough the only option we got left is obviously USD refund.
I'm ok with with 0.2. Anybody else?
EDIT: I have looked again at invoices provided by waldo: http://imgur.com/qIMQ406 . On all of them says payment 100% via BTC...
As for the rest, the original purchase agreement was ambiguous on how refunds would be calculated, but there were representations by HashFast that BTC payments would receive an equal amount of BTC in refund. And that's generally the way refunds are understood. This group buy paid HashFast entirely in BTC.
Given they were paid for in BTC, then that definitely suggests a BTC refund. That also aligns with what others were saying.
Perhaps with the Mt Gox issues today, BTC might be cheap to come by this week.
The gox situation is driving prices lower, as people are arbing from there anyway possible. What was looking like a very meek USD>BTC refund might be increased a bit.
Still problem remains, we need actual word from HF about wtf is going on.
WH, please can you post here with update, and tell us what messages HF are giving you if any at this time. Also if you know of any legal group which is pushing for case against HF, updates in that area would be great too.
With regards to the BTC being held from the total original orders, (200BTC) it would seem best that this is included in the refund totals, in addition to trying to secure what we can from the 400BTC orders we placed with HF.
I am very sceptical now of all group buys, merely because the companies taking the orders are shifty, not the GB operators. I have had a few responses from WH over the last few months, nothing revelatory, but enough to indicate he's not completely useless or on the make. What I would like from him is more support for his customers in this latest situation, as there is very little update or information being provided, and we deserve that. Many of us have paid for other GB's of his, or put much into this one, and are supportive, yet pensive about the outcome.
My guess is that some of you guys are outstanding fellows and would step up to the plate for the group, as I would, if condition A were met. Problem is the guy is so goddamn shady nowadays with communication that I cant even fathom sending him more btc. Its insane.
I suspect there would be enough who would provide funds. I don't think waldohoover is being shady. I suspect he's rather tired of people throwing rocks at him, threatening to sue him, etc.
Whatever the case, we do have to have active dialog to move forward. But, he may have already moved forward with asking for the USD refund. I think he last indicated he would do that.
Paul clearly you are the voice of reason here, and i'm not being facetious, however excusing his lack of communication as some reaction is putting the cart before the horse. I initially bought into this, and continued to purchase and inquire into more shares because of waldos reputation of quick, reliable communication. He proved it to me by replying promptly to any inquiries, always having a really upbeat attitude, and being friendly and helpful. This to me is a sign of real character which is seriously hard to come by, and why so many people trusted him with their money.
Now, look at the situation today. I certainly would be more understanding, more helpful, and have an overall better attitude about this entire thing if the guy would literally respond to any of us. He doesnt respond to messages, he doesnt respond to posts. This is a guy we all trusted. In the end it was his inaction and his silence, with me at least, that was the cause of my issues with him, not the other way around. I dont know how the situation has been with you all.
Paul, I'm down for whatever you're down for, Mr. Cool head.
As for the rest, the original purchase agreement was ambiguous on how refunds would be calculated, but there were representations by HashFast that BTC payments would receive an equal amount of BTC in refund. And that's generally the way refunds are understood. This group buy paid HashFast entirely in BTC.
Given they were paid for in BTC, then that definitely suggests a BTC refund. That also aligns with what others were saying.
Perhaps with the Mt Gox issues today, BTC might be cheap to come by this week.
Well, for the lawyer to work, we need to figure out:
1) How do we raise the $1000. This will not happen split between all investors. I for 1 will not put more money down this money pit.
2) Then if the $1000 is split between a smaller group, how / if we win, does this $1000 get paid back. Is it purely just the $1000, and then the rest is split. Or does the people who put up the $1000 expect more payment back as it is another investment by them. For that you will need a majority agreement, but nothing has been put down as to what sort of majority is expect, 51%, 75%?
Again, at the end of the day I just want back what I can get and want it now, not in x years time.
Phil
1) How do we raise the $1000. This will not happen split between all investors. I for 1 will not put more money down this money pit.
2) Then if the $1000 is split between a smaller group, how / if we win, does this $1000 get paid back. Is it purely just the $1000, and then the rest is split. Or does the people who put up the $1000 expect more payment back as it is another investment by them. For that you will need a majority agreement, but nothing has been put down as to what sort of majority is expect, 51%, 75%?
Again, at the end of the day I just want back what I can get and want it now, not in x years time.
Phil
I'd say pay back the $1k the same way you handle it in calculating the lawyer's fee. The costs come out of the recovery before anything else happens with it, so the costs that come back get distributed back to those who paid them. After that, the lawyer's fee is deducted, and the remaining recovery is split based on shareholder stake.
But that also means a potentially small group of investors bears all the risk of loss, as they may be out their portion of the $1k if we lose. I'd be willing to chip in a bit (and if Waldo is still reading this, and not simply pulling his hair out in frustration, I'd welcome him to message me about this), but I'm probably in the minority in that.
Legal proceedings are never fast. I mentioned that before. There's really no reason to demand speed, because you cannot hurry the legal system.
I would really like to know, however, whether a BTC refund was promised by HashFast or not. I read on this site that it was, but I also saw various purchase agreements that said nothing about a BTC refund. However, the purchase agreements did offer a refund if the miners were not delivered on time. So, were the miners purchased in dollars or BTC?
I would really like to know, however, whether a BTC refund was promised by HashFast or not. I read on this site that it was, but I also saw various purchase agreements that said nothing about a BTC refund. However, the purchase agreements did offer a refund if the miners were not delivered on time. So, were the miners purchased in dollars or BTC?
What's happening here isn't really legal proceedings. At least, not as most people think of them. The purchase agreement required arbitration to settle disputes, so arbitration is where we'd be going. That's significantly simpler and faster than full-blown in-court litigation.
As for the rest, the original purchase agreement was ambiguous on how refunds would be calculated, but there were representations by HashFast that BTC payments would receive an equal amount of BTC in refund. And that's generally the way refunds are understood. This group buy paid HashFast entirely in BTC.
My guess is that some of you guys are outstanding fellows and would step up to the plate for the group, as I would, if condition A were met. Problem is the guy is so goddamn shady nowadays with communication that I cant even fathom sending him more btc. Its insane.
I suspect there would be enough who would provide funds. I don't think waldohoover is being shady. I suspect he's rather tired of people throwing rocks at him, threatening to sue him, etc.
Whatever the case, we do have to have active dialog to move forward. But, he may have already moved forward with asking for the USD refund. I think he last indicated he would do that.
I would argue that anyone who is willing to chip in 0.2 BTC to pay for the lawyer should get that 0.2 BTC back immediately at the end of the case. Then whatever is left would be divided among all shareholders per share.
Legal proceedings are never fast. I mentioned that before. There's really no reason to demand speed, because you cannot hurry the legal system.
I would really like to know, however, whether a BTC refund was promised by HashFast or not. I read on this site that it was, but I also saw various purchase agreements that said nothing about a BTC refund. However, the purchase agreements did offer a refund if the miners were not delivered on time. So, were the miners purchased in dollars or BTC? If the miners were purchased in dollars, then those sales agreements speaking of refund would likely be interpreted by a court as US dollar refunds.
A third option we have (in addition to a legal argument for BTC or a USD refund) is a request by HashFast to provide the group with the comparable hashing power that would have been given if the products shipped on time. I don't know what the difficulty was then vs. now, but if the company matched the difficulty with more hardware, I'd say it would be a win for everyone.
I'd like to know these answers as well. I wouldnt have any problems at all throwing 0.2 towards this if A) our group guy operator wasnt MIA and B) there were others in the GB willing to match me.
My guess is that some of you guys are outstanding fellows and would step up to the plate for the group, as I would, if condition A were met. Problem is the guy is so goddamn shady nowadays with communication that I cant even fathom sending him more btc. Its insane.
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