Alt Crypots hurting prices? | Bitcointalksearch.org

erk

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Quote from: farlack on May 03, 2013, 12:28:31 AM

If he sells the fence for 300 bitcoin valued at $100 each $3000
By the time he gets home they're $85
Loss of $450

Big deal, the fence is still worth 300 bitcoins. If you care about dollars, then price the fence in dollars and only take dollars as payment. Once you started pricing goods relative to multiple currencies at once, then you have lost the plot, as exchange rates vary all the time unless the currencies are pegged to each other.

markm

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Sure but if he is concerned about that he can buy stuff immediiately while he is in town, or, of course, he could use options to hedge. That is what MPOE is in place for.

-MarkM-

farlack

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Quote from: markm on May 02, 2013, 11:37:46 PM

Quote from: farlack on May 02, 2013, 11:20:06 PM

Quote from: Walter Rothbard on May 02, 2013, 11:17:03 PM

In the long term, it doesn't matter if Bitcoin goes down. In the long term, it doesn't matter if the market settles at a price of $200, $100, $50, $1000, or $1000000 per BTC.

What matters, long term, is providing people a way to successfully escape government fiat, the business cycle, and the violence that is destroying them and everything they try to do in life, one piece at a time.

If everybody uses cryptocurrencies and fiat currencies die and Bitcoin is worth $25/BTC, that will be victory.

Not when it comes to sales, my stepdad builds fences, I got him looking into accepting bitcoin.

He sells a fence for $3000 worth of bitcoin, he goes out, buys all the material, starts work, comes home, they dropped $15 by the time he goes to sell. He already lost $400, but he cant hold because he has bills..

Huge dips are bad.

Huh? He did well, he sold the bitcoins for real goods to build a fence, so wasn't holding them when they went down. When he goes to sell the fence for presumably more than $3000 he gets more bitcoins for that than he started with.

Or, he built the fence for $3000 worth of bitcoins which would have been much less worth, not enough maybe to build the fence, had he waited longer before buying the materials.

You seem to have it backward.

-MarkM-

If he sells the fence for 300 bitcoin valued at $100 each $3000
By the time he gets home they're $85
Loss of $450

erk

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Merit: 500

Quote from: farlack on May 02, 2013, 08:26:40 PM

Anyone else think that alternates are hurting the price of BTC?

We keep getting new coins that just have a source code change that have 5 million made the first day, and everyone thinks they should be worth 25 cents. This is bringing money out of the market for BTC, and LTC, because everyone dumps them for these new coins, because by tomorrow they should be worth $1... for a worthless coin that only has the value of trade.

I guess now the only way to make money these days is to ~~design~~ rename the newcoin mine it first and sell it in 3 days.

Rubbish, most alt coins have no way of trading money for them, you have to trade other crypto coin for them eg you have to buy some BTC to trade for the alt-coins, that's called putting money into the BTC marktet.

Walter Rothbard

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Quote from: farlack on May 02, 2013, 11:20:06 PM

Quote from: Walter Rothbard on May 02, 2013, 11:17:03 PM

In the long term, it doesn't matter if Bitcoin goes down. In the long term, it doesn't matter if the market settles at a price of $200, $100, $50, $1000, or $1000000 per BTC.

What matters, long term, is providing people a way to successfully escape government fiat, the business cycle, and the violence that is destroying them and everything they try to do in life, one piece at a time.

If everybody uses cryptocurrencies and fiat currencies die and Bitcoin is worth $25/BTC, that will be victory.

Not when it comes to sales, my stepdad builds fences, I got him looking into accepting bitcoin.

He sells a fence for $3000 worth of bitcoin, he goes out, buys all the material, starts work, comes home, they dropped $15 by the time he goes to sell. He already lost $400, but he cant hold because he has bills..

Huge dips are bad.

I think you are missing what I was saying. I was depicting a scenario where the price settles. You're describing a different scenario. Today's volatile scenario is a necessary prelude to tomorrow's stable scenario.

markm

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Quote from: farlack on May 02, 2013, 11:20:06 PM

Quote from: Walter Rothbard on May 02, 2013, 11:17:03 PM

In the long term, it doesn't matter if Bitcoin goes down. In the long term, it doesn't matter if the market settles at a price of $200, $100, $50, $1000, or $1000000 per BTC.

What matters, long term, is providing people a way to successfully escape government fiat, the business cycle, and the violence that is destroying them and everything they try to do in life, one piece at a time.

If everybody uses cryptocurrencies and fiat currencies die and Bitcoin is worth $25/BTC, that will be victory.

Not when it comes to sales, my stepdad builds fences, I got him looking into accepting bitcoin.

He sells a fence for $3000 worth of bitcoin, he goes out, buys all the material, starts work, comes home, they dropped $15 by the time he goes to sell. He already lost $400, but he cant hold because he has bills..

Huge dips are bad.

Huh? He did well, he sold the bitcoins for real goods to build a fence, so wasn't holding them when they went down. When he goes to sell the fence for presumably more than $3000 he gets more bitcoins for that than he started with.

Or, he built the fence for $3000 worth of bitcoins which would have been much less worth, not enough maybe to build the fence, had he waited longer before buying the materials.

You seem to have it backward.

-MarkM-

powdabam

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Listen, I'm not genius but even I know trade increases value. If LTC FTC etc coin are gaining traction, these new comers are purchasing BTC to get into these coins. They are driving the price up if anything....maybe BTC is supposed to be around 80-90 and thanks to all these alts, you enjoyed huge returns?

farlack

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Quote from: Walter Rothbard on May 02, 2013, 11:17:03 PM

In the long term, it doesn't matter if Bitcoin goes down. In the long term, it doesn't matter if the market settles at a price of $200, $100, $50, $1000, or $1000000 per BTC.

What matters, long term, is providing people a way to successfully escape government fiat, the business cycle, and the violence that is destroying them and everything they try to do in life, one piece at a time.

If everybody uses cryptocurrencies and fiat currencies die and Bitcoin is worth $25/BTC, that will be victory.

Not when it comes to sales, my stepdad builds fences, I got him looking into accepting bitcoin.

He sells a fence for $3000 worth of bitcoin, he goes out, buys all the material, starts work, comes home, they dropped $15 by the time he goes to sell. He already lost $400, but he cant hold because he has bills..

Huge dips are bad.

Walter Rothbard

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Activity: 476

Merit: 250

Bytecoin: 8VofSsbQvTd8YwAcxiCcxrqZ9MnGPjaAQm

In the long term, it doesn't matter if Bitcoin goes down. In the long term, it doesn't matter if the market settles at a price of $200, $100, $50, $1000, or $1000000 per BTC.

What matters, long term, is providing people a way to successfully escape government fiat, the business cycle, and the violence that is destroying them and everything they try to do in life, one piece at a time.

If everybody uses cryptocurrencies and fiat currencies die and Bitcoin is worth $25/BTC, that will be victory.

markm

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Activity: 2940

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Well either way, bitcoins are being shaken out of "weak hands" and hopefully, maybe even presumably, picked up by "strong hands" so all is good, yes?

-MarkM-

farlack

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Quote from: LiteBit on May 02, 2013, 10:55:37 PM

Quote from: farlack on May 02, 2013, 10:51:35 PM

Quote from: LiteBit on May 02, 2013, 10:48:05 PM

I believe the recent drop in BTC is due to BFL finally delivering.

That would mean miners have to dump as soon as they get coin. I don't think many miners are dumb enough after spending the money they did to dump so low.

I'm implying that non miners are taking profit. The miners want high dollar value for their ROI.

ASICS give a profit except their initial cost, and that's what I was saying miners want high value, they wont dump for a low price. ASICS are cheap to run so if they only dumped to pay their power bill, it would not be much.

LiteBit

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Quote from: farlack on May 02, 2013, 10:51:35 PM

Quote from: LiteBit on May 02, 2013, 10:48:05 PM

I believe the recent drop in BTC is due to BFL finally delivering.

That would mean miners have to dump as soon as they get coin. I don't think many miners are dumb enough after spending the money they did to dump so low.

I'm implying that non miners are taking profit. The miners want high dollar value for their ROI.

farlack

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Quote from: markm on May 02, 2013, 10:51:00 PM

Its the part about dumping a windfall 4500 BTC on Gox while Gox rate is less than $266 that seems crazy.

If you have bills/rigs to pay that need that 500 to be dumped, then fine, after using it to pick up 4500 free you go ahead and dump the 500 as originally planned/required.

But throwing away your free extra 4500 at firesale prices? What are you, some kind of nutbar? Cheesy

-MarkM-

If you spend $5000 worth of coin for an alt coin, 2 weeks later its worth $50,000, I don't think you're a nutbar for cashing, more like intelligent. You don't know if the USA government bans bitcoin tomorrow, at least you have a new house, that essentially only cost you $5000.

The only thing you will be doing is kicking yourself for not holding. You cant complain about $45,000 profit in 2 weeks.

markm

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Quote from: farlack on May 02, 2013, 10:51:35 PM

Quote from: LiteBit on May 02, 2013, 10:48:05 PM

I believe the recent drop in BTC is due to BFL finally delivering.

That would mean miners have to dump as soon as they get coin. I don't think many miners are dumb enough after spending the money they did to dump so low.

Everyone BFL delivers to already paid long long LONG L O N G ago, they don't need to dump coin at firesale prices to pay for their rigs.

Maybe they feel they have to to pre-order more rigs though?

-MarkM-

farlack

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Quote from: LiteBit on May 02, 2013, 10:48:05 PM

I believe the recent drop in BTC is due to BFL finally delivering.

That would mean miners have to dump as soon as they get coin. I don't think many miners are dumb enough after spending the money they did to dump so low.

markm

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Activity: 2940

Merit: 1090

Its the part about dumping a windfall 4500 BTC on Gox while Gox rate is less than $266 that seems crazy.

If you have bills/rigs to pay that need that 500 to be dumped, then fine, after using it to pick up 4500 free you go ahead and dump the 500 as originally planned/required.

But throwing away your free extra 4500 at firesale prices? What are you, some kind of nutbar? Cheesy

-MarkM-

Krabby

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https://primedao.eth.link/#/

I don't think many people really care about bitcoin.
They will continue to hurt it's value as long as they are making money.

LiteBit

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I believe the recent drop in BTC is due to BFL finally delivering.

farlack

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Quote from: cygnusxi on May 02, 2013, 10:41:01 PM

Quote from: markm on May 02, 2013, 10:37:27 PM

Ah well I guess the time between births of suckers keeps decreasing as the world's hashing power increases! Cheesy

-MarkM-

i was just about to post something like this but i deleted it .... you summed it up quicker then my rant.

Ah so you don't agree, if I buy 500 btc worth of an alt coin, 2 weeks later its worth 5000 btc, I take that to gox, and dump it wont drop the price?

ok, I agree it wont drop it much, its about 25 minutes worth of trade volume, but do that many many many times a day on a smaller scale.

cygnusxi

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CureCoin Lead Dev

Quote from: markm on May 02, 2013, 10:37:27 PM

Ah well I guess the time between births of suckers keeps decreasing as the world's hashing power increases! Cheesy

-MarkM-

i was just about to post something like this but i deleted it .... you summed it up quicker then my rant.

Topic: Alt Crypots hurting prices? (Read 2781 times)