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Topic: [AMC]-The Official Active Mining Cooperative Discussion - page 76. (Read 223316 times)

member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
So, in your opinion this is 50/50 deal? Could you point out the facts that make it "50% not scam"?



No I didn't say it's 50/50 please don't put words into my mouth. What makes it likely to not be a scam is that not every new startup is a scam so ergo it might not be one. I'm not going to list the AMC statements I firmly believe or partly believe we would all have different opinions on them. Suffice it to say there is a chance this is a scam so investors should position themselves with that in mind.
member
Activity: 77
Merit: 10
Bitcoinstore, TAT, Swede, and everyone else who thinks AMC is going down or is overpriced why won't any of you sell me call options? If you don't like the terms of mine I'm letting you make counter offers. I think your failure to put money behind your posts speaks louder than anything you have to say at this point.

Pretty sure we already told you the reason, because Ken's ability to manipulate the price makes it too risky. I haven't spent a dime on AMC, nor do I plan to.

I tried hard to take any temporary price fluctuations out of the last call options. I also ensured you would not have to spend a dime on AMC to profit from their downfall.

-This is why they were European and not American.
-This is also why I allowed additional collateral to be posted so that you would not have the forced purchase of AMC shares activated as long as you could still follow through on your obligations.
-Its also why the 3 month time span was in place, this is pretty far in the future for BTC securities and the mining scene.

I'm open to any ideas you have as to how we could take any temporary price fluctuations out of the deal. I put forth terms last time and you didn't like them, so I'm giving you the chance to offer me terms you like this time so we can make a deal.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100

The fact the thread has been filled with so much FUD for the last 24h makes me believe there's been a huge effort to take the price down, making unexperienced investors sell their shares as cheaply as possible. This is a great deal for manipulators, as the can buy into AMC at a low price,

If that's the case why is no-one buying at 0.001? It's almost pre-news bargain price. I think no conspiracy just lack of confidence.

I'm sure the FUD on this thread being 99% speculation and 1% only for discussing the actual news and projections for AMC has a huge part in that.

People are scared. It will pass.

I can only assume that you will be investing heavily in the December batch of the Avalon clones at $6k a pop. By the way, if you want some for the "Bargain price" of $5.500 I will sell you as many as you want. Absolutely no limit.  PM me for any quantity!

Will you stop with the FUD already? The price you quote for the machines to be delivered from VMC to AMC is a red herring. The machines will be delivered to AMC at cost price minus 10%. The current retail price has nothing to do with it. What *will* be delivered is the hashing power stated by Ken in the original prospectus at cost price minus 10% when manufacture/delivery is made.

Buying more shares now. Anyone care to join me?  Grin

FUD? It's right there in the information on BTCT.CO? What do you mean "current retail price has nothing to do with it"? The $6k price and delivery dates is the basis for their entire profit calculations..

I don't get people that wish the "FUD" would stop, all while not offering any explanations to the concerns people have.

I have several times stated that I don't believe the intent is to scam anyone, and that my concern is based on the second IPO being made at a vastly inflated price before any important info, product or other has been released, and the calculations around the profit on the miners is just not holding up.

So far no one has been able to provide me with any reason to change my view that the current profit calculations just don't hold water at all based available info, and that makes me believe that current share price is far too high. Period.

Swede, the original AMC prospectus was written by Ken, not an investment bank. You are clearly picking out sentences that with hindsight could have been written more carefully and using them to construct a distorted narrative, that I have concluded is a lame attempt at FUD. You are not as bad as Megamouth, I'll give you that, that kid is in a FUD league of his own.

I a "picking out sentences"? I am talking about the entire profit calculation summary from the details section of the company info! NONE of their miners will in my opinion EVER sell for even close to the projected pricing at the dates set.

If this information is incorrect or 'badly written' it undermines the entire profit structure of the company.

Swede, there really is no way to have a rational discussion with you. You are determined to warp the facts to suit your FUDness. AMC is a risky asset to invest in. I am happy with the risk I have taken for my position. You would be better served pouring your enthusiasm into researching other assets you could invest in. You are wasting your cycles, which would be better used to build your wealth.

In my ideal scenario, I'd like to look back on today, in a year, say, and have a good laugh about it. Unfortunately it seems I'll be counting my profits while some of you posting here will only have improved your FUD foo. Really, why are you wasting your time?

In other news, Bill Clinton had sex with Monica Lewinsky in the Oval Office. Apparently all subsequent serving Presidents have done the same  Shocked
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
It was a pop culture reference that has clearly gone over your head.

I don't do pop culture dear boy I'm more sophisticated than that.


You didnt explicitly say that the two were correlated but you had every intention of implying that AMC was a scam by assosciation, or else you wouldnt have mentioned it at all.


I explicitly stated the facts and possibilities. If you can't listen to a simple message I do fear for your monetary wealth. These are facts I posted and I didn't make ANY of it up. You need to wake up.

I'll tell you exactly what my interests are:

I had 20k AMC, I liquidated 50% into BTC and hold the rest. If it's a scam I want to know, if it's not we should be shown who Ken is, where he is, we need to see vids, offices and eASIC outline agreements.

hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
Bitcoinstore, TAT, Swede, and everyone else who thinks AMC is going down or is overpriced why won't any of you sell me call options? If you don't like the terms of mine I'm letting you make counter offers. I think your failure to put money behind your posts speaks louder than anything you have to say at this point.

Pretty sure we already told you the reason, because Ken's ability to manipulate the price makes it too risky. I haven't spent a dime on AMC, nor do I plan to.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100


Worst. Logic. Ever.

Worst grammar ever. Why have you pull a full stop at the end of these words? Are you insane?

I very explicitly DID NOT say that because AMC use an address having a long history of scam setup companies that this makes AMC a similar scam setup company. Did you not notice that?
The full stops were to emphasize each word in the vein of the comic book guy on the simpsons. It was a pop culture reference that has clearly gone over your head.
You didnt explicitly say that the two were correlated but you had every intention of implying that AMC was a scam by assosciation, or else you wouldnt have mentioned it at all.

You clearly have some vested interest in talking down the price of AMC shares, to what end Im not sure.
full member
Activity: 224
Merit: 100

The fact the thread has been filled with so much FUD for the last 24h makes me believe there's been a huge effort to take the price down, making unexperienced investors sell their shares as cheaply as possible. This is a great deal for manipulators, as the can buy into AMC at a low price,

If that's the case why is no-one buying at 0.001? It's almost pre-news bargain price. I think no conspiracy just lack of confidence.

I'm sure the FUD on this thread being 99% speculation and 1% only for discussing the actual news and projections for AMC has a huge part in that.

People are scared. It will pass.

I can only assume that you will be investing heavily in the December batch of the Avalon clones at $6k a pop. By the way, if you want some for the "Bargain price" of $5.500 I will sell you as many as you want. Absolutely no limit.  PM me for any quantity!

Will you stop with the FUD already? The price you quote for the machines to be delivered from VMC to AMC is a red herring. The machines will be delivered to AMC at cost price minus 10%. The current retail price has nothing to do with it. What *will* be delivered is the hashing power stated by Ken in the original prospectus at cost price minus 10% when manufacture/delivery is made.

Buying more shares now. Anyone care to join me?  Grin

FUD? It's right there in the information on BTCT.CO? What do you mean "current retail price has nothing to do with it"? The $6k price and delivery dates is the basis for their entire profit calculations..

I don't get people that wish the "FUD" would stop, all while not offering any explanations to the concerns people have.

I have several times stated that I don't believe the intent is to scam anyone, and that my concern is based on the second IPO being made at a vastly inflated price before any important info, product or other has been released, and the calculations around the profit on the miners is just not holding up.

So far no one has been able to provide me with any reason to change my view that the current profit calculations just don't hold water at all based available info, and that makes me believe that current share price is far too high. Period.

Swede, the original AMC prospectus was written by Ken, not an investment bank. You are clearly picking out sentences that with hindsight could have been written more carefully and using them to construct a distorted narrative, that I have concluded is a lame attempt at FUD. You are not as bad as Megamouth, I'll give you that, that kid is in a FUD league of his own.

I a "picking out sentences"? I am talking about the entire profit calculation summary from the details section of the company info! NONE of their miners will in my opinion EVER sell for even close to the projected pricing at the dates set.

If this information is incorrect or 'badly written' it undermines the entire profit structure of the company.
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10

Very nice find! What looks like a scam, smells like a scam and tastes like a scam probably is a scam.



Personally I wouldn't quite put it like that, I would say there is clearly the possibility that this is a scam and as a result everyone should protect themselves as best they can. This could be a success long term but equally it could be a scam - these are facts.

Until the scam scenario is disproved (as it could be with more transparency) you would be a fool to have a big exposure to AMC shares.
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10


Worst. Logic. Ever.

Worst grammar ever. Why have you put a full stop at the end of these words? Are you insane?

I very explicitly DID NOT say that because AMC use an address having a long history of scam setup companies that this makes AMC a similar scam setup company. Did you not notice that?

EDIT - corrected typo, embarrassed? Just a bit.
member
Activity: 77
Merit: 10
Bitcoinstore, TAT, Swede, and everyone else who thinks AMC is going down or is overpriced why won't any of you sell me call options? If you don't like the terms of mine I'm letting you make counter offers. I think your failure to put money behind your posts speaks louder than anything you have to say at this point.

I have 81 on BTCT explain how to do this and ill do it.

Read my thread at the link below and remember the details are negotiable. If you don't want to use John K as an escrow and instead want to trade on BTCT I'll buy off you on BTCT. Do realize that selling call options on BTCT requires you to buy and hold them for a period of 3 months, which is something I doubt you want to do if you think AMC is a bad asset. This is why I'm letting you sell me the options "naked" as long as you post some collateral to ensure you can follow through on your end of the deal. I look forward to your counter offer.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=245354.20
hero member
Activity: 662
Merit: 545
Bitcoinstore, TAT, Swede, and everyone else who thinks AMC is going down or is overpriced why won't any of you sell me call options? If you don't like the terms of mine I'm letting you make counter offers. I think your failure to put money behind your posts speaks louder than anything you have to say at this point.

I have 81 on BTCT explain how to do this and ill do it.
member
Activity: 77
Merit: 10
Bitcoinstore, TAT, Swede, and everyone else who thinks AMC is going down or is overpriced why won't any of you sell me call options? If you don't like the terms of mine I'm letting you make counter offers. I think your failure to put money behind your posts speaks louder than anything you have to say at this point.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100
The address is posted on the btct.co asset details page.

Quote
Office Address:

Active Mining Corporation
95 Wilton Road
Suite 3
London
SW1V 1BZ
United Kingdom
Fax: +44 (0)20 3004 1756



umm... lol?



Not sure where this address was found - is it a genuine AMC claimed address on their website?

Just a little research shows that this address and specifically 'Suite 3' was  used circa 2007  by Italian money launderers and scam artists some of who have been jailed for a multi-million pound internet fraud.
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2009/02/422284.html?c=on

A link on that page shows the 'Suite 3' address is infamous in the arena of London-based scam companies (currently still registered as well as historic) many many of which have been set up claiming 'Suite 3' as their 'office'. Apparently there is probably no office or suite at the property just a seemingly very 'accommodating' Mail hosting operation.
http://www.complaintsboard.com/complaints/wsr-csr-corporation-worldwide-england-greater-london-c142076.html

What does this prove? Well it proves that AMC are pretending they have a London office that is infact a mailbox. It also proves AMC are using the exactly the same distancing and 'keeping anonymous' techniques that scam artists successfully use. Anything else? I have a question - Should a 25mill dollar business be using an anonymous mailbox as used by convicted scammers, or should they have a bit more transparency?






This is an apple. It is red. This is a fire hydrant. It is also red. Therefore the fire hydrant is CLEARLY AN APPLE.

Worst. Logic. Ever.
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
The address is posted on the btct.co asset details page.

Quote
Office Address:

Active Mining Corporation
95 Wilton Road
Suite 3
London
SW1V 1BZ
United Kingdom
Fax: +44 (0)20 3004 1756



umm... lol?



Not sure where this address was found - is it a genuine AMC claimed address on their website?

Just a little research shows that this address and specifically 'Suite 3' was  used circa 2007  by Italian money launderers and scam artists some of who have been jailed for a multi-million pound internet fraud.
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2009/02/422284.html?c=on

A link on that page shows the 'Suite 3' address is infamous in the arena of London-based scam companies (currently still registered as well as historic) many many of which have been set up claiming 'Suite 3' as their 'office'. Apparently there is probably no office or suite at the property just a seemingly very 'accommodating' Mail hosting operation.
http://www.complaintsboard.com/complaints/wsr-csr-corporation-worldwide-england-greater-london-c142076.html

What does this prove? Well it proves that AMC are pretending they have a London office that is infact a mailbox. It also proves AMC are using the exactly the same distancing and 'keeping anonymous' techniques that scam artists successfully use. Anything else? I have a question - Should a 25mill dollar business be using an anonymous mailbox as used by convicted scammers, or should they have a bit more transparency?




hero member
Activity: 662
Merit: 545
legendary
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1000
DONT REPLY

EDIT: The toy was not chosen, and the education will have to wait another day, it appears. I tried.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100

The fact the thread has been filled with so much FUD for the last 24h makes me believe there's been a huge effort to take the price down, making unexperienced investors sell their shares as cheaply as possible. This is a great deal for manipulators, as the can buy into AMC at a low price,

If that's the case why is no-one buying at 0.001? It's almost pre-news bargain price. I think no conspiracy just lack of confidence.

I'm sure the FUD on this thread being 99% speculation and 1% only for discussing the actual news and projections for AMC has a huge part in that.

People are scared. It will pass.

I can only assume that you will be investing heavily in the December batch of the Avalon clones at $6k a pop. By the way, if you want some for the "Bargain price" of $5.500 I will sell you as many as you want. Absolutely no limit.  PM me for any quantity!

Will you stop with the FUD already? The price you quote for the machines to be delivered from VMC to AMC is a red herring. The machines will be delivered to AMC at cost price minus 10%. The current retail price has nothing to do with it. What *will* be delivered is the hashing power stated by Ken in the original prospectus at cost price minus 10% when manufacture/delivery is made.

Buying more shares now. Anyone care to join me?  Grin

FUD? It's right there in the information on BTCT.CO? What do you mean "current retail price has nothing to do with it"? The $6k price and delivery dates is the basis for their entire profit calculations..

I don't get people that wish the "FUD" would stop, all while not offering any explanations to the concerns people have.

I have several times stated that I don't believe the intent is to scam anyone, and that my concern is based on the second IPO being made at a vastly inflated price before any important info, product or other has been released, and the calculations around the profit on the miners is just not holding up.

So far no one has been able to provide me with any reason to change my view that the current profit calculations just don't hold water at all based available info, and that makes me believe that current share price is far too high. Period.

Swede, the original AMC prospectus was written by Ken, not an investment bank. You are clearly picking out sentences that with hindsight could have been written more carefully and using them to construct a distorted narrative, that I have concluded is a lame attempt at FUD. You are not as bad as Megamouth, I'll give you that, that kid is in a FUD league of his own.
full member
Activity: 224
Merit: 100

The fact the thread has been filled with so much FUD for the last 24h makes me believe there's been a huge effort to take the price down, making unexperienced investors sell their shares as cheaply as possible. This is a great deal for manipulators, as the can buy into AMC at a low price,

If that's the case why is no-one buying at 0.001? It's almost pre-news bargain price. I think no conspiracy just lack of confidence.

I'm sure the FUD on this thread being 99% speculation and 1% only for discussing the actual news and projections for AMC has a huge part in that.

People are scared. It will pass.

I can only assume that you will be investing heavily in the December batch of the Avalon clones at $6k a pop. By the way, if you want some for the "Bargain price" of $5.500 I will sell you as many as you want. Absolutely no limit.  PM me for any quantity!

Will you stop with the FUD already? The price you quote for the machines to be delivered from VMC to AMC is a red herring. The machines will be delivered to AMC at cost price minus 10%. The current retail price has nothing to do with it. What *will* be delivered is the hashing power stated by Ken in the original prospectus at cost price minus 10% when manufacture/delivery is made.

Buying more shares now. Anyone care to join me?  Grin

FUD? It's right there in the information on BTCT.CO? What do you mean "current retail price has nothing to do with it"? The $6k price and delivery dates is the basis for their entire profit calculations..

I don't get people that wish the "FUD" would stop, all while not offering any explanations to the concerns people have.

I have several times stated that I don't believe the intent is to scam anyone, and that my concern is based on the second IPO being made at a vastly inflated price before any important info, product or other has been released, and the calculations around the profit on the miners is just not holding up.

So far no one has been able to provide me with any reason to change my view that the current profit calculations just don't hold water at all based available info, and that makes me believe that current share price is far too high. Period.
legendary
Activity: 1554
Merit: 1000
Scooped more up at .00082 yesterday.  I am very patient.

Anyone who was able to buy @ ~.0008, but didn't, needs a lesson in Risk/Reward calculations.
Interesting statement. Care to elaborate?

Sure.
Entering any trade is essentially an individuals judgement of the value of what he/she has just bought, together with what the perceived value it should be, according to that individual. How does anyone perceive what 'value' is at a given time? Thats a subjective question with many results, which is good, or we would have a very flat and boring market, with no opportunities. Whatever strategies or techniques you employ, it cannot be based on emotion.
Anybody who has had the briefest experience of established market trading, will know that emotion destroys all the think processes you need to judge a given share/future/option etc. And thats my point. The adolescents here either need to either log off and choose their favorite toy to play with, on this fine Saturday (here anyway), OR realize they may not know anywhere near enough to 'survive' these kind of markets, and get a fucking education, or i WILL take your BTC, and you WILL buy mine, and you WILL lose. Sorry, that's what i see, because that's what happened. 

So i repeat my previous post, as something to consider. Sentiment @ ~.0008 was nicely positive. It was an accepted level of value at that time, without knowing any details of the NDA, and knowing we had the Avalon/s and chips coming. There were some people who it seemed could not put together what AMC was trying to achieve, and i would accept that as understandable to some extent, but this recent news sets out a reasonably detailed plan, that should provide some kind of vision to price against.
Whats the value today? You decide, but make sure you have arrived at a figure that is based on reasoned thinking, and not correlated to the amount of adrenalin rushing through your ignorant veins. Whatever the value is, its definitely more than .0008 of anyone's money (currently ~.00130).

Disclaimer: I DO NOT offer advice, only considerations.
Emotion destroys the think processes that you need to judge a given share/future/option. I agree wholeheartedly.

That is, IF you have these think processes in the first place. The majority of the people here are not investors in the real world and do not have an investor mindset. Which means, they are highly affected by emotions, group dynamics etc.

The effect of those people basically buying any security that comes onto the virtual currency "market" is amplified by the fact that many of them bought BTC when prices were higher and now feel an urge to invest and "get back their losses" asap through dividends etc.

But that has not much to do with the valuation of a security, i.e. it being "cheap" at .0008. My point being, most of the people do not care about valuation because they don't evaluate the security to begin with.

Yep agreed. And its the oddest mix of participants ive ever experienced. Its great for volume and the opportunities it brings to the table, but ive visions of parents noticing a mood change in their children's behavior, and then finding out little Johnny has lost all his pocket money savings..... and his friends, on some highly risky and unregulated trading site.
Dont look good does it. 

 
full member
Activity: 218
Merit: 100
Scooped more up at .00082 yesterday.  I am very patient.

Anyone who was able to buy @ ~.0008, but didn't, needs a lesson in Risk/Reward calculations.
Interesting statement. Care to elaborate?

Sure.
Entering any trade is essentially an individuals judgement of the value of what he/she has just bought, together with what the perceived value it should be, according to that individual. How does anyone perceive what 'value' is at a given time? Thats a subjective question with many results, which is good, or we would have a very flat and boring market, with no opportunities. Whatever strategies or techniques you employ, it cannot be based on emotion.
Anybody who has had the briefest experience of established market trading, will know that emotion destroys all the think processes you need to judge a given share/future/option etc. And thats my point. The adolescents here either need to either log off and choose their favorite toy to play with, on this fine Saturday (here anyway), OR realize they may not know anywhere near enough to 'survive' these kind of markets, and get a fucking education, or i WILL take your BTC, and you WILL buy mine, and you WILL lose. Sorry, that's what i see, because that's what happened. 

So i repeat my previous post, as something to consider. Sentiment @ ~.0008 was nicely positive. It was an accepted level of value at that time, without knowing any details of the NDA, and knowing we had the Avalon/s and chips coming. There were some people who it seemed could not put together what AMC was trying to achieve, and i would accept that as understandable to some extent, but this recent news sets out a reasonably detailed plan, that should provide some kind of vision to price against.
Whats the value today? You decide, but make sure you have arrived at a figure that is based on reasoned thinking, and not correlated to the amount of adrenalin rushing through your ignorant veins. Whatever the value is, its definitely more than .0008 of anyone's money (currently ~.00130).

Disclaimer: I DO NOT offer advice, only considerations.
Emotion destroys the think processes that you need to judge a given share/future/option. I agree wholeheartedly.

That is, IF you have these think processes in the first place. The majority of the people here are not investors in the real world and do not have an investor mindset. Which means, they are highly affected by emotions, group dynamics etc.

The effect of those people basically buying any security that comes onto the virtual currency "market" is amplified by the fact that many of them bought BTC when prices were higher and now feel an urge to invest and "get back their losses" asap through dividends etc.

But that has not much to do with the valuation of a security, i.e. it being "cheap" at .0008. My point being, most of the people do not care about valuation because they don't evaluate the security to begin with.
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