[ANN] AEON [2019-09-27: Upgrade to version 0.13.0.0 ASAP HF@1146200 Oct 25] - page 14.

bbc.reporter

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Quote from: bigslimvdub on August 10, 2020, 10:16:24 PM

Quote from: bbc.reporter on August 10, 2020, 07:39:46 PM

@bigslimvdub. However, the fixed supply and the assumption that it is the better option is also a only theory. On bitcoin it appears that the effect is that is being used as a speculative investment more than a medium of exchange similar to gold. Early holders are incentivized to keep them instead of using them.

Aeon is a speculative investment since 99.9% of anyone who owns the coin are not spending it, only holding or trading.

Bitcoin is being used, integrated, and speculatively held on a daily basis. Bitcoin will also be around in its usable state until supply is exhausted, someone breaks sha256, or finds a severe security flaw that rendered the chain useless.

Most crypto coins with a tail emission could, and probably will, become obsolete soon after tail emissions kicks in and miners realize there is close to zero incentive to continue supporting the chain and it eventually dies off well before bitcoin can. The only way any cryptocurrency on tail emissions could survive was if the value increased exponentially to create financial incentives to continue mining operations. One of the reasons a specific project made an incredibly gigantic supply so it could literally never run out of supply in the developers lifetime.

The argument was not how the coins mentioned are presently used but on their monetary policies and how they might affect on how they could be used in the future.

Grin's monetary supply dilutes the coins of early adopters and disincentivizes them from hoarding. I reckon Aeon's tail emmission might help stabilize the price assuming it was adopted a certain % of bitcoin's adoption. Bitcoin's monetary policy of fixed supply will tie it forever as a speculative asset similar to stocks.

Bitcoin_Joker

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Quote from: bigslimvdub on August 10, 2020, 10:16:24 PM

Aeon is a speculative investment since 99.9% of anyone who owns the coin are not spending it, only holding or trading.

This can be said about almost any cryptocurrency.

bigslimvdub

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on August 10, 2020, 07:39:46 PM

@bigslimvdub. However, the fixed supply and the assumption that it is the better option is also a only theory. On bitcoin it appears that the effect is that is being used as a speculative investment more than a medium of exchange similar to gold. Early holders are incentivized to keep them instead of using them.

Aeon is a speculative investment since 99.9% of anyone who owns the coin are not spending it, only holding or trading.

Bitcoin is being used, integrated, and speculatively held on a daily basis. Bitcoin will also be around in its usable state until supply is exhausted, someone breaks sha256, or finds a severe security flaw that rendered the chain useless.

Most crypto coins with a tail emission could, and probably will, become obsolete soon after tail emissions kicks in and miners realize there is close to zero incentive to continue supporting the chain and it eventually dies off well before bitcoin can. The only way any cryptocurrency on tail emissions could survive was if the value increased exponentially to create financial incentives to continue mining operations. One of the reasons a specific project made an incredibly gigantic supply so it could literally never run out of supply in the developers lifetime.

bbc.reporter

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@bigslimvdub. However, the fixed supply and the assumption that it is the better option is also a only theory. On bitcoin it appears that the effect is that is being used as a speculative investment more than a medium of exchange similar to gold. Early holders are incentivized to keep them instead of using them.

bigslimvdub

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on August 10, 2020, 12:52:57 AM

Quote from: bigslimvdub on August 08, 2020, 09:35:28 AM

In RE to tail emissions, what CN coin is on tail emissions currently? Will aeon hit tail emissions before Monero so it can be examined on effectiveness? Since there has been zero talk about tail emissions since 2017 pre-rebase, it is only hopes and expectations on effectiveness right now.

Also for price comparison to monero, Aeon was $9.50 while monero was almost $500. Not a fair way to compare projects based of market cap

However, tail emmission and infinite emmission are monetary policies that might be theoretically more sound than bitcoin's monetary policy of having only the fees to secure the blockchain after the end of its distribution.

If supply runs out in 2150, I would say that’s a better option “right now” since it’s a known end point where tail emissions is only a theory. Imo satoshi did this for a reason. It gave 150years for technology to perfect a digital currency. Everything else is just a test bed until then.

bigslimvdub

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Quote from: smooth on August 08, 2020, 10:45:19 PM

Monero will likely hit tail a few months before AEON, as it launched before AEON and they are on basically the same schedule, though hash rate changes and such can cause them to diverge a bit.

I was inquiring since it appears that after k12 was enabled that there have been a larger volume of blocks per day. I mean it’s more stable than CryptoNote but seems to have accelerated supply consumption. Granted most are totally empty blocks, Aeon doesn’t typically get the long block times of a block or few every day like before cnlv7.

bbc.reporter

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Quote from: bigslimvdub on August 08, 2020, 09:35:28 AM

In RE to tail emissions, what CN coin is on tail emissions currently? Will aeon hit tail emissions before Monero so it can be examined on effectiveness? Since there has been zero talk about tail emissions since 2017 pre-rebase, it is only hopes and expectations on effectiveness right now.

Also for price comparison to monero, Aeon was $9.50 while monero was almost $500. Not a fair way to compare projects based of market cap

However, tail emmission and infinite emmission are monetary policies that might be theoretically more sound than bitcoin's monetary policy of having only the fees to secure the blockchain after the end of its distribution.

smooth

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Monero will likely hit tail a few months before AEON, as it launched before AEON and they are on basically the same schedule, though hash rate changes and such can cause them to diverge a bit.

bigslimvdub

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In RE to tail emissions, what CN coin is on tail emissions currently? Will aeon hit tail emissions before Monero so it can be examined on effectiveness? Since there has been zero talk about tail emissions since 2017 pre-rebase, it is only hopes and expectations on effectiveness right now.

Also for price comparison to monero, Aeon was $9.50 while monero was almost $500. Not a fair way to compare projects based of market cap

FireFox2020

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on August 05, 2020, 09:38:57 PM

@bitpotter. Also in all of its market history, Aeon's price was 10% of Monero's price. Monero is presently trading on $89 and based in market history, this implies that Aeon might be very undervalued.

Many coins are undervalued now ... but that doesn't mean they have the potential to grow. Although I believe in the future of the AEON coin

bbc.reporter

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@bitpotter. Also in all of its market history, Aeon's price was 10% of Monero's price. Monero is presently trading on $89 and based in market history, this implies that Aeon might be very undervalued.

bbc.reporter

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Quote from: bigslimvdub on August 02, 2020, 11:11:38 PM

Quote from: bbc.reporter on August 01, 2020, 10:19:15 PM

I reckon not the miners. The producers of Asics for Aeon, however, might pump this and begin a new industry for the next in demand coin in the next years. Private, anonymous, Cryptonote coins.

My speculation hehehehe.

It’s a little too late since there is minimal new coin supply to mine right now. It would make more sense to finish porting Aeon to monero latest framework then fork aeon and start a new chain from scratch with ASICS. This way you have a fresh chain, full privacy (no ring 0) history, all the tested benefits and bug fixes of 6+ years, and support of ASICS on an asic friendly POW. But that won’t happen for at least another 2(?) years when supply runs out of aeon and the unknown functionality of tail emissions kicks in. So you could say that creating ASICS now would show the full functionality on the chain to prove out any issues of sha3 + ASICS and allow for bug fixes related to ASICS before forking and creating that fresh new chain to start all over with.

Just a theory here.

Which reminds me, where is that tari whitepaper. Wink

I disagree. Cryptonote coins have a tail emission. Also, it would be more costly for manufacturers of Asics to develop a coin, grow a supporting community and produce the Asics all by themselves.

estenity

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on July 30, 2020, 10:42:25 PM

It appears the whale that controls the bot has been supporting 3000 sats and has been buying everything he can up to 10k sats.

Aeon market is very illiquid, I speculate the whale cannot accumulate on big volume without pumping it.

in effect aeon presently approaching 5000 sats.
it is impressive to see on bittrex, that the progression is obtained with a daily volume of much less than 1 btc
so you are right, the coin is very illiquid.
some members said that the available supply is in fact limited.

bigslimvdub

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on August 01, 2020, 10:19:15 PM

I reckon not the miners. The producers of Asics for Aeon, however, might pump this and begin a new industry for the next in demand coin in the next years. Private, anonymous, Cryptonote coins.

My speculation hehehehe.

It’s a little too late since there is minimal new coin supply to mine right now. It would make more sense to finish porting Aeon to monero latest framework then fork aeon and start a new chain from scratch with ASICS. This way you have a fresh chain, full privacy (no ring 0) history, all the tested benefits and bug fixes of 6+ years, and support of ASICS on an asic friendly POW. But that won’t happen for at least another 2(?) years when supply runs out of aeon and the unknown functionality of tail emissions kicks in. So you could say that creating ASICS now would show the full functionality on the chain to prove out any issues of sha3 + ASICS and allow for bug fixes related to ASICS before forking and creating that fresh new chain to start all over with.

Just a theory here.

Which reminds me, where is that tari whitepaper. Wink

seven.71

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live the dream but don't live the dream

Quote from: bigslimvdub on August 01, 2020, 01:07:51 PM

Quote from: Gash on August 01, 2020, 08:02:56 AM

Miners are not that dumb. You mine, you dump your bags and you never get back. I dont think that assumption that some might wanna pump the price to offset the cost of electricity by increasing profits from selling, is correct. Nah its not miners. Its you, bbc.reporter, who pumps it up. You want out of your debts. This is why you long for better prices for your bags. It would be a negligence on my part to overlook and not to mention the fact that most of you, people, just wanna sell and quit. We are all in the same boat.

To verify miners pumping you have to first realize it takes about 24hrs for coins to settle on an exchange. Miners must receive their payouts, send to exchange, drop off mining on the network (to reset diff and increase coins received when they start again), pump exchange volume with 1btc, dump all coins, then return to mining and repeat.

It's fairly clear this is what is done with crypto mining. Mining is not done to "support the network" on a large scale. It's done for profiteering and that is it. The little guys are the ones "supporting the network" by adding additional checkers of the blockchain. Unless a large source of hash rate is run by the devs of a project, mining is for profit by farms.

It really is sad Aeon.to shut down. It shows that people are not using Aeon to purchase goods, at least in the public eye.

in this case if the miners only prioritize a network on a large scale but from the results of mining they only suffer losses and not profitable clearly if I as a miner I do not do because as a miner wants a satisfactory result in mining and the plus value is running the network

bbc.reporter

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I reckon not the miners. The producers of Asics for Aeon, however, might pump this and begin a new industry for the next in demand coin in the next years. Private, anonymous, Cryptonote coins.

My speculation hehehehe.

bigslimvdub

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Quote from: Gash on August 01, 2020, 08:02:56 AM

Miners are not that dumb. You mine, you dump your bags and you never get back. I dont think that assumption that some might wanna pump the price to offset the cost of electricity by increasing profits from selling, is correct. Nah its not miners. Its you, bbc.reporter, who pumps it up. You want out of your debts. This is why you long for better prices for your bags. It would be a negligence on my part to overlook and not to mention the fact that most of you, people, just wanna sell and quit. We are all in the same boat.

To verify miners pumping you have to first realize it takes about 24hrs for coins to settle on an exchange. Miners must receive their payouts, send to exchange, drop off mining on the network (to reset diff and increase coins received when they start again), pump exchange volume with 1btc, dump all coins, then return to mining and repeat.

It's fairly clear this is what is done with crypto mining. Mining is not done to "support the network" on a large scale. It's done for profiteering and that is it. The little guys are the ones "supporting the network" by adding additional checkers of the blockchain. Unless a large source of hash rate is run by the devs of a project, mining is for profit by farms.

It really is sad Aeon.to shut down. It shows that people are not using Aeon to purchase goods, at least in the public eye.

Gash

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Miners are not that dumb. You mine, you dump your bags and you never get back. I dont think that assumption that some might wanna pump the price to offset the cost of electricity by increasing profits from selling, is correct. Nah its not miners. Its you, bbc.reporter, who pumps it up. You want out of your debts. This is why you long for better prices for your bags. It would be a negligence on my part to overlook and not to mention the fact that most of you, people, just wanna sell and quit. We are all in the same boat.

bbc.reporter

legendary

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@estenity. Are you speculating the pumps are done by the miners to increase their profitabilty? I reckon that might be good for Aeon's basic mining infrastructure and secure the network more. I reckon that should be the first economic development for any proof of work cryptocoin.

I speculate that it is americanpegasus pumping. Hello americanpegasus hehe.

estenity

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on July 30, 2020, 10:42:25 PM

It appears the whale that controls the bot has been supporting 3000 sats and has been buying everything he can up to 10k sats.

Aeon market is very illiquid, I speculate the whale cannot accumulate on big volume without pumping it.

so probably, as to stimulate mining results in a relatively limited benefit,
should be better to try to include aeon in a system where it would be of greater use.
however,both goals are not incompatible.

Topic: [ANN] AEON [2019-09-27: Upgrade to version 0.13.0.0 ASAP HF@1146200 Oct 25] - page 14. (Read 625666 times)