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Topic: [ANN] Ethereum: Welcome to the Beginning - page 1261. (Read 2006044 times)
So, is it launched?
Has anyone addressed the security of having a Turing complete foundation? Turing complete means that Ethereum contracts will likely be absolutely loaded with common and proprietary viruses, keyloggers, malware, adware, and a slew of other bad things. I am willing to bet my bank account that in a few short months people will be crying about how they got all their wallets/currency stolen, or their computers are now running slow, or how they blue screen every few minutes after a reboot.
If you want an example of how Turing complete works, load up a peer to peer sharing program and download a bunch of .MOV files and run them. I GUARANTEE that you will get a virus. That's because Quicktime movie files are Turing complete. This is why mkv, mpeg, mpg and avi, while not impervious, are much much safer to download. If you want to invest, mine, and run contracts at the risk of losing everything then go ahead. We will never know for sure how secure Ether is going to be until post release, so asking for money without proof of security is another red flag.
If you want an example of how Turing complete works, load up a peer to peer sharing program and download a bunch of .MOV files and run them. I GUARANTEE that you will get a virus. That's because Quicktime movie files are Turing complete. This is why mkv, mpeg, mpg and avi, while not impervious, are much much safer to download. If you want to invest, mine, and run contracts at the risk of losing everything then go ahead. We will never know for sure how secure Ether is going to be until post release, so asking for money without proof of security is another red flag.
I want to know the answer to this as well. Yes LeoC is a huge scammer and all around asshole, I get that. What I don't get is why is it ok to completely ignore this valid question solely on that basis? Will just like to let you know, that as a new user, the response to his post didn't have a positive effect on me. I have 5 BTC that I want to invest into something, but everywhere I go there is always something that just doesn't feel right, Ethereum included. So it's no longer the scammer asking the question, it's me. Also I have absolutely no problem with the IPO+premine. The amount of work that the developers have put into this deserves to be rewarded. Also which other developers publicly speak about their cryptocurrency at conventions? Exactly. Look how small Vitalik is, if it ended up being a scam, which is very unlikely, one punch by a disgruntled convention goer would put him in a coma. Besides the nagging issue about security I'm almost convinced to buy into Ethereum.
It's a valid question, you're right. There are some risks of course, our best defenses are: 1) the bounties that will be distributed for security audits, pentest, etc and 2) the relative simplicity of the programming language (less than 50 opcodes, and the c++ VM is circa 200 lines). As Vitalik would say, "The Ethereum language is designed with the need for perfect determinism and consensus in mind." Note that sandboxing is also entirely within the real of possibility and something that they are strongly considering.
So are you saying there will be no protection against the above on release? I'd like a developer to comment. Theoretically I can buy into the IPO and just not run the contracts to avoid security issues right?
im exciting...
i build go-ethereum.exe
what do I do now?
i build go-ethereum.exe
what do I do now?
anybody here?
Varys: Power is a curious thing, my lord. Are you fond of riddles?
what a spoiler
i just started the first book. i hope there is still enough tense left in the stories.
yeah i know everybody saw the series, i didn't. unlucky me.
Has anyone addressed the security of having a Turing complete foundation? Turing complete means that Ethereum contracts will likely be absolutely loaded with common and proprietary viruses, keyloggers, malware, adware, and a slew of other bad things. I am willing to bet my bank account that in a few short months people will be crying about how they got all their wallets/currency stolen, or their computers are now running slow, or how they blue screen every few minutes after a reboot.
If you want an example of how Turing complete works, load up a peer to peer sharing program and download a bunch of .MOV files and run them. I GUARANTEE that you will get a virus. That's because Quicktime movie files are Turing complete. This is why mkv, mpeg, mpg and avi, while not impervious, are much much safer to download. If you want to invest, mine, and run contracts at the risk of losing everything then go ahead. We will never know for sure how secure Ether is going to be until post release, so asking for money without proof of security is another red flag.
If you want an example of how Turing complete works, load up a peer to peer sharing program and download a bunch of .MOV files and run them. I GUARANTEE that you will get a virus. That's because Quicktime movie files are Turing complete. This is why mkv, mpeg, mpg and avi, while not impervious, are much much safer to download. If you want to invest, mine, and run contracts at the risk of losing everything then go ahead. We will never know for sure how secure Ether is going to be until post release, so asking for money without proof of security is another red flag.
I want to know the answer to this as well. Yes LeoC is a huge scammer and all around asshole, I get that. What I don't get is why is it ok to completely ignore this valid question solely on that basis? Will just like to let you know, that as a new user, the response to his post didn't have a positive effect on me. I have 5 BTC that I want to invest into something, but everywhere I go there is always something that just doesn't feel right, Ethereum included. So it's no longer the scammer asking the question, it's me. Also I have absolutely no problem with the IPO+premine. The amount of work that the developers have put into this deserves to be rewarded. Also which other developers publicly speak about their cryptocurrency at conventions? Exactly. Look how small Vitalik is, if it ended up being a scam, which is very unlikely, one punch by a disgruntled convention goer would put him in a coma. Besides the nagging issue about security I'm almost convinced to buy into Ethereum.
It's a valid question, you're right. There are some risks of course, our best defenses are: 1) the bounties that will be distributed for security audits, pentest, etc and 2) the relative simplicity of the programming language (less than 50 opcodes, and the c++ VM is circa 200 lines). As Vitalik would say, "The Ethereum language is designed with the need for perfect determinism and consensus in mind." Note that sandboxing is also entirely within the real of possibility and something that they are strongly considering.
im exciting...
i build go-ethereum.exe
what do I do now?
i build go-ethereum.exe
what do I do now?
Pre-investing in alt-coins, now I've seen it all, 
Hey if you guys can sell someone on that, more power to you.
I have a whale I need to sale some water to. Maybe, after this fails, you guys could help me with that, lol.
Hey if you guys can sell someone on that, more power to you.
I have a whale I need to sale some water to. Maybe, after this fails, you guys could help me with that, lol.
Things have dramatically changed in the last 12 months my friend. The level of innovation and the dramatic speed at which that innovation is taking place makes it unsurprising that the the coins/platforms that show great/legitimate potential are adopting this model.
Pre-investing in alt-coins, now I've seen it all,
Hey if you guys can sell someone on that, more power to you.
I have a whale I need to sale some water to. Maybe, after this fails, you guys could help me with that, lol.
Hey if you guys can sell someone on that, more power to you.
I have a whale I need to sale some water to. Maybe, after this fails, you guys could help me with that, lol.
Can anybody give a summary what happened to the presale?
I'll sum it up for you
Great potential in this product, but a god-awful IPO was scheduled to begin on the 1st. Seemed awfully greedy on the founders part with the investors taking all the risk. Regardless of if the project failed or not, the founders would still make good money.
However, they have since delayed the IPO (and are hopefully restructuring it, because if they come up with something respectable this thing could really have a future) and so on the 1st there is a tesnet release instead.
Great potential in this product, but a god-awful IPO was scheduled to begin on the 1st. Seemed awfully greedy on the founders part with the investors taking all the risk. Regardless of if the project failed or not, the founders would still make good money.
However, they have since delayed the IPO (and are hopefully restructuring it, because if they come up with something respectable this thing could really have a future) and so on the 1st there is a tesnet release instead.
+1
The presale investors have to take all the risk of project failure, while the founders take none. Also, the presale investors will get their shares diluted every year by the mining supply coming in from Botnets and cloud mining.
They either weren't ready for logistical reasons and so decided to delay the IPO....or realized that their IPO would come back to haunt them and so are now restructuring it.
Cheers.
The earlier structure did seem very weighted against the investors.
Has anyone addressed the security of having a Turing complete foundation? Turing complete means that Ethereum contracts will likely be absolutely loaded with common and proprietary viruses, keyloggers, malware, adware, and a slew of other bad things. I am willing to bet my bank account that in a few short months people will be crying about how they got all their wallets/currency stolen, or their computers are now running slow, or how they blue screen every few minutes after a reboot.
If you want an example of how Turing complete works, load up a peer to peer sharing program and download a bunch of .MOV files and run them. I GUARANTEE that you will get a virus. That's because Quicktime movie files are Turing complete. This is why mkv, mpeg, mpg and avi, while not impervious, are much much safer to download. If you want to invest, mine, and run contracts at the risk of losing everything then go ahead. We will never know for sure how secure Ether is going to be until post release, so asking for money without proof of security is another red flag.
If you want an example of how Turing complete works, load up a peer to peer sharing program and download a bunch of .MOV files and run them. I GUARANTEE that you will get a virus. That's because Quicktime movie files are Turing complete. This is why mkv, mpeg, mpg and avi, while not impervious, are much much safer to download. If you want to invest, mine, and run contracts at the risk of losing everything then go ahead. We will never know for sure how secure Ether is going to be until post release, so asking for money without proof of security is another red flag.
I want to know the answer to this as well. Yes LeoC is a huge scammer and all around asshole, I get that. What I don't get is why is it ok to completely ignore this valid question solely on that basis? Will just like to let you know, that as a new user, the response to his post didn't have a positive effect on me. I have 5 BTC that I want to invest into something, but everywhere I go there is always something that just doesn't feel right, Ethereum included. So it's no longer the scammer asking the question, it's me. Also I have absolutely no problem with the IPO+premine. The amount of work that the developers have put into this deserves to be rewarded. Also which other developers publicly speak about their cryptocurrency at conventions? Exactly. Look how small Vitalik is, if it ended up being a scam, which is very unlikely, one punch by a disgruntled convention goer would put him in a coma. Besides the nagging issue about security I'm almost convinced to buy into Ethereum.
How I can get ethereum coins? Is theirs possible to pow mine?
Is it me or does the inventor sound like Stephen Hawkings without using a voice box.... 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5FDvzj8YX4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5FDvzj8YX4
Quote
Cиcтeмa Ethereum тaкжe мoжeт быть иcпoльзoвaнa в кaчecтвe идeнтификaтopa. Taкaя фyнкция cтaлa бы oчeнь пoлeзнoй в пиpингoвыx ceтяx, пpи aзapтныx игpax, иcпoльзoвaнии pынкoв пpeдcкaзaний, фoндoвыx биpж, a тaкжe в cфepe cтpaxoвaния. Xoтя cиcтeмa и coздaнa, чтoбы быть чeм-тo бoльшим, чeм вaлютa, y нee бyдeт cвoя coбcтвeннaя дeнeжнaя eдиницa пoд нaзвaниeм Ether. Baлютa бyдeт дaвaтьcя мaйнepaм, a тaкжe cлyжить мexaнизмoм, кoтopый пoзвoлит coвepшaть oплaтy тpaнзaкций. Cнaчaлa, пpoдaжa вaлюты бyдeт ocyщecтвлятьcя из фoндoвыx peзepвoв, oднaкo пoзжe, нaчнeтcя ee мaйнинг. Taкaя cиcтeмa вызoвeт мoдeль линeйнoй инфляции.
A нeльзя ли пoдpoбнee пpo мaйнинг? я дyмaю мнoгим этo бyдeт oчeнь интepecнo Bitcoins are not a currency.
It doesn't matter what YOU think. Even if bitcoin isn't official currency that approved by gov, PEOPLE choose to use it because they find it more convenient to use than credit cards. That's the power of markets. That's the power of competing currencies.
Who gives a shit what gov says, they don't have power over you or me. They are illusion, to claim you as a part of their slavery.
Varys: Power is a curious thing, my lord. Are you fond of riddles?
Tyrion Lannister: Why, am I about to hear one?
Varys: Three great men sit in a room; a king, a priest and a rich man. Between them stands a common sellsword. Each great man bids the sellsword kill the other two. Who lives, who dies?
Tyrion Lannister: Depends on the sellsword.
Varys: Does it? He has neither crown, nor gold, nor the favour of the gods.
Tyrion Lannister: He has a sword, the power of life and death.
Varys: But if it's swordsmen who rule, why do we pretend kings hold all the power? When Ned Stark lost his head, who was truly responsible? Joffrey? The executioner? Or something else?
Tyrion Lannister: I've decided I don't like riddles.
Varys: Power resides where men believe it resides. It's a trick, a shadow on the wall, and a very small man can cast a very large shadow.
The best post I've ever read about crypto currencies!
Bitcoins are not a currency.
It doesn't matter what YOU think. Even if bitcoin isn't official currency that approved by gov, PEOPLE choose to use it because they find it more convenient to use than credit cards. That's the power of markets. That's the power of competing currencies.
Who gives a shit what gov says, they don't have power over you or me. They are illusion, to claim you as a part of their slavery.
Varys: Power is a curious thing, my lord. Are you fond of riddles?
Tyrion Lannister: Why, am I about to hear one?
Varys: Three great men sit in a room; a king, a priest and a rich man. Between them stands a common sellsword. Each great man bids the sellsword kill the other two. Who lives, who dies?
Tyrion Lannister: Depends on the sellsword.
Varys: Does it? He has neither crown, nor gold, nor the favour of the gods.
Tyrion Lannister: He has a sword, the power of life and death.
Varys: But if it's swordsmen who rule, why do we pretend kings hold all the power? When Ned Stark lost his head, who was truly responsible? Joffrey? The executioner? Or something else?
Tyrion Lannister: I've decided I don't like riddles.
Varys: Power resides where men believe it resides. It's a trick, a shadow on the wall, and a very small man can cast a very large shadow.
I stand half way corrected.
http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/31/5364406/bitcoin-miners-investors-not-regulated-fincen-ruling
http://business.time.com/2014/01/27/bitinstant-ceo-charlie-shrem-arrested-for-alleged-money-laundering/
So Charlie Shrem was arrested for laundering money or ...
R u sure that Vitalik / investors won't be arrested?
Haha - yes. But anybody is allowed to have any stupid opinion on the internet. Including me.
Crypto is being treated as something different than strictly "not currency" AND different than strictly "currency"
You don't have to pay capital gains unless you pull it out. Above article I posted. Etc, etc. So if/when the SEC will step in is anyone's guess. I have a very difficult time seeing them stepping in to protect consumers who have intentionally stepped outside of traditional money markets in this situation.
I could be wrong.
do not assume the authorities aren't watching.. and do not put your greed for money above your legal and moral duty to obey they law.
So... what will "your legal and moral duty" be when they tell you that cryptocurrencies are against the law?
+1
The word "greed" is about as objectively defined as the word "fair", and both are used in attempts to manipulate people by inducing feelings of shame and guilt.
no they are attempts to make you think about your actions before they come back to bite you HARD.
morality is as much about self preservation as it is about collective good.
I do not steal from my neighbors because I know that when they find out they will call the police or come over to my house and smash my windows (or worse), shame and guilt play a very small part in my decision not to do it.
Mr Shrek on the other hand apparently had no understanding of conscience or the implications of his actions.
do not assume the authorities aren't watching.. and do not put your greed for money above your legal and moral duty to obey they law.
So... what will "your legal and moral duty" be when they tell you that cryptocurrencies are against the law?
obey the law or leave the country.. there are plenty of countries in this world, some with very nice beaches....
so far no jurisdiction in the world has banned the use of crypto currencies so that question is purely hypothetical...
what happens to you if you run a ponzi scheme, run a drug trading website or launder money?.. those are not hypothetical questions..
I think you may have misunderstood my comments.. I did not mean obey EVERY law... just the ones that carry serious jail time as punishment.
if the NSA and Edward Snowden have taught us anything it is... "They know what you did last summer"... and its only a matter of time before they act on it.
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