Topic: [ANN] Guncoin(GUN) - New GUN Core V2.0 Released - Masternodes are HERE! - page 92. (Read 187710 times)

Community Question ----- Is anyone using the Android Wallet for anything?

Another topic of discussion is the exchanges.  While most of ours are smaller exchanges, they still provide free advertising for us.  While some think that getting listed on too many dilutes our volume - it also helps promote the coins especially when it is on a voting list.  While we hate these voting lists to be honest - they are valuable in that many who do the voting will see our name for the first time and check us out - like I said Free advertising.  So getting votes and remaining on a list for a few weeks and then getting listed is a good thing.  The big exchanges do watch and steal from the smaller exchanges.  So, I just added us to the voting list at https://comkort.com/vote/#GUN - nice little exchange that I have used before.

The other side to this is that if we are on an exchange, it is important for us to show some volume of any type - I have mentioned this before buying or selling 500-1000 coins per week is not a big deal for any of us and if enough do it on enough exchanges - we gain visibility.  Please keep all these exchanges in mind that support GUN on our main website......


http://guncoin.info/links/trade-exchanges/

Well, likewise, I am not opposed to ASICs either - that is what I use now to mine several coins including GUN.   While I am impressed that so many GUN supporters have come back which was our goal here to get things moving again, I do not picture all of them buying racks of 500MH/s ASICs each and creating a mega GUN mining network.   For starters, like has been said, at 30-40 satoshi, there is not a big profit in it.  So will they each spend $2000 just to help build a network???  I am not sure.  It is a very nice thought though - definitely something I can not do for the coin by myself.  But I think the likelihood of that happening is just as likely as the anti-Gun lobby showing up with matching horse power.  

What I do agree with, is that either way, regardless of the algorithm, interesting those outside the crypto community is one of our top priorities.  Like I have said before, going that direction, focusing on developing tools and resources they can use will catch and keep their interest.  Would anyone use Paypal if there were none of the buttons, APIs, help resources?  Probably not near as many. That is our goal, but like we have said, unless we start developing these tools and handing them out, we will never get there.  Of course, even if we do get there, it will never be fast enough for everyone.  So just to give you an example of what goes on behind the curtain of things that you do not see.........

We have spent a SIGNIFICANT amount of time trying to build up our Twitter following.  We are at the point now, where we add over a dozen NON-CRYPTO followers every week.  THESE are our target end-users.  Many have no clue who we are, what crypto is, have never heard of us, but love the idea and philosophy that GUN represents - individual gun owners, gun ranges, gun shop owners, preppers, etc. etc.  They are just waiting to be cultivated.  Now that being said, it take hours of emails, etc. to educate them and get them to the point of doing anything. We told you about a webhosting service a while back and now we have a concealed handgun site that wrote a nice article on us and is genuinely supportive of what we do to where he added us to his sponsor directory and submitted our article to all the search engines to help us. He originally never knew what crypto was, but is now a great GUN supporter - check these out....

http://www.concealedcarry-ccw.com/GunArticles/ALL/ALL/Main-Guncoin-a-virtual-currency-for-the-firearm-community-/
http://www.concealedcarry-ccw.com/our-sponsors

Big deal you say, one guy.  Well, that is one more than we had last week and the visibility from this one site is huge.  So there is nothing about what we did that any of you could not have done.  Simply pick one of our followers that suits you and tweet them or email them to the main site and thank them for following GUN and ask them if they have any questions or if there is anything you can help them with.  I promise you, that will do MORE for GUN, than any 500 MH/s ASIC will ever do.  General acceptance by the crypto and non-crypto community is what makes a coin.  You folks are the core GUN supporters in the crypto community - just buying or mining GUN is great.  But this is a decentralized coin, or it needs to be.  Is there just one person or group pushing DOGE or LTC or FTC - hardly - their community sets up websites, pools, exchanges, etc.  How many Ebayers are selling DOGE "stuff"

So if we have these interested Twitter followers on the hook, how do you convert them?  One at a time.......and it is a slow process
1) Show them the users manual
2) Tell them how crypto currency works
3) Point them to our classified ad site and show them how to post some ads for their businesses for FREE (which none of you have done yet)
4) Help them download and set up a wallet and put 1000 GUN in it for them to get them started.
5) Have them put one of our banners or buttons on their website.

I do not think anyone here can deny that all that is pretty easy to do.  Especially, if everyone of our Twitter followers has already followed us and by doing so is curious about us. So #6 above I think is where some of us differ in opinion.  To me, it seems extremely attractive to be able to show this newbie how to mine GUN with just his laptop.  He can go to bed at night, leave his laptop running and wakeup with more coins in his wallet - what a thrill to a newbie - virtually FREE money EVERY day.  I would go one step farther and tell them after the first 1000 he mines, you would give him 1000 more.  After that he is hooked....To me, none of that is rocket science and what we have been doing in the background - one at a time - some jump on board, some disappear, but unless we jump on these folks to bring them aboard, they will disappear I think.  So there were several points to my soapbox speech here and I hope you picked up on them all.  The key one goes back to the ASIC question in relation to #6.......If our super GUN network is mining 100 GH/s, we would have to depend on 1 -5 to bring these newbies on board above only and #6 gets thrown away.

Again, I do not expect every one here to agree and like I said, whatever direction we go, not all will be happy with it.  I love the discussion and encourage you to keep it going.  And hope that whatever direction we do proceed with, that no one looses site of our common support of the 2A and why we all came to GUN to start with.

FYI, thanks to some of your support, we have now replaced our 4 nodes and all are up and running full steam again!

It seems to me that you mistook my post as being anti asic, which it wasn't as far as the coin is concerned, besides from my personal mining view which I pretty much discount in the bigger picture.

It also seems that you didn't read the end of it at all where I pointed out that a clear direction for the coin is a key, and just wanted to rant at my alleged ignorance of the bigger picture.

Whatever, we all have views, and don't have to get along to help the coin succeed.   

In reply to 'damm315er',

1. We cannot tar all miners with the same brush... CPU, GPU, ASIC... Botnet, GPU farm, ASIC farm... all are used for mining... any highly profitable and successful coin will quickly be out of reach of the hobby miner... whether CPU(think XMR), GPU(think DRK), or ASIC(think LTC)... the only coins that have ever been for the hobby miner are the coins that are not a success or viable.

2. ASIC's gives power to the community...they provide the best hash-rate to power consumption to equipment cost... there has never been a better time for a community to own a network.

3. GUN will not be remotely successful until the network is sustained by at least 100GH/s... no matter what equipment is used to mine it.

4. Most folks do not understand mining and coin dynamics at a large scale... no coin will ever be mined below its true value... and the biggest challenge facing any miner with any sizable farm, botnet, GPU or ASIC is ensuring that the coin he or she mines has enough volume and liquidity for a reasonable return.

I am not expending any more time or energy on the subject of an algo change... waste of time and resources... GUN will not need to concern itself with any threat from any botnet, GPU farm, or ASIC farm if there is no improvement in adoption and progress to becoming a working currency.

The simply fact is that right now GUN is worthless... the only thing that can be bought with GUN is BTC... and there are 100's of useless coins competing for the BTC. I mine GUN for a bit of fun now and then... but do not honestly ever expect to see any real return on my investment.

The only way to achieve value in GUN is build circulation and adoption... the dev has indicated he is working several projects... so I am being patient will hold my GUN for the long-term.

I have already listed in previous thread several new scrypt coins that are very successful in harnessing the power of the ASIC as well as building a large user base, which has incidentally raised the value of the coin as well.

EDIT - I did not intend this post as a personal attack on 'damm315er', so I have made appropriate changes to the post.

Lots of discussion while I was sleeping...  Valid points on both sides, and I'll offer one point of contention.

Asics are a tool.  The most common users of them, are those seeking to mine and dump for profit.  Another point of asics, is that they increase a lot faster than the rest of the community.  Yes, CPU's get faster, but it's single digit percentage points per year with a very high cost.  GPU's increase at a slightly higher percentage rate, but are also prohibitive to increasingly replace to chase the best.  Asics have increased nearly 750% just in 2014 (400 kh/s to 300 mh/s), and don't even show that they are reaching a point of slowing down, while they keep getting cheaper.  The largest issue with this speed increase is power consumption, the next few generations of asics are going to take the ability to feed them the power they need out of the hands of the consumer and into asic farms like there are for bitcoin.  At that point any coin mine-able by asics will be out of reach of the hobbyist as the farms will mine any profitable coin.

At this point, gun is low enough it's not profitable enough to mine with an asic for sale, but at the point that it does, the farms will take over mining.  A perfect example of this, is try mining doge or litecoin.  Don't bother with a CPU or GPU, and a 6 month old asic isn't even going to get you much.


Let's look into the future for a projection.  Keeping gun scrypt, and assuming success in reaching the level where it hits the radar of the mining farms, and they bump the hashrate to several gigahash:

Will it be good for me personally?  I will be upset about losing my ability to mine it as I won't be able to compete.

The real question is, will an asic farm taking over mining of gun be good or bad for the coin?  I can see both sides.  If only 1 farm starts mining and dumping without the adoption in the gun community, it hurts coin value.  If the outside community has adopted gun, it doesn't hurt the coin at all, but it won't make the coin any more stable, it simply takes the profit of mining from the hobbyist to the farmer.


But, one thing that I'm thinking has been fending off larger asic adoption of gun so far, is the instability and lack of promise of gun coin.  The original DEV assumed that it would take off on it's own, but being released alongside a flood of other coins it really didn't stand out, and pretty much just floundered.  Now, it's has proven it has a following to support it, but currently there's no clear direction of the coin.  (coins like SYS have a dev team and a schedule to make certain achievements by, they also have 1,500 btc IPO backing to fund it)  Now, with gun, there's also the threat of farmers getting all their mining equipment setup for gun, only to have gun switch to neo-scrypt so they can no longer mine it.  That would be a pretty strong deterrent if I was a farm owner.

Yep, that has already been brought up to use - has its positives and negatives.

There is always POS (Proof of Stake), which essentially turns every wallet into a miner. Everyone with any GUN will want to keep their wallet online, (or the incentive to do so is there). This will make the PoW (Proof of Work) miners upset, since their hardware will either become useless, or have to be pointed at something else.

Anything lower than 5% (per year) isn't going to work though, but that's just an opinion.

OK, as promised two seed nodes have been replaced and should be fully operational now.  We used "seed.guncoin.info" and "seed2.guncoin.info" as the two new ones.  Again, you should need to change nothing in your config files as it is transparent to you.  Just letting you know about a network change.

Appreciate the input.  Sooner or later, it will have to change - Except for its niche market, there is nothing attractive about it for the crypto community in general.  I recognize that whatever path we go down, not everyone will be happy with - just not possible.  That is why we are interested in all the feedback we can get and looking at lots of options trying to keep focused on the big picture here and the long term - not just our wallet today.  Thanks again!

Two choices here:

1. Don't change the algo.

2. Change the algo.

If you do this, make sure it stands on it's own, and ... well I don't know enough, but my idea is to make it a CPU coin. Otherwise that gun shop owner isn't going to mine much if it requires a high end Nvidia or AMD chip on his laptop (which he can't easily upgrade.)

All good points and I appreciate the input.  I fully understand and am frustrated with all the anti-gun hype, BS, etc too. Fortunately I live somewhere where it is not a big deal and there is no threat to our freedoms at the state or local levels.  That being said, while the ASIC threat against GUN now is minimal, long-term if GUN grows to what we all hope it will, ASICs at that time, could be a real threat.  I have a room full of ASICs now mining GUN and others, so no one looses more than I do if we switch. And it is my BTC that gets spent to upgrade GUN.   All your points are excellent observations today, but maybe not 6 months from now.  So, when GUN is going for 1000 satoshi, has 10,000 Twitter followers, tables at gun shows, trading on all the major exchanges, even though we are all rich - ASICs then could take that away or at least make our life very difficult.  Of course, if our group continues to match their ASICs with our ASICs, we hold them off, right? Kind of......The little guy just coming in looses, unless he buys the big ASICs too, he cannot mine or compete.  Now I recognize, that we should be so lucky if all this comes to pass.  If I have my way, it will with all your help.  But when all is said and done, eliminating ASICs from the equation for a very long time and leveling the playing field with all current and future miners has a certain attraction and equitable ring to it.  I hate to say, even a Liberal tone to it although that is not the intent.  Like I said, if we can get the price up to a reasonable amount, telling a gun shop owner that he can let his laptop run over night and make a few GUN while he sleeps is a heck of a selling point - something you sure cannot do with paypal or BTC.

LOL, guess you could twist it that way - but not quite.  Search back to find my introductory post - that should give you all you need on me....The original developer sought me out to take over, not the other way around and he is a first class guy for all he did to get the coin this far and swore me to keep going - which I did.  Nuff sed on that....

FYI, have two replacement nodes going up this evening.  They are transparent to you since we just list them as seed2, seed3 etc.  We will probably fall back to just two seed nodes instead of the original 4 with everyone having wallets open - we should be fine.  We may not need any of them, but having 4 dead ones makes me a bit nervous.  Will let you know once they are switched over - sorry for hassle.  My node host just went belly up and left a lot o people hanging - it happens.....

Dabs,

My sentiment as well... my first response was... 'is GuncoinInfo actually an anti-gun supporter'... the rhetoric sounded so familiar and wearisome. Thus my reply...

24Kilo

This statement ... makes you sound like the anti-gunners. Don't put serial numbers and micro-stamp the brass, it won't work.

(I'm trying to be funny.)

One more thing...

Stop viewing ASIC's as threat... you are doing the same thing that the anti-gun and anti-2A crowd is doing... those people have guns... those people must be dangerous, so let's outlaw and remove them from society.

Just a few posts up in this thread is the discussion about recent rulings regarding the ATF, Hugh's Ammendment, and machine guns. As firearms owners, we are the 'ASIC's' that society fears and wants to remove, when in fact we are law-abiding citizens that would stand up for them and fight for their rights, not just the 2nd Ammendment, but the entire bill of rights. They look at us as the enemy, while we are actually their allies and friends.

ASIC's are not different... build a coin that ASIC miners want to mine... as more miners come onboard, the greater the strength of the network with the benefit of the natural response by miners to protect their coin. ASIC's are the machine guns of mining... so are we going to cow down to an assumed and hyped threat or embrace the strength of ASIC miners?

ASIC will never be the enemy of GUN... at the moment... no one is going over mine GUN because there is no value or market... as GUN gains value naturally and organically the network will get stronger and stronger... sure there are going to be hiccups along the way... NLG has had to negotiate with a multi-pool operator and is upgrading its diff algo, but in the end, NLG will have stronger network as result.

As firearms owners and protectors of the 2nd Ammendment, we are the target of hype, scare tactics, and manipulated media every day. I would think we would be able to see through the hype and misinformation surrounding ASIC's.

Create adoption and  circulation and GUN will become a currency with enough strength to stand on its own.

Briefly...

1. Liquidity is a result of adoption.

2. Adoption does not equal higher BTC price or increased attention by the crypto community.

3. Adoption can only happen if the needed tools are in place... web-site, tutorials, wallets, explorers, etc, etc...

4. The value of a currency is built by its circulation, not by speculation or accummulation...

5. Volatility is the enemy of a working currency...(read how the core NLG supporter are upset about the recent price rise and fall... it has actually done more harm than good to NLG as a currency)

5. Creating a currency is hard, tiresome, thankless work...

6. Too many folks in crypto equate high BTC value with being a successful coin when true success is when a coin becomes a currency.

One of the greatest hindrances to the success of GUN is its name. If I in fact wanted to purchase or sell firearms with a crypto currency, why would I attract attention myself by using a currency named GUN? That would be painting a bulls-eye on my forehead. I would choose to use a currency that is benign and unsuspecting.

The niche for GUN is as a novelty coin for forums and etc to use as rewards and points system. That is why I am referred to the CCN V-bulletin integration open source project. Also the BTM 'Marking Project' needs to be considered.

Regarding funding development... the dev team needs to publish a prioritized road map with the funding needed.

and...

7. How did I get dragged into this?

EDIT - to be honest... any real consideration of an algo change will result in losing my support for GUN... not a threat or blackmail... simple fact... changing algos is an unneeded expenditure of resources that need to be focused on adoption and promotion. There is no long-term proof that changing the mining algo of a coin has done anything but produced a brief pump, dump and then death of a coin. This forum is littered with a carcasses of re-algo'ed and refactored coins in a vain attempt to survive. The only thing that will ensure the survive of a coin is adoption.

It is good to see some of the original supporters reappear here.  We are happy to be here and happy for your support.  To address a few comments in different posts......

1) We are reviewing and considering several upgrades for the coin - we are convinced that it needs a serious upgrade to make it more noticeable to crypto users, pools, exchanges, etc. and also to protect against anti-gun folks who may eventually target us - although maybe not now.  With things changing so fast in crypto - staying stagnant is a killer I think.  While we have not officially chosen a direction, the creator of Neoscrypt has agreed to work Guncoin if that is the direction we want to go.  Our concern is the limited support system around this algorithm today - although the good news is that it is growing every day.  If we go this direction, it kills the two birds we just listed with one stone.  That being said, everything will NOT happen at once.  Too many changes could be a disaster.  An iterative approach that all can easily see and adapt to is the path we will most likely take.

2) In regards to Development funds, the original developer passed on some GUN to me, I have also been buying and mining it like crazy for two months.  That being said, any support or work I get done by outsiders costs me $$$ or BTC, not GUN. I am happy to create a separate BTC address dedicated to GUN Dev.  Websites, nodes, etc all cost $$$/BTC every month as well.  Likewise, if anyone has services they can provide, that will expedite the process or save money.  We do have a plan and we are moving on it - like I said before - time and money and we will get there.

3) While I agree that talking to a gun shop owner about GUN today is probably a waste of time, we still need to put that as the end-goal here and move that direction.  With that in mind, that is why I created the Users Guide and Classified Ad site for GUN users and have a few other things in work.  Anyone new to crypto will be drawn by these types of things rather than what Algo we use. 

There are a lot of moving parts to getting GUN moving again.  Now that we are moving, it is even more difficult to keep it moving and on the right track.  Good discussions here help give us new ideas, stimulate conversations among users and choose the direction to make GUN a long term success.  Thank you all for your support!

The DEV has a guncoin donation address on his posts, although seriously gun donations are pretty much useless besides a feel good measure.  He can only hold them or sell at a low market rate, at several thousand guncoin to a USD, that's not much.  Especially since programmers that take coin for payment want BTC.  Perhaps a BTC donation address addition is in order?

One of the original dev's sticking points was keeping the Scrypt/POW, and non-anonymizing it has, to offer the coin legitimacy by not appealing to people that would want to use it anonymously for nefarious purposes.  I understand the reasoning behind that, but, the coin didn't explode on it's name alone like the original dev expected it to, so at this point with all the other coins offering anonymity I don't really feel as that's much of a sticking point anymore. 

We do have to keep our noses clean to a certain extent though, as the simple name and wrath it can bring from a certain segment of the population, can still cause issues in coin success at this point.  A friend of mine regularly complains that he's one flat tire away from bankruptcy. That's similar to the situation we have here, very weak, and nothing buy a handful of users supporting it.  One good hiccup, and guncoin goes belly up. 

But, we've got a fairly dedicated group, and the group is slowly expanding.  At some point, a critical mass will be hit, that day I will be very happy as I've made this coin's success sort of a personal crusade.    I also stand to profit, but realistically don't expect to do much more than break even.

It's good to see the fresh conversation on GUN and the continued support so many have. I bought GUN while it was listed on Bittrex and I got it listed on Bleutrade because I did not want to see my investment die off. I think we are hitting on some important topics. Both liquidity and the exchanges are vital to the long term success of GUN.

I see miners or the rise of powerful asics as less important because those miners will only mine a coin of value and at current prices GUN is not worth mining. I understand there is some concern over nefarious forces out to stop GUN for political reasons and I have even seen some very strange bidding on the exchanges but I dont think Guncoin has made enough noise to be any sort of threat of interest to any organized group. Even 2A opponents have better things to worry themselves than a struggling altcoin.

I believe that Guncoin will need to first be accepted by the crypto marketplace before it gains any value and is of interest to anyone who does not already understand Bitcoin or crypto currencies. I think talking to gun shops and show vendors about Guncoin is a wasted opportunity to talk to them about Bitcoin and crypto currency in general. Having a small local gunshop acccept Guncoin when they have nowhere to convert it to cash easily is a deal killer for a majority of the industry. Margins in the gun business are abysmal and cash flow is inmportatnt to any gun dealer. A gun shop would be better served to accept Bitcoin at this point and there is little incentive or reason to take GUN other than the novelty of its name.

I think we should focus on making Guncoin more accepted and valuable to the crypto marketplace first and foremost so that when we do have the opportunity to speak with new potential vendors there is something there to talk to them about. If changes are going to be made to Guncoin it needs to be changes that the crypto marketplace would want to see. The type of changes that will boost the exchange price and volume, increase liquidity, attract new miners and new exchanges like Cryptsy which offer conversion to USD.

I think without broader support and recognition by the crypto markets it will be far more difficult to attract new vendors willing to accept Guncoin. Volume on all exchanges has been weak and we risk being delisted again which at this point in development could be a fatal blow.

So whats the solution? Well, Guncoin is looked at as an old style coin with Scrypt PoW. It's been suggested we convert to x13/Neoscrypt and I think that is an excellent idea because it is a more efficient algo. PoS or Proof of Stake is very popular as well and would certainly do something for the coins value. I think the biggest thing we could do was adopt some form of coin mixer or anonymity but that would require a dedicated development team which this coin lacks.

Is there a development fund so people can support the coins development?