Topic: [ANN] IPO of MaidSafe: Entering the Future of the Decentralized Internet - page 44. (Read 579765 times)
April 06, 2017, 02:47:50 PM
Thanks for the update why is the price crashing so hard??
April 06, 2017, 02:06:46 PM
Here's the link to the update:
https://safenetforum.org/t/maidsafe-dev-update-april-6-2017/13112
Here's the link to TEST 16 which got just released:
https://safenetforum.org/t/safe-network-test-16/13110
Enjoy!@!
April 06, 2017, 02:27:53 AM
If you want to call each transaction a block then sure 
Got that wrong. Still been thinking of some sort of hybrid. A DAG containing Blocks containing dozen of Transactions. If each transaction has it's own node you get more data like checksums, the amount of payload in comparison to overhead grows.
So there is one step further available to stuff more data into lesser bytes.
I think it's time for the Bitcoin descendants to start thinking outside the box and see that a block chain is not some kind of a technological steroid that will make everything better. Neither is Turing completeness btw
nor smart contracts, but I guess people will learn their lessons the hard way anyway. But this is a MAID circle jerking thread so I will do my contribution by stating that I see MAID as my personal liberator from the evil grasp of hosting providers and domain name servers and I look very much forward to see them getting somewhere already with this endless development and alpha phase. Damn MAID is like Duke Nukem Forever, but in the case of the latter it was well worth the waiting, best shooter ever. 
April 05, 2017, 07:44:28 PM
Byteball features blocks, they are just ordered in parallel on time axis. Each still referencing former block by hashsum. Like IOTA tangles. Or see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed_acyclic_graph for further reference.
Got that wrong. Still been thinking of some sort of hybrid. A DAG containing Blocks containing dozen of Transactions. If each transaction has it's own node you get more data like checksums, the amount of payload in comparison to overhead grows.
So there is one step further available to stuff more data into lesser bytes.
April 05, 2017, 05:00:08 AM
Quote
It is tough to understand maidsafe's ownership scheme to implement blockchainless network. Is this feature testing in alpha test so far? Quite innovative thing.
We've had Alpha 1. It worked, you could register a domain like safe://zeeman and upload your website etc. It was still running in a datacenter on several hundreds of nodes owned by Maidsafe. We're waiting for TEST 16 (don't ask me how they count in Troon
) which will become Alpha 2. And Alpha 2 is the official version of The SAFE network for which they create a nice installer and open it for downloads on their website. The big difference between Alpha 1 and Alpha 2 is that you can run a Vault from home. It stores chunks for the network and more. So it will become a real P2P network.
Alpha 3 is expected several weeks/months later. That will bring the real firework: imagine connecting to the network with a simple browser and use web-Apps for domains, websites, mail and more. It will also allow the transfer of ownership. In this march update they included a roadmap.
https://safenetforum.org/t/maidsafe-dev-update-march-9-2017/12774
So when Alpha 2 is live we'll see new testnets (they start with TEST 20 from that point) on which we might see the first alt_coins move over the network.
lot of great stuff coming. We're waiting for TEST 16 network right now. Here's the previous update from last week with more details:
https://safenetforum.org/t/maidsafe-dev-update-march-30-2017/13009
A new dev update tomorrow.
April 05, 2017, 03:58:56 AM
Thanks for all the talk about Byteball , I got their wallet to see what it's all about.
This is from the whitepaper. Looks like they don't have blocks in the form of some mined -every x minutes- thing. More like; someone makes transactions, others sign and build on top of that. Quite cool idea, I don't know the details, but looks more scalable then blockchains to me. Need to dive in a bit more to fully understand though.
Their principle is a bit different from SAFE. In SAFE all is based around ownership. So if you own address "quewrfdkjfhewkhjgfhjewgfkjhwgfkjhwe" it might a Safecoin, but it could also be a domain in the network. So sign it over to someone else involves several groups that sign the transfer.
But using "ownership" like above allows for other solutions as well. Here's a topic about "Decorum" which uses some sort of chain of transactions with digital signatures:
https://safenetforum.org/t/how-transactions-could-take-place-using-decorum/13061
Quote
Like in blockchains where each new block confirms all previous blocks (and
transactions therein), every new child unit in the DAG confirms its parents, all
parents of parents, parents of parents of parents, etc. If one tries to edit a unit, he
will also have to change its hash. Inevitably, this would break all child units who
reference this unit by its hash as both signatures and hashes of children depend on
parent hashes. Therefore, it is impossible to revise a unit without cooperating with
all its children or stealing their private keys. The children, in turn, cannot revise
their units without cooperating with their children (grandchildren of the original
unit), and so on. Once a unit is broadcast into the network, and other users start
building their units on top of it (referencing it as parent), the number of secondary
revision required to edit this unit hence grows like a snowball. That’s why we call
this design Byteball (our snowflakes are bytes of data).
transactions therein), every new child unit in the DAG confirms its parents, all
parents of parents, parents of parents of parents, etc. If one tries to edit a unit, he
will also have to change its hash. Inevitably, this would break all child units who
reference this unit by its hash as both signatures and hashes of children depend on
parent hashes. Therefore, it is impossible to revise a unit without cooperating with
all its children or stealing their private keys. The children, in turn, cannot revise
their units without cooperating with their children (grandchildren of the original
unit), and so on. Once a unit is broadcast into the network, and other users start
building their units on top of it (referencing it as parent), the number of secondary
revision required to edit this unit hence grows like a snowball. That’s why we call
this design Byteball (our snowflakes are bytes of data).
This is from the whitepaper. Looks like they don't have blocks in the form of some mined -every x minutes- thing. More like; someone makes transactions, others sign and build on top of that. Quite cool idea, I don't know the details, but looks more scalable then blockchains to me. Need to dive in a bit more to fully understand though.
Their principle is a bit different from SAFE. In SAFE all is based around ownership. So if you own address "quewrfdkjfhewkhjgfhjewgfkjhwgfkjhwe" it might a Safecoin, but it could also be a domain in the network. So sign it over to someone else involves several groups that sign the transfer.
But using "ownership" like above allows for other solutions as well. Here's a topic about "Decorum" which uses some sort of chain of transactions with digital signatures:
https://safenetforum.org/t/how-transactions-could-take-place-using-decorum/13061
It is tough to understand maidsafe's ownership scheme to implement blockchainless network. Is this feature testing in alpha test so far? Quite innovative thing.
April 05, 2017, 03:53:26 AM
This is from the whitepaper. Looks like they don't have blocks in the form of some mined -every x minutes- thing. More like; someone makes transactions, others sign and build on top of that. Quite cool idea, I don't know the details, but looks more scalable then blockchains to me. Need to dive in a bit more to fully understand though.
Yes, the ultra cool aspect of ByteBall is the fact that more TXs will actually make them confirm faster and also makes the network more secure, faster and more reliable. So basically it will scale indefinitely.
Their principle is a bit different from SAFE. In SAFE all is based around ownership. So if you own address "quewrfdkjfhewkhjgfhjewgfkjhwgfkjhwe" it might a Safecoin, but it could also be a domain in the network. So sign it over to someone else involves several groups that sign the transfer.
But using "ownership" like above allows for other solutions as well. Here's a topic about "Decorum" which uses some sort of chain of transactions with digital signatures:
https://safenetforum.org/t/how-transactions-could-take-place-using-decorum/13061
But using "ownership" like above allows for other solutions as well. Here's a topic about "Decorum" which uses some sort of chain of transactions with digital signatures:
https://safenetforum.org/t/how-transactions-could-take-place-using-decorum/13061
Thanks for pointing that out. I have always been curious how MAID plans to implement the blockchainless coin. But I've been too lazy to find it out myself
April 05, 2017, 03:21:45 AM
Thanks for all the talk about Byteball , I got their wallet to see what it's all about.
This is from the whitepaper. Looks like they don't have blocks in the form of some mined -every x minutes- thing. More like; someone makes transactions, others sign and build on top of that. Quite cool idea, I don't know the details, but looks more scalable then blockchains to me. Need to dive in a bit more to fully understand though.
Their principle is a bit different from SAFE. In SAFE all is based around ownership. So if you own address "quewrfdkjfhewkhjgfhjewgfkjhwgfkjhwe" it might a Safecoin, but it could also be a domain in the network. So sign it over to someone else involves several groups that sign the transfer.
But using "ownership" like above allows for other solutions as well. Here's a topic about "Decorum" which uses some sort of chain of transactions with digital signatures:
https://safenetforum.org/t/how-transactions-could-take-place-using-decorum/13061
Quote
Like in blockchains where each new block confirms all previous blocks (and
transactions therein), every new child unit in the DAG confirms its parents, all
parents of parents, parents of parents of parents, etc. If one tries to edit a unit, he
will also have to change its hash. Inevitably, this would break all child units who
reference this unit by its hash as both signatures and hashes of children depend on
parent hashes. Therefore, it is impossible to revise a unit without cooperating with
all its children or stealing their private keys. The children, in turn, cannot revise
their units without cooperating with their children (grandchildren of the original
unit), and so on. Once a unit is broadcast into the network, and other users start
building their units on top of it (referencing it as parent), the number of secondary
revision required to edit this unit hence grows like a snowball. That’s why we call
this design Byteball (our snowflakes are bytes of data).
transactions therein), every new child unit in the DAG confirms its parents, all
parents of parents, parents of parents of parents, etc. If one tries to edit a unit, he
will also have to change its hash. Inevitably, this would break all child units who
reference this unit by its hash as both signatures and hashes of children depend on
parent hashes. Therefore, it is impossible to revise a unit without cooperating with
all its children or stealing their private keys. The children, in turn, cannot revise
their units without cooperating with their children (grandchildren of the original
unit), and so on. Once a unit is broadcast into the network, and other users start
building their units on top of it (referencing it as parent), the number of secondary
revision required to edit this unit hence grows like a snowball. That’s why we call
this design Byteball (our snowflakes are bytes of data).
This is from the whitepaper. Looks like they don't have blocks in the form of some mined -every x minutes- thing. More like; someone makes transactions, others sign and build on top of that. Quite cool idea, I don't know the details, but looks more scalable then blockchains to me. Need to dive in a bit more to fully understand though.
Their principle is a bit different from SAFE. In SAFE all is based around ownership. So if you own address "quewrfdkjfhewkhjgfhjewgfkjhwgfkjhwe" it might a Safecoin, but it could also be a domain in the network. So sign it over to someone else involves several groups that sign the transfer.
But using "ownership" like above allows for other solutions as well. Here's a topic about "Decorum" which uses some sort of chain of transactions with digital signatures:
https://safenetforum.org/t/how-transactions-could-take-place-using-decorum/13061
April 05, 2017, 02:16:36 AM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless LIVE cryptocurrency.
LMFAO - did you just compare Maid to Byteball?!
ROFLMAO - just the aspect of having no block chain!!
IMO maidsafe is the first one, they created the prototype of no blockchain crypto coin, but byteball is the first to complete that idea, the result is 1 to 1.
that's exactly what I was saying. idea isn't worth shit until it is implemented. Byteball is the first live and working implementation of a blockchainless cryptocurrency
Wow, I didn't know Maidsafe was striving to be a blockchainless cryptocurrency. Hopefully someone let's them know Byteballs has beat them to it so that they can stop now.
Byteball features blocks, they are just ordered in parallel on time axis. Each still referencing former block by hashsum. Like IOTA tangles. Or see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed_acyclic_graph for further reference.
If you want to call each transaction a block then sure
April 05, 2017, 02:13:40 AM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless LIVE cryptocurrency.
LMFAO - did you just compare Maid to Byteball?!
ROFLMAO - just the aspect of having no block chain!!
IMO maidsafe is the first one, they created the prototype of no blockchain crypto coin, but byteball is the first to complete that idea, the result is 1 to 1.
that's exactly what I was saying. idea isn't worth shit until it is implemented. Byteball is the first live and working implementation of a blockchainless cryptocurrency
Wow, I didn't know Maidsafe was striving to be a blockchainless cryptocurrency. Hopefully someone let's them know Byteballs has beat them to it so that they can stop now.
Byteball features blocks, they are just ordered in parallel on time axis. Each still referencing former block by hashsum. Like IOTA tangles. Or see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed_acyclic_graph for further reference.
April 05, 2017, 01:56:24 AM
Why is maid dropping?
Because someone placing buy wall and selling his coins. When wall gone price will drop.
April 05, 2017, 12:23:23 AM
Why is maid dropping?
April 04, 2017, 06:18:20 PM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless LIVE cryptocurrency.
LMFAO - did you just compare Maid to Byteball?!
ROFLMAO - just the aspect of having no block chain!!
IMO maidsafe is the first one, they created the prototype of no blockchain crypto coin, but byteball is the first to complete that idea, the result is 1 to 1.
that's exactly what I was saying. idea isn't worth shit until it is implemented. Byteball is the first live and working implementation of a blockchainless cryptocurrency
Wow, I didn't know Maidsafe was striving to be a blockchainless cryptocurrency. Hopefully someone let's them know Byteballs has beat them to it so that they can stop now.
April 04, 2017, 02:20:37 PM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless LIVE cryptocurrency.
LMFAO - did you just compare Maid to Byteball?!
ROFLMAO - just the aspect of having no block chain!!
IMO maidsafe is the first one, they created the prototype of no blockchain crypto coin, but byteball is the first to complete that idea, the result is 1 to 1.
that's exactly what I was saying. idea isn't worth shit until it is implemented. Byteball is the first live and working implementation of a blockchainless cryptocurrency
April 04, 2017, 10:50:03 AM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless live cryptocurrency.
LMFAO - did you just compare Maid to Byteball?!
ROFLMAO - just the aspect of having no block chain!!
IMO maidsafe is the first one, they created the prototype of no blockchain crypto coin, but byteball is the first to complete that idea, the result is 1 to 1.
If I understand correctly, it is preparing something new, more advanced than blockchaina?
April 04, 2017, 09:21:15 AM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless live cryptocurrency.
LMFAO - did you just compare Maid to Byteball?!
ROFLMAO - just the aspect of having no block chain!!
IMO maidsafe is the first one, they created the prototype of no blockchain crypto coin, but byteball is the first to complete that idea, the result is 1 to 1.
April 04, 2017, 09:16:08 AM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless live cryptocurrency.
LMFAO - did you just compare Maid to Byteball?!
ROFLMAO - just the aspect of having no block chain!!
April 04, 2017, 07:36:46 AM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless live cryptocurrency.
LMFAO - did you just compare Maid to Byteball?!
April 04, 2017, 01:49:32 AM
SAFE will have no blockchain, revolutionary technology. MAID is temporarily on bitcoin chain.
A bit late there, not so revolutionary any more. ByteBall is the first blockchainless live cryptocurrency.
March 30, 2017, 03:06:13 PM
https://safenetforum.org/t/maidsafe-dev-update-march-30-2017/13009
Nice solution against the "account spammer" that abused the fact that Safecoin isn't implemented yet. I'm glad this was done with TEST 15. Now Alpha 2 will be more secure from a simple attack like that.
For those interested:
TEST 15 network is quite small (around 140 Vaults in total) as you need 600 KB./sec upload (which a lot of people don't have) to join as a Vault at the moment. Each chunk is stored 8 times. So when you upload 500 mb. to your account it's 4 GB. in total. Not really a problem though, but someone made a lot of accounts (several thousand) and filled them all up with data. The attacker couldn't crash the network though, it only got "full" and stayed online.
When Safecoin is implemented you need to pay a little for an account and you also need to pay to PUT (upload) data to the network. This attracts "Farmers" (people running Vaults) to the network as they can make money. So with Safecoin implemented a simple attack like this would be very close to impossible.
Enjoy@!@
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