Topic: [ANN][KARM] Karma / ₭ / X11 - page 192. (Read 583120 times)

I moved a large portion of my Karm from Mintpal to my qt-wallet a week ago. So if I hold them over 30 days, am I considered to have Karmashare? Do I have to move the rest of Karm from Mintpal? Asking your opinions. Thanks

screenshots.

Long story short this a LTC  market now right?

I've addressed that issue here: http://karmashares.com/forums/index.php/topic,559.msg3449.html#msg3449

To summarize: "These are challenges for the industry and Karma investor relations efforts rather than strictly technical challenges relating to how we are doing it."

I'm not forgetting at all, you're misunderstanding how karmashares are issued. please see my more detailed response.

OK there is no 100% fool proof method for determining which wallets are exchange wallets and which are personal.. but just by looking at the addresses it should be pretty easy to determine which ones are likely to be owned by exchanges.. just by the size and sheer number of transactional volume they generate.

the thing about exchanges is that their wallets are always in flux so the coins are unlikely to stay in one address for more than 30 days unless they are moved into cold storage.

the other thing to consider is that in order to claim your karmashares you have to actually send a signed message from your wallet.
this means that someone in the exchange would have to sign with the cold wallet + their email address to claim the karmashares.
access to cold wallets (even for employees) is something that most exchanges do not allow for obvious reasons.

also if anyone was discovered cheating then their karmashares could easily be voided.

so you are right when you say there is no way to guarantee that an exchange isn't cheating and claiming Karmashares, but given the circumstances I would say that it is highly unlikely that they would or could do it easily and even if they did, it would be quite easy to spot and remove them from the list of karmashares holders. (because the Karmashares list is controlled by Karmashares LLC)


as far as an exchange getting a payout using someone else's money is concerned.
technically this is not possible because when you send your money to an exchange it is not your money anymore so you don't have any rights to claim karmashares with it anyway.

I think this is the key point about Exchanges and Crypto currency that most people do not understand... if you don't control the private Key.. the money is not yours.

All the coins you think you own on an exchange are just IOUs and you hope (and sometimes pray) that when you want to withdraw those coins the exchange will actually honor those IOUs and give you coins in return. Most people do not realize that.
Just like in a casino, those plastic exchange tokens aren't worth anything until the exchange gives you real coins when you request a withdraw.

Perfecf, time to transfer your LTC and buy as much as you can:)

Yup, but you still do not get what I am talking about.  Anyone who hold KARM for 30 days is eligable for payout. What I am telling is, exchanges have probably 30-50% of all KARM coins in their wallets. There is no way how to distingvish between my personal wallet and the wallet owned by exchanges. So exchanges can have for example 1000 cold wallets and in every wallet 30 million KARM. And they can ask for payout, since they are holding coins of other people on their wallets. There is no way how to find out which wallets are owned by exchanges and which are owned by people. So this means, the idea was to pay KARM belivers and KARM holders. But the fact is, biggest KARM holders are exchanges, they hold people's coins. They will ask for payout thanks to the coins they do not own, but they hold them. Do you understand what I am talking about? They will get payout using others people KARM.

looks like karm will go back under 100litoshi again

You're forgetting that exchanges have wallets with millions(billions?) of coins...

I think you are confusing two issues.

what you describe is how Karmashares works.

if you hold Karma (the coin) in your wallet for more than 30 days then you can get some free Karmashares.
this does not apply to exchanges, the coins have to be held in your wallet on your computer with an address that you control, and not on any exchange.

now if you do that and get collect your Karmashares then you are entitled to any profits that Karmashares LLC distributes to their shareholders.

this is the profit sharing arrangement for Karmashares.

this does not mean that if LIL.Com is sold all of the money goes to Karmashares and then to Karma holders. it is just describing how profits are distributed if there is a "dividend" issued by Karmashares LLC.

first the Karmashares investors have to decide on whether to sell LIL.com or not.
then after it is sold they can decide how to spend the money. e.g. return some to investors, give some to charity, use some for development, use some for advertising, use some for bounties, set up a fund .. etc etc etc.

but the point I was making is that even if you don't own any Karmashares and you just own some Karma.. you will get some kind of benefit if this sale (or any future sale) goes ahead.

Yea that what you are talking about would be cool and right, but it is simply not true currently. There is official info on karmashares web, where is written any KARM coin holder will get payout if he does not move his KARM coins for more than 30 days from his wallet during payout period. Conditions are more than 5 million not moving, 1000KARM = 1 Share.  So if KARM holder exchange for shares he get 1,75 share per 1000 KARM, if he just hold, he get payout equivalent to 1share per 1000 coins. Coin holder does not have any rights, he can just get payout. Check the official site, that info is public since KarmaShares were created.

lil beongs to karmashares and so all profits should go to karmashares holders.

this does not mean that Karma will not benefit from this.

Karmashares holders are also karma holders and big suppoters of the currency.
also a lot of money from the lil sale would likely be funnelled back into Karma development projects.

so even if you own Karma but don't own any Karmashares you will still benefit if the sale goes through.

it makes no sense at all for any of that money to go to Karma holders directly.. If Karmashares LLC wanted to help Karma holders directly it would be much easier and wiser for them to simply buy Karma on the open market, thus pushing the price up to benefit everyone. and then they would have even more Karma to use for development projects, so its win win all round.

so I really don't understand what you mean about Karma coin payouts going to Exchanges.

EDIT:... I'm still not entirely sure what you mean but I think I am agreeing with you on some points lol.

Btw, noone is responding to a big problem I opened on Karmashares forum, so I will open it here. Karm coin payouts in case of lill.com search will be very low, because Cryptsy and Mintpal own probably 30-50% of all KARM.  Those 2 exchanges will take all the KARM coin payout money. There was opened discussion about disabling KARM payouts and keep only KarmaShares payout. This should help KARM coin holders to increase revenue by exhanging them for shares. Current model is wrong and those who did not exchange coin and hope for big profits will be disapointed. There is no way ho to prevent sharing profit with crypty and mintpal except forcing people to exchange for shares and pay only shareholders.

10 days until end of August left. Than anouncement about if lill was sold or not will be published. Funny is, that on the same day block reward will be reduced from 35000 to 20000. There will be either flash crash and rebound in few days or very fast pump.

except that very few people are willing to sell for 1 satoshi so you will be waiting days or even weeks to get your order filled.

not to mention why dump when there are only about 8 days left to decide whether to take the 2.5 million dollars.

Right now 1 satoshi = 92 litoshi. Buying for 1 satoshi is cheaper than buying for 110-115 litoshi, which is current price. 2 days ago it was better to buy for 120 litoshi, since LTC was much cheaper than it is now.

Is it cheaper to buy with LTC or BTC? BTC is at 1 satoshi. Should I convert my BTC to LTC then buy Karma?

I want to buy more Karma now.
But I'm not sure if its better to wait for the next big dumper to make Karma even cheaper, and then I can buy more for the same LTC/BTC