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Topic: [Archive] BFL trolling museum - page 109. (Read 69394 times)

hero member
Activity: 1652
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June 26, 2012, 01:57:16 PM
Besides the fact that a higher difficulty will make a 51% attack that much harder, yeah. No really.

A 51% attack happens when blocks are being found way faster than the difficulty allows. Raise the difficulty, and bang - 51% is out of commission, at least until he can get his speed up again.

Huh? A 51% attack could also be called a 51% takeover, and happens when 1 person owns 51% of the hashing power, and takes control of the entire network (rewrites the blockchain). The larger the network is, the harder for 1 person to own 51%. It's a LOT harder to gain 51% of a 200TH/s network than it is a 2TH/s network, for example. A larger network is inherently more resilient to a 51% takeover, you see?

A larger difficulty is just a side effect of that larger network. The difficulty of that 200TH/s network will be 100x that of the 2TH/s network, right? The difficulty itself doesn't actually protect against an attack (or takeover), but the factors that caused the difficulty to raise are what protect us.
Exactly, that's what I was saying.
no, its not what you were saying. what i said is completely true. difficulty has nothing to do with the 51% takeover. raising or lowering the difficulty would have 0 effect on the 51% takeover. bottom line is that you need 51% of the network's total hashing power.
hero member
Activity: 504
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Scattering my bits around the net since 1980
June 26, 2012, 01:47:06 PM
Question: Will the ASIC still work once all coins have been generated ?
Depends on how well they built it. It would probably die before that happens tho.

But, if you mean generally? Yeah, no reason why an asic wouldn't work after the rewards end.

Rewards aren't the purpose of mining, processing transactions is... Rewards are just a reward.

-- Smoov
rjk
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Activity: 448
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1ngldh
June 26, 2012, 11:05:21 AM
Besides the fact that a higher difficulty will make a 51% attack that much harder, yeah. No really.

A 51% attack happens when blocks are being found way faster than the difficulty allows. Raise the difficulty, and bang - 51% is out of commission, at least until he can get his speed up again.

Huh? A 51% attack could also be called a 51% takeover, and happens when 1 person owns 51% of the hashing power, and takes control of the entire network (rewrites the blockchain). The larger the network is, the harder for 1 person to own 51%. It's a LOT harder to gain 51% of a 200TH/s network than it is a 2TH/s network, for example. A larger network is inherently more resilient to a 51% takeover, you see?

A larger difficulty is just a side effect of that larger network. The difficulty of that 200TH/s network will be 100x that of the 2TH/s network, right? The difficulty itself doesn't actually protect against an attack (or takeover), but the factors that caused the difficulty to raise are what protect us.
Exactly, that's what I was saying.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
June 26, 2012, 10:56:47 AM
Besides the fact that a higher difficulty will make a 51% attack that much harder, yeah. No really.

A 51% attack happens when blocks are being found way faster than the difficulty allows. Raise the difficulty, and bang - 51% is out of commission, at least until he can get his speed up again.

Huh? A 51% attack could also be called a 51% takeover, and happens when 1 person owns 51% of the hashing power, and takes control of the entire network (rewrites the blockchain). The larger the network is, the harder for 1 person to own 51%. It's a LOT harder to gain 51% of a 200TH/s network than it is a 2TH/s network, for example. A larger network is inherently more resilient to a 51% takeover, you see?

A larger difficulty is just a side effect of that larger network. The difficulty of that 200TH/s network will be 100x that of the 2TH/s network, right? The difficulty itself doesn't actually protect against an attack (or takeover), but the factors that caused the difficulty to raise are what protect us.
sr. member
Activity: 344
Merit: 250
June 26, 2012, 10:37:02 AM
Just because somebody has a lot of hashing power and could get 51% doesn't necessarily mean they'd do an attack, either.  It's just a threat because they'd be able to if they wanted to.
rjk
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
1ngldh
June 26, 2012, 10:26:27 AM
From what I understand, the difficulty adjusts based on network speed, and the whole point of difficulty is to stop a single node from having too much power over the network ?

Question: Will the ASIC still work once all coins have been generated ?

the whole point of difficulty is to make sure the time it takes to find a block is consistent. it has nothing to do with the 51% attack.
Besides the fact that a higher difficulty will make a 51% attack that much harder, yeah. No really.

A 51% attack happens when blocks are being found way faster than the difficulty allows. Raise the difficulty, and bang - 51% is out of commission, at least until he can get his speed up again.
legendary
Activity: 1400
Merit: 1005
June 26, 2012, 10:23:48 AM
It "should" be easier

That's the problem with BFL. Yes it should be easier, but they don't respond to emails for days/weeks. This causes me to be placed at the end of the ASIC waiting list, even though I placed the order 2 hours after pre-orders went live. It has gotten to the point where I might just cancel my ~$5k worth of orders from BFL. Their customer service is absolute shit.

Your $5k is an insignificant drop in the ocean for them, there are people investing $100k each, and BFL spent atleast $1.5mil designing the ASIC, just because $5k is big for you doesn't mean it is big for them.
Like I said, if it's not about the money. Why don't they just hire somebody that could help them with the customer support?
I just find this all very shady.
They are trying to...
http://www.butterflylabs.com/jobs/
hero member
Activity: 1652
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Catalog Websites
June 26, 2012, 10:23:30 AM
From what I understand, the difficulty adjusts based on network speed, and the whole point of difficulty is to stop a single node from having too much power over the network ?

Question: Will the ASIC still work once all coins have been generated ?

the whole point of difficulty is to make sure the time it takes to find a block is consistent. it has nothing to do with the 51% attack.
hero member
Activity: 481
Merit: 500
June 26, 2012, 06:31:54 AM
It "should" be easier

That's the problem with BFL. Yes it should be easier, but they don't respond to emails for days/weeks. This causes me to be placed at the end of the ASIC waiting list, even though I placed the order 2 hours after pre-orders went live. It has gotten to the point where I might just cancel my ~$5k worth of orders from BFL. Their customer service is absolute shit.

Your $5k is an insignificant drop in the ocean for them, there are people investing $100k each, and BFL spent atleast $1.5mil designing the ASIC, just because $5k is big for you doesn't mean it is big for them.
Like I said, if it's not about the money. Why don't they just hire somebody that could help them with the customer support?
I just find this all very shady.

They did hire somebody, but it seems like the customer service hasn't noticeably improved since the days when Sonny answered the emails.
hero member
Activity: 530
Merit: 500
June 26, 2012, 06:11:41 AM
It "should" be easier

That's the problem with BFL. Yes it should be easier, but they don't respond to emails for days/weeks. This causes me to be placed at the end of the ASIC waiting list, even though I placed the order 2 hours after pre-orders went live. It has gotten to the point where I might just cancel my ~$5k worth of orders from BFL. Their customer service is absolute shit.

Your $5k is an insignificant drop in the ocean for them, there are people investing $100k each, and BFL spent atleast $1.5mil designing the ASIC, just because $5k is big for you doesn't mean it is big for them.
Like I said, if it's not about the money. Why don't they just hire somebody that could help them with the customer support?
I just find this all very shady.
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
June 26, 2012, 05:52:17 AM
It "should" be easier

That's the problem with BFL. Yes it should be easier, but they don't respond to emails for days/weeks. This causes me to be placed at the end of the ASIC waiting list, even though I placed the order 2 hours after pre-orders went live. It has gotten to the point where I might just cancel my ~$5k worth of orders from BFL. Their customer service is absolute shit.

Your $5k is an insignificant drop in the ocean for them, there are people investing $100k each, and BFL spent atleast $1.5mil designing the ASIC, just because $5k is big for you doesn't mean it is big for them.
member
Activity: 62
Merit: 10
...
June 26, 2012, 01:09:37 AM
BFL, can you tell us who your foundry is?  It would boost confidence in your product considerable- and spur more order  Wink

Thanks-
legendary
Activity: 1834
Merit: 1020
June 25, 2012, 07:09:31 PM
It "should" be easier

That's the problem with BFL. Yes it should be easier, but they don't respond to emails for days/weeks. This causes me to be placed at the end of the ASIC waiting list, even though I placed the order 2 hours after pre-orders went live. It has gotten to the point where I might just cancel my ~$5k worth of orders from BFL. Their customer service is absolute shit.

Ever call them?

816-226-6966 if you're in the states.
hero member
Activity: 626
Merit: 500
Mining since May 2011.
June 25, 2012, 10:29:22 AM
It "should" be easier

That's the problem with BFL. Yes it should be easier, but they don't respond to emails for days/weeks. This causes me to be placed at the end of the ASIC waiting list, even though I placed the order 2 hours after pre-orders went live. It has gotten to the point where I might just cancel my ~$5k worth of orders from BFL. Their customer service is absolute shit.

Yes, hence the use of quotes.  Sad 100% agree, their Customer Service is abysmal.

That being said, if you placed your new order, and you have credit, I don't see why you would be put at the end of the list. They already have your money, it should be faster payment then any other option. (BTC or Wire) It's just a matter of having them process it on their accounting side. Hence the suggestion to place the order, then when they do communicate with you, start the dialog. They will at some point be contacting you to place the wire, at that point provide the prior order info and see what works.
hero member
Activity: 576
Merit: 500
June 25, 2012, 10:11:09 AM
It "should" be easier

That's the problem with BFL. Yes it should be easier, but they don't respond to emails for days/weeks. This causes me to be placed at the end of the ASIC waiting list, even though I placed the order 2 hours after pre-orders went live. It has gotten to the point where I might just cancel my ~$5k worth of orders from BFL. Their customer service is absolute shit.
hero member
Activity: 626
Merit: 500
Mining since May 2011.
June 25, 2012, 10:05:03 AM
Place in the queue is determined by date/time of money received, not of order placed, so before they accept to apply any credit, you will still be at the end of the queue....  Sad

Where do you see that? I think the order number is issued at the time of the order not at the receipt of the money. I would only assume that they would use that number as the order of the list.

He's right:
http://www.butterflylabs.com/order-form-bitforce-sc-jalapeno/
http://www.butterflylabs.com/order-form-bitforce-sc-single/
http://www.butterflylabs.com/order-form-bitforce-sc-mini-rig/
Quote
Please be aware that your order date is set at the time payment is received, so we recommend Bit-Pay due to it’s faster processing time as compared to bank wire transfer.

I guess my point was, they already have his money. It "should" be easier to process an order when he has credit from the order he wants to convert vs. them having to handle their end of another wire transfer.
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1002
June 25, 2012, 09:49:50 AM
Place in the queue is determined by date/time of money received, not of order placed, so before they accept to apply any credit, you will still be at the end of the queue....  Sad

Where do you see that? I think the order number is issued at the time of the order not at the receipt of the money. I would only assume that they would use that number as the order of the list.

He's right:
http://www.butterflylabs.com/order-form-bitforce-sc-jalapeno/
http://www.butterflylabs.com/order-form-bitforce-sc-single/
http://www.butterflylabs.com/order-form-bitforce-sc-mini-rig/
Quote
Please be aware that your order date is set at the time payment is received, so we recommend Bit-Pay due to it’s faster processing time as compared to bank wire transfer.
sr. member
Activity: 295
Merit: 250
June 25, 2012, 09:39:21 AM
Place in the queue is determined by date/time of money received, not of order placed, so before they accept to apply any credit, you will still be at the end of the queue....  Sad

Where do you see that? I think the order number is issued at the time of the order not at the receipt of the money. I would only assume that they would use that number as the order of the list.
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
June 25, 2012, 08:30:45 AM
Just as i thought...
Many people waiting and they annouced new product whick makes old seem like junk.
Thanks for link.
Standard operating procedure for any new/next-generation product that has ever came out.

Nothing to see here, move along...

-- Smoov

What? To have never delivered a single one on time before making them worthless?
(or requiring you give them twice as much money so they aren't worthless)

not to mention having money tied up so we cannot order ASICs. I placed an order for 2 singles 7 weeks ago (still not received). I placed an email to BFL asking if I could upgrade to the ASIC waiting list + the ~$100 difference for the SC. Well guess what? That email has not yet been responded to and now I am in the back of the F'ing line again with the ASICs. This is not even close to cool. They should have waited at least another month for pre-orders so they could ship out most/all of their singles and mini-rigs still waiting. ~75 day waiting list to get a single when they are now obsolete? .....

If you have money tied up with BFL on something they have yet to deliver, I'd place your new order, select bank transfer. When they come looking for payment, ask them to apply the credit and close out the first order. (Provide your original order number, etc.)
I have no clue if it will work, but it's worth a shot.


Place in the queue is determined by date/time of money received, not of order placed, so before they accept to apply any credit, you will still be at the end of the queue....  Sad
hero member
Activity: 530
Merit: 500
June 25, 2012, 08:28:22 AM
Well guess what? That email has not yet been responded to

Yeah BFL, start answering your emails more frequently.
It's very annoying when you have alot of money invested into this and get treated like shit and have to wait several months for a simple answer.
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