ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It - page 190.

empoweoqwj

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: hdbuck on September 18, 2014, 08:55:04 AM

I think the situation of bitcoin, AM et al should unfold soon now. It is not sustainable for investors nor for the miners. And Im not going to panic.

You mean you aren't going to sell?

Neither am I, but only because my shares are worth peanuts compare with what I paid for them. They just aren't worth selling at current levels.

hdbuck

legendary

Activity: 1260

Merit: 1002

I think the situation of bitcoin, AM et al should unfold soon now. It is not sustainable for investors nor for the miners. And Im not going to panic.

empoweoqwj

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: ensurance982 on September 18, 2014, 08:00:32 AM

Quote from: empoweoqwj on September 18, 2014, 06:18:57 AM

Quote from: ensurance982 on September 18, 2014, 06:09:03 AM

Quote from: ninjarobot on September 17, 2014, 05:55:10 PM

In the current mining climate (declining BTC value, exponentially increasing difficulty, fierce competition) it is hard enough for an ASIC manufacturer to survive, let alone thrive.

I would not expect anything in terms of dividends. Gen2 was vaporware and Gen3 a bit of a dud due to a design mistake that significantly increased power consumption. I think the best we can hope for is for friedcat to roll over any earnings from Gen3 to accelerate and perfect development of Gen4. Shareholders looking for short term gains will be disappointed. In the long run, I think AM is still well positioned to come out on top and worth the risk of holding shares.

I also believe that this is the way to go! The Bitcoin price is just too low at the moment, even ROCKMINER decided to postpone their 2 PH/s mining operation.... AM just doesn't seem to have enough of a margin to spend the income as dividends. I think the best thing to do would be to order massive amounts of gen 4 chips ASAP.

That was exactly their policy with gen 3. How did that work out?

Bottom line, if they aren't paying dividends, share price will slide and slide. There is no way AM can wipe out the competition because of "lowest cost". Business ain't that simple.

Yeah, but gen 3 had two or three big problems: About half as efficient as planned, at least two months to late, focus on selling the chip when the mining market got much too saturated (in combination with higher power consumption of BE200) and wasting 2-3 months on selling the chip before self-mining. In addition we saw a steep decline of the BTC price, which AM couldn't have prevented.
That being said, if things worked out better, we'd have had a gen 3 chip almost twice as efficient, self-mining in March/April, and potentially a better price. I do see where at least half of those things wouldn't necessarily be a problem with gen 4!

Again, relying on hope ..... AM didn't predict these problems with Gen3 did they? They told us how amazingly power efficient the chips would be. Why do you believe, and that's believe, and not hope, Gen4 will be any different. Not even talking about Gen2 that disappeared without even being made without an explanation.

You know the bitcoin price could easily decline from where it is now right? You don't have to believe all the bitcoiners that we are going to $3000 soon.

Its a quintessential human quality, hope. People make a lot of money off it

All I'm saying is for every optimistic circumstance there is the opposite. I should know. I paid 4 BTC for AM shares a year or so ago .....

xhomerx10

legendary

Activity: 3808

Merit: 7912

Quote from: hdbuck on September 18, 2014, 08:32:35 AM

bitcoin down, AM up Grin

It seems like AM tracks to the US dollar (and also to dividends).

jiefangqian

full member

Activity: 229

Merit: 100

up
to the moon

hdbuck

legendary

Activity: 1260

Merit: 1002

bitcoin down, AM up Grin

RoadStress

legendary

Activity: 1904

Merit: 1007

Quote from: ThunderSheep on September 17, 2014, 03:26:57 PM

@RoadStress
While I value your contrarian opinion as much as Vycid's (he saved me a lot of money) it would be downright obvious if dividends had been paid as posters would be whooping with delight or raging at Friedcat. Your last post was nothing more than a troll. Please refrain from poking others solely to get a reaction.

I know, but I was called a troll even when I raised legitimate questions about AM sales and self-mining so no matter what I say I will still be called a troll(or a shill) here. I am more than ready to discuss what AM did with their 60PH/s worth of chips, but I'm assuming that you are afraid to face the truth. I am ready to break down the numbers anytime.

Let me help you in starting it: How big do you think AM self-mining is/plan to be? How many Ph/s do you think AM sold from the original 60Ph/s?

Quote from: dmcdad on September 17, 2014, 03:36:30 PM

No dividends yet RS. BTW, how is the ROI coming on those SP30s?

Superb!

xhomerx10

legendary

Activity: 3808

Merit: 7912

Quote from: ensurance982 on September 18, 2014, 08:00:32 AM

Quote from: empoweoqwj on September 18, 2014, 06:18:57 AM

Quote from: ensurance982 on September 18, 2014, 06:09:03 AM

Quote from: ninjarobot on September 17, 2014, 05:55:10 PM

In the current mining climate (declining BTC value, exponentially increasing difficulty, fierce competition) it is hard enough for an ASIC manufacturer to survive, let alone thrive.

I would not expect anything in terms of dividends. Gen2 was vaporware and Gen3 a bit of a dud due to a design mistake that significantly increased power consumption. I think the best we can hope for is for friedcat to roll over any earnings from Gen3 to accelerate and perfect development of Gen4. Shareholders looking for short term gains will be disappointed. In the long run, I think AM is still well positioned to come out on top and worth the risk of holding shares.

I also believe that this is the way to go! The Bitcoin price is just too low at the moment, even ROCKMINER decided to postpone their 2 PH/s mining operation.... AM just doesn't seem to have enough of a margin to spend the income as dividends. I think the best thing to do would be to order massive amounts of gen 4 chips ASAP.

That was exactly their policy with gen 3. How did that work out?

Bottom line, if they aren't paying dividends, share price will slide and slide. There is no way AM can wipe out the competition because of "lowest cost". Business ain't that simple.

Yeah, but gen 3 had two or three big problems: About half as efficient as planned, at least two months to late, focus on selling the chip when the mining market got much too saturated (in combination with higher power consumption of BE200) and wasting 2-3 months on selling the chip before self-mining. In addition we saw a steep decline of the BTC price, which AM couldn't have prevented.
That being said, if things worked out better, we'd have had a gen 3 chip almost twice as efficient, self-mining in March/April, and potentially a better price. I do see where at least half of those things wouldn't necessarily be a problem with gen 4!

I think you've hit the nail on the head! Good analysis Wink

xhomerx10

legendary

Activity: 3808

Merit: 7912

Quote from: ensurance982 on September 18, 2014, 06:09:03 AM

Quote from: ninjarobot on September 17, 2014, 05:55:10 PM

In the current mining climate (declining BTC value, exponentially increasing difficulty, fierce competition) it is hard enough for an ASIC manufacturer to survive, let alone thrive.

I would not expect anything in terms of dividends. Gen2 was vaporware and Gen3 a bit of a dud due to a design mistake that significantly increased power consumption. I think the best we can hope for is for friedcat to roll over any earnings from Gen3 to accelerate and perfect development of Gen4. Shareholders looking for short term gains will be disappointed. In the long run, I think AM is still well positioned to come out on top and worth the risk of holding shares.

I also believe that this is the way to go! The Bitcoin price is just too low at the moment, even ROCKMINER decided to postpone their 2 PH/s mining operation.... AM just doesn't seem to have enough of a margin to spend the income as dividends. I think the best thing to do would be to order massive amounts of gen 4 chips ASAP.

Rockminer postponed their 2 PH/s mining operation because there wasn't enough margin left to pay friedcat and electricity costs let alone make a profit. AM had the idea -

"We will rent the excessive hashing power to financial and technical capable people, accepting full deposits at the market price, shipping the devices and collecting a certain PPS rate based on the theoretical hashrate."

of course, AM was a little late for that game after trying for too long to sell chips that did not meet their own efficiency expectations. Sure if bitcoin price were to go higher, they might be able to get a little more mileage out of them but the chips are middle of the road as far as efficiency and a higher bitcoin price would create a higher demand ergo a higher price for all chips. As it stands, Rockminer was selling some of their equipment below cost. It's not a friendly market right now.
If AM can incorporate the lessons learned from mistakes made with the gen 3 into a gen 4 chip and can produce it at a cost that will be profitable with today's bitcoin price, I say go for it! Order up the gen 4 chips! Otherwise, I would think there is no rush.

ensurance982

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Trust me!

Quote from: empoweoqwj on September 18, 2014, 06:18:57 AM

Quote from: ensurance982 on September 18, 2014, 06:09:03 AM

Quote from: ninjarobot on September 17, 2014, 05:55:10 PM

In the current mining climate (declining BTC value, exponentially increasing difficulty, fierce competition) it is hard enough for an ASIC manufacturer to survive, let alone thrive.

I would not expect anything in terms of dividends. Gen2 was vaporware and Gen3 a bit of a dud due to a design mistake that significantly increased power consumption. I think the best we can hope for is for friedcat to roll over any earnings from Gen3 to accelerate and perfect development of Gen4. Shareholders looking for short term gains will be disappointed. In the long run, I think AM is still well positioned to come out on top and worth the risk of holding shares.

I also believe that this is the way to go! The Bitcoin price is just too low at the moment, even ROCKMINER decided to postpone their 2 PH/s mining operation.... AM just doesn't seem to have enough of a margin to spend the income as dividends. I think the best thing to do would be to order massive amounts of gen 4 chips ASAP.

That was exactly their policy with gen 3. How did that work out?

Bottom line, if they aren't paying dividends, share price will slide and slide. There is no way AM can wipe out the competition because of "lowest cost". Business ain't that simple.

Yeah, but gen 3 had two or three big problems: About half as efficient as planned, at least two months to late, focus on selling the chip when the mining market got much too saturated (in combination with higher power consumption of BE200) and wasting 2-3 months on selling the chip before self-mining. In addition we saw a steep decline of the BTC price, which AM couldn't have prevented.
That being said, if things worked out better, we'd have had a gen 3 chip almost twice as efficient, self-mining in March/April, and potentially a better price. I do see where at least half of those things wouldn't necessarily be a problem with gen 4!

101111

hero member

Activity: 525

Merit: 500

Quote from: rudi on September 18, 2014, 05:36:46 AM

Quote from: 101111 on September 18, 2014, 05:23:01 AM

hash rate https://blockchain.info/charts/hash-rate spiking up around 275 Gh/s - AM mining?

PH/s

oops, yeah. Maybe that was the subconscious pessimist in me

empoweoqwj

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: ensurance982 on September 18, 2014, 06:09:03 AM

Quote from: ninjarobot on September 17, 2014, 05:55:10 PM

In the current mining climate (declining BTC value, exponentially increasing difficulty, fierce competition) it is hard enough for an ASIC manufacturer to survive, let alone thrive.

I would not expect anything in terms of dividends. Gen2 was vaporware and Gen3 a bit of a dud due to a design mistake that significantly increased power consumption. I think the best we can hope for is for friedcat to roll over any earnings from Gen3 to accelerate and perfect development of Gen4. Shareholders looking for short term gains will be disappointed. In the long run, I think AM is still well positioned to come out on top and worth the risk of holding shares.

I also believe that this is the way to go! The Bitcoin price is just too low at the moment, even ROCKMINER decided to postpone their 2 PH/s mining operation.... AM just doesn't seem to have enough of a margin to spend the income as dividends. I think the best thing to do would be to order massive amounts of gen 4 chips ASAP.

That was exactly their policy with gen 3. How did that work out?

Bottom line, if they aren't paying dividends, share price will slide and slide. There is no way AM can wipe out the competition because of "lowest cost". Business ain't that simple.

ensurance982

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Trust me!

Quote from: ninjarobot on September 17, 2014, 05:55:10 PM

In the current mining climate (declining BTC value, exponentially increasing difficulty, fierce competition) it is hard enough for an ASIC manufacturer to survive, let alone thrive.

I would not expect anything in terms of dividends. Gen2 was vaporware and Gen3 a bit of a dud due to a design mistake that significantly increased power consumption. I think the best we can hope for is for friedcat to roll over any earnings from Gen3 to accelerate and perfect development of Gen4. Shareholders looking for short term gains will be disappointed. In the long run, I think AM is still well positioned to come out on top and worth the risk of holding shares.

I also believe that this is the way to go! The Bitcoin price is just too low at the moment, even ROCKMINER decided to postpone their 2 PH/s mining operation.... AM just doesn't seem to have enough of a margin to spend the income as dividends. I think the best thing to do would be to order massive amounts of gen 4 chips ASAP.

empoweoqwj

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: ninjarobot on September 17, 2014, 05:55:10 PM

In the current mining climate (declining BTC value, exponentially increasing difficulty, fierce competition) it is hard enough for an ASIC manufacturer to survive, let alone thrive.

I would not expect anything in terms of dividends. Gen2 was vaporware and Gen3 a bit of a dud due to a design mistake that significantly increased power consumption. I think the best we can hope for is for friedcat to roll over any earnings from Gen3 to accelerate and perfect development of Gen4. Shareholders looking for short term gains will be disappointed. In the long run, I think AM is still well positioned to come out on top and worth the risk of holding shares.

Just trying to work out how "fail, fail" = "much success in future"? Wink

The fierce competition will not disappear, the BTC price is falling fast, AM will not suddenly do PR properly (PR representative promised 8 months ago?!?), or probably even build an English website, and who knows what Gen4 will be like .... given that past behaviour is the best predictor of future behaviour, my hopes are not high.

As a shareholder I wish I was wrong ....

I don't actually believe in the concept of long-term investing in AM. Why invest in someone that doesn't run a real company and you have no idea where he lives? We all invested in the first place because of the dividends they were paying out.

Hence the share price now being 1/10 to 1/20th of what it once was. No dividends = amazing amount of risk

rudi

full member

Activity: 141

Merit: 100

Quote from: 101111 on September 18, 2014, 05:23:01 AM

hash rate https://blockchain.info/charts/hash-rate spiking up around 275 Gh/s - AM mining?

PH/s

101111

hero member

Activity: 525

Merit: 500

hash rate https://blockchain.info/charts/hash-rate spiking up around 275 Gh/s - AM mining?

bitcoin.newsfeed

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 250

Quote from: hdbuck on September 18, 2014, 01:43:46 AM

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on September 18, 2014, 01:36:20 AM

Just curious when is the next financial report due
Believe they should be quarterly and perhaps the next board meeting ?

They are semestrial and should roll in by the end of october, as they did last year.

HA-HA don't believe that, you will be disappointed (again,again,again,....)

hdbuck

legendary

Activity: 1260

Merit: 1002

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on September 18, 2014, 01:36:20 AM

Just curious when is the next financial report due
Believe they should be quarterly and perhaps the next board meeting ?

They are semestrial and should roll in by the end of october, as they did last year.

Swordsoffreedom

legendary

Activity: 2884

Merit: 1115

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Just curious when is the next financial report due
Believe they should be quarterly and perhaps the next board meeting ?

ninjarobot

hero member

Activity: 761

Merit: 500

Mine Silent, Mine Deep

In the current mining climate (declining BTC value, exponentially increasing difficulty, fierce competition) it is hard enough for an ASIC manufacturer to survive, let alone thrive.

I would not expect anything in terms of dividends. Gen2 was vaporware and Gen3 a bit of a dud due to a design mistake that significantly increased power consumption. I think the best we can hope for is for friedcat to roll over any earnings from Gen3 to accelerate and perfect development of Gen4. Shareholders looking for short term gains will be disappointed. In the long run, I think AM is still well positioned to come out on top and worth the risk of holding shares.

Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It - page 190. (Read 3917058 times)