ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It - page 585.

jimmothy

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Quote from: binaryFate on November 21, 2013, 05:05:30 AM

Quote from: jimmothy on November 21, 2013, 05:01:44 AM

Quote from: BitThink on November 21, 2013, 04:41:29 AM

Quote from: jimmothy on November 21, 2013, 04:33:05 AM

1) KnC 28nm watt/G is less than one half of AM chips. Cube is still using the Gen1 chips which are > 7w/GH
2) bitman is selling on stock units.

Yea but with AM coming out with 28nm chips around january and 45nm chips some time before that along with immersion cooling there is no reason to panic.

Where did you get that time frame? AFAIK we have no information whatsoever on 28nm. Did I miss something or you just make it up?

It was mentioned in the interview along with the fact that Friedcat plans to prepare for a network of up to 1000ph/s (currently only a few ph/s).

binaryFate

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Still wild and free

Quote from: jimmothy on November 21, 2013, 05:01:44 AM

Quote from: BitThink on November 21, 2013, 04:41:29 AM

Quote from: jimmothy on November 21, 2013, 04:33:05 AM

1) KnC 28nm watt/G is less than one half of AM chips. Cube is still using the Gen1 chips which are > 7w/GH
2) bitman is selling on stock units.

Yea but with AM coming out with 28nm chips around january and 45nm chips some time before that along with immersion cooling there is no reason to panic.

Where did you get that time frame? AFAIK we have no information whatsoever on 28nm. Did I miss something or you just make it up?

jimmothy

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Quote from: BitThink on November 21, 2013, 04:41:29 AM

Quote from: jimmothy on November 21, 2013, 04:33:05 AM

1) KnC 28nm watt/G is less than one half of AM chips. Cube is still using the Gen1 chips which are > 7w/GH
2) bitman is selling on stock units.

Yea but with AM coming out with 28nm chips around january and 45nm chips some time before that along with immersion cooling there is no reason to panic.

bailywen

newbie

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it still can buy?

data

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Quote from: drawingthesun on November 21, 2013, 01:08:58 AM

To give an idea of how overvalued AM was at its peak: 4.5btc per share x 400,000 = 1,800,000btc.

While I agree that it was overvalued, why would it be following your logic? Theres nearly 10 million BTC to be mined + the magical transaction fee raise of the future + the possibility of self-mining and selling machines to really get profits from more than e.g. 20% of the network.

BitThink

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Quote from: jimmothy on November 21, 2013, 04:33:05 AM

Quote from: BitThink on November 21, 2013, 04:08:03 AM

If our concerns about AM still concentrate on mining income, then I am quite confident that we will be disappointed. One bitfury has already caused the big drop of shares of AM, then KnC, and now BitMain. BitMain is also in China and their first 30 units were sold in 2 hours, and then they will produce mass batch of their 55nm chips shortly. That will not only hurts the mining share of AM but also the hardware sales.

If there's no big news about cooperation of Gen2 chips out in this month, then the following 3 months are miserable for all AM investors, who will see big loss in revenue (both mining and sales).

The only hope is the Gen3 chips, which may be ready no earlier than Jan 2014. Forget about cooling technology now, cause it will not help in the short term. Even finally it is sold to big companies, I doubt AM have the ability to produce them in large quantity.

In short, now mining income almost becomes irrelevant in evaluating AM's future. There's no point to look at their hashing rate.

KNC 28nm is not even more efficient than an am cube... bitmain is not selling only accepted pre-orders.

1) KnC 28nm watt/G is less than one half of AM chips. Cube is still using the Gen1 chips which are > 7w/GH
2) bitman is selling on stock units.

jimmothy

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Activity: 770

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Quote from: BitThink on November 21, 2013, 04:08:03 AM

If our concerns about AM still concentrate on mining income, then I am quite confident that we will be disappointed. One bitfury has already caused the big drop of shares of AM, then KnC, and now BitMain. BitMain is also in China and their first 30 units were sold in 2 hours, and then they will produce mass batch of their 55nm chips shortly. That will not only hurts the mining share of AM but also the hardware sales.

If there's no big news about cooperation of Gen2 chips out in this month, then the following 3 months are miserable for all AM investors, who will see big loss in revenue (both mining and sales).

The only hope is the Gen3 chips, which may be ready no earlier than Jan 2014. Forget about cooling technology now, cause it will not help in the short term. Even finally it is sold to big companies, I doubt AM have the ability to produce them in large quantity.

In short, now mining income almost becomes irrelevant in evaluating AM's future. There's no point to look at their hashing rate.

KNC and bitfury 28nm is not even more efficient than an am cube... bitmain is not selling only accepted pre-orders and 2800 for 180gh/s is not better than 600 for 40gh/s assuming they even deliver.

BitThink

legendary

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If our concerns about AM still concentrate on mining income, then I am quite confident that we will be disappointed. One bitfury has already caused the big drop of shares of AM, then KnC, and now BitMain. BitMain is also in China and their first 30 units were sold in 2 hours, and then they will produce mass batch of their 55nm chips shortly. That will not only hurts the mining share of AM but also the hardware sales.

If there's no big news about cooperation of Gen2 chips out in this month, then the following 3 months are miserable for all AM investors, who will see big loss in revenue (both mining and sales).

The only hope is the Gen3 chips, which may be ready no earlier than Jan 2014. Forget about cooling technology now, cause it will not help in the short term. Even finally it is sold to big companies, I doubt AM have the ability to produce them in large quantity.

In short, now mining income almost becomes irrelevant in evaluating AM's future. There's no point to look at their hashing rate.

empoweoqwj

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Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: msm595 on November 21, 2013, 03:24:51 AM

Is AM on a lucky streak, or is hashrate increasing dramatically? We already have 150 BTC in the wallet, which is 1/2 of the most recent dividend. In one day. Even if you discount the 50 BTC mined before the dividend, that's 100 so far/375 total last week. If this isn't luck, that means at least 2x dividend next week.

Could easily be a lucky streak. As we have seen so many times in the past, variance is a huge factor in mining. You cannot judge anything on a day or two ... a week at least of good results is more like it.

Thanks everyone for pointing out what Havelock "Market Cap" actually means. Its not the market cap of the company, just the shares held at Havelock. Quite misleading really. Needs clarifying.

msm595

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Is AM on a lucky streak, or is hashrate increasing dramatically? We already have 150 BTC in the wallet, which is 1/2 of the most recent dividend. In one day. Even if you discount the 50 BTC mined before the dividend, that's 100 so far/375 total last week. If this isn't luck, that means at least 2x dividend next week.

drawingthesun

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Quote from: JimiQ84 on November 21, 2013, 03:09:57 AM

oh, I got it - it's ActiveMining address

Haha yeah, huge difference between ActM and AM. It looks like AM is pulling in over 100 times what ActiveMining does.

I am a huge shareholder in ActM, hopefully one day our mining address will look like ASICMINER's. Hehe one can hope!

JimiQ84

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Quote from: hlynur on November 21, 2013, 02:38:32 AM

Quote from: JimiQ84 on November 21, 2013, 02:33:35 AM

that's not AM mining address, what is this?

yea good question.

by the way right AM mining address:
https://blockchain.info/address/1HtUGfbDcMzTeHWx2Dbgnhc6kYnj1Hp24i

oh, I got it - it's ActiveMining address

hlynur

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Quote from: JimiQ84 on November 21, 2013, 02:33:35 AM

that's not AM mining address, what is this?

yea good question.

by the way right AM mining address:
https://blockchain.info/address/1HtUGfbDcMzTeHWx2Dbgnhc6kYnj1Hp24i

JimiQ84

sr. member

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that's not AM mining address, what is this?

jimmothy

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Quote from: gaba on November 21, 2013, 02:26:30 AM

Hashrate is obviously increasing - fast. https://blockchain.info/address/1DJpsvnM7xTnQbWEhLYyCyfxQyxwupEzCa

In one day they mined about half as much as they mined all last week. Most likely just luck though.

edit: no idea what that address is but statement still true.

gaba

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Hashrate is obviously increasing - fast. https://blockchain.info/address/1DJpsvnM7xTnQbWEhLYyCyfxQyxwupEzCa

freedomno1

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Learning the troll avoidance button :)

Quote from: Jutarul on November 21, 2013, 01:12:35 AM

Quote from: hak8or on November 20, 2013, 04:12:54 PM

Quote from: Jutarul on November 20, 2013, 03:22:24 PM

....
In the spirit of defusing this a bit, the board is going to have a meeting soon and discuss the communication/transparency issue. The last attempt to improve the situation was well intended but not followed through. This point needs clarification.

Awesome stuff. Will the meeting be made public (streamed/recorded/transcript online), or will it be fully in private? Any comments on what the previous attempt was and why it failed?

There will certainly be a public statement on how to go forward on this issue.

Well as an aside FC does need to work on the marketing arm
Been getting a lot of questions on how to buy AM shares and Purchase Miners in the last couple of weeks there seem to be a lot of interested people in AM with all the bitcoin news.

Jutarul

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Quote from: hak8or on November 20, 2013, 04:12:54 PM

Quote from: Jutarul on November 20, 2013, 03:22:24 PM

....
In the spirit of defusing this a bit, the board is going to have a meeting soon and discuss the communication/transparency issue. The last attempt to improve the situation was well intended but not followed through. This point needs clarification.

Awesome stuff. Will the meeting be made public (streamed/recorded/transcript online), or will it be fully in private? Any comments on what the previous attempt was and why it failed?

There will certainly be a public statement on how to go forward on this issue.

drawingthesun

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Quote from: empoweoqwj on November 21, 2013, 12:22:06 AM

havelock down at the moment? Back up now. Down for about 15 mins.

According to havelock:
Market Cap ฿4672.1613

Which is less than the ฿5484.66 AM listed as assets on 27th October, plus the 4480310.50￥ (about US$700,000)

So this company is worth less than the cash assets they have? Please explain to a layman

That is the market cap for the shares on Havelock.

To give an idea of the actual market cap, there are 400,000 shares of AM.

So 0.3 x 400,000 = 120,000 Bitcoin or $60million.

To give an idea of how overvalued AM was at its peak: 4.5btc per share x 400,000 = 1,800,000btc. It was obvious AM was overvalued, the only way it could maintain 4btc per share was to have 100% of the network or close.

BitThink

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Quote from: empoweoqwj on November 21, 2013, 12:22:06 AM

havelock down at the moment? Back up now. Down for about 15 mins.

According to havelock:
Market Cap ฿4672.1613

Which is less than the ฿5484.66 AM listed as assets on 27th October, plus the 4480310.50￥ (about US$700,000)

So this company is worth less than the cash assets they have? Please explain to a layman

It's just the market cap of all PTs in Havelock, which is a very small part of all shares.

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