Hi, I would like to report a rogue behaviour from Cryptopokerclub.io
My name is Alexander Orlov, I am a professional poker player for more than 8 years. I play HUNLH up to 10-20$.
I have spotted a CPC and made a deposit of 0.74 BTC on 3rd March 2019 and got a full first deposit bonus in amount of 0.26 BTC.
This bonus was immediately and fully credited on my account and I started playing with a bankroll of 1 BTC.
In 4 months I decided to make a first cashout but received an objection with an explanation that my bonus is not yet cleared and I have to clear it with 2x wager from bonus amount (2x 0.26 btc = 0.52 btc), otherwise I will lose a bonus.
My email:
Alexander Orlov
22 June 2019 г., 19:33
To: Crypto
Dear Support Team, I want to know if I have fulfilled the bonus conditions. If I make a withdrawal, will I lose the whole bonus, or some part of it.
Best regards , Orlov Alexander
Answer:
Crypto Poker Club <[email protected]>
22 June 2019 г., 19:43
Hello,
Please see your account totals for the lifetime of the account:
Your total rakepaid is: 261.93 mBTC
Your total rakeback is: 72.78 mBTC
Total bonus: 260 mBTC
Requirement: 520 mBTC
Total needed to clear bonus (minus rakeback): (520) - (189.15) = 330.85 mBTC
Withdrawing before meeting requirements will mean the bonus being removed from the account.
Please let us know if you have any questions?
With regards,
Crypto Poker Club TeamI have decided to continue playing and clearing a bonus but in 2 month when I realised that there is not much action, I decided to make a cashout with a deduction of bonus amount, as per their T&C, but received an unexpected reply:
Crypto Poker Club <[email protected]>
19 August 2019 г., 23:27
Hello,
You can cancel the bonus however there are cancellation policies which is the following as outlined in our terms of service:
Cancelling the bonus would initially mean the full bonus amount will be taken away from your total balance
The remaining balance is subject to a 50% reduction fee
The calculation would be: (Current balance) - (Bonus) * 0.5 = (Final balance able to withdraw)
In your case that would be: 3,104.22mBTC - 260.00 mBTC * 0.5 = 1,422.11 mBTC
We always recommend players not to go through this route however it is up to you. The option is there if you wish to take it. If you would like to cancel the bonus simply let us know and we will get that ready for you.
With regards,
Crypto Poker Club TeamIn other words they are taking not only the bonus amount but also 50% of the remaining balance and I discover this fact only after 6 months of playing. WTF?
Besides, I was regularly communicating with customer support and they told be a few times that I am going to lose ONLY my bonus amount. They never mentioned this terms that are hidden on their site so that no one can see it. In my opinion only this is a rogue behaviour. Fair poker rooms never hide their “rogue” terms from players.
Obviously I continued playing and chatting with customer support. In 1.5 months, having 90% of the bonus already cleared, I requested a rake report but received this:
CPC <[email protected]>
3 October. 2019 г., 20:19
Hello,
Please find your stats below including the remaining figures:
Total net Rakepaid: 573.97 mBTC
Total net Rakeback: 106.70 mBTC
Clarence: 467.27 mBTC
Total requirement: 1,040 mBTC
Amount remaining to clear: 572.73 mBTC
With regards,
Crypto Poker Club Team
Now they doubled the rake, that I need to clear from 0.52 to 1.04 btc. It turned that I had to clear it during 6 months, otherwise the requirement is doubles. WTF? Again???
I felt like a donkey swallowing the same bait over and over again. After I realised that I am dealing with rogues I stopped playing, informed my affiliate and told him the whole story.
He contacted CPC and they ensured him that right after clearing bonus requirements, they will fully pay me. Okey, what could I do. I continued playing.
There was not much HUNL action and I began starting 6max tables and playing a lot without any select to clear the rake. I also started joining these tables, although it is not my main discipline.
So, on 17th December I had 0.94btc cleared from 1.04 btc cleared. According to my calcs I was going to finally clear the bonus by the end of December/early January. And here BOOM! New email. “You are banned!”
Here is an accusation:
CPC <[email protected]>
17 December. 2019 г., 07:15
Hello,
Your account has been permanently banned due to substantial evidence of BOT usage over the last 6 months from August - December 2019. It is a direct violation of our terms of service to use BOT software and/or any assistance software of any kind on the tables.
Additionally your account was found to have been used by multiple people and/or BOTS as mentioned above which is a direct violation of our terms of service.
Enclosed below is the evidence for the findings of your account usage, activity, login times, frequency and more gathered across all the months. All times are in UTC.
Section 1A: Account Login Date/Time 24 hours a day
Summary:
Across the entire 9 months of account usage, our systems were unable to find a single hour of time whereby your account has not been logged into. This evidence suggests artificial usage of BOTS that control the account and/or other people have been using your account other than yourself which is a direct violation of our terms of usage (section 13.2).
Evidence:
Attachment (1.PDF) - This extract showcases all your account login history. Every single hour has been utilized which is simply not possible as this does not give you any hours of the day to sleep/work and other general activities. The same pattern is true for the duration of the entire year which indicates either other people in other time-zones have been using your account or a BOT software has been controlling your account on your behalf. For simplicity, the team has sorted the data (Attachment: 1_sorted.PDF) to showcase every hour has been utilized in terms of login times. If this occurred only a few times then it would be natural however there is substantial evidence to suggest continuous account usage across very timezone month on month which proves unnatural usage.
Section 1B: Login pattern of 0-8MIN syntax detected
Summary:
A unnatural login pattern has been detected. Across every hour of the 24 hour period, your account has been logged into at XX:00-XX:08 throughout the year which indicates precise login slots for BOT software log in configurations. There would not be any natural reason for your account being logged in at such precise times 24 hours a day throughout the entire year. In other words - your account always logs in between minute 1-8 at every hour throughout the year.
Evidence:
Attachment (1.PDF) - This extract showcases all your logins and log outs. Highlighted fields in yellow indicate such login pattern behaviour.
Section 2A: Timed Exact Delay of Buying of Chips + Joining Tables Pattern Detected
Summary:
The team has compared multiple heads up only players (like yourself as your account has only played heads up tables) throughout our platform as well as other platforms vs your account behaviour of joining tables and buying chips. Your behaviour has shown as soon as you log in, a precise timed delay of 9-12 seconds of joining empty tables.
The same mirrored behaviours of heads up players starting a new session is far different. Normally real players automatically join multiple tables instantly and also at varying intervals. At each time you began your session, there was no deviation in joining tables. There was always an exact delay at that time. Typically on average, you successfully concluded joining up all desired tables within 1-2 minutes. Comparing that data to real players who on average join all desired tables in under 30 seconds (that were empty tables).
Why was there an exact delay on joining empty tables? Why did your account always join tables as soon as you logged in and almost never browsed around current game action first? Why did your account never join existing game action and instead only joined empty tables even though there were heads up players waiting for action? The pattern detected is not a natural way of joining tables and is not a natural way of how long it took you to buy chips or never join existing players. The BOT software you were running seems to have required your configuration to be on an empty table for calibration purposes.
Evidence:
Compare your login times to when you bought chips and the pattern is displayed instantly. This can be visible by viewing Attachment (2.PDF) in the joining tables/buying chips timestamps. At each login, it takes you on average 1-2 minutes to join all desired EMPTY tables. Real players statistics is between 10-20 seconds on average.
Section 2B: Time Exact Delay of Selling Chips + Table Disconnections
Summary:
The team have identified an exact instant pattern of selling chips. On average it took 9-12 seconds to join and buy chips. For selling and disconnecting of all multiple tables, this occurred instantly.
Evidence:
In attachment (2.PDF) where we showcase transaction flow of your account - you can also notice how there were no delays of table disconnections. On further analysis - tables were disconnected instantly on the same 1-2 second period. The team analyzed more recent playing behaviour in November-December and noticed up to 12 tables being disconnected within a 3 second period.
Section 3A: Unnatural Table Selection
Summary:
Further to earlier points - your account only joined empty tables throughout your entire 9 month history even when there were multiple heads up tables available with players waiting for action. It seems your BOT configuration did not allow joining of existing games and therefore you required to only join empty tables to set up the programme. It is simply not possible for a real player not to join hundreds of available games across the 9 month period.
Evidence:
Number of players on table joined highlighted in attachment (2.PDF). Further to this - your account had a lot of trouble with clearing bonuses which still have not yet been cleared due to the fact that you limited your own games due to only joining empty tables. Not once did you play any other game format other than heads up games and they all initiated from players joining your table instead of you joining other players tables.
Section 3B: Heads Up Games Only & Conclusion
This is an observational comment backed up by engineering experience and how BOTS are made that ties into the evidence above.
Our engineers confirmed that for a BOT programme to work well, pixels need to be captured on the screen. The reason why you may not have joined other games is due to BOT complexity. It is far easier for you to capture the pixels of one panel in the table than multiple HUD panels in a 6 or 9 max ring game.
The reason you only joined empty tables is due to the ability to select your SEAT on the table. It is likely that the BOT is calibrated only on one side of the table. Automatically joining games filled with players will mean you would not be able to select your ideal SEAT therefore invalidating the configuration.
The delay in joining tables may be for memory management purposes for the BOT configuration. Joining a new table would initiate a new version of the simulator required to run solvers and other auxiliary components. If a BOT joined 10 new tables all at once, it may not function well (time outs may happen or worse). Memory and other components need time to initiate even if that means a few additional seconds of delay.
Point #3 is further explained by the fact that there was always a fixed delay amount in seconds every day that your account was active at the time of joining tables. It is likely that the BOT configuration has some method of auto regulation to ensure a random but fixed delay amount is added to ensure maximum up-time.
Account login patterns and frequency indicates a single human did not use the account solely which is a direct violation of the platforms terms of service which would result in a ban regardless of BOT usage or not.
Due to the evidence of both BOT usage as well as multiple people and/or software using your account, your account has been closed permanently and players affected refunded to the full extent possible.
Regards,
Crypto Poker Club Team
1. 1_FILTERED.pdf -
https://www.dropbox.com/s/v21kdyv6gtmzxxx/1_FILTERED.pdf?dl=02. 1.pdf -
https://www.dropbox.com/s/h1f0zp8c8erznin/1.pdf?dl=03. 2.pdf -
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1t477zfh81xqf15/2.pdf?dl=0Let's take a closer look at their accusations:
1A. They system sees that my account was online during last 9 months 24 h/day. As a proof they provide sheet 1. But when reading sheet 1 there have been days and even more than a week that I was offline ((Oct 06, 2019 @ 14:31 Disconnected Oct 16, 2019 @ 11:01 Success)
Also as a proof they provide sheet 1_Filtered, where login time can be seen.
Its hard to comment on this evidence. I dont know when this happened and what is the reason to constantly log-in to the client. This looks more like a glitch in their system.
1B.Here security team was concerned login time between XX: 00-XX: 08 and according to their opinion this could only be a bot. A sheet provided as an evidence of this fact, where these intervals are marked in yellow. Let's take a closer look at this sheet:
1.You can clearly see, that only those logins that fall under their “theory” are highlighted (there are even a few that do not fall, but are all marked) Aug 04, 2019 @ 18:09, Dec 03, 2019 @ 13:09, Dec 05, 2019 @ 05:09), and those that do not fall, and about 80% of them are not taken into account. Who made these charges
2. Even if most of the logins were in this interval, can't professional poker players have a regime and their working day cannot begin at about the same time?
I will draw a conclusion on the charges.
1. The evidence presented proves the opposite: that I was not online 24/7 and that I logged in at different times.
2. I do not agree with these figures and believe that this is a system glitch.
2A. At this point, I was accused:
1. that I open tables unnaturally fast - 9-12 seconds after entering the client, and it takes me 1-2 min to open them.
Unlike other players who open tables in 30 seconds, I open more tables than any other HU player on this site. Except HU tables, I also opened 6 max NL200-NL10k tables. I opened all empty 6max and HU tables. Then I started to crush other HU players, this takes more time than the average HU player of this site.
2. that I did not observe active tables.
First of all, I occupied free tables, and only then I looked through the lobby
3. That I did not join the players who were waiting for the game.
This is not true, I was the only HU player on the site who crushed other HU players.
4. Why do I have the same time joining tables.
I play 10 sites at the same time, and my working day begins with the fact that I open more than 50 tables, my actions are refined to automatism. And I'm sure that with a detailed check, you would see the difference.
What are these charges
Any professional player will understand that these charges are non-sense.
2B. At this point I was accused of quickly closing the tables
seriously? did the team analyze my behavior in 2 months?)) I just close the client, and all tables close instantly.
3A. In other words, at this point, I’m an HU player, a bamhunter, they accuse me of being a bot because I didn’t sit down to play with regulars, isn't that funny?) This is the essence of HU, not playing with regulars !!! It is very strange that the CPC's security service does not understand this. I repeat that I was the only HU NLH player on the site who crushed other regulars !!!!!!
How is it possible that the CPC team made so many mistakes in relation to me.
3B. 1. You are a bot because you only play HU. No comments
2. You are a bot because you do not sit other regulars. Answered this question above
3. You are a bot because you sit down at the tables for a long time. Answered this question above
4. You are a bot because you spend the same time sitting at the table. Answered this question above
5. You violated the rules due to the login frequency, although their tables prove the opposite, I do not agree with the numbers and see a system glitch
I suggested that the CPC team uses the practice of world poker rooms to solve such problems, namely, record my live session so that they see that all my actions are human and possibly found bugs in their system. To which I received a refusal and all my arguments for them were not convincing.
I find all the accusations against me extremely poor, it seems that they were made by students who have nothing to do with poker.
I see the extremely unprofessional work of the CPC team or the deliberate manipulation of facts in order to take control of my funds. 3.9 btc confiscated from me.
I am ready for any checks. If the CPC team does not engage in dialogue, I ask the forum moderator to delete the CCP thread or mark it as fraud.
I would also ask moderator to take other similar complaints in this thread when considering taking down this thread or marking it as a “rogue/fraud”
