Once pegged it will be very attractive to all crypto related businesses!
Would be great if more people could be made of what is happening with Bitbay! Shame nobody is aware we exist.
Topic: BitBay OFFICIAL BITBAY Thread Smart Contracts Decentralized Markets Rolling Peg - page 274. (Read 542094 times)
February 12, 2016, 05:59:29 PM
February 12, 2016, 01:55:25 PM
l m also holding since ico and no intentions to sell, Bay will be huge.Thanks very much David for great work you have done so far.
February 12, 2016, 10:03:28 AM
Either way, this year we should see the complete client.
Been holding Bay since ICO.
Great to see you say that!
Thanks again David for all your hard work.
February 12, 2016, 06:38:25 AM
thanks david for the very detailed answer.
I can only imagine how hard it is to get guys who can actually help with this project.
I know you have posted on various places for help. Do you think there are any devs on this board that we could inspire to come work with us on this. I mean are there not vital (less secret) tasks they could do? but still the work they would do would really help boost us on.
I was wonder if the community could all donate some bitbay to a big developement pot which we could use to bring other devs on to the team to assist you with your work
I think we should keep all the coding or as much as possible of the vital stuff to for you knowledge only and closed source as possible until we have a clear lead in the areas you have been working for so long.
I mean if we could raise say a few million bays in a pot do you think we could bring on another dev or 2 from here to help us? then again we would ideally want them invested in the project not just dumping our coins back on the market.
If we could devise some ROI projects for bay that would be good too.
Thing is nobody really donates much unless they get something in return or else everyone sits there waiting for everyone else to donate for projects...the secret is getting them some return for donating ....even though a higher price for BAY should be a good enough reason it doesn't work because even those that don't donate benefit the same as those that do donate. Shame we can't think of a way to reward those that donate only.
Or even reward for doing tasks - if we had a pot where you did various tasks and got paid with bay that could be useful too.
Even so I'm very impressed with the work done so far. I think people are just unaware of this project right now. If we could get on poloniex that would really help along with btc38. It's a shame the wallet is so buggy i wonder if that can bring consideration from poloniex?
I can only imagine how hard it is to get guys who can actually help with this project.
I know you have posted on various places for help. Do you think there are any devs on this board that we could inspire to come work with us on this. I mean are there not vital (less secret) tasks they could do? but still the work they would do would really help boost us on.
I was wonder if the community could all donate some bitbay to a big developement pot which we could use to bring other devs on to the team to assist you with your work
I think we should keep all the coding or as much as possible of the vital stuff to for you knowledge only and closed source as possible until we have a clear lead in the areas you have been working for so long.
I mean if we could raise say a few million bays in a pot do you think we could bring on another dev or 2 from here to help us? then again we would ideally want them invested in the project not just dumping our coins back on the market.
If we could devise some ROI projects for bay that would be good too.
Thing is nobody really donates much unless they get something in return or else everyone sits there waiting for everyone else to donate for projects...the secret is getting them some return for donating ....even though a higher price for BAY should be a good enough reason it doesn't work because even those that don't donate benefit the same as those that do donate. Shame we can't think of a way to reward those that donate only.
Or even reward for doing tasks - if we had a pot where you did various tasks and got paid with bay that could be useful too.
Even so I'm very impressed with the work done so far. I think people are just unaware of this project right now. If we could get on poloniex that would really help along with btc38. It's a shame the wallet is so buggy i wonder if that can bring consideration from poloniex?
I wouldnt say anything I'm doing is secret... because its hard work anyways and I share source with other devs. But finding someone qualified is hard. The syscoin dev hangs out here, but i know he is super busy on his project... most good crypto devs are busy with their own thing
Ive got some Bitbay I could chip in, I've not spent any of it since the launch. In fact, I bought a little bit when it was low at 40. But you know a dev might want BTC? I'm not sure but its an interesting idea. We could look for devs in reddit at r/bitcoin or even on odesk. But finding a cheap one who is trustworthy who doesnt procrastinate and who follows through is almost impossible. This is why I'm looking into Mexico. Plus I've got tons of friends down there.
In the meantime, I'm here coding! Right now setting up my new computer and building distributables. The speed of my updates will pick up very soon! Now I'm home, no distractions and just catching up on work.
Only the QT wallet is buggy. The markets wallet only has a few minor bugs but nothing that interferes with markets or contracts.
Poloniex is almost definitely looking for VOLUME. That brings them money and low volume will not make them want to bring it on.
Hopefully when I get to coding NightTrader that the decentralized exchange will be fast enough that people will want to use it. I'm still facing some speed decisions.
Either way, this year we should see the complete client.
February 11, 2016, 08:52:31 PM
thanks david for the very detailed answer.
I can only imagine how hard it is to get guys who can actually help with this project.
I know you have posted on various places for help. Do you think there are any devs on this board that we could inspire to come work with us on this. I mean are there not vital (less secret) tasks they could do? but still the work they would do would really help boost us on.
I was wonder if the community could all donate some bitbay to a big developement pot which we could use to bring other devs on to the team to assist you with your work
I think we should keep all the coding or as much as possible of the vital stuff to for you knowledge only and closed source as possible until we have a clear lead in the areas you have been working for so long.
I mean if we could raise say a few million bays in a pot do you think we could bring on another dev or 2 from here to help us? then again we would ideally want them invested in the project not just dumping our coins back on the market.
If we could devise some ROI projects for bay that would be good too.
Thing is nobody really donates much unless they get something in return or else everyone sits there waiting for everyone else to donate for projects...the secret is getting them some return for donating ....even though a higher price for BAY should be a good enough reason it doesn't work because even those that don't donate benefit the same as those that do donate. Shame we can't think of a way to reward those that donate only.
Or even reward for doing tasks - if we had a pot where you did various tasks and got paid with bay that could be useful too.
Even so I'm very impressed with the work done so far. I think people are just unaware of this project right now. If we could get on poloniex that would really help along with btc38. It's a shame the wallet is so buggy i wonder if that can bring consideration from poloniex?
I can only imagine how hard it is to get guys who can actually help with this project.
I know you have posted on various places for help. Do you think there are any devs on this board that we could inspire to come work with us on this. I mean are there not vital (less secret) tasks they could do? but still the work they would do would really help boost us on.
I was wonder if the community could all donate some bitbay to a big developement pot which we could use to bring other devs on to the team to assist you with your work
I think we should keep all the coding or as much as possible of the vital stuff to for you knowledge only and closed source as possible until we have a clear lead in the areas you have been working for so long.
I mean if we could raise say a few million bays in a pot do you think we could bring on another dev or 2 from here to help us? then again we would ideally want them invested in the project not just dumping our coins back on the market.
If we could devise some ROI projects for bay that would be good too.
Thing is nobody really donates much unless they get something in return or else everyone sits there waiting for everyone else to donate for projects...the secret is getting them some return for donating ....even though a higher price for BAY should be a good enough reason it doesn't work because even those that don't donate benefit the same as those that do donate. Shame we can't think of a way to reward those that donate only.
Or even reward for doing tasks - if we had a pot where you did various tasks and got paid with bay that could be useful too.
Even so I'm very impressed with the work done so far. I think people are just unaware of this project right now. If we could get on poloniex that would really help along with btc38. It's a shame the wallet is so buggy i wonder if that can bring consideration from poloniex?
February 11, 2016, 12:55:03 AM
btc38 would be great for bitbay.
Indeed it would.
The thing is to push the marketing side of it now.... or await the pegging. I mean if we await the pegging and get it fully stable and get all the bugs ironed out.
Then we done some marketing get some volume going through on the exchanges.
Then we got some decent vendors using it since with pegging they can't lose on volitile spiking
That could be great.
We do have a few senior or above serious crypto people interested in BAY it would seem. It just seems so low in value considering all the things it has going for it?
It's terrible that none of us really has any coding skills to help david. Is there some team for other things? I see some nice graphical work has been done, and the website looks really nice too.
One thing that could be holding us back is the bitbay QT ... I mean i know it is just a standard wallet to coin to hold the tokens for now, but really I don't know why but it seems so buggy compared to some other qts on my machines. It takes ages to download the chain from scratch too.
I know it's not actually important right now but it would be cool for when people get started to have something as easy as possible with zero wating and frustration.
Is anyone here using the bitbay market place to sell things atm?
There is a lot of senior bitcointalk members interested and obviously the code was of interest enough to draw a lot of people to its unfortunate launch.
Also, it is fair to mention the progress made on the client in the last year (comparing screenshots alone) a lot of features have been added and of course the decentralized markets.
The people we have on our team are mostly the slack members. We have a couple people who did graphics mostly meta who did our site which I have to admit looks excellent. And the slack members helped find artists for the new logo, promotional materials and everything else which I made sure everyone we contracted got paid of course.
The reason the QT is buggy is because it was not built with complete source code. Oxidians github is missing files so it cant even build bitbayd for some platforms. I have a more updated source which is good for the daemon but it wont run qt. It would be nice to see a new qt but we have to consider that very soon it will be phased out. I might even fork early to get rid of the qt before we even start to peg.
I just bought a new laptop today actually for testing and may buy a couple more cheap ones just to see a few different systems. Aside from any VMs im going to run.
By the way, to avoid the sync, you should look at how Ive coded Bithalo. That version of Halo actually doesnt download a blockchain.
The reason i download a blockchain for Bitbay and BLK is because I want to make sure the data is 100% reliable (like blockchain.info). I used 3 different apis for Bithalos balance checking to avoid mistakes at all costs since these are contracts and we cant afford unreliable info.
HOWEVER, since Im coding a decentralized exchange, technically im going to have to start relying on online block explorers for altcoins. Plus, i dont see why bitbay cant do both once that functionality is complete? Just a though. I'm trying to not promise more than I already have on my plate though.
Some sales have been done on the Bitbay market. Someone sold a tire pressure gauge, trading cards, cash for coins, fawcet contracts, stickers and promotional materials. So I think thats a pretty good start for our first year. Hell the only thing anyone ever bought with Bitcoin was a pizza! For like 10,000 btc haha
The reality is, I would LOVE coders. Did you know that I posted to find someone to simply build a cross platform blackcoind and bitbayd build on reddit and on a few job search platforms and found absolutely nobody?!?
It was sad, I have a hard time simply getting a damn build. Of course, Im going to build those myself but to get them cross platform and stable requires some testing and ive been working on other things.
I was in Cambodia, tried to hire, had 3 coders who didnt contribute a single line of code. Sad i know. I spent 1 month training them and after saw the sluggish speed of how they struggled and gave up on them. Two of them quit. They only really managed to build the daemon, get blackcoin and bitbay running and they practiced on some small projects i gave them that took them forever. A thing one of them took an entire week to do, i did in one hour.
So I tried to look into India, was there for a month, but found out that i need to apply for a 3 month or more visa from the usa and India doesnt take bribes anymore haha. So that was out. Plus they are ballbusters anyways. I was concerned about the training issue and time commitment since I knew I had to produce markets asap... ( so i did
).I tried hiring a guy from Blackcoin under a BlackHalo contract for a basic refactor. At first it was good, he did a decent amount of work (proof that double deposit works!) BUT he started to get lazy after 2 weeks. He had a bunch of things changed with file management, cleaned up some stuff etc. The problem was, I was working on the code at the same time and we werent using github. SO he was frustrated since I didnt merge the code, he asked for about 5 time extensions and eventually disappeared completely. So the contract ended.
Unfortunately, I ended up not using a single line since I already refactored the file mangement in Halo core myself.
So I also tried hiring a few other crypto guys but they take weeks to respond and just suck. They either dont understand my source code, or are obviously planning to pad their hours. (where are the good cheap ones hiding?)
I'm looking into hiring here in Mexico... since I'm not far. And the quality and price might be alright plus i speak spanish. But its very hard to say again if they will understand the code or bitcoin. Coders are hard to find. Bitcoin coders are impossible to find. Cheap bitcoin coders are like unicorns... they dont exist.
So, I'm stuck coding alone. And by the way your assessment was correct. The amount of work for one coder is insane and unhealthy! But we've made it this far, this client is like 10000 times more badass than any client out there. Its STILL the only client in the world that does contracts, still the only one with true decentralized markets, and like 10 other cool features.
On a side note about marketing, to bring in some extra cash and to help a buddy out, I spent the past week making some marketing bots for a friend... and maybe they can be useful for crypto related projects. Mostly for forums, online promotion social media... all automation bots. The thing is, I'm not so interested in marketing heavily until the pegging is complete so we dont worry about volatility.
By the way, are you on slack? Its been a bit quiet there lately.
February 10, 2016, 08:57:01 PM
btc38 would be great for bitbay.
Indeed it would.
The thing is to push the marketing side of it now.... or await the pegging. I mean if we await the pegging and get it fully stable and get all the bugs ironed out.
Then we done some marketing get some volume going through on the exchanges.
Then we got some decent vendors using it since with pegging they can't lose on volitile spiking
That could be great.
We do have a few senior or above serious crypto people interested in BAY it would seem. It just seems so low in value considering all the things it has going for it?
It's terrible that none of us really has any coding skills to help david. Is there some team for other things? I see some nice graphical work has been done, and the website looks really nice too.
One thing that could be holding us back is the bitbay QT ... I mean i know it is just a standard wallet to coin to hold the tokens for now, but really I don't know why but it seems so buggy compared to some other qts on my machines. It takes ages to download the chain from scratch too.
I know it's not actually important right now but it would be cool for when people get started to have something as easy as possible with zero wating and frustration.
Is anyone here using the bitbay market place to sell things atm?
February 10, 2016, 04:06:34 PM
Bitbay is extreme under valued! Nobody knows about it.
February 10, 2016, 10:15:36 AM
How many senior or above members are interested in following this coin or support it in any way?
I mean how big is the bitbay community? The coin seems stupidly undervalued at this point. I can only think lack of awareness and understanding is holding it back.
BTC38 would bring it to the attention of the east.
I mean how big is the bitbay community? The coin seems stupidly undervalued at this point. I can only think lack of awareness and understanding is holding it back.
BTC38 would bring it to the attention of the east.
February 09, 2016, 02:27:35 PM
Everything seems to have slowed down? Whats happening next please. Will will see lagging to the dollar before winter?
Do we still have the ailibaba link?
Don't get me wrong I think David is a great Deb and very active!
Do we still have the ailibaba link?
Don't get me wrong I think David is a great Deb and very active!
Yeah, I think when the pegging is done and proven to work well then a lot of websites would be inclined to go with bitbay over all other crypto for price stability.
David seems excellent but is only one person.. the work behind the scenes is probably unimaginable to a person not familiar with this kind of work.
Problem is how can we speed things up with such a low market cap and low level of interest. W
On the other side of the argument.... could be best to keep it on the low burner whilst we try to grab up more cheap bitbays.
Depends on how much you believe in the coin i guess. I keep adding a few here and there. Would love to get 10M eventually.
The thing i like about bitbay is the features are very useful for everyday buying and selling online not just gimmicks like with some other coins.
February 09, 2016, 08:46:16 AM
great to see Bitbay is still alive and David works on the coin!!!
February 09, 2016, 08:17:09 AM
David, what were your thoughts ^^
I didn't know if you missed the post or not?
I didn't know if you missed the post or not?
Hey a late reply, I was out of town for the weekend. Yeah as far as integrating the reputation system for merchants with staking and miners its not a good idea since they are two decentralized protocols done in completely different ways. So its hard to integrate the reputation system in that way per se. However, if you had a series of servers or master nodes that collected reputation data or spot prices or things like that then that might be something to look in to down the road.
Thanks for helping me understand the complexity. I see what you mean now.
I'll keep 'stewing' on the concept.
February 08, 2016, 06:50:24 AM
David, what were your thoughts ^^
I didn't know if you missed the post or not?
I didn't know if you missed the post or not?
Hey a late reply, I was out of town for the weekend. Yeah as far as integrating the reputation system for merchants with staking and miners its not a good idea since they are two decentralized protocols done in completely different ways. So its hard to integrate the reputation system in that way per se. However, if you had a series of servers or master nodes that collected reputation data or spot prices or things like that then that might be something to look in to down the road.
February 07, 2016, 03:35:39 PM
Interesting ^^
I never knew that POS staking pools existed.
I never knew that POS staking pools existed.
Yeah this is the second time i seen pos pool but first time for bitbay
February 07, 2016, 06:10:23 AM
Interesting ^^
I never knew that POS staking pools existed.
I never knew that POS staking pools existed.
February 06, 2016, 10:13:16 PM
Bitbay has now been added to the CoinWallet.co online wallet, POS pool service and Twitter tipping service.
https://www.coinwallet.co
Running since 2013.
POS Pool fee: 2%
Wallet withdrawal fee: 0.5%
Twitter tipping fee: 0%
Email payment / transfer fee: 0%
As always use online wallets with caution and store the majority of your coins in cold storage or a secure / encrypted wallet on your computer.
Coinwallet.co serves as an easy to use and accessible wallet that you can access with just an internet connection.
Donations welcome: BPvweW7HcT4bX8AqpTo5LU2dHHhhkUQVCR
February 05, 2016, 07:38:12 AM
And also it creates some really interesting possibilities for transfers of liquidity for frozen coins. Similar to loans, trustless bonds and futures, etc.
Yea I can't wait to see the possibilities that pan out from these ideas ^^
And I love that you see the importance of creating a voting system so as not to send the coin down a dead end path like bitcoin and litecoin seem to be on.
It shouldn't be up to a handful of people to decide what new innovations should be incorporated into the coin.
This brings up another question:
The vote can be done by majority, but majority votes are hard to calculate. Here are the two ways I'm thinking of coding it would like to hear what you guys think:
The first way is to give the vote to the miner who wins the block. Since everyone has a fair chance of winning a block, this lets anyone who is staking make the decision. This way is provably fair since staking is fair. Its harder to game and you burn less funds. However, this might be less democratic if you consider the people with the most coins usually get the blocks. However, the people with the most coins have more at stake and perhaps the votes matter to them more anyways. ALSO this benefits users who have frozen coins and gives them this added benefit of being the bank.
The second way is based on a voting address. Basically you can cast votes in the client, send a small payment to a voting address. This might be a more democratic way to vote but it has the following challenge:
Anyone can create an address, so doing the vote by address can be gamed
also if you do the votes by simply counting them, then that encourages spam
So if this method is used, votes have to be measure by balance. The more money in the account the more weight the vote has. But this has some drawbacks, users dont always keep all their funds in one account so imagine voting from 10 of accounts just to change the interest rates
Also to prevent people from switching accounts, I would have to make the votes happen at an exact block otherwise people would vote twice(since they could move the money to another address).
This means to vote you have to be connected and miners will usually get the vote anyways. Also the most troublesome part of this is, miners would have to calculate everyones balance which means they would be running a full node. (Balance checking is not so easy unless you build an index which makes the blockchain take up tons of space)
So, I think voting can be done by miners. Its clean and simple and pretty democratic. And because i dont think we are going to change interest every block, we can probably have more than one miner vote. If we change interest twice per day, then we will get about 720 votes anyways for each interest rate change.
Yes , miners would be a good method to cast vote for consensus . Would voting twice a day be necessary ,maybe once a week will get a solid interest rate which would give good enough time to gather up volume.
So miners voting method would work like this ,you leave your client staking then it grants you or allows you to make a selected desired interest rate or would it be in increments of some value ?
Basically yes, when you are staking you would be asked to cast a vote for inflation, deflation or no change in the wallet. No vote means no change. You can always change the vote later. When you are staking it will automatically cast your vote just by sending one of the outputs to the voting address. The only reason to change interest rates once per day would be so we can see results within a month or two. Since if we all choose to deflate first (which I assume we will) then it will take about 2 months to move the rate to 60% deflated or more. If we vote twice a day we can see that target sooner.
Also the question of how much should it be per day, should it be 1% or less?
I like the idea of an aggressive interest rate change because the markets are volatile and prices can swing pretty quickly so a faster interest rate would be able to absorb that. However, there is a question of when we can achieve stability and what that target price is.
I honestly doubt we can know the target price or the target amount of deflation because that is all going to depend on demand and what exchanges we get on.
So if for example, we change interest once per day. Miners find a block every minute more or less. So we should see about 1440 votes per day. Some miners would be voting more than once obviously which is fine since they win more blocks, so they deserve it.
I'm going to guess the price will really shoot up very high when we get to 90% deflation and more. But the market might surprise us and do it sooner. Then again, I can hold a special vote in my wallet for changing the interest rate potentially if its really needed. Those types of things will need to be decided eventually.
Also, its probably worth pointing out that the rate changes will probably not be compound. I'm thinking of making it a linear curve. So 1% for the first 50% then maybe .5% for the next 20% and so forth. But it might just be compound. Or I might have it be part of a parabolic equation that makes it move at 1% for a while and then as it approaches zero the rate of deflation slows down exponentially until it hits the maximum.
Because the system is fractional(not based on decimals or floating point numbers), I probably have to mark coins in billionths. Since you have at least 1 billion coins. Although I'm not sure I want to do that yet either. It really comes down to math and protocol.
As for time to gather volume, thats a good question. If we started at 100% inflated and just voted to deflate 1% per day, then how long will it take to see the volume spike? I'm going to guess that will happen as the people notice the price gradually rising. But maybe if it was slower it would also be better?! These are all really good questions. Again, I'm not sure anyone knows the best answer here. We are in complete NEW territory. This has never been done in the history of finance before. Although there are examples of countries doing market pegs... munti would know more about that than I would though.
Yeah very new territory for sure.
I had it in my head that when a miners is staking the client will automatically vote for the prefered interest change (inflation deflation or no change) the user selected by percentage starting at 1 percent everyday collecting data for 100 days ,so if someone wanted to deflat to 90 percent everyday till 90 days you will vote for deflation then the last 10 day no change. After all that data is collected by all the users the system will takes the highest deflation or inflation value and freezes that percentage of coins for 3 month and any new coins made from staking will also be frozen plus it would be cool to lower the staking to .01 percent to make things easer and inflation be less for the system.
Once the data is collect from the vote the system will check what the value is of bitbay in satoshi and maintain the increase percentage that was voted for, in this example 90 percent so the system will freeze and unfreeze coins to maintin that amount for three months.
Maybe just make it more simple what ever percentage the community votes on the system will just freeze that percentage from everyone cilent even the exchanges and that includes any new staked coins you get in your client for three months.
I like the ideas. Yet I have one other to throw out there. So yes I agree the miners should be the basis of the deciding factor as it give incentive for people to stake and support the blockchain. Yet as David's mentioned it's more geared for the heavily invested coin holders. I think we ought to give incentive to merchants as well to diversify. I'm sure the merchants will be using a lot of coins in DDE and thus won't have their true 'power of voice' over the investor miners. Yea, I'm sure the merchants will be staking whatever coins they have left over because they earn more coins, but it won't be the true potential they deserve. That being said I think their ought to be a multiplier effect based off a reputation system as well. It would help even the odds verses a group of individuals that are highly invested in the coin but don't use it for anything else. This gives the small 'fish' incentive to use the coin and gives their vote a much more even playing field.
David, what were your thoughts ^^
I didn't know if you missed the post or not?
February 05, 2016, 07:36:37 AM
Everything seems to have slowed down? Whats happening next please. Will will see lagging to the dollar before winter?
Do we still have the ailibaba link?
Don't get me wrong I think David is a great Deb and very active!
Do we still have the ailibaba link?
Don't get me wrong I think David is a great Deb and very active!
David mentioned recently all the core concepts should be complete by the end of the year.
Steven was the alibaba link and he's been absent from some time now.
February 04, 2016, 01:10:14 PM
Everything seems to have slowed down? Whats happening next please. Will will see lagging to the dollar before winter?
Do we still have the ailibaba link?
Don't get me wrong I think David is a great Deb and very active!
Do we still have the ailibaba link?
Don't get me wrong I think David is a great Deb and very active!
February 03, 2016, 06:14:56 PM
Is it possible to integrate BitBay with this?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1316199.0;topicseen
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1316199.0;topicseen
I guess it's possible since we have CLTV, but the question is why?
We have been able to do the same thing with our smart contracts for a year already. Actually I think our smart contracts are superior. The solution you are linking to requires every participating coin to have CLTV. The BitBay client can be used to trade any coin safe and decentralized.
Smart contracts are really nothing to do with it, its about cross chain transfers to exchange the usage of services on one blockchain with the token value of another, or perhaps simply trading one token for another trustlessly.
Would it be something like this, using sidechains:
I'd also like to congratulate the works for BitBay! Do your best!
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