Topic: Bitcoin all time high and the hoarding theory. (Poll included) - page 2. (Read 5278 times)

Lets say an very early adopter has paid lots of money for his mining equipment and bills but has chosen not to sell any of his bitcoins. If tomorrow bitcoin price collapses he will have a worse faith than someone who joined a year later than him but sold his bitcoins. Therefore In order to call it a pyramid scheme those early adopters should
1. make a financial gain bigger than the adopters that joined after him
 and
2. have a GUARANTEED PROFIT from the fact that others joined later. In our early adopter case neither is true. This could be the case with many bitcoiners which haven't yet recovered their investment which they made into mining while others who traded on the exchanges but joined later than them made much more money.

Bitcoin is not a pyramid scheme because
3. there's not a level of differentiation between joining dates of participants, only that you acquire more knowledge of the inner workings of Bitcoin.
also
4. you don't have to make a payment to join, you can merely offer your services in return for bitcoins and doesn't require you to buy or mine them, hence no initial payment is required for you to join. Overstock for example keeps 10% of bitcoins for their products. They haven't investment anything into bitcoin but still they can interact with some of the earliest adopters without Bitcoin making any distinctions between them.

The term "pyramid scheme" is charged, and often equated with "Ponzi scheme".

At least as an investment, Bitcoin is a pyramid scheme (though not a Ponzi scheme), in the sense that the earlier you got in, the more your investment will be worth, and without new blood entering, your investment doesn't grow.

The big difference to the usual pyramid schemes though is that in our case, it is just the bootstrapping phase of a peer to peer currency/store of wealth. In other words: it has to be a pyramid scheme, because it needs to start from nothing, and aims to grow to capture a huge market.

I don't know what you call a valid argument but you're wrong thinking I'm here to change your mind, your mind is already set so at least I can show to others how wrong you are.

of course it is, do your math and grow up.

Do you concur with him that Bitcoin is a pyramid scheme ?

I have nothing against someone who knows how to make money & diversify his/her portfolio, but when someone talks nonsense its worth pointing that out to them.

you need some time to understand the whole picture, but whatever....it is not expensive to go to the woods but it is expensive to quit your job to have time to spend with your family doing things you love anytime, well this is*priceless*.

you are still attacking me, you didn't provide a single valid argument against my arguments, another stupid post and you will go on my ignore list.

Like I said, some of the reactions in here are actually really pretty disappointing in their aggressiveness, including a number of posters that I thought would be better than that.

That said, your OP is a bit of a red cape: you're telling a forum full of (by and large) holders that a) you sold a substantial part of your holdings, and b) that you did so because you believe price will most likely not continue to go up in the near future.

What I'm trying to say is, some amount of disagreement is to be expected. But, yeah, the aggressive, personal tone that developed pretty soon isn't your fault.

Is it so expensive to wander in the woods nowadays that you need an investment ? :-)

Your investment isn't worth more because new users joined, but because Bitcoin is FINITE(current users will value 1 btc more tomorrow than they do today) & miners PAID MUCH MORE for their mining equipment & electricity bills(so they won't sell their mined bitcoins for less than it would take to recover their invesment). You understand Bitcoin worse than a newbie. You're really pathetic.

I don't need to justify my position, they turned this discussion about my personal decision... I pointed out that after I sold half of my stash my average cost now is $-400/Bitcoin so why would this be disappointing ? now even if bitcoin goes to zero I have nothing to lose, and thanks

ITT lots and lots of extremely skin thinned bulls in here. The rally so far not to your liking, gentlemen?

Anyway, ignoring all the bile being spread in this thread... enjoy your time off, mmitech. I agree what some have pointed out, that there would have probably been better times to sell than right now, from a purely economical perspective, but you don't need to justify your decision when and how much to sell one bit.

Very good points, Maok, and well said!!!   

We can only hope that mmitech will sell the other half of his bitcoins and remove himself from this poor investment called bitcoin.  Then the rest of us can suffer.  Mmitech, could you just sell all of your bitcoins and remove yourself from BTC and from this forum.  Thank you.

I largely agree with you, Maok; however, on a personal level, I do NOT really expect that individuals have a responsibility to invest back into bitcoin before they have a right to bragg.  For me, I did harp a little bit about mmitech's bragging b/c he seems to be acting as if he is some kind of wise / guru in his foresight in when he invested, and then that he made a profit and that he is getting out before the ship goes does... some kinds of implications like that.  

Certainly, NONE of us really know exactly the direction of bitcoin and the future, so surely it may be possible that mmitech guesses correctly and gets it right and bitcoin tanks tomorrow and then he has gotten his money out before the BIG BITCOIN CRASH.  YET>>> personally, I believe that the odds are considerably against mmitech having had bet correctly and on top of that I have already explained that it makes hardly any sense to take out 2 years worth of spending with your bitcoin proceeds at this particular moment, when it seems more likely than NOT that BTC prices are on their way UP rather than DOWN.  In other words, in my thinking, NOT only is mmitech lacking in a plan, he is lacking in any kind of meaningful ability to communicate why his investment decision to remove half of his bitcoin investment would be a prudent choice at this point in time.
 

The main reason that I came to this thread and commented here is b/c you and I seemed to be having a series of posts and discussions/debates in another thread and in one of the posts (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.7392143)  you referred me to this thread that you were making, which I presumed to be that you were explaining your investment plan, or something like that, but seems NOT

Here's another series from the thread too.  https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.7316589



Even though my language has seemed to become increasingly strong, b/c I have become increasingly irritated by the content of your posts, I have never really intended to personally attack you... or to call you dumb.. just to call your ideas dumb and lack of plan dumb and your seemingly lack of an ability to communicate dumb.  So, I apologize if you took any of my posts as personal attacks b/c they were NOT meant to be personal attacks.

NO DOUBT, I do stand by my previous statements, and to the extent that you are bringing up and/or framing some new or additional topic, at this point, I am NOT really interested in reading and/or attempting to understand the potentially fine details of any framing that you have b/c I have already come to realize that you seem to have a lot of real perverted thinking and logical connections that greatly are out of the range of anything that I consider to be valuable use of time to engage in such goofeyness.  I will glance through the remainder of this thread to see if there is any potential value or any way in which maybe my contribution may be helpful to others reading the thread... however, largely I believe that I have wasted enough of my time entertaining you various streams of consciousness to realize that they do NOT really seem to go anywhere that I find worth being.

you could vote for " go fuck your self" or " the OP is butt hurt" but you bitcoin fanatics are so bitchy when it comes to things that scares you....

OP sounds like a douche-bag.

So satoshi is a scumbag, huh. What about Leonardo da Vinci, or Beethoven?

I must admit , OP has some legit points!



MMITECH posted the anatomy of a bubble, this made my day!  

Thanks for that.

What´s next? Rpietila postin the south sea bubble chart?