bitcoin from illegal activities - page 2.

smooth

legendary

Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: MWesterweele on May 28, 2016, 05:07:10 PM

Bitcoin is always connected to illegal activities.Cause of its anonymous transactions and wireless transactions.Bitcoin are use to buy drugs online buy weapons and to some pornsites.Bitcoins can be use in all illegal activities online thats why bitcoin from illegal activities.Because bad people benefits of its features.

Porn sites (assuming they follow some basic rules on age of talent, etc.) are not illegal, at least not everywhere.

It is a good example though, of something that is often legal but still considered high risk and can cause problems with regulated entities, and also something that many people want to do but not be identified as doing.

MWesterweele

hero member

Activity: 1372

Merit: 564

Bitcoin is always connected to illegal activities.Cause of its anonymous transactions and wireless transactions.Bitcoin are use to buy drugs online buy weapons and to some pornsites.Bitcoins can be use in all illegal activities online thats why bitcoin from illegal activities.Because bad people benefits of its features.

jonathgb25

full member

Activity: 140

Merit: 100

★YoBit.Net★ 350+ Coins Exchange & Dice

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on January 05, 2016, 11:22:17 AM

Quote from: DannyHamilton on January 05, 2016, 10:57:22 AM

entirely possible that some services are being run by government agencies so that they can secretly maintain a database of the source and destination of each "mixed" quantity.

I think it is unlikely because taint is not proof of ownership.

Imagine the following scenario:

Alice sells 1 BTC worth of cocaine to an undercover DEA agent and
then sends that 1 BTC to Bob for a loan.

Bob tries to sell the 1 BTC to coinbase and cash it out.

DEA agents show up at Bob's house.

Bob says: "But that Bitcoin came from Alice! I never sold any cocaine!"

How does the DEA know whether the Bitcoin (which has 100% taint)
came from a third party or was simply passed from one address to
another? (They can't).

They can trace that if the bitcoins were not mixed and washed properly. You can do it by sending different amount of bitcoins to multiple addresses and mixing it again with new coins.

CreativeCarol

member

Activity: 70

Merit: 10

Bitcoin is just always going to have illegal activity available. It's really really hard to do certain things with Bitcoin because of the reputation. I keep trying to get random people like friends and whatnot to try it but they just don't care.

owm123

sr. member

Activity: 392

Merit: 250

Quote from: eternalgloom on February 07, 2016, 11:03:31 PM

Didn't the FBI auction a massive amount of coins from the Silk Road bust?
Those must've been as tainted as they could be, but does the auctioning provide some sort of provenance which 'washes' the coins?

Its tricky questions. I think they were "officially cleaned" by the fact that they were put on action by FBI. But then this would only be valid in USA. Thus ppl and exchanges using these coins in EU, Australia or whatever, could still find them as dirty. USA law does not apply outside USA.

eternalgloom

legendary

Activity: 1792

Merit: 1283

Didn't the FBI auction a massive amount of coins from the Silk Road bust?
Those must've been as tainted as they could be, but does the auctioning provide some sort of provenance which 'washes' the coins?

owm123

sr. member

Activity: 392

Merit: 250

Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on February 07, 2016, 09:57:45 PM

Quote from: franky1 on January 05, 2016, 11:56:53 AM

Quote from: StevenS on January 05, 2016, 11:52:37 AM

Quote from: franky1 on January 05, 2016, 11:30:51 AM

future solution
make silk road only use 'dash' (darkcoin)
then let the druggies play with dash coins illegally and then swap for clean bitcoins. that way bitcoin doesnt touch silkroad directly

That would make 'dash' less valuable (and likely much more volatile) than Bitcoin.

Who would "make" them use a particular coin?

well what do you think dash was invented for..
the whole point of dash's extra anonymity features was to be used for the dark market.. so let them play with the dark market and sever bitcoins tie to that stuff

Franky, do you have any sort of reference for this? And I'm not challenging you, I'm just curious and I've never used anything on the dark market myself. I'm curious but not that curious, so I don't know who takes Dash there. If anyone. Seems like it would be a good coin to buy illegal stuff with, and I know it was originally called Darkcoin.

There are reports of some darknet markets adopting dash/darkcoin, e.g.,
http://www.tripwire.com/state-of-security/latest-security-news/silk-road-reloaded-adopts-i2p-anonymous-network-and-darkcoins/

But in minority. Most darknet is using Bitcoin, and no one is going to change this anytime soon. One reason is that there is entire market there for "cleaning" the bitcoins using mixers, or what not. Non of these services will allow real anon coins to take over, as they will lose their "small fees" for the cleaning. Second reason is that Bitcoins are easier to buy and sell with cash, without any exchanges. You can only get anon coins on exchanges.

The Sceptical Chymist

legendary

Activity: 3528

Merit: 7005

Top Crypto Casino

Quote from: franky1 on January 05, 2016, 11:56:53 AM

Quote from: StevenS on January 05, 2016, 11:52:37 AM

Quote from: franky1 on January 05, 2016, 11:30:51 AM

future solution
make silk road only use 'dash' (darkcoin)
then let the druggies play with dash coins illegally and then swap for clean bitcoins. that way bitcoin doesnt touch silkroad directly

That would make 'dash' less valuable (and likely much more volatile) than Bitcoin.

Who would "make" them use a particular coin?

well what do you think dash was invented for..
the whole point of dash's extra anonymity features was to be used for the dark market.. so let them play with the dark market and sever bitcoins tie to that stuff

Franky, do you have any sort of reference for this? And I'm not challenging you, I'm just curious and I've never used anything on the dark market myself. I'm curious but not that curious, so I don't know who takes Dash there. If anyone. Seems like it would be a good coin to buy illegal stuff with, and I know it was originally called Darkcoin.

PakistanHockeyfan

member

Activity: 98

Merit: 10

Bitcoin no longer has that many illegal practices as of now. If we were to focus on more routes of making sure money laundering is no longer happening within Bitcoin, we would be fine in terms of having a better reputation for Bitcoin. Bitcoin will indeed be the future of money if we just focus on making it better.

owm123

sr. member

Activity: 392

Merit: 250

Quote from: maokoto on January 12, 2016, 09:42:33 AM

In my view, is the activity that is tainted, not the coins. Lets say something receives X ammount of BTC for selling drugs. Then he pays X ammount to buy a tablet in a site accepting Bitcoin. Part of the coins are now in the hands of the merchant who sold the tablet.... how can that money be considered "tainted"? He obtained it lawfully.

Yes, but this works for fiat money, as there is law that says that with each transaction, cash looses its history. Thus cash is fungibile. For bitcoin, there is no such law.
http://jpkoning.blogspot.co.id/2016/01/what-makes-money-special-lawyers.html

And even if there was, where would it be? usa only? what about all other countries? Its a lot of problems. So merchants may prefere to avoid tainted coins and work with blockchain analytics companies. For example, it seems bitpay is already doing exactly this by working with chainalysis company and actively rejecting tainted coins:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4012hu/bitpay_is_actively_cooperating_with_chainalysis/

which explains this previous post:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3mea6b/bitpay_is_blacklisting_certain_bitcoins_rejecting

maokoto

hero member

Activity: 770

Merit: 500

✪ NEXCHANGE | BTC, LTC, ETH & DOGE ✪

In my view, is the activity that is tainted, not the coins. Lets say something receives X ammount of BTC for selling drugs. Then he pays X ammount to buy a tablet in a site accepting Bitcoin. Part of the coins are now in the hands of the merchant who sold the tablet.... how can that money be considered "tainted"? He obtained it lawfully.

praprata

sr. member

Activity: 420

Merit: 250

Quote from: blackmachinegun on January 11, 2016, 11:46:27 AM

Quote from: gilangIDR on January 09, 2016, 08:23:40 PM

bitcoin significantly is not illegal. which makes it illegal is how to use it.

I think bitcoin is also illegal, according to the government
because there are no rules and regulations to regulate the bitcoin
That's why bitcoin illegal and banned in many countries

If there is no rule about that bitcoin illegal is I think is just legal.
For me bitcoin is always have been legal is just how use it what he said.

If you do it illegal things than you are not that always save. So just do bitcoin for legal things.

Indianacoin

sr. member

Activity: 406

Merit: 252

I wish there was a burning feature for tainted coins in exchange with a freshly prepared coins.

Let us assume A sold cocaine(from a fake address) to B(an Undercover agent) for BTC. Now after B pays him, A then transfers the coins to a so-called "furnace wallet" where those tainted coins gets burned for a freshly generated coins in lieu of some transaction fees. And the whole process of burning and generating is to be done by miners for some extra subsidy. So that even if A cashes out the daughter coins, B will never be able to identify him in any way. Neither will he be able to perform taint analysis (https://blockchain.info/taint) anymore Wink

But this feature is a tough one to implement.

rustynailer

hero member

Activity: 725

Merit: 501

Boycott Qatar 2022

Quote from: blackmachinegun on January 11, 2016, 11:46:27 AM

Quote from: gilangIDR on January 09, 2016, 08:23:40 PM

bitcoin significantly is not illegal. which makes it illegal is how to use it.

I think bitcoin is also illegal, according to the government
because there are no rules and regulations to regulate the bitcoin
That's why bitcoin illegal and banned in many countries

That's not how things work, every new invention is legal until your gov makes a law that says otherwise and not everything has to be regulated.

blackmachinegun

hero member

Activity: 532

Merit: 500

Quote from: gilangIDR on January 09, 2016, 08:23:40 PM

bitcoin significantly is not illegal. which makes it illegal is how to use it.

I think bitcoin is also illegal, according to the government
because there are no rules and regulations to regulate the bitcoin
That's why bitcoin illegal and banned in many countries

Blawpaw

legendary

Activity: 1596

Merit: 1027

Quote from: indbitcoin on January 05, 2016, 10:43:17 AM

I'm curious now what they called the bitcoin from illegal activities. I know it but just forgot the term they called it. Just like the bitcoin from alphabay and other sites from tor. I wanna know how they make it become clean bitcoin except using mixers. Maybe there is a wallet now that will make it a fresh bitcoin without the stain from illegal activities. Or it still the mixers they used?

I guess it is the same with cash. How many paper notes do we use every day that are tainted with criminal activity? Every form of money will always be used for criminal activity one way or another...

rustynailer

hero member

Activity: 725

Merit: 501

Boycott Qatar 2022

TLDR: step into my van

iCEBREAKER

legendary

Activity: 2156

Merit: 1072

Crypto is the separation of Power and State.

Quote from: ObscureBean on January 11, 2016, 12:15:18 AM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on January 10, 2016, 10:51:26 PM

How exactly does this technique make it more private? Ok so he's not buying Bitcoin directly from a regular exchange but he's still receiving it to a BTC address of his choice. Wouldn't it be possible to still link the transaction to him same as if he'd bought it from a regular exchange? I've never been interested to learn about mixers or other anonymization techniques so I could be missing something here.

TLDR: The XMR.to Bitcoins received in the last step are free of any taint accrued by the original Bitcoins sent to Shapeshift.

The XMR intermediary point makes them anonymous, because a key feature of Monero is that transactions are unlinkable.

That feature is inherited from Monero's Cryptonote protocol, which uses ring signatures and stealth addresses in a type of zero-knowledge (homomorphic) encryption.

Mixers are not zero-knowledge; they only obfuscate, always leak information, and may be unraveled given sufficient scrutiny. They require trust; Monero does not.

You're in for a treat; start here: https://downloads.getmonero.org/whitepaper_annotated.pdf

PS

PT's technique can be perfected by transferring (with a healthy mixin) the xmr between two separate wallets you control. That ensures your privacy even if both Shapeshift and xmr.to are compromised (or even full blown, cooperating adversaries).

rustynailer

hero member

Activity: 725

Merit: 501

Boycott Qatar 2022

Quote from: smooth on January 11, 2016, 05:40:28 AM

Interesting. What does this have to do with Monero code quality, besides nothing at all?

Where have I said anything about Monero's code quality.

smooth

legendary

Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: rustynailer on January 11, 2016, 05:29:07 AM

Quote from: smooth on January 11, 2016, 04:48:54 AM

Quote from: rustynailer on January 11, 2016, 04:41:52 AM

Quote from: smooth on January 11, 2016, 04:15:57 AM

Quote from: rustynailer on January 11, 2016, 03:49:40 AM

I had no idea that the older tweets from Peter Todd are to be disregarded, how silly of me.

Not silly at all, just dishonest.

When the same person writes about lousy code and then later writes about how the same code has been cleaned up, then yes it is pretty clear that the older comment no longer applies.

Lol I was wondering if you were going to turn up here.

How is it dishonest, I just took a screen cap of the tweet and made it the approximate size of the other one and also I didn't see the need to include all the other irrelevant stuff there as well, for example facebook likes and shares and retweets. I would have had to include all that other meaningless crap just to include the date. There was no intention of deceiving anyone its just a tweet for a tweet thing. Here is the whole thing: https://twitter.com/petertoddbtc/status/507427225927708672

And you are doing the same shit as icebreaker, attack me instead of the point I have raised. Good luck with that strategy.

You raised no meaningful point, since the older tweet you posted is clearly superseded by the newer tweet where he says the code has been cleaned up.

BTW, since you obviously didn't even bother reading the thread before you started posting obviously stupid nonsense, I didn't "turn up", I was already here discussing the Bitcoin fungibility issue, not the off-topic garbage about Monero code you posted.

You are one of the most deceitful persons on this forum and have zero credibility in my book, what off-topic garbage Monero code did I post here. I just put a PT tweet up as a response to the other PT tweet.

Being a Peter Todd tweet does not make it on topic. The first tweet was about services that add to Bitcoin privacy, clearly on topic.

The (out of date) tweet you posted was about Monero code quality. That has nothing to do with Bitcoin privacy and clearly off topic.

Quote

And the point I made is that none of you Monero ~~scammers~~ ~~shills~~ ~~devs~~ retards have addressed is: "The whole fucking point of bitcoin and especially any anon currency is to not have to trust 3rd parties for your transactions".

Interesting. What does this have to do with Monero code quality, besides nothing at all?

Topic: bitcoin from illegal activities - page 2. (Read 5690 times)