Topic: Bitcoin isn't worth it for consumers. And that will stop adoption. - page 3. (Read 9891 times)

Still that has nothing to do with uncovering identities.


Plain wrong. IP address identifies a place on Earth, even not identity.

not all transactions of a currency involve every-day consumer purchases. IE sending money to a relative in another country, or paying for a very expensive item.

Well no matter how many time you have to mention Tor there isn't any anonymity in bitcoin. Only pseudonymity.
Every transaction is logged in a public ledger which is the blockchain. Ip addresses have nothing to do with it.

Well, at least you would know the contents of everything that flows through those exitnodes. And I bet they do.

Exit node does not know where the source node is. It's the chain of proxies. SR has fallen not because they outsmarted Tor, but because DPR had some pretty stupid social-related errors in online behaviour.

At the beginning, no one knew what was going to happen exactly. Who could predict 1k$/btc in 2013. I regret buying 3 ASIC machines now because if I kept all those coins, I would have much more money now, but I'm not regret it too much because that's sort of illogical backward thinking. Bitcoin must get fairly stable over time, so even regular consumers are expected to kick in, not just junkies. All of that is ofc just my opinion...

TOR isn't safe to use imo. Chances are you will be on every spy agencies radar just because of it. They are likely sitting at/running many exit nodes themselves. Silk Road owner believed to be anonymous as well. Look where it got him.

Bitcoin is not going to be used by consumers at all. In fact, if you did so you must be stupid. Not all that long ago I paid 2000 Dollars for a few riser cables worth 20 bucks. Just glad that was the only thing I ever purchased. I will never ever use bitcoin again to buy anything but fiat. You may not like this idea, but you must be insane otherwise. The only incentive for people to use bitcoin other than to try to buy drugs or guns would be to get products/goods/service 100% tax free. This is not going to happen because of regulation.

If, and this is a big if, any crypto currency will be used for anything besides speculation or money laundering/tax evasion/hedge against inflation, it will be a much less valuable super fast currency. I have my doubts it would be stable enough price wise though.

In the olden days -say 40 years ago- world travelers and explorers would buy a Rolex or another gold watch, as it translates into money everywhere. As internet reaches a worldwide spread, accessing bitcoin will be possible everywhere. This goes ofcourse not only for kidnapped adventurers, but the pro's to Bitcoin definitely exceed the lack of transfer fee's for shopkeepers.

How many f. times I have to mention Tor around? F. connect to it and all your anonimity problems are gone. Literally.


Not essentially the problem with this type of transactions...


Good reputable escrow is enough.


Bitpay?

Exactly, I'd rather use MasterCard PayPass or Visa payWave.

If we have to install bitcoin acceptance machines at Starbucks, that's going to add to costs. People forget that and point to the fact that it is cheaper theoretically, but not practically. Add wifi, a terminal and the need to secure the machine and lost business due to people waiting in line for confirmations before they are allowed to leave. You can argue to use off-chain transactions, but why not use cards that are off-chain too? It defeats the purpose of bitcoin, it isn't even using bitcoin to be technically correct. You aren't transferring anything, you are just changing numbers on the screen like the card companies do when you buy something.

Wealth store? Bleh, that's fake. Remember you can only consume more in the future when there is real economic growth. If people start to create less things, you should actually consume now rather than put your money into assets. If no one can buy those assets in the future, your wealth is eroded anyway. The only reason why gold is going up is because people can afford it. If they can't, then it can't go up.

The best solution is to invest in real economic growth. That's why you have the shale industry evolving even though it's short lived. It's so there is more stuff to consume. The fact is we are running out of things to consume, that will destroy wealth. Not the fact that your money or bitcoins are worth less. That's just the symptom. If we all created more things to trade with, we wouldn't be worried about hedging wealth.

You can't store wealth unless you believe that there will be a similar amount of production per capita in the future. Even then it's not really hedged! Climate Change and Famine. That's going to screw us all up.

Thus the only true users of bitcoin are the consumers. People that need to buy drugs without entrapment and more. People that can afford to use it.

Robert Metcalfe didn't give us google, linked-in and facebook. Neither did Tim Berners-Lee. To suppose that Gavin needs to do it all is folly.

This is something that bothers me. How will it work when bitcoins are accepted everywhere? Will I go to Starbucks, pay and then wait 10 minutes before getting my coffee???

Anonymity? Wait, Bitcoin doesn't have that.

Faster transactions? Wait, Bitcoin doesn't have that.

Protection against fraudulent merchants? Wait, Bitcoin doesn't have that.

More merchants because easier to signup? Wait, Bitcoin doesn't have that.

Actually the chargebacks could be accomplished decentralized with Bitcoin's M of N signers capability.

You're forgetting one key property: that is anonymity. Black-market consumers are absolutely motivated for crypto use, and guess what... that's enough for initial healthy rise. Remember, SR was the first one, then came speculators. And it's only just begun. Primary markets are black, until it's big enough to be stable, and when it becomes stable - regular consumers will kick in massively. I give 1 year until we see relatively stable Bitcoin.

theoretically the overhead in using Bitcoin is lower, thus you can carry lower prices in real terms.

building all this business structure on top of bitcoin somewhat cancels out this effect however.  Certainly having all this expensive mining structure certainly brings Bitcoins general value proposition into question.

Almost nobody is accepting Bitcoins for products that don't have huge markups. Look in "Goods". It's like reading Craigslist. Keychains, necklaces, old stamps, books, games, and coins, "Fake G-Shock Watches" (Why? Real ones are only about $50), and other garage-sale junk.  Plus various Bitcoin-related items. Also silver and gold, just the thing to buy from an anonymous party using an irrevocable money transfer, and usually being sold at a big markup.

Take a look at BitPay's merchant list. It's mostly stuff that doesn't cost much, if anything, to make, has a huge markup, or is drug-related. T-shirts, stock graphics, web hosting, etc. Bitcoinshop.us has real products like laptops, but the first product they list, an "ASUS G750JX-DB71 17.3-Inch Laptop (Black)" is ฿2.4559, (times Bitstamp price of $825/BTC = $2026). Amazon offers that at $1,808.98.

That's what Bitcoin retail looks like. Lame.

Bitcoin just isn't being used seriously as a currency.

then stop quoting/replying to me...

my post wasn't for u in the first place...

Have a nice day..

First, your caps crap, doesn't emphasis your point any better.  It's just annoying actually.  Second, you quoted the "dining" scenario and are now running from it.  Pick a position and stick with it.

If you read my comments on the subject, you'll see I clearly stated, "likely to be worked out in the coming decade."  So, the rest of your rant was really a waste of my time to read and your time to type.

So in short...good for merchants, terrible for consumers.  At least for now.  Got it.

What happens if you haven't and you will never in your life acquire 100 bitcoins?