Topic: Bitcoin transaction Times SUCK - page 4. (Read 6324 times)

See, that is the real problem. You have obviously no idea, how a double spend works, if you say, you have to trust/hope, that no double spend occurs.
That is just not how Bitcoin works.
There is also no third party that guarantees, that you really got your money when someone paid with a credit card. I don't know, why it is so hard to understand that a charge back can occur 6 months later. A charge back can occur= no guarantee that you really got your money.
Got it? Or do I have to rephrase it again?

So, for the people, who neither understand Credit Cards nor Bitcoin, it should be enough to understand: Bitcoin transactions are instant and please don't try to tell them anything about confirmations or double spends. They most probably will get it wrong.

BTC transaction time right now is more than hour on average. I think there is a problem and hope it will be solved 

For daily transactions, I would be happy to accept an transaction with no confirmation. As long as

Bitcoin fees aren't high at all. It is still quite low compared to how much the bank/credit card company charges the shop or customer. For larger transactions, as long as >0.0001BTC is included, the confirmation would likely be quite fast.

The problem is different with chargeback. When paying with a card you trust the operators and so does the merchant. He trusts that the money will come into his account, because a third party takes care of it and vouches for it.
With a 0 confirmation Bitcoin transaction the merchant cannot trust anyone, the best is to hope that the transaction will happen and it is not a double-spend or not in a sidechain (by chance). This is a consequence of bitcoin removing trust from the equation. A benefit, and a drawback some other times.


If you look at it like this, bitcoin only for developers and tech-savy people, then you are narrowing down the potential user base to an awfully small group. After this you won't be able to argue that "bitcoin will be adopted", "the price will rise" and the usual things (that people say when first reading about bitcoin but not giving any thought to it.. If you want mass adoption then you have to make it straightforward, fast and reliable: easily available for the majority of the public.

I don't think there is a problem with a 10min, 1hour or even a 6hour transaction, in the case where you want to send money across the border from Russia to Mexico. Who cares about a few hours when it goes across the world? (although if it gets to 12 hours+ then it can get annoying) The problem is when you want to buy something local e.g. I meet someone in a café or at home and want to buy his bike/computer etc. I wouldn't want to wait 6 hours to see if the transaction really happened. Although I am not aware of any solution that would solve this problem without introducing trust in the system somewhere or the "obvious" solution of "add more fees".

I personally don't even mind a 3 day transaction of 10$ on my own if I can be sure (100% certainty) that the funds will be transferred, no matter what.If there is a chance that it will not go through because of network spam or similar, then I couldn't consider the system reliable any more and so the public probably neither.

Never.

Mathematic probality and timing diffusion of a global network.



that's why NASDAQ computer are 5 meters to the stock exchange to work at the nanosecond.



Bitcoin don't do that.
It connect every person everywhere in the world.



Mastercard don't does this (censorship against country).
Banks don't do this (freeze and limited wire and cash retrieve).

When hashing power drops 50% than avg. confirmation times doubles.
When hashing power drops 10% than avg. confirmation increases ~11%
This effect holds on for 2016 blocks.

So, no, unless you expect big drops all the time, there won't be a noticeable increase in blocktime.

hahaha.  Bitcoin is supposed to be about perpetual inflation and no fees?  no I think that is a different protocol.

When mining decreases, you should expect longer intervals between blocks.
If you don't like this fact, you should be using a different protocol.

With the fee pressure, mining has increased, but it had been decreasing prior to that.

We get to chose between: Longer between blocks, or more fees and higher bitcoin mining and valuation.

Orchestrating a double-spend at a bar or restaurant would be more complicated and expensive than earning that money and paying your bill... The answer is that people are hysterical. They are non-technical non-developers and cry about 10 minute confirmations or long waiting times. They have illusions about what is and isn't, and feel clever when they complain.

If you don't like or understand it, stop using Bitcoin and leave. Bitcoin is for a new generation of economically empowered individuals who wish to put their trust in mathematics rather than human beings. Just consider that some of the same people whining could be working at a bank and handling your money in the same, callous and uninformed manner. No thank you. If someone feels addressed by this, by all means, please go back to Paypal. 

We should just never have told anybody about confirmations.
Bitcoin are send instantly. I never waited long after paying for my beer, since the barman accepts 0-confirmation transactions.
People handle Bitcoin like there are double spend attacks all the time. Maybe I am in the wrong sections of this forum, but I don't see them anywhere.
Where are all this double spends, that justify waiting 6 confirmations to be sure for a >$10 item?
So, the fault is with the merchants. Do they wait 6 months to accept a credit card payments, since it could be charged back in this time? No? Why are they doing this with bitcoin? A 0-confirmations Bitcoin transaction is safer, than waiting a month after getting paid with a credit card.

There is no other solution as of yet that I would know of. It is as you described, bitcoin is fast and cheap or rather fast or cheap 
(Although in most cases probably still cheaper than traditional systems, it just became "less cheap" and also still faster)

A saying comes to my head: "Our company works fast, good and cheap. You can choose two of these".

Splurge on the extra $0.0003 and go to the head of the line with a 10010 satoshi fee.  Its crowded at 10K.

I sold some alts today to a guy who paid me BTC. I was not releasing escrow before his payment would have at least 1 confirmation, so I kind of felt like a jerk to keep him waiting. Still I got first confirmation in 12 minutes, so it was ok.

Yes this doesn't prove the problem doesn't exist, I just didn't experienced it today.

Okay I just had my nightmare. When I transferred my blockchain funds to my other wallet. It took almost 24 hours after confirmation. It got 100+ confirmations but it still shows pending on my account on the other wallet. I got worried abit but all is good now.

And it's the confirmations that some transactions rely on in order for the transaction to actually process for the user to get their purchase. 

As far as others saying the answer is to raise fees... I totally disagree.  Fees are already too high.  It's disrespectful and represents a defeatist attitude towards bitcoin to impose such high transaction fees as if this is what bitcoin is supposed to be about. 

This is the worst possible solution you guys have "include more fees for faster transaction"

So let me get this straight, Bitcoin says 10 minute confirms yet delivers 30 minute to 2 hours (or maybe more I guess from reading some of these posts). So now it can't come thru with the first advertised benefit, so the first thing the bitcoin gurus come up with to compensate for the broken system is "include more fees for faster transaction" So now lets take the second advertised benefit and destroy that to, So basically what i can read here if I were a new user is Bitcoin promotes itself as a fast transaction with low fees, yet it does not provide actual fast transactions unless you pay a high fee, so at the end of the day what ambition do new users have to adapt to Bitcoin if they are in the same boat as sending cash with Western union?

So now for a new user looking  to get into bitcoin the only thing they have going for them is anonymity which actually if you are not careful is not as anonymous as they preach. So I have to ask you guys out there who love Bitcoin so darn much, if the developers cant deliver on their fast transactions, and if you want fast transactions you have to pay more in fees, and it can be tracked easier than lead on to be, what real benefit do new users have to adapt and use it.

Sure www.stakeminers.com/transactions2.php then just follow those transaction on pages 2 thru 4 and you can see some of the transaction times. now on page one I lowered the fee and those ones are not the transactions I am complaining about I am complaining about the high priority transactions that take 30 minutes to 2 hours for 1 confirm.

You: "What are you saying?"
Me: "Sure, if it's 9 hours you got a point"
You: "it take 1 days until now and I havent got my confirmation"

Me: Sure, a day is longer then 9 hours, so, yes, I do understand your frustration.

Not really, only the confirmations have taken longer time lately.

In the "traditional" system there is a developed trust between parties. So even if it takes 30 days for a card payment to clear, I can eat my burger that I bought 30seconds ago right away, without having to wait a month.

On that note, I don't really mind waiting for my coins to arrive when I am receiving them. I know they will be there. However when I send and it takes exceptionally long it gets frustrating. Maybe there could be a time forecast feature telling how long it will take approximately with x amount of fee instead of "include more fees for faster transaction". I don't want to over-pay, just make it go through in a reasonable amount of time.

While there's nothing more we can do to it at our level as a user and community member to change the code, what we can do is either to look for alternatives like altcoins or just simply adjust the way on how we use the coin in order to adapt to the system. Increasing transaction fee is of course one of them. Instead of retail spending perhaps you can make use of it as cross border payment method. That is much faster than any of the money transfer service.