Bitcoinica MtGox account compromised - page 34.

Mt.Gox Support

vip

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Quote from: tbcoin on July 13, 2012, 08:24:04 AM

Bitcoins ok, but how 40k dollars disappear? how withdrawn? I do not know how mtgox codes work, but you can not really know where are redeemed? Other options dwolla? OKPAY? Bitinstant? LR? I really can't believe that you can move dollars without knowing where, how and to whom.

We know how and where the USD moved, but unfortunately those funds are not under our control anymore.

BadBitcoin (James Sutton)

donator

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Ok, so, class action lawsuit now?

Come-from-Beyond

legendary

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Newbie

Quote from: tbcoin on July 13, 2012, 08:24:04 AM

Bitcoins ok, but how 40k dollars disappear? how withdrawn? I do not know how mtgox codes work, but you can not really know where are redeemed? Other options dwolla? OKPAY? Bitinstant? LR? I really can't believe that you can move dollars without knowing where, how and to whom.

Could the thief buy BTC with 40k USD and transfer with the other BTC?

muyuu

donator

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Hi peeps, I'm late to the party.

Jeebus almighty. 350K US$ this time?

LOL. Crooks must love Bitcoinica.

hazek

legendary

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Quote from: proudhon on July 13, 2012, 08:40:56 AM

This.

Actually I was wrong. Read above.

Vod

legendary

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Licking my boob since 1970

Quote from: Jointops420 on July 13, 2012, 08:39:25 AM

It all seems to convenient to me. After the previous hacks to allow this to happen is b/s.
Another cluster fuck that dirties the Bitcoin name again. I cant wait for the day when inept companies like this are a thing of the past and are stories to be told to scare children.

You'll be waiting a long time.

As long as there are people who allow it to happen (see post right above mine - "move on, accept our losses"), scams like this will continue!

proudhon

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: ninjarobot on July 13, 2012, 08:28:37 AM

Quote from: hazek on July 13, 2012, 07:19:06 AM

Quote from: hatshepsut on July 13, 2012, 06:22:49 AM

Quote from: HorseRider on July 13, 2012, 06:16:00 AM

No, this is not the users' fault. Why should the bitcoinica users eat all the loss?

+1

It makes no sense to make us eat the loss. That is their own fault. They need to all stop taking a paycheck like Zhou did and/or start eating muesli with even cheaper milk and cough up the money out of pocket.

Some of us have undeniable proof and we want our money back.

Actually they need to honor their terms of use their clients agreed to and if they didn't make any guarantees about security they're off the hook and it's the client's fault for putting money someplace where such guarantees weren't made.

From the Bitcoinica ToS:

Quote

[12] Limitation of Liability

IN NO EVENT SHALL BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES BE LIABLE FOR LOST PROFITS OR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH OUR WEB SITE, OUR SERVICES OR THIS AGREEMENT (HOWEVER ARISING, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE) EXCEPT AS STATED IN THIS AGREEMENT. THE LIABILITY OF BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES, TO YOU OR ANY THIRD PARTIES IN ANY PROVEN CIRCUMSTANCE IS LIMITED TO THE AMOUNT OF MONEY YOU TRANSFERRED OR DEPOSITED IN YOUR ACCOUNT AT BITCOINICA IN RELATION TO THE TRANSACTION GIVING RISE TO SUCH LIABILITY. In the case where you make funds available for trading via a voucher, "coupon code", or similar from another financial service, banking institution or exchange, you acknolwedge that you are providing Bitcoinica access to those funds for trading purposes only and that the originating financial institution is the holder of such deposits. Bitcoinica is not liable for any loss if such institutions fail in honoring withdrawal of customer funds.

Shouldn't you have put this part in bold:

Quote

IN NO EVENT SHALL BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES BE LIABLE FOR LOST PROFITS OR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH OUR WEB SITE, OUR SERVICES OR THIS AGREEMENT (HOWEVER ARISING, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE)

Face it people. You agreed to use a service without even a promise that they'll be liable to you if they are negligent. So if you're looking for the guilty you need only look in the mirror.

This. Can we just move on from this, please? But this whole thing has been an absolute blight on this project for most of this year. Let's move on, accept our losses, and agree not to use flashy looking bitcoin websites designed by 17 years olds. The silver lining out of this is that a bunch of people, myself included, have been reminded of one of the most valuable things about bitcoin - that you can secure it yourself and make stealing it over the internet practically impossible. Of course, that that can be done fairly simply highlights those working at bitcoinica's negligence.

hazek

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Quote from: sadpandatech on July 13, 2012, 08:35:18 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: ninjarobot on July 13, 2012, 08:28:37 AM

Quote

[12] Limitation of Liability

IN NO EVENT SHALL BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES BE LIABLE FOR LOST PROFITS OR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH OUR WEB SITE, OUR SERVICES OR THIS AGREEMENT (HOWEVER ARISING, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE) EXCEPT AS STATED IN THIS AGREEMENT. THE LIABILITY OF BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES, TO YOU OR ANY THIRD PARTIES IN ANY PROVEN CIRCUMSTANCE IS LIMITED TO THE AMOUNT OF MONEY YOU TRANSFERRED OR DEPOSITED IN YOUR ACCOUNT AT BITCOINICA IN RELATION TO THE TRANSACTION GIVING RISE TO SUCH LIABILITY. In the case where you make funds available for trading via a voucher, "coupon code", or similar from another financial service, banking institution or exchange, you acknolwedge that you are providing Bitcoinica access to those funds for trading purposes only and that the originating financial institution is the holder of such deposits. Bitcoinica is not liable for any loss if such institutions fail in honoring withdrawal of customer funds.

Shouldn't you have put this part in bold:

Quote

IN NO EVENT SHALL BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES BE LIABLE FOR LOST PROFITS OR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH OUR WEB SITE, OUR SERVICES OR THIS AGREEMENT (HOWEVER ARISING, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE)

Face it people. You agreed to use a service without even a promise that they'll be liable to you if they are negligent. So if you're looking for the guilty you need only look in the mirror.

You're reading it wrong. That statement you posted is not undoing the first in bold. First is to do with 'deposits' and the second with your 'earnings' or lack thereof.

Whoops you are right. I made mistake and I decided to delete my post.

Jointops420

full member

Activity: 132

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It all seems to convenient to me. After the previous hacks to allow this to happen is b/s.
Another cluster fuck that dirties the Bitcoin name again. I cant wait for the day when inept companies like this are a thing of the past and are stories to be told to scare children.

Gabi

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If you want to walk on water, get out of the boat

vampire

hero member

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So let me see:

So so called security experts:

Use a mailing list for admin access
Don't disable remote root on VPS
Don't have have offsite backups in 3 different physical location, encrypted
Don't use unique passwords for their accounts
Don't secure their clients' money with two factor authentication
Don't change passwords after their compromise

sadpandatech

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: ninjarobot on July 13, 2012, 08:28:37 AM

Quote

[12] Limitation of Liability

IN NO EVENT SHALL BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES BE LIABLE FOR LOST PROFITS OR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH OUR WEB SITE, OUR SERVICES OR THIS AGREEMENT (HOWEVER ARISING, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE) EXCEPT AS STATED IN THIS AGREEMENT. THE LIABILITY OF BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES, TO YOU OR ANY THIRD PARTIES IN ANY PROVEN CIRCUMSTANCE IS LIMITED TO THE AMOUNT OF MONEY YOU TRANSFERRED OR DEPOSITED IN YOUR ACCOUNT AT BITCOINICA IN RELATION TO THE TRANSACTION GIVING RISE TO SUCH LIABILITY. In the case where you make funds available for trading via a voucher, "coupon code", or similar from another financial service, banking institution or exchange, you acknolwedge that you are providing Bitcoinica access to those funds for trading purposes only and that the originating financial institution is the holder of such deposits. Bitcoinica is not liable for any loss if such institutions fail in honoring withdrawal of customer funds.

Shouldn't you have put this part in bold:

Quote

IN NO EVENT SHALL BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES BE LIABLE FOR LOST PROFITS OR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH OUR WEB SITE, OUR SERVICES OR THIS AGREEMENT (HOWEVER ARISING, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE)

Face it people. You agreed to use a service without even a promise that they'll be liable to you if they are negligent. So if you're looking for the guilty you need only look in the mirror.

You're reading it wrong. That statement you posted is not undoing the first in bold. First is to do with 'deposits' and the second with your 'earnings' or lack thereof.

flower1024

legendary

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TOS does not break local law
LP does not help if the businness owners do BS

Bitcoin Oz

hero member

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Wat

One does not simply transfer 40 grand in Mordor.

Vod

legendary

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Licking my boob since 1970

Quote from: genjix on July 13, 2012, 04:00:07 AM

40k USD and 40k BTC were stolen (~350k USD).

"Stolen"? Police report or it didn't happen.

ninjarobot

hero member

Activity: 761

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Mine Silent, Mine Deep

Quote from: hazek on July 13, 2012, 07:19:06 AM

Quote from: hatshepsut on July 13, 2012, 06:22:49 AM

Quote from: HorseRider on July 13, 2012, 06:16:00 AM

No, this is not the users' fault. Why should the bitcoinica users eat all the loss?

+1

It makes no sense to make us eat the loss. That is their own fault. They need to all stop taking a paycheck like Zhou did and/or start eating muesli with even cheaper milk and cough up the money out of pocket.

Some of us have undeniable proof and we want our money back.

Actually they need to honor their terms of use their clients agreed to and if they didn't make any guarantees about security they're off the hook and it's the client's fault for putting money someplace where such guarantees weren't made.

From the Bitcoinica ToS:

Quote

[12] Limitation of Liability

IN NO EVENT SHALL BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES BE LIABLE FOR LOST PROFITS OR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH OUR WEB SITE, OUR SERVICES OR THIS AGREEMENT (HOWEVER ARISING, INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE) EXCEPT AS STATED IN THIS AGREEMENT. THE LIABILITY OF BITCOINICA, ITS OFFICERS, DIRECTORS OR EMPLOYEES, TO YOU OR ANY THIRD PARTIES IN ANY PROVEN CIRCUMSTANCE IS LIMITED TO THE AMOUNT OF MONEY YOU TRANSFERRED OR DEPOSITED IN YOUR ACCOUNT AT BITCOINICA IN RELATION TO THE TRANSACTION GIVING RISE TO SUCH LIABILITY. In the case where you make funds available for trading via a voucher, "coupon code", or similar from another financial service, banking institution or exchange, you acknolwedge that you are providing Bitcoinica access to those funds for trading purposes only and that the originating financial institution is the holder of such deposits. Bitcoinica is not liable for any loss if such institutions fail in honoring withdrawal of customer funds.

proudhon

legendary

Activity: 2198

Merit: 1311

Quote from: genjix on July 13, 2012, 04:00:07 AM

We are actively losing money from dealing with the payouts.

Sorry, I know this is horrible, but I don't know what else to do at this point but laugh. This statement at the end cracked me up. There are some other people, I think, who will have actively lost money...

At this point it'd probably be better for all of you to just walk away. Donate what's left to the faucet and deal with the legal consequences. I'm sure for you guys that'll be significantly easier to deal with than securing the bitcoins you have remaining and attempting to refund anyone their money.

bremer-btc-user

newbie

Activity: 43

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ok, you guys are very funny, while we are waiting weeks and weeks to get back from you what is ours, you are worried about :

- legal issues
- reasonable concepts of making payouts
- avoiding to payout malicious claims
- not knowing about who is in reponse for whatever

and within the same time you let yourself steal again in remarkable parts whats left to payout?
And this after more than two months time to secure the status Quo after the hack that lead to suspending the page and the business?

Do you really think this is believable?

tbcoin

legendary

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Merit: 1000

Quote from: Mt.Gox Support on July 13, 2012, 07:55:25 AM

Hi everyone

We are once again very sorry to hear what's happening to many of you and that once again Bitconica has been the victim of a theft.

As far as Mt.Gox is concerned and as Genjix explained, we did not suffer any breach or any hack, all other account are safe and the thief only targeted Bitconica's account. Mark (MagicalTux) has been in contact with many Bitcoin players since this announcement and offered any help we can give, but unfortunately all funds (USD & BTC) are no longer within our reach.

Once again, someone with a US IP succeed to get Bitcoinica's account credential which did not trigger any alarms since they were fully identified. Since Bitconica's account was a verified account the owner of this account asked (This happened when Zhou was still controlling Bitconica) to have his limits lifted to the maximum possible, giving the possibility to the thief to move Bitcoinica's assets to another external account (External to MtGox).

Despite our effort on securing Mt.Gox and protecting everyone's asset I would like to remind everyone that it is also your responsibility to secure your account with a very strong password and use either a Yubikey or Google Auth (You can even use both at the same time).

Of course and within our capacity we at Mt.Gox are ready to give a hand in anyway we can to help Bitconica's team.

Mt.Gox

-- EDIT --

We would like to stress that Mt.Gox Verified Bitconica as a Company and NOT as an Individual.

Bitcoins ok, but how 40k dollars disappear? how withdrawn? I do not know how mtgox codes work, but you can not really know where are redeemed? Other options dwolla? OKPAY? Bitinstant? LR? I really can't believe that you can move dollars without knowing where, how and to whom.

sadpandatech

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Quote from: genjix on July 13, 2012, 04:00:07 AM

(40k BTC and 40K USD - the mtgox daily limits)

40k USD and 40k BTC were stolen (~350k USD).

Just to make sure that I am not missing anything. They were able to transfer out 40k in USD?? to where?

Topic: Bitcoinica MtGox account compromised - page 34. (Read 156022 times)