Topic: Bitcoin's Dystopian Future - page 3. (Read 28200 times)
I need to read it more thoroughly later, but I just wanted to quickly observe that Bitcoin is not untaxable. There are proposals for building income/sales tax systems that can apply to cryptocurrencies and it's a topic I intend to write more about in future.
yes you are right bitcoin to give a good future and your words can be made into articles and references for new players who are still confused with bitcoin and what the advantages of having bitcoin.
Bitcoin's Dystopian Future
yes If you were to peak into my bedroom at night (please don’t), there’s a good chance you would see my wife sleeping soundly while I stare at the ceiling, running thought experiments about where Bitcoin is going. Like many other people, I have come to the conclusion that distributed currencies like Bitcoin are going to eventually be recognized as the most important technological innovation of the decade, if not the century. It seems clear to me that the rise of distributed currencies presents the biggest (and riskiest) investment opportunity I am likely to see in my lifetime; perhaps in a thousand lifetimes. It is critically important to understand where Bitcoin is going, and I am determined to do so.
My hundreds of hours of thought experiments have been productive. I published a whitepaper about the future of Bitcoin, and because of that paper I’ll have the great privilege of sitting on the “Bitcoin in the Future” panel at the 2013 Bitcoin Conference in San Jose. Through these years of deliberation I have satisfied myself that the answer to the “Trillion Dollar Question” of whether any form of distributed currency can ever achieve a stable price, is “yes”. (There are three ways this will happen, as I have written elsewhere).
To many people, this sounds like an implausibly rosy future, and for early adopters that is true — it feels like winning the lottery every day. However, for most other people, the epascendancy of distributed currency systems will feel like a disaster. If you are epascendancy of distributed currency systems will feel like a disaster. If you areinvolved in Bitcoin now, you should prepare to be almost universally hated someday. and Anarchists and hardcore libertarians love Bitcoin, but most people outside those circles are not in favor of completely doing away with their government. If you aren’t part of a fringe political movement, chances are there is something the government does that you like, whether it’s handing out entitlement money, killing enemies, putting people in prison, building dams and roads, funding research, or any number of other things. and I need to read it more thoroughly later, but I just wanted to quickly observe that Bitcoin is not untaxable. There are proposals for building income/sales tax systems that can apply to cryptocurrencies and it's a topic I intend to write more about in future. I have been predicting for years that the world’s first trillionaire by USD valuation will be an early investor in distributed currency — quite possibly Satoshi Nakamoto, whoever he/she/it/they may be. I own a few bitcoins, and I intend to keep them until I find a more attractive investment (that is, I want to invest in whatever replaces bitcoin or builds on top of it).
yes If you were to peak into my bedroom at night (please don’t), there’s a good chance you would see my wife sleeping soundly while I stare at the ceiling, running thought experiments about where Bitcoin is going. Like many other people, I have come to the conclusion that distributed currencies like Bitcoin are going to eventually be recognized as the most important technological innovation of the decade, if not the century. It seems clear to me that the rise of distributed currencies presents the biggest (and riskiest) investment opportunity I am likely to see in my lifetime; perhaps in a thousand lifetimes. It is critically important to understand where Bitcoin is going, and I am determined to do so.
My hundreds of hours of thought experiments have been productive. I published a whitepaper about the future of Bitcoin, and because of that paper I’ll have the great privilege of sitting on the “Bitcoin in the Future” panel at the 2013 Bitcoin Conference in San Jose. Through these years of deliberation I have satisfied myself that the answer to the “Trillion Dollar Question” of whether any form of distributed currency can ever achieve a stable price, is “yes”. (There are three ways this will happen, as I have written elsewhere).
To many people, this sounds like an implausibly rosy future, and for early adopters that is true — it feels like winning the lottery every day. However, for most other people, the epascendancy of distributed currency systems will feel like a disaster. If you are epascendancy of distributed currency systems will feel like a disaster. If you areinvolved in Bitcoin now, you should prepare to be almost universally hated someday. and Anarchists and hardcore libertarians love Bitcoin, but most people outside those circles are not in favor of completely doing away with their government. If you aren’t part of a fringe political movement, chances are there is something the government does that you like, whether it’s handing out entitlement money, killing enemies, putting people in prison, building dams and roads, funding research, or any number of other things. and I need to read it more thoroughly later, but I just wanted to quickly observe that Bitcoin is not untaxable. There are proposals for building income/sales tax systems that can apply to cryptocurrencies and it's a topic I intend to write more about in future. I have been predicting for years that the world’s first trillionaire by USD valuation will be an early investor in distributed currency — quite possibly Satoshi Nakamoto, whoever he/she/it/they may be. I own a few bitcoins, and I intend to keep them until I find a more attractive investment (that is, I want to invest in whatever replaces bitcoin or builds on top of it).
I think bitcoin have a great future if you watch and observe the vaule and demand of bitcoin and especiallly the price of bitcoin when you set your mind that bitcoin is the best and fit to invest rather than any other on investment,
We are still very poor at predicting complex systems future states. Definitely worth thinking these things, and anticipating what we can, but we don't know how this will play out - just face the fact. Probably somewhere between utopian and dystopian - like always.
I just started crypto Jan 2018 this year because of the hype on Dec 2017 where bitcoin reached all time time 10,000. I have asked myself what are the thoughts of those who started early in crypto/blockchain what ever you may want to call it. Then I came across an article and another article that led me here. Wow this dates back 2013. 5 Years ago! I imagine you guys already made your profits and just enjoying life.
For the topic starter hats down to you for your prediction. It really gave me a heads up of what will happen in the future. A noob like me who is not thinking properly starts to brag" hey im starting on crypto so should you, You can be my follower for airdrops/referral/bounties etc. " but I never came across to think what you did! Again Thank you for your precaution. Its better to be anonymous. rather than pull your friend to explore on crypto which is like digging your own grave because they will know what you have accomplished when you suddenly become rich. I just can't thank you enough for your thoughts. Maybe people should be more aware of this.
From:
2018 Crypto Enthusiast Noob
For the topic starter hats down to you for your prediction. It really gave me a heads up of what will happen in the future. A noob like me who is not thinking properly starts to brag" hey im starting on crypto so should you, You can be my follower for airdrops/referral/bounties etc. " but I never came across to think what you did! Again Thank you for your precaution. Its better to be anonymous. rather than pull your friend to explore on crypto which is like digging your own grave because they will know what you have accomplished when you suddenly become rich. I just can't thank you enough for your thoughts. Maybe people should be more aware of this.
From:
2018 Crypto Enthusiast Noob
Bitcoin is fringe stream as we all know it and dont neglect that no matter how powerful the fringe stream gets but it cannot overcome or beat the mainstream ..there is a reason why mainstream is 'MAIN' and as we speak of the difficulty of accepting bitcoin for the public then we should look at the real literacy rates right now ,people who are not even educated to a level of high school how can they even use bitcoin or even if they,how do u expect them to not get hacked/scammed???.. and plus not everybody is an Anarchist ,most people are just surviving not even 'living' they dont care even if they are ruled by anyone they just let the governments do the power violation thing and just live their way.
I don't think the OP of this topic even comes here anymore. I see him in the mastercoin/omni discussions on reddit occasionally. Two years ago he talks about a future for Bitcoin that I don't see materializing. I see governments that have proven to be quite effective at controlling Bitcoin with current legislation. Government fiat that isn't struggling or failing as expected. Tor which, in his example, could be used for awful things like child slavery is being penetrated and the Ross Ulbrichts of the world are being caught and prosecuted. But the most interesting thing that's happened is in the opposite direction of a dystopian future. Main stream business is taking to Bitcoin like a moth to a flame and the price seems to be stabilizing.
the Dystopian Future, is ironically not in Bitcoins future, the image projected by the OP is an extreme example of the Fiat world we live in.
On the topic of shorting Fiat and going long Bitcoin in anticipation of inflation, the jury is still out.
There is a lot of talk about removing cash, and having electronic currencies with negative interest rates and deflation. In this scenario a Central Bank can still manage the herd and drive it away from Bitcoin.
Don't think you will be paid to have loan in fiat, you wont, that privilege is for the elites in Fiats Dystopian Future.
On the topic of shorting Fiat and going long Bitcoin in anticipation of inflation, the jury is still out.
There is a lot of talk about removing cash, and having electronic currencies with negative interest rates and deflation. In this scenario a Central Bank can still manage the herd and drive it away from Bitcoin.
Don't think you will be paid to have loan in fiat, you wont, that privilege is for the elites in Fiats Dystopian Future.
IF they do remove cash....and I can see them trying, It will make something like BTC defacto cash worldwide which would be a huge boost to BTC as that would be quite large.
Bitcoin is not really economically different from gold.
The big difference between gold and Bitcoin is that you can send bitcoin over the Internet.But your analogy still holds.
Bitcoin is hugely different to Gold and defeats it on every single aspect, except the psychological one since gold is still king of wealth, luxury and all that crap which is deeply ingrained into peoples minds from birth. But eventually the objectively superior pragmatic reasons to use BTC over Gold will dethrone it as the to-go safe haven.
Very interesting read - but to be trusthful, while I might agree with you, there is no point in predicting the future and then try and avoid the future you've imagined!
You have no idea what everyone else is planning for the same future!
Agree, but its good for future of things when diffirent people think of many possible outcomes. You have no idea what everyone else is planning for the same future!
the Dystopian Future, is ironically not in Bitcoins future, the image projected by the OP is an extreme example of the Fiat world we live in.
On the topic of shorting Fiat and going long Bitcoin in anticipation of inflation, the jury is still out.
There is a lot of talk about removing cash, and having electronic currencies with negative interest rates and deflation. In this scenario a Central Bank can still manage the herd and drive it away from Bitcoin.
Don't think you will be paid to have loan in fiat, you wont, that privilege is for the elites in Fiats Dystopian Future.
On the topic of shorting Fiat and going long Bitcoin in anticipation of inflation, the jury is still out.
There is a lot of talk about removing cash, and having electronic currencies with negative interest rates and deflation. In this scenario a Central Bank can still manage the herd and drive it away from Bitcoin.
Don't think you will be paid to have loan in fiat, you wont, that privilege is for the elites in Fiats Dystopian Future.
Ironically if you really believe in a bitcoin future, now is the time to run up massive fiat debts, as logically they will be inflated away to mean nothing against any bitcoin holdings.
I do feel the problem of the technology illiterate old folk, with their life savings and pensions in the bank needs to be thought about some more. If things play out as predicted they will be left with nothing. (unless banks and pension fund managers, manage to stay ahead of the curve and divest so of thier portfolios into gold/bitcoin that is)
food for thought.
I do feel the problem of the technology illiterate old folk, with their life savings and pensions in the bank needs to be thought about some more. If things play out as predicted they will be left with nothing. (unless banks and pension fund managers, manage to stay ahead of the curve and divest so of thier portfolios into gold/bitcoin that is)
food for thought.
Each step toward utopia is a step toward dystopia...the deciding factor will be global cultural values
I'm glad this thread has come back up so I could see it - the author's thinking is very similar to my own, regarding the "tipping point" risk and resulting governmental crisis and social unrest. A few thoughts:
1. I'm relatively more sanguine about the kidnapping issue because kidnappers can be tracked and caught using many tools unrelated to the ransom payment mechanism. So long as the punishments are severe, I don't see crypto driving a surge. (As the father of four young children, I hope and pray I'm right!)
2. There will be great envy towards early adopters when the whole world has to flee to bitcoin amidst a collapse of fiat currencies. But although it will happen quickly, and although some early adopters will no doubt be overnight tycoons of great wealth, I think the pace will be such that a large chunk of the population will at least gain a toehold in crypto. Some will lose a lot in the transition, others (particularly young, indebted people will new home loans in fiat) will come out ahead. And since those young, currently poor and indebted people are the biggest risk in a riot environment, the fact that many of them will be coming out ahead is comforting.
It's also worth pointing out that there is still a lot of wealth tied up in physical property, real estate and so on. Stocks of companies that survive the transition to crypto will retain their value, while bondholders and T-bill holders in fiat currencies will lose entirely. Again, younger people are more inclined to hold stocks whereas older people have the bonds and T-bills and CDs, so unless you fear a bunch of rioting senior citizens we may be able to avoid a zombie apocalypse. (Or maybe a bunch of rioters from a nursing home will _be_ the zombie apocalypse? :-)
1. I'm relatively more sanguine about the kidnapping issue because kidnappers can be tracked and caught using many tools unrelated to the ransom payment mechanism. So long as the punishments are severe, I don't see crypto driving a surge. (As the father of four young children, I hope and pray I'm right!)
2. There will be great envy towards early adopters when the whole world has to flee to bitcoin amidst a collapse of fiat currencies. But although it will happen quickly, and although some early adopters will no doubt be overnight tycoons of great wealth, I think the pace will be such that a large chunk of the population will at least gain a toehold in crypto. Some will lose a lot in the transition, others (particularly young, indebted people will new home loans in fiat) will come out ahead. And since those young, currently poor and indebted people are the biggest risk in a riot environment, the fact that many of them will be coming out ahead is comforting.
It's also worth pointing out that there is still a lot of wealth tied up in physical property, real estate and so on. Stocks of companies that survive the transition to crypto will retain their value, while bondholders and T-bill holders in fiat currencies will lose entirely. Again, younger people are more inclined to hold stocks whereas older people have the bonds and T-bills and CDs, so unless you fear a bunch of rioting senior citizens we may be able to avoid a zombie apocalypse. (Or maybe a bunch of rioters from a nursing home will _be_ the zombie apocalypse? :-)
It's wrong to assume that cryptography will lead to a chaotic and dystopian future.
Cryptography is just a tool like knife, it can be used for good or for bad.
Some people might use this tool for bad which will disrupt the society negatively, but as a defense response the society will eventually evolve back to what we had before urbanization: strong local communities where people in the local community trust each other but are extremely suspicious to outsiders. Our social relations will be our greatest defense against possible threats from the outside.
Changing the parameters of a system will lead to instability short term but a new equilibrium emerges always.
Cryptography is just a tool like knife, it can be used for good or for bad.
Some people might use this tool for bad which will disrupt the society negatively, but as a defense response the society will eventually evolve back to what we had before urbanization: strong local communities where people in the local community trust each other but are extremely suspicious to outsiders. Our social relations will be our greatest defense against possible threats from the outside.
Changing the parameters of a system will lead to instability short term but a new equilibrium emerges always.
This
Bitcoin is not really economically different from gold.
The big difference between gold and Bitcoin is that you can send bitcoin over the Internet.But your analogy still holds.
Bitcoin is not really economically different from gold.
The supply is quite limited, it is durable, it can be used as a medium of exchange, and people have trouble keeping their individual stashes of it secure against robbery.
Therefore if we want to see Bitcoin's future, we should look at gold's past and present.
We should expect to see people paying online wallets a fee each year to keep their bitcoin safe, the same way people used to pay banks to keep their gold in the vault. We should expect to see the companies that operate those "vaults" buying insurance against theft, the way banks used to buy insurance against theft. Then we should expect to see them getting laws passed that force their insurance expense to be borne by taxpayers at large, rather than just the people whose Bitcoin they're holding.
Over time, we should expect to see Bitcoin concentrated in the hands of financial institutions and governments who will then loan it out - then issue promissory notes against it, operating on fractional reserves of it, and then..... back to fiat currency.
Face it, when was the last time ordinary people used gold or silver coins in their hands for daily transactions? Well, Bitcoin is going to eventually occupy the same place that gold and silver do in our current economy; a place for investment capital to flee to, as a last-resort inflation hedge when the productive economy is administered by miss Helena Handbasket. It will not likely be used by ordinary people.
The supply is quite limited, it is durable, it can be used as a medium of exchange, and people have trouble keeping their individual stashes of it secure against robbery.
Therefore if we want to see Bitcoin's future, we should look at gold's past and present.
We should expect to see people paying online wallets a fee each year to keep their bitcoin safe, the same way people used to pay banks to keep their gold in the vault. We should expect to see the companies that operate those "vaults" buying insurance against theft, the way banks used to buy insurance against theft. Then we should expect to see them getting laws passed that force their insurance expense to be borne by taxpayers at large, rather than just the people whose Bitcoin they're holding.
Over time, we should expect to see Bitcoin concentrated in the hands of financial institutions and governments who will then loan it out - then issue promissory notes against it, operating on fractional reserves of it, and then..... back to fiat currency.
Face it, when was the last time ordinary people used gold or silver coins in their hands for daily transactions? Well, Bitcoin is going to eventually occupy the same place that gold and silver do in our current economy; a place for investment capital to flee to, as a last-resort inflation hedge when the productive economy is administered by miss Helena Handbasket. It will not likely be used by ordinary people.
@op; This, sir, is a genius brainstorm! 
I've spent countless night thinking on the subject "adept or perish/block chain" and time after time I get a little confused why no government hasn't adepted already and made their own BTC 2.0 and let people change it vs country-currency 1:1.
With some programs and apps it would make life sooooo..oo....ooooo much easier for 99,9% of the population.
Why aint this already real?
My answer always boils down to three words;
1; Banks
2; Money
3; Power
The block chain is the future, it's UNDENIABLE!
Once again; Thanks for a genius brainstorm!
-Grg
I've spent countless night thinking on the subject "adept or perish/block chain" and time after time I get a little confused why no government hasn't adepted already and made their own BTC 2.0 and let people change it vs country-currency 1:1.
With some programs and apps it would make life sooooo..oo....ooooo much easier for 99,9% of the population.
Why aint this already real?
My answer always boils down to three words;
1; Banks
2; Money
3; Power
The block chain is the future, it's UNDENIABLE!
Once again; Thanks for a genius brainstorm!
-Grg
Changing the parameters of a system will lead to instability short term but a new equilibrium emerges always.
Because the system parameters are ever changing and equilibrium is never reached, but we are mired in a perpetual instability.
this is also why free market doesnot work as advertised, The invisible Hand suffers from parkinson
I agree with you and the former poster. Life is all about trying to reach that equilibrium, but knowing it can never be actually reached.
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