Topic: Bitmain looks like they're releasing a 15GH/s DASH miner called the AntMiner D3 - page 230. (Read 299754 times)

ok i get what you're saying. I DO think, however, that if DASH was suddenly un-mineable, it WOULD cause the price to increase (somewhat), even if only 45% of newly minted coins comes from miners and there's an existing supply. That sounds like basic economics to me, but i could be wrong and crypto is a crazy crazy world.

be honest cryptocrane - how many D3's did you order?

gigawatt isn't cloud mining and they're actually great for decentralization and the small miner. And hey, you go girl as far as explaining to the layman about "how cloud mining in general is bad for decentralization and the small miner," but if you're doing that on MY FB PAGE WHERE I SELL MY PRODUCT/SERVICE then yeah, id delete your comments and ban you too. what did you expect - it's THEIR FB page dude.

That would make sense if Dash were a consumable resource, but it's a currency that doesn't disappear when used. This means that the "supply" for Dash isn't just newly minted coins, but every coin available for purchase on all exchanges. If one could magically increase the difficulty to the point in which nobody could mine any Dash, it wouldn't cause the Dash price to increase. People who want Dash can still get Dash from the existing supply. Lots of coins start as mine-able and transition to PoS, which is the equivalent of what I just described. They don't become more valuable simply because the mining has stopped. People tend to over-estimate the effect that newly minted coins have on the underlying price. Newly minted coins make such a tiny percentage of the daily volume traded that even if every miner in the world was selling and never holding, the affect would be negligible. It's even less meaningful with Dash, since only 45% of newly minted coins come from miners.

Even taking into account difficulty increase, there is still much money to be made. I think people are expecting too much to think a miner pays itself off in two weeks or less. Even a 4 month ROI is great.

all cloud mining is shady idgaf how the repackage or slice it , gigawatt deleted my posts on facebook and blocked me
when i asked legitimate questions and tried to explain to the layman how cloud mining in general is bad for decentralization and the small miner

I think December will start around $12 a day and end closer to $8.

There should be some sort of prize for the closest guess.  Free lapdance or something.

I agree with you about the D3s. Nobody should expect what the calculators currently show. But I do expect them to pay for themselves in less than 6 months, which in the real world is an awesome ROI - maybe about 10%-20% of what the calc's currently show - which is still extremely profitable.

I know what a ponzi scheme is, but what i haven't seen is anyone actually describe WHY gigawatt is a ponzi scheme. They just call it that without any actual evidence. "It's a ponzi Scheme!" ok why? "Because it's a ponzi scheme!"

cool argument!

You just described the effect of diff increase on todays miners "exactly right".  Now multiply that by the massive numbers that Bitmain just sold in this last batch and do the math.  Everyone on a daily basis is going to witness exactly what those of us already mining X11 have been witnessing first hand.  

Yet somehow these new miners will defy "diff" or "gravity" is really misguided.   I love the posts where I see people:  "You people don't know what your talking about, we are going to be making $160 a day! I just can't see it falling as much as you say...  You people are fear mongering!".  And I would say to you that your numbers all depend on when you received or will receive your miners.  

Let's just see where the earning will be by the time the November batch 2 Bitmain D3's ship and let's compare what all the calculators say today with what these will earn at ship date, and then let's fast forward 30 days to the later part of December and let's compare the numbers...

The only way we will see this outcome change is if we see Dash take off to the moon.  If that is the case that Dash is going for a moon shot then there is zero FUD in telling people to buy and hold Dash.  It may make more sense to invest in Dash than it is to buy more X11 miners in these later batches until we see where we are at the end of the year.  If you were lucky enough to get in on the first batch orders of the big boy X11 miners then congrats!  You will do well.  For those who still haven't bought X11 miners you may want to consider putting your money in Dash because mining X11 may be tough if Dash does not have the expected increase in value.  

For those that weren't so lucky to get early batch miners and have been buying these later batches we are going to be working for our ROI. How long we will be grinding it out will depend on what the Dash price does.    

Everyone should put it on the record here now what they think they will be earning by the end of the year with the D3's.  That would be interesting to see who is closest to the real numbers.

Look up the definition of ponzi scheme and I wish you the best of luck with Giga...

i get what you're saying, but using your analogy - if it became much more expensive/difficult for the windmills to create wind energy, then it seems natural that the wind energy would then become more expensive. If it's more expensive to produce a product, then it seems the product would become more expensive to purchase. whatcha think?

Explain please.  AFAIK, Difficulty is the collective total of all miners on the Dash network at any given time (a projected 2 year average of this amount, if I understand correctly).  If that's the case, Difficulty does not chase profitability, unless you mean that un-profitable D3's will simply be unplugged and collect dust.

This monster increases the complexity of mining several times.

Correlation does not imply causation. In this case, you're reversing the causation. Difficulty chases profitability (price), not the other way around. Whenever I hear someone say they think the price will go up because the difficulty is going up, it makes me wonder if they also believe that windmills create wind. After all, the faster windmills spin, the faster the wind seems to get.  

It seems more likely that the recent price increase is linked to the 40,000+ people who didn't know much about Dash and started researching while contemplating a D3 purchase - only to realize that there's quite a bit of potential for this coin. I know that happened to me and I purchased some Dash in response. There are tens of thousands of people who probably never heard of Dash that suddenly saw a new product from Bitmain and started looking into it.

Lol @ Bitmain calling other people a scam.

Not that I care about Gigawatt, at all (no opinion), but the blog post you're talking about, afaik, refers to the illegal and unlicensed use of Bitmain's logo and "reputation".  That's not really the same thing as calling Gigawatt a scam.

That said, it's very possible Gigawatt is a scam.  I'm not trying to defend them, just point out the difference between what you're implying and what Bitmain is actually upset about.

They have a limited number of pools to choose from. yes you can log into the controls to check the chips temp etc and watch the hashing. your questions "regarding legal questions and operations they were not once able to provide answers that could hold up in any legal situation" is about as clear as mud. What legal questions? can you elaborate? A company / project is not automatically a ponzi scheme just because they dont answer your questions to your satisfaction. i believe the project is restricted to US citizens - is that what you mean?

anyway my electricity at home is 24c/kwh and at gigawatt it's 3.3, which includes on-site maintenance of the miners if you need it. at 3.3c vs. 24c its about 4 months before the WTT tokens pay for themselves in electrical savings alone. I have an account manager I can call or email and he's always accessible and responsive and knowledgeable. Of all the "schemes" out there in the crypto world, this is not one of them.

did you read their white paper? it's one of the better ones out there. They're repped by Perkins Coie which is a major international law firm.

But whatever if you think its a ponzi scheme (for whatever reason) then by all means, stay away. I'll keep happily mining there.

I'd say that yes, generally diff increase and price increase go hand in hand.  But if you look at Dash value chart next to Dash diff chart... that does not appear to be the case here, the ratios are not the same, they're very different.  I think anyone expecting Dash to go up 5x-10x in value  just because diff went up 5x-10x over the next few months is going to be in for a nasty surprise.  It'll go up, but not as much as diff.

May 24, 2017
Dash Difficulty = 154k
Dash Value (USD) = $142

Aug 22, 2017
Dash Difficult = 1128k (730% of May 24 level)
Dash Value (USD) = $290 (204% of May 24 price)

Value does not go up as fast as difficulty.

Maybe you get more Dash when diff goes up per mined block?  I don't know.  But if the block reward stays consistent, and the gains have to be made by appreciation, what I'm seeing says Dash value will not go up anywhere near as much as Dash diff.

I wish everyone the best of luck with their D3's and similar next-gen Dash miners... but I think it's not going to be as amazing as people think.  Better be ready to hold that Dash a while.

yep...looks likes Bitmain has them marked as "scam" as well....according to their official blog news

Can you set the pool? Can you log into the controls checking the chips and temp?  If you can't do that, its not your miner its theirs....

I also believe GIGA is a ponzi and not a very good one. When i contacted them over and over again regarding legal questions and operations they were not once able to provide answers that could hold up in any legal situation.


If they cant tell you the difference between US citizen customers and non citizen customers and how that will affect the legal situation and their responsibilities you can't call them a serious business venture.


And I highly doubt they got audited by any legal entity

Not sure what you're talking about. Everyone who mines x11 right now are watching profits crash because they don't have sufficient hashing power. and gigawatt isn't a ponzi scheme. why do you think that? they're a fully audited project. I have my miners there now and I pay 3.3c/kwh for electricity.

Your right everyone who mines X11 right now watching profits crash are just imagining it.  And Gigawatt is a ponzi scheme... Buy and mine yourself, or find a reputable hosting site you can trust. 

Thank you CryptoCrane....that is a big help.