I think I can clear some of the confusion (I am not related to them but I know how the circuits/components involved work) .
The choke/inductor is not from the power supply but from the 12 to 0.85v dc-dc converter in the hashboard and that is good news as they are not made yet.
They should be able to provide a 10 to 15% improvement in overall efficiency as long as the rest of the dc-dc converter design is really optimal. Designing a dc-dc converter for those powers is really hard and at 200A a tiny internal resistance anywhere is catastrophic (and inductors are a prime candidate for unwanted internal resistance).
Also knowing the real asic specifications they might extract some extra stability/overclockeability by adjusting the vdroop and some extra efficiency by adjusting frequency and gate drive parameters at the dc-dc converter so there is stil a chance for some improvement.
Also you can't make a power supply or dc-dc converter 100% efficient and we are going to have at least two between the wall and the asics. 1st one turns mains into 12V and 2nd one turns 12V into the asic vcc (0.85V if i am right). So lets say that both those converters are 90% efficient wich would we an awesome job, 0.9*0.9=0.81 so roughly 20% more power at the wall than at the asic would be an awesome job. If they have active pfc they might have even another dc-dc converter.
Topic: Black Arrow 28nm 100Ghash Bitcoin ASIC from $0.49/GH/s - page 202. (Read 787053 times)
They're shiping in less than a week i wouldn't expect a large change in numbers.
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ok! so, what is the minion power comsumption when run at 100 Ghs/s?
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ok! so, what is the minion power comsumption when run at 100 Ghs/s?
150w @ 120gh/s is 1.25w/gh at the wall (compared to 1w/gh had they hit spec)
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
it's almost the same W/Gh ratio as an ant miner wich is cheaper and available now.
Bitmain is 2W/Ghs in NORMAL mode
Blackarrow is 1.25w/Ghs OVERCLOCKED
They mean the Antminer S2, not the S1. The S2 is basically the same thing as one of the X-3 subunits, but has been available for a bit already.
S2 is $2500 for 1th or $2.5/gh
BA is $6000 for 3.6th or $1.7/gh
They mean the Antminer S2, not the S1. The S2 is basically the same thing as one of the X-3 subunits, but has been available for a bit already.
thats true but my point is wait for the final numbers to make comparisions!
150w @ 120gh/s is 1.25w/gh at the wall (compared to 1w/gh had they hit spec)
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
it's almost the same W/Gh ratio as an ant miner wich is cheaper and available now.
Bitmain is 2W/Ghs in NORMAL mode
Blackarrow is 1.25w/Ghs OVERCLOCKED
150w @ 120gh/s is 1.25w/gh at the wall (compared to 1w/gh had they hit spec)
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
it's almost the same W/Gh ratio as an ant miner wich is cheaper and available now.
It's worse than both Bitmain and Bitfury, 55nm chips from last year!
150w @ 120gh/s is 1.25w/gh at the wall (compared to 1w/gh had they hit spec)
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
it's almost the same W/Gh ratio as an ant miner wich is cheaper and available now.
150w @ 120gh/s is 1.25w/gh at the wall (compared to 1w/gh had they hit spec)
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
Anyways what do you want them to do? Send the chips back to design stage and let us wait another 3 months? I'd rather just get my asic now.
BA.
im very sorry that i have to be the negative person here again, but WTF happen your chip is at the same point as was your first design back in feb.. these specs are terrible !!
your in the same range as an ant miner, and yet your price is higher + you don't have the units in stock.
surly you can't deliver the machines with these kind of specs then your screwing your costumers over, are you planning to replace these chips with new ones if the design is reviewd, iff not your screwing batch 1 and batch 2 ppl over big time.
at these numbers the machine will be worthless on diff 30 bil... this can't be true
your machine is running at 1,5W/Gh at wall while your were telling us it WILL preform around 0,75W/Gh on chip level @ T/T corner (120Mhz) !!!!
YOUR CUTTING OUR POTENTIAL MINING TIME IN HALF WITH THESE SPECS..
it almost sounds like your rushing out the machines before PPL realize its crap and start asking refunds
im very sorry that i have to be the negative person here again, but WTF happen your chip is at the same point as was your first design back in feb.. these specs are terrible !!
your in the same range as an ant miner, and yet your price is higher + you don't have the units in stock.
surly you can't deliver the machines with these kind of specs then your screwing your costumers over, are you planning to replace these chips with new ones if the design is reviewd, iff not your screwing batch 1 and batch 2 ppl over big time.
at these numbers the machine will be worthless on diff 30 bil... this can't be true
your machine is running at 1,5W/Gh at wall while your were telling us it WILL preform around 0,75W/Gh on chip level @ T/T corner (120Mhz) !!!!
YOUR CUTTING OUR POTENTIAL MINING TIME IN HALF WITH THESE SPECS..
it almost sounds like your rushing out the machines before PPL realize its crap and start asking refunds
Cheers David that's good. 😊
Thanks david. Do we have the full minion specs yet? 0.92w/gh is not great but its not bad either. Can the chips reach better efficiency by underclocking?
If a delay occurs for X-1 customers we will start hashing with our own X-3's for those customers. Bitcoins mined on their behalf will be transferred accordingly.
Well if they are shipping x3's next week and have no x1 cases my 2 batch 2 x1's which should ship on the 15th look like not coming till June
Bitcoin Miners progress update – 09 May 2014
1. The Minion has arrived.
a. Has been tested at 120Ghash. The power measured at the wall was 150Watt. This includes the 8% loss of the PSU and currently 20% on the DC/DC converter. This translates on 0.92W/Ghash at the chip level. We have asked the ASIC designers to come to our office to study how to further improve the power efficiency.
b. The expected loss on the DC/DC should be around 10%. We have identified We identified that part of the power used is lost by the inductor. A new customised inductor is scheduled to arrive in one week.
b. We decided to write a software application which will produce a full report to include details on voltage, speed and efficiency at all ranges. Estimated time to completion is up to 3 weeks but this additional feature will not affect the shipping schedule.
c. We believe that further overclocking is available, further tests are scheduled after we complete the assembly of the 200A board tomorrow.
2. All Minion orders have been shipped today.
3. Most of the X3 and X1 PSUs have been delivered are now in stock.
4. The majority of the heatsinks have been manufactured.
5. The first lot of X3 cases has been received. (Aluminium alloy)
6. The control board assembly has just been completed. This is behind schedule and we are not confident at this stage that we can write the LCD driver in useful time for first shipments. If this is the case we will release firmware updates to enable the LCD functionality.
7. The first batch of LCDs was delayed 1 day and is now due to arrive tomorrow.
8. Unfortunately we have been told that the X1 case will not be delivered in time. If the X1 miners will not be ready at the same time with our X3 miners we made a contingency plan to start hashing with our own X3 units for our X1 customers affected by this delay. Bitcoins mined on their behalf will be transferred accordingly. Full details will be announced directly to customers, therefore please do not flood our customer support with tickets regarding on how to receive Bitcoins.
9. Our main PCB assembly factory failed to initiate the assembly 2 days ago as scheduled. We were forced to switch the assembly production with another local factory which is now scheduled to start the assembly tomorrow.
10. X3s are scheduled to start shipping early next week.
Pictures: http://ecointalk.net/gallery/album/20-09-may-2014-progress-update/
1. The Minion has arrived.
a. Has been tested at 120Ghash. The power measured at the wall was 150Watt. This includes the 8% loss of the PSU and currently 20% on the DC/DC converter. This translates on 0.92W/Ghash at the chip level. We have asked the ASIC designers to come to our office to study how to further improve the power efficiency.
b. The expected loss on the DC/DC should be around 10%. We have identified We identified that part of the power used is lost by the inductor. A new customised inductor is scheduled to arrive in one week.
b. We decided to write a software application which will produce a full report to include details on voltage, speed and efficiency at all ranges. Estimated time to completion is up to 3 weeks but this additional feature will not affect the shipping schedule.
c. We believe that further overclocking is available, further tests are scheduled after we complete the assembly of the 200A board tomorrow.
2. All Minion orders have been shipped today.
3. Most of the X3 and X1 PSUs have been delivered are now in stock.
4. The majority of the heatsinks have been manufactured.
5. The first lot of X3 cases has been received. (Aluminium alloy)
6. The control board assembly has just been completed. This is behind schedule and we are not confident at this stage that we can write the LCD driver in useful time for first shipments. If this is the case we will release firmware updates to enable the LCD functionality.
7. The first batch of LCDs was delayed 1 day and is now due to arrive tomorrow.
8. Unfortunately we have been told that the X1 case will not be delivered in time. If the X1 miners will not be ready at the same time with our X3 miners we made a contingency plan to start hashing with our own X3 units for our X1 customers affected by this delay. Bitcoins mined on their behalf will be transferred accordingly. Full details will be announced directly to customers, therefore please do not flood our customer support with tickets regarding on how to receive Bitcoins.
9. Our main PCB assembly factory failed to initiate the assembly 2 days ago as scheduled. We were forced to switch the assembly production with another local factory which is now scheduled to start the assembly tomorrow.
10. X3s are scheduled to start shipping early next week.
Pictures: http://ecointalk.net/gallery/album/20-09-may-2014-progress-update/
Looks like one of their peeps snuck a peek in here and added 8, 9, and 10 to avoid getting bitched at to infinity by the angry mob.
There might be hope for June.
There might be hope for June.
At least one good thing as come of this, BFL, Hashfast etc. a lot of people will never pay for miners on pre-order again.
Just look at how many law suits are going on atm with ASIC manufactures, it's an epidemic, all based around taking monies on pre-orders then failing to deliver as promised.
At least there are a few brands like Antminer, Gridseed etc. that still have some honor.
I will be glad when this is over, so I can walk away from the pre-order brands altogether, never again! (Yes I am angry)
Just look at how many law suits are going on atm with ASIC manufactures, it's an epidemic, all based around taking monies on pre-orders then failing to deliver as promised.
At least there are a few brands like Antminer, Gridseed etc. that still have some honor.
I will be glad when this is over, so I can walk away from the pre-order brands altogether, never again! (Yes I am angry)
The update seems to have been updated.
Bitcoin Miners progress update – 09 May 2014
1. The Minion has arrived.
a. Has been tested at 120Ghash. The power measured at the wall was 150Watt. This includes the 8% loss of the PSU and currently 20% on the DC/DC converter. This translates on 0.92W/Ghash at the chip level. We have asked the ASIC designers to come to our office to study how to further improve the power efficiency.
b. The expected loss on the DC/DC should be around 10%. We have identified We identified that part of the power used is lost by the inductor. A new customised inductor is scheduled to arrive in one week.
b. We decided to write a software application which will produce a full report to include details on voltage, speed and efficiency at all ranges. Estimated time to completion is up to 3 weeks but this additional feature will not affect the shipping schedule.
c. We believe that further overclocking is available, further tests are scheduled after we complete the assembly of the 200A board tomorrow.
2. All Minion orders have been shipped today.
3. Most of the X3 and X1 PSUs have been delivered are now in stock.
4. The majority of the heatsinks have been manufactured.
5. The first lot of X3 cases has been received. (Aluminium alloy)
6. The control board assembly has just been completed. This is behind schedule and we are not confident at this stage that we can write the LCD driver in useful time for first shipments. If this is the case we will release firmware updates to enable the LCD functionality.
7. The first batch of LCDs was delayed 1 day and is now due to arrive tomorrow.
8. Unfortunately we have been told that the X1 case will not be delivered in time. If the X1 miners will not be ready at the same time with our X3 miners we made a contingency plan to start hashing with our own X3 units for our X1 customers affected by this delay. Bitcoins mined on their behalf will be transferred accordingly. Full details will be announced directly to customers, therefore please do not flood our customer support with tickets regarding on how to receive Bitcoins.
9. Our main PCB assembly factory failed to initiate the assembly 2 days ago as scheduled. We were forced to switch the assembly production with another local factory which is now scheduled to start the assembly tomorrow.
10. X3s are scheduled to start shipping early next week.
Bitcoin Miners progress update – 09 May 2014
1. The Minion has arrived.
a. Has been tested at 120Ghash. The power measured at the wall was 150Watt. This includes the 8% loss of the PSU and currently 20% on the DC/DC converter. This translates on 0.92W/Ghash at the chip level. We have asked the ASIC designers to come to our office to study how to further improve the power efficiency.
b. The expected loss on the DC/DC should be around 10%. We have identified We identified that part of the power used is lost by the inductor. A new customised inductor is scheduled to arrive in one week.
b. We decided to write a software application which will produce a full report to include details on voltage, speed and efficiency at all ranges. Estimated time to completion is up to 3 weeks but this additional feature will not affect the shipping schedule.
c. We believe that further overclocking is available, further tests are scheduled after we complete the assembly of the 200A board tomorrow.
2. All Minion orders have been shipped today.
3. Most of the X3 and X1 PSUs have been delivered are now in stock.
4. The majority of the heatsinks have been manufactured.
5. The first lot of X3 cases has been received. (Aluminium alloy)
6. The control board assembly has just been completed. This is behind schedule and we are not confident at this stage that we can write the LCD driver in useful time for first shipments. If this is the case we will release firmware updates to enable the LCD functionality.
7. The first batch of LCDs was delayed 1 day and is now due to arrive tomorrow.
8. Unfortunately we have been told that the X1 case will not be delivered in time. If the X1 miners will not be ready at the same time with our X3 miners we made a contingency plan to start hashing with our own X3 units for our X1 customers affected by this delay. Bitcoins mined on their behalf will be transferred accordingly. Full details will be announced directly to customers, therefore please do not flood our customer support with tickets regarding on how to receive Bitcoins.
9. Our main PCB assembly factory failed to initiate the assembly 2 days ago as scheduled. We were forced to switch the assembly production with another local factory which is now scheduled to start the assembly tomorrow.
10. X3s are scheduled to start shipping early next week.
If we receive these miners by July 4th weekend, it'll be a pleasant surprise. 
Thank God we all wanted those fancy touch screen LCD displays that potentially cut into the compensation packages. These guys are so dreamy for thinking of us....
Thank God we all wanted those fancy touch screen LCD displays that potentially cut into the compensation packages. These guys are so dreamy for thinking of us....
Love me some pokemon, btw still no update? It is getting a bit past the usual time.
From their forums, david said an update would be coming in the next couple of hours.
edit
Quote
Bitcoin Miners progress update – 09 May 2014
1. The Minion has arrived.
a. Has been tested at 120Ghash. The power measured at the wall was 150Watt. This includes the 8% loss of the PSU and currently 20% on the DC/DC converter. This translates on 0.92W/Ghash at the chip level. We have asked the ASIC designers to come to our office to study how to further improve the power efficiency.
b. The expected loss on the DC/DC should be around 10%. We have identified We identified that part of the power used is lost by the inductor. A new customised inductor is scheduled to arrive in one week.
b. We decided to write a software application which will produce a full report to include details on voltage, speed and efficiency at all ranges. Estimated time to completion is up to 3 weeks but this additional feature will not affect the shipping schedule.
c. We believe that further overclocking is available, further tests are scheduled after we complete the assembly of the 200A board tomorrow.
2. All Minion orders have been shipped today.
3. Most of the X3 and X1 PSUs have been delivered are now in stock.
4. The majority of the heatsinks have been manufactured.
5. The first lot of X3 cases has been received. (Aluminium alloy)
6. The control board assembly has just been completed. This is behind schedule and we are not confident at this stage that we can write the LCD driver in useful time for first shipments. If this is the case we will release firmware updates to enable the LCD functionality.
7. The first batch of LCDs was delayed 1 day and is now due to arrive tomorrow.
1. The Minion has arrived.
a. Has been tested at 120Ghash. The power measured at the wall was 150Watt. This includes the 8% loss of the PSU and currently 20% on the DC/DC converter. This translates on 0.92W/Ghash at the chip level. We have asked the ASIC designers to come to our office to study how to further improve the power efficiency.
b. The expected loss on the DC/DC should be around 10%. We have identified We identified that part of the power used is lost by the inductor. A new customised inductor is scheduled to arrive in one week.
b. We decided to write a software application which will produce a full report to include details on voltage, speed and efficiency at all ranges. Estimated time to completion is up to 3 weeks but this additional feature will not affect the shipping schedule.
c. We believe that further overclocking is available, further tests are scheduled after we complete the assembly of the 200A board tomorrow.
2. All Minion orders have been shipped today.
3. Most of the X3 and X1 PSUs have been delivered are now in stock.
4. The majority of the heatsinks have been manufactured.
5. The first lot of X3 cases has been received. (Aluminium alloy)
6. The control board assembly has just been completed. This is behind schedule and we are not confident at this stage that we can write the LCD driver in useful time for first shipments. If this is the case we will release firmware updates to enable the LCD functionality.
7. The first batch of LCDs was delayed 1 day and is now due to arrive tomorrow.
So no units have been built yet, I would be surprised if they have any real shipment before June, I think I got my BFL gear last year faster than that!
Well since the LCD's aren't in until tomorrow (maybe) we can assume shipping isn't happening today. I'm a bit confused, if the power supplies showed up than what is the inductor for? Is it just for the test board or are all the PSU's bad? And if so, then I imagine shipping will be delayed until all the inductors are replaced. So +/- another week to ship. That's my guess.
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