Topic: Both Bitcoin-24 and Mtgox having problems in the EU - page 2. (Read 14655 times)

bitcion central
bitcoin.de

also, this sounds about right... considering the kids I was reading in that chat:

http://board.btc24-help.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=38&sid=d6fecdf4bffc63f3aecec3cd88ea6cf8

Names or it didn't happen.

my sepa transfers via the poland mt gox account went through without any problem last week and this week.

the bitcoin24 case (i am german and i have 70 btc on a bitcoin24 account):

simon is a 23 year old fellow who had the idea of creating an exchange about 12 months ago. so he did. he used a few accounts in germany and in poland at the same bank, that mtgox is using. a lot of money started to pour in. banks were getting nervous. then, march 2013 ... btc value exploding, mt gox having problems = a ton of customers started to switch to btc24. btc 24, basically a one man show couldnt handle it. things got stuck. banks were really getting nervous. informed the authorities. the authorities started to suspect simon being the head of an epic phishing attack, since there was money pouring on his accounts from all over the world and from all kinds of people. THAT MUST BE CRIME!  some idiot customers which money got stuck somewhere did not get any reply by simon about what is happening. with bitcoin on the rise like a rocket they went to the authorities claiming their money must have been stolen. THAT WAS THE EXCUSE the authorities needed to step in. blocking the accounts, search simons home and seize what they can. they think they got some big fish. major newspaper titels: young fraudster runs of with 7 million €

but: there was nothing stolen. no fraud, no scam. all the information simon gave turned out to be correct so far. nervous customers, halluzinating prosecutors, eager police officers, a kid with not the slightest understanding of public relations and all this in this incredible bitcoin storm of the second half of march.

i guess there is a reason why there is a line of mtgox users waiting to get confirmed. on btc24 there was no confirmation necessary. there is no money lost, but it will take months or years to figure it all out. especially with german prosecutors/police being involved. they know nothing but expect the worst.

Why the charge of 300 bucks? Where are the money going?

it needs to be discussed here:

http://www.bitcoin2013.com/

This is true, and it seems they're in support of regulation of bitcoin markets. I suppose regulation is better than non-existence, but I am not sure if that is what they were going for when speaking.

Bitcoin has no a foundation. There is a company called Bitcoin Foundation but they do their own business. They care only about their own money.

just start to actually USE bitcoin.
pay with it, accept it.

We are!



Hope bit-24 guy keeps us updated with the progress.

Good idea. The Bitcoin community has alot of bright heads and if we work together we can do wonders. I was thinking that we could start a company and sell shares to bring up enough money to make this possible. If some highly respected members of this community held this project it could really take of. As for laws and countries where this is possible.. someone here must know alot more than me. I don't know about Swiss though. I've heard that their banks have started to cooperate with EU lately.

Who is John Galt?

These documents state it quite clearly:


1.) his bank account in Poland is closed for suspicion of money laundering. Don't be mislead by the "terrorism" wording in there, it's just a law that covers money laundering which was probably altered somewhat after 9/11. They may block his bank account for up to 3 months. This is just the maximum time they may take to gather evidence, it does not necessarily mean that the account will be closed that long.

2.) is his lawyer's objection to that.

3.) is something like a search warrant for his home / office in Germany. The accusation is fraud. In this case, the police will usually confiscate / seize his computer and probably any written documents which seem to have anything to do with bit coin-24. It can take years to get those things back.

I'm currently incorporating in Seychelles, working on a website to sell / buy bitcoins OTC but online. Only problem I have with opening an exchange is the legal aspect... Does accepting deposits fall under 'Banking'? Probably takes a whole lot of money (lawyers) to investigate what's permitted in those countries. I've yet to decide on where to open the bank account. Swiss seems tempting because of it being in the SEPA zone and being outside the EU. What we definatly need is an open source exchange code so anyone willing to take the (legal) risk can bring one online. Might be a good idea for the bitcoin foundation to organise.

Fucking. This.

But, which tax haven country is good for this? And what controls are there in place for sending money there for Europeans?

EDIT: Sending wires.

If I read correctly his incoherent ramblings in German (well fair enough, I bet he's having the worst time of his life), the problem was that Commerzbank noticed that he was doing too many transactions with cash - mostly taking out cash - so they alerted the financial police whatever.

Not 100% sure he is in the clear but I remember that he also offered a "withdrawal" service where he sends you cash in a post parcel.

Now I like to examine a fact from both sides, so let me try to wear the much hated government's hat for a moment.
No account verification needed, withdrawal/deposit with no limits, withdrawal of cash per post... that kinda qualifies as an open door to money laundering, doesn't it?

The fact that bank assets can be frozen by a government, only pleads for Bitcoin.

Time for a P2P exchange.

We should crowdfund and open an exchange in some tax haven country and have the possibility to deposit by sending cash. That way they can't touch us.

We are going to have to expect at least some governments to throw everything they can at bitcoin. But you're right, perhaps bitcoin needs a lobby *gag.* Similar to AOPA for general aviation, someone who has some power who can represent the true nature of bitcoin. You can expect the banks with their lobby are currently or about to unleash an epic smear campaign, there needs ot be another side to the story.

What about setting up exchanges using banks in the Caymans? I don't know anything about that, but has it been considered?

Another thought, wouldn't this be a good source of revenue for one of those tiny island nations somewhere that has no other source of revenue? What about Trisan de Culhan, or is that British? What about someone in Micronesia, or hell... even Sealand, although if it became an issue they wouldn't be there long

Ok i feel bad for him but this isn't a big thing for Bitcoin. Just some hackers stealing accounts. The thing that makes me angry is how the police dealt with it. This is only possible because people have been raised to turn the other cheek.