Topic: Bryan Micon's List of BTC Ponzi Schemes that should not be listed as "Lending" - page 35. (Read 119653 times)

very well said.

I tell internet:

 "I have a secret business plan that if you told you then I could no longer profit"

now according to skeptics in this thread, after making this statement no acceptable concrete proof of Ponzi can be accepted because of this super-secret vague money machine you should take me at my word that I have & it's extremely profitable.  but want to let you invest in it. 

+1

please continue smacking down the Fuddettes with fact and logic.  tytytyty for being vigilant in this thread.

To the water tank poster,

That's pretty much the only idea that could possibly work for Pirate. His supporters agree with you, the naysayers call bs and just say it's a Ponzi.

Borrowing coins to do this could be profitable, in my mind. But 7% is just a gimmick. He would have the same amount of investors at 4% or 5% a week. A variable percentage rate would also be acceptable. You see, to pay 7% for this long, Pirate would have to:

1. Have the connections. This entails knowing people who are a.) filthy rich b.) willing to pour money into bitcoin c.) haven't already done so. d.) are too stupid or lazy to figure out bitcoin-OTC (just like me!)

2. have these "rich folk" lining up at his doorstep week after week after week. Pirate apparently needs more and more coins all the time. He can't sell enough of them! He keeps borrowing more and more because these hungry little birds just can't get enough of bitcoin.

3. HE WOULD HAVE TO OBTAIN THE BITCOINS TO REPAY HIS DEBTORS. He has already explicitly said that GPUmax has nothing to do with BTCST (too bad, would have been a decent explanation). This means he buys them all on OTC (very unlikely imo), or on Gox. Which defeats the whole purpose (profit) of the entire operation. This point as been brought up time and time again, but it has never been explained.

Even if the first 2 requirements are met, the 3rd just makes no damn sense to me. It never will until somebody explains it in a way other than "ooh its a secret, don't invest in something you don't understand." Still waiting.

If pirate is legit, and he is rapidly expanding the bitcoin economy under the table, then he is playing a zero sum game (i think). In theory, it all comes back around to market in the end, and everyone benefits from the delayed price hike. It's just delayed. (could be totally wrong about this last paragraph)

Yeah, nothing like a closed mind to make you want to leave the sheep behind. At least some can maintain a productive discussion.


Yup, the pipes analogy is great.

The latter.  Dude is running a Ponzi scheme. 

Clearly, Pirate is recirculating the flows of the gross BTCUSD capital-flow ratios through a proprietary securities algorithmic trading process by which the future net present value discounted interest rate is projected onto present equity value market-velocity parameters!

Thanks, it all makes so much sense now!

also xfd at the scuba

More info for this amazing investment opportunity: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfW0ke4bwI4

I'll say this for Atlas: at least he wasn't an eager participant in the biggest bitcoin fraud to date.

You're giving Atlas a run for being the most obnoxious troll around.

Ignore.

Did you miss the posting where Pirate said trust accounts are pushed back?  I didn't think I had to regurgitate public knowledge.  Contrary to public opinion, I don't have some special access to Pirate and only know what he announces to everyone else.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot

You and your ilk are not fooling anyone.


Did you go to night school to learn to talk like that?


See the above link.

I made no such assertion. I was merely saying that we had proof that imsaguy's claim that pirate is discouraging deposits and is being effective in doing do is patently false. Of course this was the case, because apparently the discouraging hasn't started.
Weird that you never brought that up... Well, guess we now know what is happening on the 14th.

I already brought this up.  Clearly it isn't a compelling argument. 

I guess that means whoever thought up "Innocent until proven guilty" was a conman. 


So far, your evidence is an unjustified return and the lack of disclosing trade secrets.  What other characteristics?   Please, document them.  Don't make generic statements, they just repeat whats already been said.

If you want a Kardashian dog & pony show, you won't get it from me. Ignorance prevents you from connecting the dots and engaging in any argument of substance. Read the links to expand your knowledge.

A buyer at $5 may be a seller at $10. New entrants may be buyers at $10 and sellers at $9. In either situation, supply is replenished and available for acquisition to be redirected as return for investors. Everyone is looking at the total amount of BTC in existence rather than the churn at the margin, where holders of bitcoins sell, reintroducing flow into the market. Once more - that flow becomes fodder to be picked up and supplied to Pirate & investors. There is a recirculating dynamic.

Get it? No? Read the links again. Then read them a third, fourth, and fifth time. Sleep on it. Read it again. Read through my explanations in this thread again. Not an easy concept to wrap your head around when you're stuck in the fiat world, is it? Keep reading.

To help, study the difference between cash/physical market pricing and derivative-driven pricing of underlying assets (esp. options & futures). Bitcoin is almost entirely a cash/physical market, and its stock to flow ratio works nearly identically to gold.

Facts in bold:

A simple truism: the burden of proof lies on those making incredible statements which contradict all experience. The returns promised require extraordinary explanation.

FACT: No explanation is provided. End of story. One can only conclude that what looks and smells like an utter fraud is, in fact, an utter fraud.

Obviously, much evidence exists that this is a ponzi scheme [as in exhibits literally each and every characteristic of a ponzi scheme], and the lack of any evidence to counter is sufficient for appropriate branding.

Demand for the impossible proof of a negative is a reliable gambit for the conman and also assuages the bedeviling consciences of the naively complicit (and there are many of those, indeed).

The numbers IS  the meat ,7.7% IS  the meat ,  if after "many,MANY hours" of diligent research you still
think its legit your either supporting it or you need to get a new calculator because your old one is bonked .

Oh right, once again, no facts.

Permit me to simplify:

E_p > E_np

where E_p = N (for large positive values of N) is evidence of being flaming ponzi
and E_np = 0 is evidence of not being a flaming ponzi