Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 119. (Read 142289 times)

$50.00 during 2010. How about if a person said that it's possible, with 3% probability, that Bitcoin might surge to $50,000 in three cycles, 99% of people would probably say that he needs to go to a doctor to check is sanity. But what a majority of people never care to notice is that the total supply of fiat has always expanded, which THEN cause the prices of commodities, goods, services, EVERYTHING to increase.

Why were the prices of goods and services during 1950 much cheaper than the prices of goods and services today? - It's the money supply, https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/M2SL

Yes, before Newbies make any decisions including choosing where to store bitcoins, they must start based on the belief whether they are truly competent to take on such responsibilities. Some Newbies who are just starting to invest in Bitcoin choose to store assets on the Exchange because they do not fully understand how to transfer and store bitcoins in a personal wallet, but this should not be left for too long because if the exchange is hacked, they will not only lose personal data, but also lose all the Bitcoins stored there.

They should know that Bitcoin transactions are irreversible, so they need to learn each process step by step to avoid the risk of accidental errors. Keeping assets secure is very necessary, such as not trusting anyone, storing Bitcoin in a private wallet, using a strong password and storing most of your Bitcoin in a wallet that can control the private key. These steps need to be learned properly so that they can become a bank for themselves.

Yes that was the exact purpose why Bitcoin was made, rather it began serving alternatively, having to answer if Bitcoin wasn't as eligible to give ROI would you be willing enough to own/hold any portion. The only reason why we have this much market population in Bitcoin isn't just for transactional purpose, payment of goods and services but rather interest where picked majorly as users who chose to invest.

Removing percentage of the DCA amount to pay for items is just another way of selling out your Bitcoin because it is being spent out. I prefer to keep what is meant for investment, just alone for that specific purpose, having to pay for items can be dealt separately from a different portfolio not from the exact one which i have been DCAing throughout. Imagine moving your Bitcoin from a cold wallet just for payment with fees attached which can  be reduced by having a piece in your hot wallet to serve those minor purposes. Multi portfolio will be required with the option of doing transactions and holding at the same time.

$1 million! I mean, as oddly as it may seem, that’s just how $50 would have looked back then in 2010 when Bitcoin was still breaking out from being just an idea to gain mainstream. I mean, up till now it’s still an idea to some and haven’t gotten that wide acceptance yet in a highly and densely populated world.
Make no mistake, it is coming to be what might be of use for everyone and by that, there would be much pressure on the demand which can push price to even the unimagined extent in the millions and investors to have hold would be proud of the years they’ve had to maintain calm and did hold, despite the many criticism/FUD that went around.
At the moment, price is pushing upwards and we are surely smiling, which makes me wonder why we don’t seem to accept these rise and falls to be the way things are in Bitcoin and not entertain fear when it dumps.

I think you didn't understand the person's point, he mentions that he has little knowledge about bitcoin and crypto. In terms of what you mentioned that he might have separated bitcoin and crypto, after reading your statement I feel like you don't have the slightest knowledge of bitcoin. It is very important for you to know this little thing about Bitcoin, Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency coin like other currencies even Bitcoin is also called a decentralized digital currency.

When a new investor comes to us to learn about investing in DCA method, we should guide them through the basic steps of investing in this method very easily. As such, it is possible to invest in the DCA method even with minimal knowledge of Bitcoin. Ensuring financial management i.e. having specific source of funds. One has to accumulate bitcoins continuously for long term on weekly monthly basis according to own ability irrespective of income expenditure. Be ready to buy bitcoins continuously i.e. immediately instead of waiting for dip time only.

You are wrong. A new bitcoin investor doesn't need to understand bitcoin circles before he can start accumulating bitcoin or trying to figure out the best time to accumulate bitcoin. Just because most people missed accumulating bitcoin when the price was very low doesn't mean we have to wait for the dip or figure out how to accumulate bitcoin in a dip. We have to put the past behind us and accumulate bitcoin when our money is readily available because we are not certain if bitcoin will dip today or tomorrow. A new bitcoin investor should be worried about his finances to know how much of his discretionary funds will be allocated to his bitcoin investment. And since bitcoin is not a scheme to get rich soon, a newbie shouldn't start his bitcoin investment with the buy the dip and hold strategy; it will delay his bitcoin accumulation plan since he cannot figure out when a bitcoin dip could happen. What a newbie needs to do is to start accumulating bitcoin with the DCA strategy either on a weekly or monthly basis, which will allow him to consistently accumulate bitcoin even though the price of bitcoin is high or low, and a newbie should also use the money he will not need for 4-10 years or more to accumulate bitcoin since bitcoin is not a scheme to get rich soon so that he will hold his bitcoin for a long time since he will not depend on his bitcoin investment to survive.

It is not advisable to keep your funds which you will need in short-term in bitcoin because you might run at loss when you will need the money if bitcoin price is in the dip, and you will have no option than to tap from your bitcoin investment to balance up the lost since it is a necessity. Using bitcoin for payment is good but I will not do that because bitcoin is more precious when you see it as an investment worth keeping than spending because bitcoin is going to get more matured in future with high value.

However, if you are the investor that is being paid in bitcoin, it is better that you invest your DCA amount and convert the rest to USDT because of the price fluctuation in bitcoin so that it does not affect other expenses that you are to do, otherwise, you will run at loss. This is the same reason why your emergency funds should not be in bitcoin if you are a new investor so that when a real emergency comes, and bitcoin price is at the dip, you will not be forced to sell at loss. Don't hold too much of bitcoin when you don't have enough fiat on you because it seems like gambling to me.

I understand the concept of hodling your Bitcoin on the long term and that is the essence of DCA method so that we can be focused on the long term investment plan. But remember that the primary purpose of creating Bitcoin is for p2p transactions to bypass third parties like going through banks. I believe that inasmuch as we're hodling Bitcoin on the long term for investment purposes to keep getting ROI in the future, this shouldn't stop us from spending some of it on the short term. If you remove the percentage for your DCA method, I believe that you can choose to pay for items with Bitcoin, hodling Bitcoin shouldn't eliminate the need to spend it on the short term. If you have a budget for your expenditures from your income and you've removed the percentage for DCA into the long term, you can leave some of the amount in Bitcoin for short term expenditures.

Ofcourse if you're on DCA method, you'll just keep buying despite the price of Bitcoin, and short term price speculations wouldn't matter much to you. But this doesn't mean that there's not a more profitable time to accumulate your bag, as a matter of fact when we're in dip is the best time to accumulate more if the hodler is capable to increase more funds. Keep buying as much as you can, hodl and wait for as long as you've planned into the future.

What immediate transaction are you talking about? Newbies that starting their bitcoin accumulation journey are encouraged to hold their bitcoin for a long term. And their investment should be kept on bitcoin alone and not convert into anything else. That's why we are encouraged to invest money that we won't be needing for the next 4 -10 years and above. So if they are investing money that they have need for immediate conversion to fiat or stablecoins  then you are encouraging them to chasing short term gains. I will understand if you say that they can keep a little portion of their bitcoin exchange till it gets to a certain volume so that they can withdraw all at once to their wallet to avoid paying withdrawal fee every week or month especially if they are doing weekly or monthly DCA with small amount of money.

From what I have learnt from this thread, there is no best season to buy bitcoin, especially when you are investing in bitcoin for the long term and you are making use of the DCA method to accumulate your bitcoin. All seasons are best for buying bitcoin. It is people who have the mindset of chasing short term profits in bitcoin investment that always tends to wait for whatever reason they think is the best to invest in bitcoin. Provided you have your capital readily available for investment go ahead and invest with the DCA strategy. Irrespective of market season.

It is not best to buy the the dip, and hodl, rather it is best to buy bitcoin and hodl and wait. It doesn't really matter the market condition you are buying the bitcoin.

This brings us back to the issue that you raised in regards to maintenance, and personally I believe that there are ways to set up your bitcoin stash and to valuate it in such a way that you don't need to sell large quantities of it, but sure if you are planning to shave 50% or whatever your amount at some price peak, then that could work too.. even though 50% seems like a lot.

Personally I think with bitcoin, it is way better to engage in sustainable withdrawal and you don't need as much capital as you need if you keep your money in traditional assets.. but hey if you don't know those kinds of things, you are likely going to end up selling way too much bitcoin too soon and perhaps you are also not even stacking bitcoin well enough.. which may also get us back to ideas of how does a guy transition from accumulation and then into maintenance and then into some kind of sustainable withdrawal.. which you seem to not really know or understand sustainable withdrawal and that is part of the reason that you consider there to be some value in withdrawing large chunks of whatever BTC you have so far accumulated at the point that you execute such large withdrawal.

You can see some of my sustainable withdrawal points in one of my threads.


We do not need to talk in exact amounts or even to know which part of the world you are in.  In traditional systems usually the person has to accumulate around 25 years of investment value that is equal to 25 years of expenses, so then when he starts to withdraw at 4% per year, he can pretty much sustain his lifestyle.. and of course, there might be some need to count for inflation too.

I personally believe that bitcoin we are able to accumulate ONLY the equivalent of 10 years of our investment valued at the 200-WMA price (that is bottom price) and then we would be able to withdraw up to 10% per year based on the 200-WMA valuations which tends to go up greater than 20% per year.  Yeah it sounds a bit complicated, but I think that it is a great and empowering system if you can figure out how to do it, how to target the size of your BTC stash and those kinds of things... including considering your timeline since historically it has tended to take less BTC with the passage of time to get similar goods and services.  You can see that trend in my fuck you status chart - which is not completely up to date, but the underlying ideas are still the same as the current version of that chart.


I agree that we don't necessarily need to get into personal details.. so no problem with that.


Doesn't sound like a great idea.. .but hey whatever.. you do you.

I like the ideas of shaving off here and there rather than selling large portions, but whatever, you can do what you like and maybe it will all work out for you.


I doubt that very many guys should be thinking that selling BTC is a success, but instead figuring out ways that they mostly keep their BTC and then just sell small amounts from time to time and potentially have other sources of cash too.. but yeah, maybe some higher level price based selling and time based selling can also still be worked into sustainable practices.


$1 million could happen this cycle.. perhaps around 3% odds.. or maybe it is next cycle.. perhaps approaching 20% odds.. or it could be after that.. I have not though too much about assigning exact odds, but there are good chances for $1 million in the coming years.  Many of us don't need $1 million to already start executing decently good bitcoin management practices..and of course, many folks are still in their earliest of stages of accumulating bitcoin so they may well be wanting to accumulate more BTC so they might be in a better position to take advantage of $1 million and higher prices.

I have no issues with where or how to store it since I researched that well before I started accumulating. I actually started back in 2016, but honestly, the amount I’ve gathered isn’t enough (yet) to make me retire. As for budgeting, I’m good with that too since I have income outside of the Bitcoin space that helps me live a simple life. But I’ve always kept in mind that I need more time to keep accumulating, and when the right moment comes, I’ll sell even just half of it and live a financially free life by my own standards.

That time will definitely come, but for now, I’m not focused on hitting any specific figure since I’m not ready to cash out yet. I’ll just keep accumulating regularly. I won’t share the exact amount for privacy reasons, but you’ll know it’s big when it satisfies me.


I’m pretty sure I know, but right now, I’m not at the point where I feel the need to count all the eggs I’ve saved up. The time will come, hopefully soon, and I’ll update you here when it does. But like they say, privacy keeps us safe, because you never know who’s watching. It’s a good thing our accounts hide our real identities; otherwise, I wouldn’t feel comfortable sharing here.

Let’s just say I believe Bitcoin could hit $1 million a piece, and when that happens, maybe I’ll be tempted to sell. How’s that sound?


Selling will be the ultimate success, but I know it won’t happen anytime soon. So, I’ll just keep holding with discipline. Like I said, maybe one day I’ll get tempted to sell. Here’s a little clue: I’ll sell my Bitcoin when it hits $1 million a piece. So, when do you think that’ll be?

I agree that there are various ways to transact, and I am a little bothered by your suggestion to transact through exchanges or to transact through stable coins, other crypto or fiat.  Sure there might be some practicalities, yet there can also be some value in transacting directly on chain and no one can stop you and it can frequently be more private to be transacting online or even through lightning network wallets, even though lightning network wallets become pretty technical too.. including that many of the easier to use lightning network wallets have third party custodial aspects to them.


It is very powerful to hold your own keys.. yet people screw up their custodial situation, including locking themselves out of their coins... and even thinking about having back up seeds and devices in the same location and some kind of a natural disaster or even a fire happens.. that could be a pretty expensive loss, and putting your back up keys with someone else at another geographic location can be quite logistically challenging too..


Exactly... and scary too...especially if it might be your life savings that gets lost.. versus if maybe it was merely 5% to 10% of your stash that ended up getting lost.  There is a difference.. even suffering higher levels of loss could still be acceptable in contrast to losing most if not all of your BTC stash due to some mistake or oversight, that might have had been preventable...and sometimes we cannot know exactly the various vulnerabilities.;.or to prepare for every single negative consequence scenario.


So yeah, part of the point is which aspects of these do you need to know in the beginning, and in the beginning you mostly just need to know if you have discretionary income enough to buy some bitcoin and then you can work out the details as you go, and so some aspects of holding bitcoin are more complicated in terms of different options and even the changes in options with the passage of time that also might change based on how many BTC that the newbie accumulates, so if the newbie is starting out with a $10, $100 or even $1k purchase of bitcoin, his security may not need to be as much as the person who is either starting or getting to $10s of thousands of dollars, or $100s of thousands or more of value into his BTC stash.

A new investor does not need to know anything about the market circle of bitcoin when to buy and when to sell. This is because the best time to start buying bitcoin as a new investor is the moment you have the money available. After figuring out how much of your discretionary income that can make you continue buying weekly or monthly regularly, you are good to go in immediately.

 A new investor doesn't need to bother about selling so that he does not lose focus on building his bitcoin portfolio continously overtime when he sees a little profit because it is better that we invest in a long term and hodli without selling a dime from our bitcoin portfolio during your accumulation phase. You don't just buy the dip and hodli and be waiting at the same time. What are you waiting for as a new investor who is still a low coiner, rather start with DCA buying method and keep buying regularly consistent and persistent for 4-10 years and above, so that you can keep building and growing your bitcoin portfolio because it is the size of your bitcoin portfolio that matters a lot since that is where your profit lies in future.

Waiting is a way of staying poor, instead keep your bitcoin accumulation ongoing and fight your way out of staying poor.

There is likely a difference between what a newbie needs to know to get started and what would be to his advantage to learn after he has already started, so if the person is starting out investing into bitcoin and using an exchange or some place like that to hold his initial BTC purchases, then sure it is likely good to realize that those are not actual bitcoin but instead vouchers for bitcoin rather than bitcoin, but even vouchers for bitcoin provide BTC price exposure, and some people may or may not graduate into holding their BTC, even though they would be more empowered by owning their own BTC and also it is better for BTC if more people hold their own BTC, yet at the same time, new investors do not need to custody their own BTC in order to get started... and they might choose to never custody their BTC, and that is to their disadvantage, but it is also their choice.

I believe that there is a lot of value in self-custody of BTC, and some self-custody solutions are easier and some are more difficult, and even if it is preferred that bitcoiners learn about self-custody, they might not want to and that is their choice and also there is no prerequisite that they have to learn about self-custody prior to investing into bitcoin, even if many of us might proclaim that they are not buying real bitcoin unless they hold such bitcoin in self-custody, they still might choose to not custody their bitcoin and take chances in regards to various aspects of having their coins with 3rd party custodians, whether an exchange or whatever other kind of BTC exposure they buy, such as BTC shares in a spot ETF.


Managing your BTC is not ONLY about figuring out how much you are going to buy, since how you balance your life, your dollars, your other investments and your bitcoin may well be considered a moving target.

Sure, you have been registered on the forum since early 2016 so getting close to 8 years so maybe you have had time to accumulate bitcoin, and you may or may not be done with you BTC accumulation, yet you might go through a maintenance stage where you are neither buying BTC and you are also not selling it either, yet you still should be purposefully considering how you are managing your BTC in that regard.. and what your expectations might be in regards to your BTC.   Whether you don't yet have enough, or you are getting close to having enough or you have more than enough can affect how you choose to manage your holdings, which also may include considerations where to keep it, which could end up being a combination of places that may or may not be shared with others and ideas about whether you have figured out succession strategies too.. or if you are going to just die with your bitcoin. 


You kind of sound like a guy who is in a long term trade rather than an investment, since you seem to have not considered how much bitcoin you need (or want to accumulate) and then you seem to not really know what your target is.. Are you just going to sell all of it when it reaches a certain price, or maybe you have ideas about how much you are selling at various price points? 

I am not suggesting that you need to know all of these matters, but you should try to figure out some of the parameters in regards to how you are planning to treat your BTC. and if you are still accumulating then how much more do you need or want?  Sure there are some guys who might mostly be done accumulating BTC on a regular basis, but they still might choose to pick up more on dips... so there can be quite a few variations  in regards to how to manage your BTC holdings.


So you seem to not have any exact target for how many BTC you want or need, except you just buy it from time to time, and then wait for the day that it goes to the moon?  When it goes to the moon, then what are you going to do?  Sell at that point?  You seem to have a pretty vague approach in regards to your bitcoin stash, no?


Even though you use the term "investor" at various points of your post, you have the mentality of a trader, not an investor.

Once you take profits, then what you going to do with such profits?


You still seem unable to get absolutes out of your head and your way of expressing your ideas?  Why do you need to use the word "definitely" in your post (and in your thinking)?  You cannot feel good about investing into bitcoin unless it is "definitely" going to become more expensive in the future?

Yes it's true that you don't need to be tech savvy to start your Bitcoin investment journey, just know the basics and you're good to go. Satoshi Nakamoto, has put all the complexities into perspective that involves holding your Bitcoin in a decentralized Blockchain. Miners and nodes are there to take care of the technicalities of the network, so you're pretty much left with understanding the basic knowledge of how to protect your passwords and seed phrase in the case of using none custodial wallets. As much as it's not advisable to leave your coins in an exchange, it's still ok to start with them, especially when you're starting with a small fund, there's no genuine reason not to get started. As a newbie's knowledge is increasing then he can start to figure out which self custodial wallets are reputable in the crypto space. There are lots of them, he'll need to DYOR and make a choice for himself. As a newbie's knowledge is increasing and his Bitcoin accumulation is also increasing it's better to consider cold wallets that doesn't need to connect online. The crypto space is a hub for scammers and hackers so everybody must know how best to secure their funds. Bitcoin for immediate transactions can be left with a third party like exchanges, so that it'll be easy for conversion into other cryptos, stablecoins or fiat, that is if there's nobody to do p2p transactions with. Hot wallets that are connected online should be categorized for short and mid term use, while cold wallets should be for long term hodling.

The biggest responsibilities about being your own bank when you're holding your Bitcoin in a none custodial wallet is to secure your private keys and seed phrase. If a holder is able to do this then he's as good as being his own decentralized bank. The concept and importance of securing your seed phrase can not be overemphasized, if you lose it maybe through theft or damage, then your BTC is as good as being a donation to the Bitcoin community. Through your wallet is the only access that you have to your BTC on the blochchain. So yes if you can be able to protect the privacy of your wallet, then you don't need to worry about Bitcoin technicalities. Understanding Bitcoin circles, the best season to buy and the best time to reap returns on your investment is important. Bitcoin is not a get rich quick scheme like most shitcoins in the market, it's best to buy the dip, hodl and wait.

Of course as an investor keeps on increasing his size of his bitcoin portfolio to a certain level, what will be his worries/concern is the best way he can secure his investment. One advantage that using an exchange to keep your bitcoin temporarily is to pile up the little little amount of bitcoin that you are buying weekly till it get to a certain amount like $500 before sending it to your self custody wallet that is open source.

This practice will save you from paying too much high transaction fees when transaction fees is very high in future. If you buy immediately $50 of bitcoin and transfer directly to your private wallet continously overtime, you will make so many small UTXO and this will affect you in future when you want to make transactions because the fees will be very high and might eat up all your profit making it a wasts of time because you didn't combine all your small small bitcoin purchases into one when you where investing.

What I understand is that third-party custody and self custody is very important for a bitcoin long-term investor for him to enjoy the fruit of his labor in future. Some investors don't know this and they think that it is the best to buy and transfer their small weekly DCA amount immediately to their self custody wallet. Invest wisely and save yourself from small UTXO in future.

However, if you are DCAing with $500 and above, it is good that you send it directly to your private wallet.

I also agree with you, there is no 100% guarantee that bitcoin will bring us profit in the future. We can only predict the future by researching past data and it may be right or wrong. But we can never be sure. Those who are experienced and well versed in crypto know very well that no one can predict Bitcoin or other currencies with 100% certainty.

But researching the past of Bitcoin shows that there is a high probability that Bitcoin will become much more valuable in the future than today and everyone believes it, so every investor is investing and holding Bitcoin as much as they can, and thus given the popularity and demand of Bitcoin are day by day increasing. As a result, there is a high probability that Bitcoin will definitely become very expensive in the future. And those who are buying DCA and "hodly" for long term, they will stand to benefit immensely in the future.

I think you both are on the same page, you've indirectly outlined some possible ways of managing your Bitcoin investment like not being phased by market the fluctuation of the market, thinking long-term and using the history of Bitcoin as motivation to continue investing. Also, let's not forget that investing in Bitcoin requires patience and discipline to be able to manage your portfolio very well and management too also involves security cause their are some investors who still hodl Bitcoin in exchanges which is not very safe. It's very beneficial to own Bitcoin as an asset but the securing it from online intruders and hackers is also very important and it all falls under the management of Bitcoin investment. Also, it's not only about buying and Hodling to gain profits after a long period but buying continuesly, accumulating more Bitcoin to your portfolio periodically for long-term that's the best way to go about Bitcoin investment. Bitcoin has come to stay, though there were people who doubt it's potential in the past but I think  some of them are beginning to retrace their steps, more people are gradually understanding Satoshi's idea and seeing it's benefits for different usecases. As we can see, Bitcoin is gradually heading to another possible ATH so it's best to Hodl than take profits cause of these sudden upsurge.

What kind of management we talkin' about here anyway? We're in it for the long game, HODL mode activated. Not phased by market swings, not even by those dramatic dumps, because history’s shown us they’re just temporary speed bumps. Let’s not forget, Bitcoin’s "died" 477 times and yet here we are, sitting on one of the most successful assets of our generation.

When it comes to managing your investment, it’s more about how much fiat you're willing to put in. Whether you're buying small during dips or going all in, the key is holding it long term.

Honestly, I wrestle with how much to invest myself, but once it's in my wallet, I’m in for the ride. It just waits there, knowing one day it’ll be worth so much more. Bitcoin’s growth is inevitable, especially with big names that once hated it now slowly coming onboard.

Look at the USA, they used to think Bitcoin was just for shady stuff, but now they’re regulating it and even approving ETFs for the big players.

This is only the start, just the beginning of Bitcoin's climb. You might be tempted to cash out, but when Bitcoin skyrockets, you might regret it. That’s why HODL’s the word.

Very well needed to get started first before figuring out whichever wallet to use to store you Bitcoin as a start off new Bitcoin investors, the most important thing in safeguarding Bitcoin for a newbies Bitcoin investor is to first get hold of a wallet that he can have total control of the Bitcoin in it, and along side also a third party exchange wallet where he can use to buy and store Bitcoin along the way, this is why in most time's some of the newbies tend to make a good solid start off, while few others still make the mistakes of taking third party exchange wallet to hold all they Bitcoin assets, and thinking that their are holding Bitcoin not knowing that I. Realities, they are not in control of those Bitcoin as long as it in an exchange wallet, so for a start, having such a mindset of temporary usage of exchange and there after transferring the Bitcoin back to your own personal wallet if possible a cold hardware wallet, since that the most secured, so once there is already a long term investment approach, it becomes easier to combine Bitcoin investment and building security of funds along the way, this is mostly very important at all time and one need not to get carried away with the simplicity that comes with exchange wallet, don't get carried away a d always have your Bitcoin transfered to you own wallet in other to be in full control of the Bitcoin.