Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 166. (Read 142622 times)

Well for me I think the risk was worth taking. It is better to invest now and find out what the outcome will be in the future than to neglect investing at all, while figuring what the future will be like for bitcoin. If it eventually pay off the person that decided to invest will be considered as a wise person. If it doesn't pay off by that time, we continue holding with the hope that it will pay off someday.

From your example it was evident enough that lump summing once without following up with DCA during the waiting period is not actually a wise decision. While waiting for the x number of years, one should take the advantage of following up the investment, provided that the investor has the means.

Even if it wasn't guaranteed that the extra money the investor is putting is not going to pay off in the end. It was an avenue for the second guy to save up his money by investing it in bitcoin through the DCA of $50 per week. It was a risk that was worth it. It was better than the first guy who probably was saving his extra money he was getting in Fiat within that 9 years intervals.

My assertion in making the comparisons is that the first guy ONLY did a lump sum purchase of bitcoin with $5k and the second guy did the lump sum, yet continued to invest into bitcoin through out the period.

So my assertion is that the first guy purposefully chose to be less aggressive in his investment style than the second guy, and it seems that the first guy was more whimpy in his investment style than the second guy.

Sure, it was not guaranteed that all of the extra money that the second guy put into bitcoin over the next 9 years was going to end up paying off, and it cost him $50 per week to put in that extra money over 9 years, which I was presuming to be fairly easily within the means of either one of them to continue to buy bitcoin, yet the first one chose to limit his investment in bitcoin to the $5k amount.

With bitcoin we see that historically it had been the best of assets to invest in, and right now we are faced with similar kinds of choices, and we cannot know for sure whether our choices to ongoing invest into bitcoin are going to end up paying off.

An emergency fund is money set aside to solve unexpected financial problems and not to be used to solve daily expenses. So, if any investor invests his whole money into bitcoin with the idea that his emergency fund will allow him to hold his bitcoin for a long time, that investor will end up selling his bitcoin to survive even though he is at a loss because his emergency fund cannot take care of his daily expenses for a long time. If anyone wants to get it right with a bitcoin investment, that person should invest what he or she can afford to lose and also keep an emergency fund, a reserve fund, and a float.

Experience is the best teacher no doubt but sometimes you can not possibly learn from other people's experience because you won't know or understand the magnitude of the experience

Even though you invest all your money on BTC and have emergency money that can make you to exercise patience till the bull run occur before you can sell

With bitcoin we see that historically it had been the best of assets to invest in, and right now we are faced with similar kinds of choices, and we cannot know for sure whether our choices to ongoing invest into bitcoin are going to end up paying off.

To me short-term investment ain't encouraging at all the risk in it alone is too much compare to that of long-term investment. Like for instance someone that lacks the ability to be patient (because I believe short-term investors are really impatient) , and endup buying bitcoin at the peak and then a massive dip followed it , that individual won't have the mindset to keep buying and holding instead he or she will endup selling in loss because they lack the patient, thinking he or she has cut their losses.

But for those that are into long-term investment, instead of selling in loss they will continue to buy the dip , because they believe in a long run they will endup with the last laugh , so they will keep accumulating and holding , and if later on the price's endup risen (surging) they will endup with a far better profits.

I have gone through the question you add above and I would rather be the guy who spent $28,500 and had somewhere between 27 BTC and 34 BTC (with an average cost per BTC between $838 and $1,056). Even though I ended up spending more money than the first guy in acquiring my bitcoin. I also ended up having more bitcoin in my possession which is much more profitable than the first guy. Although both of them are successful with their investments. Each were able to invest according to their financial capabilities.

Although, shitcoiners could make/invent the same debate/argument about their shitcoins, my counter-argument for THAT is - For an investment strategy of Buy the DIP/DCA, and HODL with low time preference, we need to be HODLing the asset that will actually continue to exist in 10 to 20 years. That's Bitcoin, the others in crypto are risky and MOST might start dying after 2 or 3 cycles.

What give them pressure is the volatility since they provably would get affected on each movement of the market since what they aim is to hit big gains from their trades. But if there's sudden unexpected situation like big price fall it made them panic since they don't have any plan to hold it for many months since maybe they don't like to be a bag holder that's why usually they think about dumping to cut the losses then buy at more deeper price so they can recover. Common practice happening in trading and that's stressful.

Short term investment is high risk and see a lot of people fall down because they choose the hard path. If they just follow what lots of people did and they are not attracted for short term risky profit for sure those bad situations will not happen to them. They could just learn the best way to deal with bitcoin if they are open for new things on how to improve their self towards choosing the best approach on their investment with bitcoin since they could learn that long term holding and consistent accumulating is always the best for this coin.

Experience is the best teacher no doubt but sometimes you can not possibly learn from other people's experience because you won't know or understand the magnitude of the experience and  I want you to know that every strategy is unique in there own way, DCA method doesn't give investors the mindset of being consistent rather investors disciplined themselves and know what is right to do because there are a lot of investors who uses the DCA method yet they are not consistent with it so that method doesn't give investors the mindset to be consistent. Just like I said earlier any strategy can be good and perfect depending on your capacity, you are sounding like a trader at the end of your post however, you can't incur loss because of change of strategy rather you can become stranded and biased if you don't know how to manage your investment and your income.

Statement like yours defeat the aim of our discussion here because going by that, people might go in search of their strategy instead of using what works and its being recommended here by people who have actually tested them and have even made some improvements that helped them become more effective. For instance, I was doing something else before joining this discussion and when I joined, I learnt about the DCA method of accumulation from @JayJuanGee who did exceptional job in it. Quickly, I started using it and it was not long that I saw real peace and progress in my Bitcoin investing, for which I'm eternally grateful.

Assuming I followed your type of advice, I would have moved ahead in search of supposed personal strategy and that would have mostly likely landed me into shitcoins where I came from with so much regrets. So, the reason we are here is to exchange ideas that will help us become better in our investing and   to remain adamant about what we believe in even when it is not working fine or giving us much positive result.

Well said mate, I think it's best to learn from other people experience it is the best teacher, the DCA method of accumulating bitcoin is one of the best method I know of cause it gives an investor the mindset of being consistent in accumulating more bitcoin, so instead of looking for other Strategies that could make one loose their asset in the process it's good to stick to what works best.
 Atleast it's been proven by @JayJuanGee and you, else you guys won't be preaching about it to others here, so @Lidger, instead of experimenting other Strategies you should stick to what works best and have been tested and trusted by other members.

Investing in Bitcoin for short terms puts the investor in a big pressure, because the investor knows that they aren't going to invest on Bitcoin for long term and all their mindsets is just that Bitcoin should continue to go higher instead of dipping any time soon. However, short term investment isn't the good way to invest in Bitcoin because you aren't going to witness more buying opportunities.
Well, talking about trading, I see that as also a short term investment and it has the highest risks because you might lose your capital within some seconds. But when you invest on Bitcoin for long term you aren't going to lose that much money and even if Bitcoin dips and you lose some money, you only have to give it some days for it to increase again (most times it takes few hours for it to increase again) and you will gain back your money. Meanwhile, on the other hand, the DIPs is also a good opportunity that we all should use to accumulate more Bitcoin into our portfolio for the long term.

This above response is correct.


This is a strange way of outlining what may or may not be successful since there are variations of success including the ways that individuals make their choices to tailor what they invest in and how they manage their cashflows in light of their own risk tolerance, so their level of aggressiveness after they had identified a good investment (such as investing in bitcoin, since that is what we are talking about here), there still can be levels of aggressiveness or whimpiness within correct applications in regards to accumulating bitcoin, and outcomes might vary quite a bit, even within variations of correct applications of good practices, even though each person might also be able to claim success within his own parameters of how much and how he was willing to apply similar strategies and to purposefully come to different balances when his financial circumstances might have had been very similar to another person who might have had been more whimpy in his BTC accumulation approach or might have been more aggressive than the person with comparable starting financial circumstances.  

There is also a lot of discretion in regards to cashflow management and determining how much to keep within various backup fund categories, and a lot of the variations could be correct and/or within discretionary but acceptable parameters.

Mere financial success in terms of the outcome of how much money is in the bank (or how many bitcoin in the wallet) might not be exactly an appropriate comparison of which version is more successful if each person might have applied his own BTC accumulation strategy and cashflow management to his best of abilities and his individual factors, but still each could have made various errors along the way too that may or may not have ended up materially affecting the results...

We would have to know more before we might presume certain kinds of financial outcomes would be considered to be more successful than others as long as each of the ones who are buying the bitcoin are tailoring their own balances of good practices to their own circumstances...and success is not even guaranteed, either... even if someone does everything correct, success is not guaranteed, even if they choose bitcoin as their primary investment vehicle or they might even choose certain ways to hedge their bets in ways that are very smart and prudent, but they still are not guaranteed success even if they do everything correctly.

Don't count me as overly pessimistic, since I include myself in the camp that guys increase their chances of success when they plan, prepare and even act in accordance with good practices, and they surely have more likelihood for success as compared with the guy who does not plan, prepare and act in responsible ways.. yet surely there are always going to be exceptions in either direction, yet from my own perspective there are a lot of advantages in planning and acting in accordance with plans, especially when it comes to cashflow management and investing.

By the way, I edited and added a question ("which one would you rather be?") to my above post.

To me short-term investment ain't encouraging at all the risk in it alone is too much compare to that of long-term investment. Like for instance someone that lacks the ability to be patient (because I believe short-term investors are really impatient) , and endup buying bitcoin at the peak and then a massive dip followed it , that individual won't have the mindset to keep buying and holding instead he or she will endup selling in loss because they lack the patient, thinking he or she has cut their losses.

But for those that are into long-term investment, instead of selling in loss they will continue to buy the dip , because they believe in a long run they will endup with the last laugh , so they will keep accumulating and holding , and if later on the price's endup risen (surging) they will endup with a far better profits.

I know that with proper knowledge of trading, someone has some chances of making a profit from Bitcoin. However, what I know is that it can't always be profitable, and sometimes even those with proper knowledge also lose money. In fact, if we check some traders claiming to be good, and if we examine the profits they make over a year, many of the profits aren't even more than 10% of their capital. This is because, as they make profits, they also incur losses. In fact, some of them don't even make a profit over the years because they encounter big losses when they least expect them. However, since they continually add more money to their trading accounts, they may not feel much of losing as they due make some like profits sometimes.

To be honest, long-term investment is far better than trading because the risk of investing is less compared to trading. If someone can keep accumulating Bitcoin for, say, 15 years, they could potentially make a very reasonable amount of profit, which many traders may not achieve. Let's just imagine those early investors who kept accumulating Bitcoin over the last 10 or 8 years how much do we think they would have in their wallets by now? 

Statement like yours defeat the aim of our discussion here because going by that, people might go in search of their strategy instead of using what works and its being recommended here by people who have actually tested them and have even made some improvements that helped them become more effective. For instance, I was doing something else before joining this discussion and when I joined, I learnt about the DCA method of accumulation from @JayJuanGee who did exceptional job in it. Quickly, I started using it and it was not long that I saw real peace and progress in my Bitcoin investing, for which I'm eternally grateful.

Assuming I followed your type of advice, I would have moved ahead in search of supposed personal strategy and that would have mostly likely landed me into shitcoins where I came from with so much regrets. So, the reason we are here is to exchange ideas that will help us become better in our investing and   to remain adamant about what we believe in even when it is not working fine or giving us much positive result.

Everyone has their own strategy when it comes to investing and I certainly appreciate the fact that everyone invests in their own strategy. If we follow others directly in the field of investment then we will never be satisfied with our investment because if one person is successful by investing in different strategy, I may not be successful by investing in the same strategy.

In as much as everyone has their own strategy I still think one can actually make a great investment or success using other strategy provided the person is capable of handling the strategy I mean this is Bitcoin investment not ordinary business investment where luck and grace follows sometimes. In Bitcoin investment, whatever you invest, you are going to make profit according to that likewise anyone who invest with same capital and same period of time. Adapting to other strategy or chosing other strategy depend on the capacity of the person. For example I can leave DCA and decide to be buying lump sum if I have what it takes. I believe we have three strategy which includes:
1. Lump sum or lump summing
2. Buy Dip
3. DCA
Then again, these above mentioned I don't think it's belongs to a particular person because I believe some investors rotate on this strategies so I don't know if there is any other personal strategy you are talking about and if there's please I want to know.