Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 240. (Read 136036 times)

i have seen many comments regarding my response to $50 not a reasonable amount to invest and to set aside for emergency and reserved, and it is causing alot of misconception. I wouldn't have talked about it though but I thought I will explain more better. the thread has explained about Investment and how we can start as little as possible yes it s true any suggestions of anybody about how little they can start up with is fine by them. according to Roseline492 she said that someone who leaves with their parents can be able to invest and have some amount in his discretion because the person is fed by the parents but what if the person is staying alone without his parents? definitely that amount would not be able to withstand everything he is definitely going to sell of his Bitcoin. In actual sense, investment is for mature people who can take care of their bills/ responsibilities and be able to invest in bitcoin and have  discretionary fund and also an emergency fund for a long time horizon and we can not deny that fact. when talking about investing we shouldn't be carried away by how small we feel we can start, but how far we can go continuously with it. we all know bitcoin investment required us to invest either through   DCA, dip and HODL and lump sums trategy. and this $50 amount as a salary is not enough to handle any of this strategy properly and be able to have enough in our discretionary or reserved. how steadily we can be able to maintain the BTC investment time horizon surely depends on our discretion, when your salary can not be able to put a reasonable amount to discretion after family expenditure how can you be able to continue DCA? it may sound somehow to you guys, but believe me in my own understanding I know what am saying I have family I carter for and I know how much money I spend on feeding for my family how much I also set aside for emergency and reserved in weekly so I know what am saying considering the inflation all over the world. though to some countries $50 may be a reasonable amount to withstand all but in my country it is very poor. maybe it surely depends on your own opinion and the value of some countries currency. any way is fine but the main point is that instead of Involing in some investment that will make you sell of you bitcoin HODLing due to the inability to maintain balance ⚖️ between discretion and bitcoin investment, is better not to invest atol. but if you can be able to maintain the balance for longer time horizon then no problem.

you seem to be misunderstanding the whole concept of investment. your sudjestion does not speak of a good investor. a good investor doesn't invest blindly without considering the level of his discretion. you can't just start to invest in DCA while you have no plans for discretion. as a matter of fact if you dont have reserved or floats there is no point to invest because you will definitely sell of the rips down the road. when you don't have a reserve to fuel your DCA.

before investing, you must have a focus of a longer time horizon or duration, you must have steady flow income generation that will help you have some reserved fund to be able to DCA weekly and be able to provide for other necessary expenses. and yet you don't feel like you are even investing in bitcoin.

I really find this explanation meaningful and informative and i also believe alot will also learn from it because it is very clear and understandable. Am investor decide how much of his aggressiveness towards his investment in terms of how much of his discretional or disposable income he is allocating to his investment by considering what will be his basic expenses ,  it further explained how our discretional income can be increased by considering a certain level of comfort by optioning for things that should really be considered to be a basic needs which will varies individually but however, attenting to increase our discretional income by reducing our expenses in such way that it will not effect negative impact on our living is another way of showing how much aggressive one can be be in his investment or probably increase his float and reserve funds which are also important in our investment journey.

Even though I understand that you are saying that your bitcoin investment comes from your discretionary income, so it is extra income that you are putting into bitcoin with the hope to be able to both defer gratification and to hopefully improve your life at some future time.

Nonetheless, whether someone invests $10 per week, $100 per week, $1,000 per week or some other amount into bitcoin, the amount that is invested does have potentials to take away from current consumption, depending upon how aggressive the person is in light of his discretionary income.. if he is really wimpy and he is investing only 1-5% or his discretionary income then he is less likely to feel the effects of missing that income that he could have used for current consumption rather than potentially profiting later.  And, of course, if he is investing somewhere close to 100% of his discretionary income, he might be sacrificing driving a nicer car or maybe living in a less luxurious house or maybe going out to eat less (or perhaps not at all), so there could be some current sacrifices and reductions in quality of life based on investing into bitcoin, even though the investment into bitcoin would not be taking away from the basic expenses, yet the investor still chooses what he considers to be basic expenses or not.


That is a pretty dumb video.. but yeah sure funny at the same time.

There are people who could have had gotten into bitcoin at $69k and then just sat on their hands for the last 2.5 years, which surely that would have been a short-sighted approach, especially if we see that even someone who started investing right around $69k in 2021 would likely be in pretty good profits right now, and even if the person front loaded and bought a whole bitcoin for $69k, but if that same person bought an additional $69k worth of bitcoin since about October 1, 2021 until now (at $500 per week), then he would have had accumulated a total of around 3.2595 (1 + 2.2595) bitcoin and a total of $69* 2= $138k invested (currently valued right around $218k (so nearly 60% higher than the invested amount).. which truly would not be a bad place to be.


Yep exactly.. as my attempt at an example (above).  A person could have started buying BTC at the top and even lump sum invested at the top, and there quite a few different scenarios in which he would still be quite a bit in profits right now based on continuing to invest in BTC, even if he started with a relatively high lump sum investment at the top of the 2021 BTC prices.

I sometimes feel that everyone who hears something about cryptocurrencies will search for the next thing that he or she believes will explode 10000x. It is the feeling that they missed the train and now find themselves hunting that one coin nobody else knows about. In other words, probably 90% of new investors decide against going down the solid route and DCA into Bitcoin overtime right from the start.

The worst is when you get into hopping from Bitcoin into shit coins and try to do that repeatedly, hoping to double your money. In the very, very beginning I have given some shit coins a shot and while it is exciting to see some of them go up, the markets for them very quickly dry out or some of the "dev wallets" get flash dumped and you are screwed.

The proof lies in the data for Bitcoin. There are threads that explain in a very solid way where somebody would be if they had investors X amount over time in a certain interval. It is mind-blowing and only in hindsight do more people understand how powerful DCAing would have actually been for them even with small amounts.

Yes I agree with this, when we talk about investing then we are only required to always be able to maintain a consistent budget allocation on the various strategies that we have, one of which is DCA which is now more widely used by most investors. On the other hand, I understand that investing is not only about profit opportunities but will also always have the possibility of potential losses, but as long as you still maintain your accumulation even if for example the price drops then that does not mean you are completely at a loss, because as we know that in the last 10 years bitcoin has always had an increase which sometimes the increase can be very significant and this is also the reason why it is more advisable to have long-term planning when we want to get involved in this bitcoin investment, one of which is by using the DCA strategy.

On the other hand, of course everyone has worries in him especially when it comes to financial matters, but when you are able to be patient to maintain your long-term planning, there is a high probability for you to reach the recovery phase if indeed the price has previously dropped and maybe you can achieve a maximum profit of thousands of percent of the amount of capital you allocated, and the point is to always be consistent in the budget allocation according to what you plan, whether it's once a week or once a month and always be patient in the process of the journey, I understand that there is no 100% guarantee that you will succeed at the end of the accumulation plan, but I think we should remember the fact that usually something that is done consistently and patiently usually will not disappoint.

Well i don't think a serious person with an unstable income will want to go into investment without looking for an alternative source to fund his investment, it must have been an unexpected situation that has put that person in a tight bent corner beyond his control ,which has led to unstable investment.
Investing in Bitcoin using the DCA method makes it very easy for anyone that is interested in investing , no matter how little your income is ,you still chose to invest either daily, weekly or even monthly,as long as your are comfortable with your income and  it meet your demands .

The investor will not make profit if he only bought at that price once without buying again until Bitcoin price passes 70k, that is when he can start seeing profit. However, if that investor bought his first bitcoin at 69k and continue to buy regularly weekly or monthly using DCA for four years, even with the current bitcoin price of 66k+ as I am typing this post he would have made profit. This is because he was opportune to also buy bitcoin at the dip of 2022 October, so due to constant buying, his average bitcoin price will be lower and not at 69k anymore.

This is the power of DCA, and that is why it is recommended mostly for beginners or those that are in their accumulation phase. Bitcoin investment is like every normal investment that in the early stage you need to sacrifice a lot to make sure that it stands. This is why I don't get it why people feel bitcoin investment is something they put their money into and expect profit immediately without building it over a long period of time.

There are people who come into Bitcoin based on the hype or the believe that they could possibly make money easily without knowing that it does not work that way and this set of people are actually the ones that gets confused or panicking if the price is going opposite direction. But however for someone who his major aim is to buy and hold will never be afraid weather the price goes up or down because what he is looking out is not the current state of Bitcoin but instead he is focusing at what the future could bring and that's what differentiate a holder from other investors, however is actually surprising to see that most investors could not differentiate holding and short term because most of them believe that holding there investment six or seven months is consider as a holder, on the contrary that's a short term holding.

Stop talking about altcoins and b specific on the word Bitcoinbecause only bitcoin is an assest, and is worth hodling for long. You don't need to wait for the dip before to start investing in bitcoin because you don't know when the dip will come. A beginner in his bitcoin journey should start buying immediately he has the money, and continue regularly weekly or monthly in order for him to grow and build his bitcoin portfolio over time. If you wait for the dip, you will end up accumulating little over a long period of time compare to an investor that used the DCA strategy. The aim of investing in bitcoin is to have a reasonable amount of bitcoin and this is why a new investor don't need to stop accumulating or waiting because your portfolio will be stagnant and the price of bitcoin increases overtime. If you have your discretionary income, emergency funds, get started without looking back.

Trading has nothing to do with hodling, they are opposite. For you to be at rest with your bitcoin investment, you need to invest in a long term so that you don't bother about the price of bitcoin dipping or pumping, what you only focus on is accumulating consistently and persistently in order to build your bitcoin portfolio to a certain level. This is why using the DCA strategy is the best because it gives you the opportunity to buy bitcoin irrespective of the price.

Exactly, I support your idea about this where maybe we have also often heard the saying that sooner is better, in any case including in investment where when people are still busy satisfying their desires with the money they have but we already have a smarter plan that leads to a potentially bright future when we have completed our accumulation plan (although not always guaranteed).

On the other hand, lately I often see people who prefer to satisfy or improve their lifestyle when they have a lot of money rather than thinking about the future, even though fate in the future cannot always be predicted but obviously by thinking about the future early on by doing various things that might have great potential to give us a brighter financial situation and condition in the future then of course this is a better decision to do, especially if you realize that you now have a fairly good financial situation such as having additional income as you said.

Is there any guarantee that someone who invest his little money in short term trading, that the person will make profit? Trading is not for everyone and there are techniques to these things, anybody can wake up and make investment and Hodl for long, but it's not the same thing when it comes to trading, hence people like me that know little or nothing about Short time trading, will prefer a situation where I can invest my $5 and be assured that my $5 is safe and continue accumulating no matter how small it is. Unlike trading where we have advanced and highly skilled professionals who are patiently waiting for you to make the slight mistake so they can profit from your money. People with low funding should not be venturing into trading, because when you guess wrongly and lose your funds it will take you longer time to rise back. I will rather accumulate with the little I have than venturing into day trading.

Shrink the scope and focus only on bitcoin. You won't get stuck with fake pump and dump, even if you get a dump at some point you can still buy and accumulate them. The price of bitcoin will increase over time, even someone who is stuck at the previous ATH can still hope to get a return when the season bullish occurs. If you buy and continue to accumulate, your average price will get lower and will no longer keep you stuck at ATH, for example.

You can easily find examples like what I mean, so of course you won't be trapped in bitcoin if you have good financial strength. Even if you can still hold longer and wait out the bull run market for some time if you are stuck at ATH, you will likely find your investment in bitcoin to be profitable.

Some folks think that they don't have discretionary income left for them after their monthly expenses, whereas they have extra funds that they use to gamble, buy expensive clothes and buy things that is not that important whenever they get paid. Unknown to them that such funds can be used to invest into bitcoin because it comes regular from their income, but they will not have that idea. It is when they have made up their mind to invest and the start looking for how they get money that they will now realize that those extra funds after their monthly expenses in which they keep aside to buy some irrelevant things can be used to invest.

If you are poor and you feel that your monthly income is small for you to invest, just be serious and try to see how you can invest, you will see that if you are serious, you will begin to look into your income and expenses to see how you can squeeze out some extra funds from there, and that is when you will find out that you can have some extra funds in which you can use to invest, or because you are so serious to invest, you will cut down some expenses to have extra cash. Investing helps a poor or average man to have financial management compare to when he is not investing. This is why bitcoin is the best asset that a poor man can invest in as long as he has income, because he can buy bitcoin with little amount based on his own discretionary income.

It is only those that don't have a job or their income cannot take care of their monthly needs that cannot invest in bitcoin only if they look for additional income before they will. I pity for those rich people that don't want to invest in bitcoin because they will regret in the latter.

Right. It will happen with those people who made investment from only with the hype when the greed level is high.
If investors weren't aware at least with the basic knowledge then they will definitely face loss even they intend to investment in bitcoin. for example if a person invested in bitcoin at the 2021 at 69k then how will he make profit, he takes 4 years to recover even if he made the investment for the long-term. Here is memes for those-


here is one video also
https://twitter.com/naiivememe/status/1783890530952188267

In not all cases, you have to wait for the price of Bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies to fall deeply. You should have a bracket of how many percent you will buy a coin that you believe will give you good savings in the future.

There are many people who are confused by such a system; what they think is going to drop a lot in the market is suddenly just a fake dump, and if they continue with the baiting tendency, the fund will be stuck and the expected will not happen, unless you really have a deep understanding of trading here in the crypto space.

Yes, I want to give one additional point that might be considered by those who have not invested in Bitcoin.

Talking about additional income, of course this money will not be used for other purposes, meaning that if we don't get additional income, our expenses will automatically remain the same, which is of course better to use additional income to invest in Bitcoin. If they save money, of course no profit will come to them unless they save it in the bank and of course there are taxes and only a very small percentage of interest per year. At this point, of course, the big conclusion is to take advantage of additional income to invest in bitcoin, which we consider this money to be ready to lose.
Or as you said investing in bitcoin does not promise wealth but it is better to do it because we see the development of bitcoin increasingly advanced due to mass adoption.

On the other hand, a fixed monthly income is of course included in the initial planning to set aside our ability to invest, such as 10% or 5%, for us to invest in bitcoin. If everything can be managed as well as possible, of course the investment we make in Bitcoin will not interfere at all with our expenses or our daily needs.

From here the interesting conclusion is, of course, don't be afraid of losing the money we invest in bitcoin and this investment does not promise wealth, but there are times when we will enjoy profits from investing in bitcoin. Profit is the profit from the capital that we have spent, where if the target is to accumulate Bitcoin within a period of 10 years, after that we will calculate how much profit we get. Looking at the history of people who have invested in Bitcoin, they have become millionaires now, so your doubts are your fault. Get Bitcoin by buying regularly every week, no need to worry about the price going down because a downturn is the opportunity you have been waiting for to buy aggressively.

There is an important distinction related to the point that you seem to be wanting to make, which seems to be that you are missing some nuance in regards to what makes a person able or unable to invest.

There is some correctness that if a person lacks capital, then he may well not be able to invest into bitcoin or anything else, yet the more important point would be that a person's ability to invest in bitcoin or anything else relates to the extent to which he has discretionary income.   

So in that sense there is no requirement that anyone has any capital at all in order to invest into bitcoin, and so the main requirement is that a person has discretionary income - and sure, a person who has a lot of capital may well be able to invest into bitcoin by moving his capital from certain kinds of assets into bitcoin, so there could be exceptions to any proclamation - even though we already know that it is not required to have any capital to invest into bitcoin so long as you have discretionary, even though having capital could be another way to establish an investment into bitcoin.


So are you admitting that there is no need for capital to invest into bitcoin?


With something like bitcoin, many times it is better to get started as soon as possible, especially once you have figured out that you have discretionary income.   

Now you might have a lot of messiness in your cashflows and your psychology, so you may well need to get some of those things in order, yet I would not presume that it mis necessary to get your finances and psychology in order prior to getting started in your investment into bitcoin, unless your situation happens to be so bad that you are not even able to figure out with any level of confidence whether you actually have discretionary income or not. 

Even though a large number of people might have a lot of complications in their finances and perhaps even lacking in their abilities to manage their finances very well.  Most likely an overwhelming number of folks should be able to tell you wether they have $100 per week or maybe $10 per week that they would be able to spare or throw away (meaning that it is extra and not needed to cover their expenses).    When folks have really small amounts of extra income and a lot of disorganization in their finances, it is likely more important that they start out more slowly and that they also spend time getting their shit figured out, but that still may well not justify waiting rather than getting started right away with some small amount of discretionary income that can be figured out. 

If there is no way to establish the existence of discretionary income, then those people need to make sure that they have discretionary income before they can start to invest into bitcoin.


Yes... if they have figured out that they actually do not have discretionary, then the should not be investing into bitcoin, because if they were to do that they would be gambling rather than investing.  They need to be able to put the money into bitcoin and have a certain level of confidence that they are not going to need such money for 4-10 years or longer and also understand the risk that the amount that they put in could go to zero (meaning they could lose up to 100% of the amount that they put into bitcoin, so they have to be ready, willing and able to accept that possibility, and if they are not able to do that, then their finances and psychology is not ready to invest into bitcoin).


No it is not better to be slow.  It is better to figure your shit out, and either you have disposable income or not.  If you have disposable income, then it is better to get started investing into bitcoin as soon as possible and figure out some kind of a system. 

Otherwise, if you figured out that you either do not have disposable income, then you should realize that you are not able to invest into bitcoin until you are sure that you have disposable income and then you can ONLY invest into bitcoin up to 100% of the amount of your disposable income, but if you are not sure if you have disposable income then you cannot invest into bitcoin.  I would not call that waiting, but instead you either have disposable income or you do not, and if you do not have it you cannot (or should not) be investing into bitcoin, and if you are not sure if you have disposable income or not, then you are likely in the same situation of not having it.. because you need to be clear that you actually have disposable income in order to invest into bitcoin, otherwise you are gambling and not investing.


I agree with all of the points of your post, including this one, except you could have worded this part better, since you are suggesting that holding more bitcoin is going to guarantee increased wealth, which truly is not true.  There is no guarantee, including that if someone does all the right things in bitcoin including investing into it as aggressively as he can, without over doing it, and he still might end up in a worse situation than if he had not invested into bitcoin... so surely it is better NOT to consider your bitcoin investment as if it were guaranteed, including communicating to others in a way that suggests that either you believe it is guaranteed or that it is guaranteed - since also you could lose your credibility when you communicate like that... even though many of us likely recognize and appreciate that it is better to invest into bitcoin rather than not investing into bitcoin, especially if we have figured out that we have discretionary income.  The devil is also in the details in regards to either how much or how to go about such investing into bitcoin.

Bitcoin holding definitely requires money but only having money doesn't make holding if the person doesn't make any good start. I think people's decisions are more important than money. There are many wealthy people who do not have a little bit of Bitcoin under their control, but people with ordinary incomes are also aware of the benefits of Bitcoin, they try to keep a little money from their hard-earned money and invest it in Bitcoin. That person may have less investment but better than the wealthy person. Everyone who is doing DCA is slowly moving towards their goal. On the one hand, as their Bitcoin holdings increase, on the other hand, their wealth will also increase.

The thing is that is not even all about having a huge amount of money to invest all at once but what is important is being able to start accumulating with the amount you can afford because sometimes it doesn't really matter how you can invest at once but what should be considered is how consistent you are into accumulating Bitcoin because even if an investor decided to invest all at once without a consistent accumulation their is a chance that he may not have a good tangible profits after holding.

And also no matter how good it is for us to keep accumulating Bitcoin it will be very unwise for someone to invest 50% of his funds because it could go wrong for him and I consider those kind of investment as being greedy because it is believed that most of the people who missed to acquire Bitcoin when they had the opportunity before tend to invest aggressively in other meet up those opportunities they missed without realizing they can get into trouble.

You are right here! Investment is not for everyone but people also misunderstand this statement they feel you must be rich before you can invest and that when they mean by not everyone they meant the poor should avoid investment which is not true. In previous times the poor were the ones who see investment as a way out of poverty until this era the rich became part of it and started gaining shares in companies and invest in potential projects. Both the poor and the rich are allowed to invest. Although it is easier for one  rich because they can afford anything, however the poor can invest in as much as they have taken care of the most important things (emergency funds, feeding and other things).

What the differentiate the poor and the rich in their pattern of investment is that the rich are not afraid to take high risk. It is a criteria that the poor should pay close attention to risk management only in that way can they succeed in investment just like the rich. The reason is because if an investment goes wrong the rich ca easily invest again because their disposable funds are high while the poor would feel so down for losing such money. Which is why the poor must minimize risk and avoid greed in investment.