Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 46. (Read 138798 times)

Surely you are right in your explanation but the aspect I would love to correct is the aspect of saying that buying 2 pizza with $10k BTC Is the highest follies. I wouldn't have brought up this matter but for the sake of corrections and would love this conversation to handle properly as the last one was abused In road to $100k thread. All what I am saying is that as at that time lalzslo sold those numbers of bitcoin, bitcoin was totally worthless and probably he just did what he did for the sake of making bitcoin more useful since there was no one using bitcoin to pay for goods or services. He knew bitcoin will be great but a sacrifice need to be made to pave way.  Now people sees him as fool but he was the reason bitcoin gain more attention. back then many people never thought bitcoin has a real usage, they thought like it was some sort of Fairy Tail or some sort of socia media propagander, but doing what he did motivated the mindset of people.  So we can not see that as being foolish, but it was a breakthrough.  Afterall for something to succeed it requires a great sacrifice and that he did and of course back then it was nothing to him because he had nothing to lose. those numbers where just up to $45 so bitcoin gained popularity and growth lately but not that initial time he bought those pizzas.

Nothing wrong with having conservative parameters, and then if your numbers are exceeded, then you are even more happy.  I would imagine that the newer that you are to bitcoin, then the more inclined that you would want the numbers to stay down while you are still building your bitcoin stash, but there is ONLY so much you can do about the price, even though you can try to consider what would be the best thing for you to do, even if you don't really know what bitcoin is going to do exactly, even if you have some tentative theories that may or may not end up playing out as you anticipate.


You seem to still have a trading mindset, since you are thinking about when to exit bitcoin rather than holding it for 4-10 years or longer..  .. so yeah, if you already have your own ideas about how you are going to play bitcoin, you might never get to a status in which you can live off of your bitcoin by having had spent time continuing to accumulate it and to hold it until it reaches such status that you might be able to start to thereafter start to cash out and withdraw from it at a hopefully sustainable rate.

There is no way to necessarily change your mindset if you are thinking about something like bitcoin as a trade rather than like an investment, even if you are using the word investment, you are not really investing long term into bitcoin, since you are thinking when to cash out and/or when you might maximize your dollar payout.



If you figure out how much to invest into bitcoin, then you don't have to worry about selling.. so if you build your investment into bitcoin for 4-10 years or longer, then at some point the size of your BTC stash will start to inform you what to do, yet in the beginning, you may well invest into bitcoin without giving very much thoughts to BTC prices.  You just keep buying it within your discretionary income, and hopefully you take care of your other financial matters  and get your life and cashflow in order from the remaining portions of your income.  Try not to put yourself into any emergency by creating an emergency fund and other back up funds, and surely if an emergency comes then you would hopefully draw from your various back up funds prior to touching your bitcoin, and if you get to the point of dipping into your emergency fund, then you are in a pretty desperate state at that point, so hopefully you are able to restore your income or cut your expenses, yet if you deplete your emergency fund, then at that point you might need to draw from your bitcoin.

Of course, any other investments that you have might also be available to draw from prior to drawing from your bitcoin, and yet these are personal choices regarding which funds to spend from first, and you have to live with the consequences if you choose to draw from your bitcoin prior to drawing from other funds, and you also have to end up using your bitcoin too if you get to a point that you have no other funds to draw from, so you would not want to die or to suffer from bad health if you were to choose to guard your bitcoin rathe than eating or lodging yourself or whatever your basic needs would be if your finances were to get to such a dire state.

To catch up, I have been involved with investments for a long time. When I first came to know about Bitcoin, like 10 other new members I was skeptical about Bitcoin which is why I didn't invest in this coin initially. But gradually when I came to know about this coin and when various big media started publishing news about this coin regularly, I became a bit focused on Bitcoin and decided to start investing in this coin with a small amount of money.  

In the beginning my investment journey was a bit like trading because at that time I didn't hold my investment for long after investing but after investing I sold my investment at a small profit. But when I saw that despite the regular fluctuations of the market, the market is moving in a good position and the popularity of this coin is steadily increasing, then I became more serious about this coin. At that time I didn't have that much money to invest a lot of money but I tried my best.  

But in the last two years I have been very successful in investing in these coins because in the last two years I have only invested and in contrast I have not sold my investment amount. I am still trying to hold on to the investment. Although my target was to sell bitcoins at $100k, the market still looks positive to me. People like me who gave so much importance to investing in Bitcoin may now be smiling with success.

The future of the investment is uncertain, maybe an investor plans before investing that after one year he will sell the investment and by selling the investment he will meet his needs. But after one year, the market may not change according to his wishes, in this case, the investor may be in danger if he is sitting on the trust of that investment. That's why investors are always advised to invest only the amount of money that you don't need or the amount of money that will not affect your financial life badly if it is lost from your life. There are many people who borrow money from others and invest in bitcoins.

I always ask them a question that when the person asks you to pay them, where do you pay them from? Maybe many investors simply answer this question that they will sell their investment at that time. In this case, I have another question that if there is market dumping at that time, will that investor sell his investment at a loss and pay off his debt?  
Assuming he pays off his debt with a relatively small loss, where is the investor profit?  

There are many things to think about before investing. I think every investor should think about these things so as not to regret later.

Somehow I find $0.107821 million per BTC more motivating than $107,821 per BTC, I know it's a mindset because anything that has million attached to it sounds differently just like a television show in my country which a presenter walks around the streets asking people to chose between 500k and half a million. To his surprise, majority of the people prefer to be given half a million instead of 500k without knowing that they are actually the same thing . So this new format will gibe ome the millionaire mindset and if that is what it will require to keep holding tight, it is indeed a welcomed development.

Which is an unrealistic prediction even in 2025 ending bitcoin will probably not hit $1m per bitcoin. I like to make things very simple and clear than make an over rated or much expectations from anything that at the end it makes short of my expectations that's why I predict $200k price in 2025 third quarter and this is probably possible as BSR have been proposed in several counties and such can spike mush pump to a 200kish price.

Some people already have converted to talking about bitcoin in terms of millions, so we could say today we reached a high of $0.107821 million per BTC.

The concept of bitcoin is totally different from crypto and this is one big mistake that has been common in this forum or this thread specifically, a lots of people here do mistake bitcoin for crypto in this process including shitcoins into the same concept with bitcoin. bitcoin is totally different from any coin out there and when we talk of long term investment I think the term crypto shouldn't be mentioned as it doesn't correspond with the longevity of investment. cryptos are mostly some pump and dump coins but bitcoin in my own term is a paradigm that has become the root to all the shitcoins that ever existed including the existing ones and those that has disappeared from the space over the years.

IMO, bitcoin is a paradigm shift that has possibly changed or shifted the way the world thinks or do things to a different pattern, world has left gold standard and now most countries are proposing Bitcoin Strategic Reserve (BSR) which shows the power of bitcoin with this happening around bitcoin I think one should be able to differentiate properly the difference between bitcoin and any other coin (crypto).

Additionally, having read through JJG's Sustainable Bitcoin Withdrawal Strategies, I believe that we (especially those in this thread) have a long way to go before we can begin to think of withdrawal because its obvious that we haven't accumulated enough bitcoin.


Of course it's good news that we hit a ATH but personally it's not a surprise me because we are in the period in which upward trend is all that we expect the most till next year as bitcoin will keep breaking new ATH.

And $1 million dollars per bitcoin isn't that too much for a bull run ? well let's be realistic which 200kish price is much more realistic.

Congratulations, we've hit $107,500 today.
Soon, we'll be having the M instead of the K. Let's go to $1M per BTC. 
Keep HODLING legends. 

It's not certain, but there is a big possibilities that the growth will continue in 2025, but to put some perspective, we hit another new all time high if you haven't heard at $107k, so it's a fresh all time high again. And we thought that there will be a pullback at some point when we hit $100k, but Bitcoin goes on the other way and never ceases to amazed it with another record today. Speculators attributed the strong increase to Trump's announcement of US going to Bitcoin as a strategic national reserved just like oil. With that kind of statement and as I said before, it's going to be a race between US, Russia and China as who will hold the most Bitcoin.

As for newbie, just remember that at some point in time, all of us here are newbies or even those early adopters, who sold early and didn't know what Bitcoin and how will it turn into the future. So we shouldn't blame them, humans by nature fear the unknown. But if you are a newbie by now, you have access to a lot of information on Bitcoin, and you don't need to be a rocket scientist to know that their are risk but the returns are going to be big. And then we have this community, with a lot of early investors or at least smart one, who don't gate keep their secrets of being successful or at least made a lot of money in Bitcoin. And as Satoshi once said,


So it's never too late to invest on Bitcoin even if we are in the 6 digits already. It still has a huge potential for growth. So if newbies are reading this, be smart just like the majority of members here, "buy and hold'.

I wasn't even referring to investors who intend to sell off their bitcoin investment once bitcoin hit $100,000; I was referring to investors who will invest in bitcoin in such a way that it will stop them from solving their daily expenses, which might get them off the game partially or permanently. It is always a bad idea to sell off all your bitcoin with a stupid idea of buying back that same bitcoin when you are still in your accumulation stage because you are not certain if bitcoin will dip to the price that will allow you to accumulate the quantity of bitcoin you sold. Since nobody can predict the price of bitcoin, it will be better for you to stop wishing because your wish might never come to pass.

I doubt if investors who sells because of the bull run do not use what they can afford to let go but perhaps, some of them selling at this point was actually their intentions while some investors got carried away because of the market pump which of course I know some investor will take advantage though it's not a bad idea. However, they feel that  is what they are supposed to do but i wish Bitcoin to Dip to the price they wish to buy again else they will live to regret. Everyone is responsible and accountable for their actions

That is what happens when someone who has a foresight introduces something that has great future and those who lacks foresight fails to admit it earlier. If the government had accepted bitcoin earlier, and made some good policies that favors bitcoin, by now we might have seen a new dimension in the world economy and things could have been better. Since the government is now buying more bitcoins, we should also buy and hodl in our possession because the government cannot totally be trusted as to their reasons of having many bitcoins in their custody. It is better for individuals to hodl more bitcoins than for organizations and the government to hodl more because if they turn against bitcoin in the future, it may be very disastrous and it will cause a great panic in the market. For those who are still in doubt about bitcoin, they should not be our concern because there are actually people in this life that will always watch things happening instead of them to make things happen, they should perish in their cowardice and regret their actions in the future.

Not only traders but also investors who sell their bitcoin investment too early during their accumulation journey will regret ever doing that because we have seen how bitcoin keeps increasing in price. This is the more reason why we should always use the money that we can afford to lose or the money we will not need for 4-10 years or more to invest in bitcoin so that it will allow us to hold our bitcoin investment for a long time since we didn't use the money that is meant to solve our daily expenses to invest in bitcoin, which will allow us not to sell our bitcoin investment to get our daily expenses sorted out.

Our current price appreciation likely should show the newbies that there are advantages in regards to stacking as much BTC as you can and as soon as you can.. so then you are not so worried about what to do when you mostly have already been stacking, and if you had already gotten to one year's worth of income/expenses in bitcoin, then if bitcoin does a 10x price appreciation, then we end up with 10 years worth of our annual income/expenses in bitcoin..

But yeah, if we are not able to get as much invested, then we do not get as much advantage from the compounding effect.. even though surely personally, I don't try to get too caught up upon the spot price in terms of valuating my own BTC holdings.


Since you have been around since 2017 @Litzki1990, it is likely that you have had time to accumulate BTC over the past 7.5 years, as compared with someone who is newer to bitcoin.  The newbies may well need to just stack bitcoin for at least a whole cycle without looking at price before they become too sensitive to various BTC price movements.


You make some decent points Litzki1990... Largely guys have to figure their BTC position size in light of their confidence about bitcoin, and perhaps weighing their concerns about bitcoin.



There is nothing wrong with anything that you said, except we are not talking about crypto (or shitcoins), so I don't see why you feel as if you need to use the term crypto, especially if you might be referring to bitcoin...  Are you referring to bitcoin or something else?  Investing and long term holding and even DCA does not work with shitcoins, since you have to figure out your in and out strategies, and that is not the case with bitcoin.  Why not use the word bitcoin? Do you not know the difference in the choice of your words?  You are the one that chose to use that crypto term rather than bitcoin, and if you meant bitcoin, why did you not use the word bitcoin if that is what you meant?

Regarding my sustainable withdrawal ideas, it should be clear that it can take guys a while to reach such a point that they are ready to employ such withdrawal strategies since they need to accumulate and/or overly accumulate bitcoin first.. which an overwhelming majority of people do not have any BTC or even close to enough BTC..and for sure, my sustainable withdrawal ideas would also not be applied to shitcoins.

Traders will run at loss in the long run. Majority of traders will be a no coiner or low coiner in future. Traders will regret their actions and feel like they have lost it all in future when bitcoin price will very expensive. Traders want to play a smart one in the market but they forget that they're gambling with their future, because you cannot outsmart the market since the price of bitcoin is unpredictable.

This is why I have only focused on long-term investment goal to secure my future when I am old. Bitcoin long-term investors are winners because they have taken their time to sacrifice and build wealth for themselves through discipline on regular buying bitcoin persistently and consistently over time. In the future traders will say long term investors were lucky to buy bitcoin cheap. Forgetting that they both had the same opportunities now to hodli till then.

Weak and strong hands are in every trading market and crypto is not a different thing. Everyone has it's own way of investing in crypto and there is no standard technique that is considered to be correct. Everyone has to figure out what suit him in getting desired number of Bitcoins.  First we need to get to our desired number of Bitcoins then one can follow JJG Sustainable Bitcoin Withdrawal Strategy




I have this post year a go where I did some work on finding how much return DCA and Lump Sum gives you. In the long run, Lump Sum investment is way ahead of DCA but the key is you are willing to HODL for long term.
Below data is for past four years. I will try to update it for last five years or someone else can also do that, https://dcacryptocalculator.com/ is the tool and we just to update few parameters.  

Your insights are very good but using the term cryptocurrency to describe bitcoin is way off. You can just be specific than classifying it with other shitcoins as cryptocurrency. Bitcoin is a course and subject matter of its own and it will be lack of understanding for anyone who knows about the concept of bitcoin to call it cryptocurrency even though it is the mother that gave birth to other cryptocurrency, but it is better to accord it that honor of standing on its own without attaching it with alt or shitcoins called cryptocurrency. It has already been noted that bitcoin has become more popular than Gold in recent times and despite that the market cap. of Gold is way higher than that of bitcoin, but bitcoin will soon attain and surpass that level one day. All we need is to be optimistic about bitcoin that it can reach any ATH and focus on buying more bitcoins than we sell and it's not only by buying but also hodling for long term growths.

I don't know why you are still talking about waiting for the dip because of the price of bitcoin. A new investor who is a no coiner shouldn't think that bitcoin price is high and should get started no matter the condition of the market be it bear or bull.

You don't know when the dip will come and that will make you waiting missing the opportunity of building an d grow your bitcoin portfolio as a late comer to bitcoin, and you still prefer to be waiting. I think that person is not serious with investing. DCA has solved the waiting problem.

You are getting the concept of long-term investment wrong because, you don't need excess cash on you before you can invest in bitcoin and continue buying regularly every week for 4-10 years and above. You will not run at loss for buying and hodli but it's when you sell that you will run at loss because trading is not good for a bitcoin investor who wants to acquire enough Bitcoin in future.

You don't invest in bitcoin because of FOMO or because you want to get rich quick, otherwise, you will make the wrong decisions and run at loss. Invest in bitcoin because it's a good asset to generate profit in the long-term and an hedge to inflation so that you can stay focus and build your bitcoin investment.

The main reality here is cash flow, once a Bitcoin investors have a good cash flow management and can set aside the right amount to DCA in Bitcoin and also properly managing the timing he get into Bitcoin, such an investor could be sure of making the right Bitcoin investment decisions along the way, since he already put in place mechanism that will guide his decisions on how he/she uses the cash flow to fill up Bitcoin stash along the way, there is no doubt the fact that, buying low is the best buying position, and avoid jumping on the market when the price is at all time sure way to avoid getting trapped in a downward trends movement and longer waiting before your portfolio can be in profits again.

One other thing that help new investors to move fast in their Bitcoin accumulation journey is the aspect applications of excess cash flow for an investors advantage, some of the Bitcoin investors who have excess cash flow easily lose the patients to wait for the price to drop at low before buying, because they are carried away by the available resources in their hands and instead waiting for correction they jump on the market regardless weather Bitcoin is at all time at that moment, this practice have lead to a lot of loses in the past, and some of such investor wont have the patient to wait for recovery tge also cash out at lose because of the frustration and fomo around them, is very important to learn how to use cash flow to our advantage and not being under pressure to buy Bitcoin at whatever price just because we have available fund's to do so.

I believe so much in Bitcoin and it's growth however the growth of Bitcoin in 2025 is not certain, a lot of newbies are rushing into Bitcoin now because they believe by 2025 Bitcoin will grow more bigger in price so they can sell and make profit but when there's no growth and a dip happens in 2025 you see them selling off there Bitcoin and saying Bitcoin has disappointed them, if you are a newbie into Bitcoin investment remove your mind from thinking that because 2024 is like this 2025 will be better so it won't frustrate and affect your accumulation journey when a dip happens in 2025, what you should focus on is to be consistent in your accumulation and making necessary arrangements that will help you succeed in your journey and prevent you from dipping hands into your Bitcoin investment when you have not Accumulated enough.