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Topic: Cairnsmore1 - Quad XC6SLX150 Board - page 54. (Read 286370 times)

hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 564
July 25, 2012, 12:15:37 PM
Ok a short update on progress with glasswalker's build that we are playing with. We have this now running on 3 FPGAs with a good stability and good mining results currently at a 175MHz clock rate. The 4th FPGA position still has some problems and we have a few more things that may make it viable in it's current form yet to try. Either running as 3 or 4 FPGAs we will aim to make a controller release available for it later today as it will give you all better hashing rates and U values. We will discuss with glasswalker how current bitstream is released and there may be more than one variant of the bitstream to suit each FPGA's particular needs.

The current issues are related to noise on the com lines which coupled with a weak UART design which either allow a false edge trigger and/or incorrect data to be received. At the penalty of a rebuild this can be fixed with a more robust UART design should the other methods that we are currently playing with fail.
Well, I guess that explains a lot...
newbie
Activity: 31
Merit: 0
July 25, 2012, 12:13:31 PM
I sort of agree with you wildemagic but don't forget the $300+ mining you would have lost before bfl actually delivers your Single.

Biggest issue i have with bfl (not counting the import tax etc i would have to pay getting them into the UK anyway) is that i will not pay a company like that up front for a product EVER. I wouldn't pay porsche upfront to get on a delivery list (funny enough they don't ask for it upfront either) and they are a little more reputable than bfl imo. It's just the way i work, i've never been ripped off by anyone because i won't put anyone in a position where they have the oppertunity to run off with my money. Even if they didn't ask for money upfront i still wouldn't buy on priciple the way they handle customers. Mining is a little bit of fun on the side for me, bfl arn't providing me a product that i need, just something that i want so the above factors would rule them out of ever getting my money.

That leaves me with the other reputable vendors which all seem preety good of which enterpoint are my personal prefered choice.

member
Activity: 112
Merit: 10
July 25, 2012, 11:59:41 AM
...
Everyone that ordered here got their devices for $640
...
That is an assumption.

IIRC, *current* price *is* $960.

Which they have raised it to in violation of their promise not to do so until an 800MH/s hash rate was delivered/available.
That was only recently raised, and I shouldn't have said "everyone", however the correct answer is probably closer to "99% of all orders". But anyway, yeah. We don't know how many orders have been placed since after the price was put up, but I can be sure that it wouldn't be *more* than the total of the orders that were placed prior to the hike.

That wasnt really the point, the point was that 'someone' was under the false pretense that the CM1 had a 'significant' price:performance advantage over a BFL single.  This statement is totally incorrect.  Even based on speculation, at $960 for 1200mhs vs $599 for 800mhs there is little advantage except power consumption, which would likely be close at those speeds.

Once again, thats speculation, the reality is <400mhs @ $640 vs >800mhs @ $599 is the current situation, greatly favoring BFL.

kind regards
sr. member
Activity: 476
Merit: 250
July 25, 2012, 11:50:00 AM
Fair enough, rjk.

However, the current facts are that Enterpoint's price is about 50% higher than a BFL Single for %50 less performance. IOWs, monetary cost is half again more for one half the MH/s.
rjk
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
1ngldh
July 25, 2012, 11:43:38 AM
...
Everyone that ordered here got their devices for $640
...
That is an assumption.

IIRC, *current* price *is* $960.

Which they have raised it to in violation of their promise not to do so until an 800MH/s hash rate was delivered/available.
That was only recently raised, and I shouldn't have said "everyone", however the correct answer is probably closer to "99% of all orders". But anyway, yeah. We don't know how many orders have been placed since after the price was put up, but I can be sure that it wouldn't be *more* than the total of the orders that were placed prior to the hike.
hero member
Activity: 648
Merit: 500
July 25, 2012, 11:40:22 AM
that's what I had thought, couldn't remember where I saw it though.

second question. probably for Yohan. can I connect 2 600w psu's to the power control board instead of one 1200w?
sr. member
Activity: 476
Merit: 250
July 25, 2012, 11:39:21 AM
...
Everyone that ordered here got their devices for $640
...
That is an assumption.

IIRC, *current* price *is* $960.

Which they have raised it to in violation of their promise not to do so until an 800MH/s hash rate was delivered/available.
member
Activity: 112
Merit: 10
July 25, 2012, 11:26:33 AM
Everyone that ordered here got their devices for $640, and they may reach up to 1Ghs with an optimized bitstream. That is better than BFL.
An optimized bitstream is likely to pull more than 10 watts per FPGA, preliminary estimates are between 12 and 15 watts each.

Ok, but I wasnt basing my post on speculation.  Thats an entirely different and subjective discussion.
Its entirely possible to clock chips at 300mhz/mhs and high voltage and end up with 60w 1200mh/s devices.

Given that most sparty150s are clocked at or around 200mhz@10w or less (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mining_hardware_comparison), I dont think I was too presumptuous.

Its taken ztex and Elden ALOT of development to get their bitstreams performing better, its doubtfull ztex will port over to CM1 and Eldens project is still not final either.

kind regards
rjk
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
1ngldh
July 25, 2012, 11:19:10 AM
Keep in mind, once they do get a sufficient software solution for this board, everyone that owns one is going to be mining at significantly better price/hash rates than anyone who owns a BFL Single

BFL singles sell for $599 and hash at 830-880mh/s

CM1 sells for $960 and is speculated to hash at 800mh/s as (Xilinx XC6SLX150 x 4 / typical speed 200mh/s each)

any speculation on the maximum power draw for the CM1 once everythings optimized? trying to plan out my psu purchase. I'm guessing ~60 watts per board if they're running @ 1000+mh/s

Typical Xilinx XC6SLX150 based FPGAs use about 10w, so a quad board should be around 40w @ 200mhz/mhs.

kind regards
Everyone that ordered here got their devices for $640, and they may reach up to 1Ghs with an optimized bitstream. That is better than BFL.
An optimized bitstream is likely to pull more than 10 watts per FPGA, preliminary estimates are between 12 and 15 watts each.
member
Activity: 112
Merit: 10
July 25, 2012, 11:16:57 AM
Keep in mind, once they do get a sufficient software solution for this board, everyone that owns one is going to be mining at significantly better price/hash rates than anyone who owns a BFL Single

BFL singles sell for $599 and hash at 830-880mh/s

CM1 sells for $960 and is speculated to hash at 800mh/s as (Xilinx XC6SLX150 x 4 / typical speed 200mh/s each)

any speculation on the maximum power draw for the CM1 once everythings optimized? trying to plan out my psu purchase.

Typical Xilinx XC6SLX150 based FPGAs use about 10w, so a quad board should be around 40w @ 200mhz/mhs.

I'm guessing ~60 watts per board if they're running @ 1000+mh/s

Not going to happen any time soon, especially if the chips are only at 1.2v, check out kakobrekla's thread here : https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/ztex-voltmod-90370

This will be my last update or at least for a while, I have achieved maximum clock 248mhz at 1.41V, which is the ztex bitstream limit.
Still waiting for new releases of ET's TML release - maybe we will see some interesting numbers there.

But given that Enterpoint might have software control over the voltage, its entirely possible that with a better bitstream or the tricone stream that overvoltage and 200mhz/mhs+ speeds will be possible.

kind regards
sr. member
Activity: 397
Merit: 500
July 25, 2012, 11:11:59 AM
any speculation on the maximum power draw for the CM1 once everythings optimized? trying to plan out my psu purchase. I'm guessing ~60 watts per board if they're running @ 1000+mh/s

60 Watt is maximum, so this is what your PSU have to handle.
hero member
Activity: 648
Merit: 500
July 25, 2012, 11:04:21 AM
any speculation on the maximum power draw for the CM1 once everythings optimized? trying to plan out my psu purchase. I'm guessing ~60 watts per board if they're running @ 1000+mh/s
donator
Activity: 1419
Merit: 1015
July 25, 2012, 11:01:56 AM
I've been following this thread very closely as i'm interested in making a bulk order.

So far, it doesnt make any business sense now. If you think this as an investment, then its terrible. How many ppl have got these board worked at intended speed? and if you did, for how long? I'm not a technical person but spending a month of tinkering is not acceptable. Maybe we should now know why BFL had a long waiting for their production.

As a potential customer, may i know exactly why you sell the boards without a working bitstream?

/troll

I don't think this post is a troll, his other posts seem to indicate he was looking to purchase from BFL but is having exactly the same problems everyone always seems to have with them on this forum. That said, these boards are being sold as pure hardware, because the guy making them knows hardware. He doesn't know or care what we do on the software end. I would highly encourage anyone to continue to watch this thread and see how open source community solutions work.

Keep in mind, once they do get a sufficient software solution for this board, everyone that owns one is going to be mining at significantly better price/hash rates than anyone who owns a BFL Single or anyone that's pre-ordered a SC product.

I know many people think the SC is going to beat everything else hands down, but guess what? You don't own one and you don't know when you will have one, people that order any other FPGA solution at least have an idea of when they will receive the product.
member
Activity: 108
Merit: 10
July 25, 2012, 10:42:25 AM
Thanks for the update!  I can't wait to test it out!  Grin
sr. member
Activity: 397
Merit: 500
July 25, 2012, 10:34:04 AM
nice one! can't wait for the new bitstream and things.  Smiley
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 251
July 25, 2012, 10:28:29 AM
Ok a short update on progress with glasswalker's build that we are playing with. We have this now running on 3 FPGAs with a good stability and good mining results currently at a 175MHz clock rate. The 4th FPGA position still has some problems and we have a few more things that may make it viable in it's current form yet to try. Either running as 3 or 4 FPGAs we will aim to make a controller release available for it later today as it will give you all better hashing rates and U values. We will discuss with glasswalker how current bitstream is released and there may be more than one variant of the bitstream to suit each FPGA's particular needs.

The current issues are related to noise on the com lines which coupled with a weak UART design which either allow a false edge trigger and/or incorrect data to be received. At the penalty of a rebuild this can be fixed with a more robust UART design should the other methods that we are currently playing with fail.

The 175MHz build also looks like it might run at 200MHz on many boards as well but we have more work to do on that. We will concentrate on the 4th FPGA issue first before looking more at this possibility.
newbie
Activity: 33
Merit: 0
July 25, 2012, 08:31:22 AM
Today I was able to get the Enterpoint cairnsmore to work with the tricone mining software without needing an isolated stand-alone cable, just the FTDI link.  The code is still early in function, and still suffers from some JTAG errors likely due to noise / reflections on the lines which will need better error handling.  I only performed several tests, but was easily able to get stable function with three rings at 100Mhz. (150 Mh/s).

I will keep you guys updated, I should have more time to work on it on Tuesday.

Here's some brief logs from submitted shares, it's fairly garbled from the ascii formatting for the colors.


Hi chrisp,

so you wrote the java interface for the cairnsmore board?

spiccioli

Yep.

Unfortunately some JTAG timing or noise issues persist, but they are improved, I'll post an update when things are more stable.  I was able to run the the miner for 20-30 minutes without any issues, which is reassuring.
sr. member
Activity: 476
Merit: 250
Keep it Simple. Every Bit Matters.
July 25, 2012, 08:05:46 AM
Good to hear another with promising stability.
Have you tried Cgminer 2.5 I found it more stable all round over 2.4.3?
hero member
Activity: 810
Merit: 1000
July 25, 2012, 04:11:26 AM
FYI...day 2 now and stable

Set up

Win 7 64bit, cgminer 2.4.3 for FPGAs, phoenix miner for GPUs  (cgminer for GPUs not stable), 2 * CM1 om MB USB lines, 2 * 6770

CM1 are stable at total of 750.5MHs
GPUs are stable at total of 380MHs
legendary
Activity: 1378
Merit: 1003
nec sine labore
July 25, 2012, 02:28:33 AM
Today I was able to get the Enterpoint cairnsmore to work with the tricone mining software without needing an isolated stand-alone cable, just the FTDI link.  The code is still early in function, and still suffers from some JTAG errors likely due to noise / reflections on the lines which will need better error handling.  I only performed several tests, but was easily able to get stable function with three rings at 100Mhz. (150 Mh/s).

I will keep you guys updated, I should have more time to work on it on Tuesday.

Here's some brief logs from submitted shares, it's fairly garbled from the ascii formatting for the colors.


Hi chrisp,

so you wrote the java interface for the cairnsmore board?

spiccioli
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